RE: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

om: Sam Ruby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 7:01 PM > To: Jakarta General List > Subject: RE: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed) > > > Paulo Gaspar wrote: > > > > I was not demanding karma, just stating what I thought were obstacles.

RE: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

Paulo Gaspar wrote: > > I was not demanding karma, just stating what I thought were obstacles. > > Now I have some clues and it looks like I can help even without karma. > =:o) My guess then is that you have not read down the page far enough then. No demands required. - Sam Ruby -- To unsubsc

RE: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

I was not demanding karma, just stating what I thought were obstacles. Now I have some clues and it looks like I can help even without karma. =:o) Have fun, Paulo > -Original Message- > From: Sam Ruby [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 11:54 AM > > Paulo Gasp

RE: crushed

> Look at TC3 vs TC4 - I subscribed about a year ago to their dev > list and the > relationships between the two groups were less than good and a few people > were trying to make the division even greater .. apparently now > all is good over there. Keep in mind (maybe not Peter but other rea

Re: crushed

On Tue, 8 Jan 2002 09:02, Jeff Turner wrote: > I would encourage people (esp. Jon, Ceki, Peter) to read Linus' emails > on design: > > "The problem with "singlemindedness and strict control" (or "design") > is that it sure gets you from point A to point B in a much straighter > line, and wit

RE: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

Paulo Gaspar wrote: > > No karma, no clue on how to change a Jakarta web page! > =:o/ > > But at least puting the URL on the list should be a couple of > minutes for someone who does know. karma follows clue, i.e., get a clue, and you get karma. A good place to start is by going to "http://jakar

Re: crushed

Jeff Turner wrote: > > Incidentally, the other statement Craig made in that email sums it all > up for me: > >> The point from Jon that I *do* dismiss is his feeling that there >> should be one and only one implementation of any particular >> functionality -- "one size fits all" is a very rare phe

Re: crushed

Andrew C. Oliver wrote: > > At the macro level you have to stand back a bit and let the > secretary spend 30 cents too much on the paperclips. +1 - Sam Ruby -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: For additional commands, e-mail:

Re: crushed

Jon Scott Stevens wrote: > > A good one that Sam worked on > resolving fairly successfully is the one about Gump. Another issue which I > see as a failure is the failure of projects to communicate with each other. Thanks for the kind words. If you take a moment and read the first paragraph of te

RE: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

e: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed) > > > on 1/7/02 9:05 PM, "Paulo Gaspar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > No karma > > Submit a patch. > > >, no clue on how to change a Jakarta web page! > > RTFM > > <http://jakarta.

Re: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

on 1/7/02 9:05 PM, "Paulo Gaspar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > No karma Submit a patch. >, no clue on how to change a Jakarta web page! RTFM Oh well, Geir did your work for you, so you don't learn anything. -jon -- To unsubscribe, e

RE: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

COOL! =:o) > -Original Message- > From: Geir Magnusson Jr. [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 6:03 AM > > > On 1/8/02 12:05 AM, "Paulo Gaspar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > No karma, no clue on how to change a Jakarta web page! > > =:o/ > > > > But at leas

Re: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

fun, > Paulo > >> -Original Message- >> From: Jon Scott Stevens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] >> Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 5:05 AM >> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >> Subject: Re: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed) >> >> >> on 1/7/02 7:5

RE: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

8, 2002 5:05 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed) > > > on 1/7/02 7:59 PM, "Paulo Gaspar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > What about just a version of this form: > > http://search.apache.org/ > >

Re: crushed

On 1/7/02 11:20 PM, "Jon Scott Stevens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > on 1/7/02 8:10 PM, "Geir Magnusson Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> I agree with Sam here - you have to buy into the Gump nags and understand >> the value, or you are going to think it's an intrusive fussyness, which it >>

Re: crushed

on 1/7/02 8:10 PM, "Geir Magnusson Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I agree with Sam here - you have to buy into the Gump nags and understand > the value, or you are going to think it's an intrusive fussyness, which it > is, actually :) Or you could think of it this way... Part of the 'privile

Re: crushed

On 1/7/02 11:03 PM, "Jon Scott Stevens" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > on 1/7/02 7:27 PM, "Tim Vernum" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> If the project won't deal with gump nags, and can't keep their >> builds from breaking then they probably won't fit into Jakarta. > > Bingo. Great point. > > How

Re: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

on 1/7/02 7:59 PM, "Paulo Gaspar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > What about just a version of this form: > http://search.apache.org/ > > or a link to it??? > > Take a look at my previous posting (the "crushed" thread) for more > details. It can b

Re: crushed

on 1/7/02 7:27 PM, "Tim Vernum" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > If the project won't deal with gump nags, and can't keep their > builds from breaking then they probably won't fit into Jakarta. Bingo. Great point. However, forcing a project to have gump nags is not something Sam is willing to dicta

RE: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

What about just a version of this form: http://search.apache.org/ or a link to it??? Take a look at my previous posting (the "crushed" thread) for more details. It can be made (hidden fields I love you) to search any sub-domain just by changing its HTML. Have fun, Pa

RE: crushed

> That is because I don't see a way to fix the problems and I'm not sure I > have the energy to actually go through with it anymore. Did you ever run or walk a Marathon? Or just 20 Km? Or swim 10Km? It is one step (or stroke) after the other or you get too tired just by thinking about it. > I

RE: crushed

> Perhaps like Commons, there should be an open proving ground > for those wishing to make steps into the Apache world. Probably not what you had in mind, but adding the project to the gump run would be a start. All sorts of monitoring goes on then, including prompting from the gump-er (ie Sa

Re: Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

on 1/7/02 6:26 PM, "Jeff Turner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The idea of a Jakarta code search engine has arisen a few times. Any > lucene or alexandria developers care to comment? Cocoon docs are already > searchable apparently, though this functionality isn't online. > > Alternatively, a simp

Jakarta code search engine? (Re: crushed)

On Mon, Jan 07, 2002 at 05:59:51PM -0800, Jon Scott Stevens wrote: > on 1/7/02 5:10 PM, "Paulo Gaspar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > I see you crying a lot over this but no POSITIVE initiative. > > That is because I don't see a way to fix the problems and I'm not sure I > have the energy to a

Re: crushed

on 1/7/02 5:10 PM, "Paulo Gaspar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I see you crying a lot over this but no POSITIVE initiative. That is because I don't see a way to fix the problems and I'm not sure I have the energy to actually go through with it anymore. I haven't seen you give any positive initi

Re: crushed

on 1/7/02 5:41 PM, "Andrew C. Oliver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > When I was much younger I used to go on BBSes and post "Which is better > Amiga or IBM?" and "Why not just use a Mac?" to see the fires rage. As > I grew up I found more productive ways to spend my time. Code > formatting is sub

Re: crushed

> That isn't entirely what I'm asking for (re: singlemindedness and strict > control). > Part of what I'm asking for is very simple: documentation of the process and > then following that process. > Remember that all of this started with something as simple as source code > formatting. We can't

Re: crushed

> I know it's hard to tell from the convoluted way this thread have gone > back and forth, but the comment above was not intended to have *anything* > to do with POI specifically, or the proposal to move POI to Apache. It > was a response to Ceki's concern about how to keep Jakarta from being ju

Re: crushed

the macro level you have to stand back a bit and let the secretary spend 30 cents too much on the paperclips. After all its the bigger picture. This is a forum where not everyone will ever agree with you. You have to let them do things the wrong way. Express disagreement but stick to the fact

Re: crushed

On Mon, Jan 07, 2002 at 03:44:50PM -0500, Andrew C. Oliver wrote: > Guys, > > This whole experience has become a bit disheartening. Craig McClanahan > who is like an idol of mine said this: > > " > We will continue to do what we've done in the past -- reject projects > that only want the "name

RE: crushed

ct. Have fun, Paulo Gaspar > -Original Message- > From: Jon Scott Stevens [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 1:05 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: crushed > > > on 1/7/02 3:51 PM, "Jeff Turner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrot

RE: crushed

t!!! =:oD Have fun, Paulo > -Original Message- > From: Jeff Turner [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2002 12:51 AM > To: Jakarta General List > Subject: Re: crushed > > > On Mon, Jan 07, 2002 at 03:44:50PM -0500, Andrew C. Oliver wrote: >

Re: crushed

on 1/7/02 3:51 PM, "Jeff Turner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > "The problem with "singlemindedness and strict control" (or "design") > is that it sure gets you from point A to point B in a much straighter > line, and with less expenditure of energy, but how the HELL are you > going to consistently

Re: crushed

On 7 Jan 2002, Andrew C. Oliver wrote: > > This whole experience has become a bit disheartening. Craig McClanahan > who is like an idol of mine said this: > > " > We will continue to do what we've done in the past -- reject projects > that > only want the "name recognition" value of being unde

Re: crushed

On Mon, Jan 07, 2002 at 03:44:50PM -0500, Andrew C. Oliver wrote: > Guys, > > This whole experience has become a bit disheartening. Craig McClanahan > who is like an idol of mine said this: > > " > We will continue to do what we've done in the past -- reject projects > that only want the "name

Re: crushed

At 03:44 PM 1/7/02 -0500, you wrote: >Guys, > >This whole experience has become a bit disheartening. Craig McClanahan >who is like an idol of mine said this: What I like most about Craig is that he is concise and accurate. - micael -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: For

Re: crushed

on 1/7/02 2:20 PM, "Paul Hammant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > We should be careful turning away projects as they may end up as GPL > . Now that is the funniest reason I have heard for accepting projects here! :-) Thanks. I needed a good laugh. -jon -- To unsubscribe, e-mail:

Re: crushed

Andrew, Don't be disheartened. Regroup and come back later. (ref : Robert the Bruce and the Spider). 1) Build a bigger community that is active behind POI, 2) Add value to the project by making sure it can run inside as many contexts as possible, 3) possibly depend on more Apache project

Re: crushed

Jon Scott Stevens wrote: > If you look at how Scarab is run, we are pretty damn successful at this > point with regards to building and managing a strong developer community > around it. And it isn't even a Jakarta project. I personally see the model I > have used for Scarab as pretty close to rig

Re: crushed

>Have many developers does scarab have, 10? Jakarta has around 200 >committers plus ten >times that many developers. At 200'000 USD per committer that's a >budget of 40'000'000 Whoa dude. I am SO doing something wrong. 200,000? >USD a year. I'd estimate the budget of an equivalently sized so

Re: crushed

a Jakarta project. I personally see the model I >have used for Scarab as pretty close to right way to run projects. > >Not that it is a contest, but I can guarantee I feel more crushed than you. Have many developers does scarab have, 10? Jakarta has around 200 committers plus ten times tha

Re: crushed

ssful at this point with regards to building and managing a strong developer community around it. And it isn't even a Jakarta project. I personally see the model I have used for Scarab as pretty close to right way to run projects. Not that it is a contest, but I can guarantee I feel more crus

Re: crushed

+1 "Andrew C. Oliver" wrote: > I mean lets go ahead with the proposal (final draft in the making) -- To unsubscribe, e-mail: For additional commands, e-mail:

crushed

Guys, This whole experience has become a bit disheartening. Craig McClanahan who is like an idol of mine said this: " We will continue to do what we've done in the past -- reject projects that only want the "name recognition" value of being under Apache, and don't have a development community c