Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
I've had a look at http://jakarta.apache.org/site/mail2.html ... Here are the strange things I found : * Alexandria : no user list (Pier I thought you said ALL projects had both lists ;-) ) * Avalon : no user list and a strange cvs list (I thought all CVS messages went to the devlist ?) * Commons : information not updated * Jakarta documentation : only a docs@ : no user and dev and a cvs list ... * Log4j : a cvs list * Velocity a TDK list : Question : do we say that -user and -dev lists are mandatory and projects are allowed to create additional lists ? * Watchdog : no user list In summary, there is still some work to be done to homogeneize lists ... :) Who takes charge of changing this ? Thanks -Vincent - Original Message - From: Pier Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Brian Behlendorf [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Ted Husted [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2001 3:53 AM Subject: Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval Brian Behlendorf [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lists to moderate: - slide-dev (Remy) - slide-user (Remy) Email address? Er, I'll let you deal with it. [EMAIL PROTECTED] :) He's one of my fellow bandwidth stealers :) (I contacted him and he agreed, in exchange for WebMail on betaversion.org. Done - apart from webmail!) Lists to nuke: - check-dev - docs - josper-dev I'll let you do these. Done... Lists to rename: - jakarta-commons (commons-dev) Renamed... (or better, created new mailing list, moved all regular and digest subscribers, posted a couple of test messages to see that everything was working right and removed the old list - leaving the post address to be an alias to the new mailing list!) - cactus-user (commons-user or commons-cactus-user) - servletapi-dev (collapse into tomcat-dev) - watchdog-dev (collapse into tomcat-dev) I'll let you do these. I'm waiting for feedback on those... Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
Vincent Massol [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Regarding cactus : I think we should leave a few more days for other committer to vote. I don't know what the standard number of days to leave. Why don't we say until monday 12:00 PM GMT. Then we submit the proposition to the PMC for their blessing. How is that ? That's why I said waiting for feedback... Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
Hey, don't take me wrong here :-) I just jumped in because I saw some post on this newsgroup saying that you wanted to homogeneise mailing lists ... I probably misunderstood the intent which was maybe only to standardise on the mailing-list names (or rather to align with the existing standard :)) ... Ok for doing the website but I would have preferred someone who has already done it and has everything set up on his machine (I don't and will have to learn the mechanism before so it'll take a some time). To summarise, there are 2 things to correct: remove the doc mailing list and correct the commons one. Regarding your quote, I looked for it in my emails ... and couldn't find it ... :) I guess I dreamed it ... So I apologise and I owe you a beer. Tell me when you are in London and we'll go to the pub someday :-) Have a goo weekend Cheers, -Vincent - Original Message - From: Pier Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2001 12:44 PM Subject: Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval Vincent Massol [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've had a look at http://jakarta.apache.org/site/mail2.html ... Here are the strange things I found : * Alexandria : no user list (Pier I thought you said ALL projects had both lists ;-) ) I thought doesn't work... Give me a quote of me saying that, and I'll owe you a beer... * Avalon : no user list and a strange cvs list (I thought all CVS messages went to the devlist ?) Depends on the project... * Commons : information not updated Do it :) I manage EZMLM, someone please kick some code in the website... * Jakarta documentation : only a docs@ : no user and dev and a cvs list ... In fact there was no traffic... I deleted that mailing list yesterday since noone complained... * Log4j : a cvs list They have a CVS list, so what? APR, HTTPD, and many others have a -cvs list. Some of the Jakarta project decided to collapse it with the -dev... Some didn't... * Velocity a TDK list : Question : do we say that -user and -dev lists are mandatory and projects are allowed to create additional lists ? Their list is velocity-tdk-dev... So, (kudos to Jon) project-subproject-identifier, in line with our guidelines... As CVS trees... Jakarta-project-subproject-subsubproject * Watchdog : no user list So? In summary, there is still some work to be done to homogeneize lists ... :) No, there's no work to be done... Apart from a website fix (and I am NOT going to do that... Someone else please volunteer): removing docs and modifying commons. If a project don't wont a -user list because they don't feel like having reached that point where users do bother on the developer list, I'm not going to force them to have one. If a project wants a CVS list because they don't want all -dev traffic mixed with it, that's FINE... As long as we agree on the basic naming scheme, I'm fine... Who takes charge of changing this ? You :) At least for the website part... Nothing else need to be done... Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
on 9/8/01 5:26 AM, Vincent Massol [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok for doing the website but I would have preferred someone who has already done it and has everything set up on his machine (I don't and will have to learn the mechanism before so it'll take a some time). To summarise, there are 2 things to correct: remove the doc mailing list and correct the commons one. cvs co jakarta-site2 cd jakarta-site2 edit xdocs/site/mail2.xml ant cvs ci It isn't rocket science. -jon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
- Original Message - From: Jon Stevens [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2001 5:51 PM Subject: Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval on 9/8/01 5:26 AM, Vincent Massol [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok for doing the website but I would have preferred someone who has already done it and has everything set up on his machine (I don't and will have to learn the mechanism before so it'll take a some time). To summarise, there are 2 things to correct: remove the doc mailing list and correct the commons one. cvs co jakarta-site2 cd jakarta-site2 edit xdocs/site/mail2.xml ant cvs ci It isn't rocket science. Yep, thanks for the tutorial. I have done the changes. However, I haven't modified the archiving on mail-archive for Commons as I'm not sure what to do (and do not have the rights). We probably need to subscribe the new commons-dev@... to it. Do we need to do something to prevent creating a new archive (http://www.mail-archive.com/faq.html#duplicate) ? thanks -Vincent - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
- Original Message - From: Jon Stevens [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, September 08, 2001 5:51 PM Subject: Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval on 9/8/01 5:26 AM, Vincent Massol [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok for doing the website but I would have preferred someone who has already done it and has everything set up on his machine (I don't and will have to learn the mechanism before so it'll take a some time). To summarise, there are 2 things to correct: remove the doc mailing list and correct the commons one. cvs co jakarta-site2 cd jakarta-site2 edit xdocs/site/mail2.xml ant cvs ci It isn't rocket science. you forgot the second part (which I had to make up myself ! :) ): ssh -l xxx jakarta.apache.org cd /www/jakarta.apache.org/site cvs update mail2.html -Vincent - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
Vincent Massol [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hey, don't take me wrong here :-) I don't :) :) :) I just jumped in because I saw some post on this newsgroup saying that you wanted to homogeneise mailing lists ... I probably misunderstood the intent which was maybe only to standardise on the mailing-list names (or rather to align with the existing standard :)) ... Homogenization on naming... My bad... I should have pointed that out :) Ok for doing the website but I would have preferred someone who has already done it and has everything set up on his machine (I don't and will have to learn the mechanism before so it'll take a some time). To summarise, there are 2 things to correct: remove the doc mailing list and correct the commons one. Well, then I'm in your same set... I've never done it :) :) :) Regarding your quote, I looked for it in my emails ... and couldn't find it ... :) I guess I dreamed it... Guess so :) :) :) Hehehehe So I apologise and I owe you a beer. Tell me when you are in London and we'll go to the pub someday :-) Somehow I _live_ there, St. Katherine's Docks, Tower Bridge... Let's meet sometime :) Have a goo weekend Just got back from Camden with 300 pounds less in my pockets (damn CyberDog), so the week-end is looking great :) Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
On Thu, 6 Sep 2001, Pier Fumagalli wrote: Currently, the following lists have -MU set, and really should be reconsidered: bugs Hmmm... This is unused... I would suggest converting it to an alias to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Done. jakarta-commons (which should be renamed to commons, btw) [EMAIL PROTECTED], to be exact... I can go ahead and do the conversion of the actual ML, and put [EMAIL PROTECTED] as an alias for that list... Please do. library-dev There's no whatsoever traffic on that list... I don't know what's it all about even IF I am listed as the owner of it... Either someone claims its usefulness (only spam received on that list since months), or I'll just remove it. Done. The following lists are set to -mU, which means all messages are moderated: announcements That should stay as-is... Yes. taglibs-user (this I don't understand) I'm going to change this one to be -mu... Cool. Lists to moderate: - slide-dev (Remy) - slide-user (Remy) Email address? Er, I'll let you deal with it. Lists to nuke: - bugs - library-dev Done - check-dev - docs - josper-dev I'll let you do these. Lists to rename: - jakarta-commons (commons-dev) - cactus-user (commons-user or commons-cactus-user) - servletapi-dev (collapse into tomcat-dev) - watchdog-dev (collapse into tomcat-dev) I'll let you do these. Lists to modify (-mu instead of -mU): - taglibs-user (Get me off moderation for this one please!) Done. On Thu, 6 Sep 2001, Ted Husted wrote: struts-dev struts-user Moderator for those two should be Craig :) Or me. Craig keeps pretty busy with Tomcat these days ;-) Done. taglibs-dev And for this one too (Craig? :) Or me. I'm the PMC contact. Done. Brian - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
Brian Behlendorf [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lists to moderate: - slide-dev (Remy) - slide-user (Remy) Email address? Er, I'll let you deal with it. [EMAIL PROTECTED] :) He's one of my fellow bandwidth stealers :) (I contacted him and he agreed, in exchange for WebMail on betaversion.org. Done - apart from webmail!) Lists to nuke: - check-dev - docs - josper-dev I'll let you do these. Done... Lists to rename: - jakarta-commons (commons-dev) Renamed... (or better, created new mailing list, moved all regular and digest subscribers, posted a couple of test messages to see that everything was working right and removed the old list - leaving the post address to be an alias to the new mailing list!) - cactus-user (commons-user or commons-cactus-user) - servletapi-dev (collapse into tomcat-dev) - watchdog-dev (collapse into tomcat-dev) I'll let you do these. I'm waiting for feedback on those... Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
Brian Behlendorf [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: this didn't seem to go through yesterday It did :) -- Forwarded message -- Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2001 19:24:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Brian Behlendorf [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: lists that don't require subscriber approval Today, the tomcat-user list was spammed by an errant mailer-daemon out there that sent out nearly 300 email messages to the rest of the list. There are 1091 subscribers to that list, so 300K messages were sent out - or nearly that many, as Pier told me about it and I shut down qmail, removed the offending messages from the queue (after a half hour of grep and awk action to identify those bad messages and nuke them). That was not fun, and it was a good thing I was back from Burningman today and could fix it, or all mail for apache.org would have been fuct for potentially days. As I said, as soon as I noticed, I unsubbed anyone from that domain from all mailing lists (thinking it was a some sort of auto reply to each single message posted on the list). When I noticed that even after unsubbing those guys I was still flooded by messages, I created the deny mail from list of addresses and put that email address in there, but the queue was already WAY backlogged... And I contacted Brian on the spot... (BTW, I didn't create that mailing list, and I don't know who did it, I just noticed what was happening, but - hey - it's not by fault! :) This was possible only because the mailing list was running with the -MU options set to ezmlm - which means basically anyone can post. If that's changed to -mu, it changes the behavior of the list to subscribers can post, non-subscribers have their messages bounced to the moderators for approval. I really really really recommend all lists run this option - the only place where I can see it not being appropriate are lists that intentionally welcome posts from outsiders, such as [EMAIL PROTECTED], where bouncing or delaying such a message would potentially be a serious problem. Any list larger than a few people should have -mu set. Agreed... Currently, the following lists have -MU set, and really should be reconsidered: bugs Hmmm... This is unused... I would suggest converting it to an alias to [EMAIL PROTECTED], and I would like to have a couple of volunteers to help me out on that... jakarta-commons (which should be renamed to commons, btw) [EMAIL PROTECTED], to be exact... I can go ahead and do the conversion of the actual ML, and put [EMAIL PROTECTED] as an alias for that list... library-dev There's no whatsoever traffic on that list... I don't know what's it all about even IF I am listed as the owner of it... Either someone claims its usefulness (only spam received on that list since months), or I'll just remove it. pmc This is a small list... Could remain open, as we want anyone to be able to post to the PMC, and subscription is (I believe) moderated... servletapi-dev I propose collapsing this one with tomcat-dev... Servlet API and Tomcat are more or less the same thing, and keeping a mailing list only for CVS putbacks is (IMO) wrong... Also because I would love to see those putbacks on the tomcat-dev mailing list, where they are more relevant... slide-dev slide-user Moderator for those two too... (Remy?) struts-dev struts-user Moderator for those two should be Craig :) taglibs-dev And for this one too (Craig? :) The following lists are set to -mU, which means all messages are moderated: announcements That should stay as-is... taglibs-user (this I don't understand) I'm going to change this one to be -mu... Let me know if I can make this change. I and Craig can take care of changing moderations/options for the lists, The only thing you should do is check out that archives are generated correctly. Things I also noticed: - cactus-user I don't know what this is all about... There is no archive, cactus is related to the commons project, so, it should be really a commons-user@jakarta... - check-dev No traffic since october 1999... I propose to erase this one... - docs This seems to be unused... I can't see any relevant traffic but various spam on the archives... - josper-dev I believe this was erroneously created (josper? It's JASPER! :) Blast it - watchdog-dev It should be treated (IMO) as servletapi-dev... Collapse it with tomcat-dev. To sum up: Lists to moderate: - slide-dev (Remy) - slide-user (Remy) - struts-dev (Craig) - struts-user (Craig) - taglibs-dev (Craig) Lists to nuke: - bugs - library-dev - check-dev - docs - josper-dev Lists to rename: - jakarta-commons (commons-dev) - cactus-user (commons-user or commons-cactus-user) - servletapi-dev (collapse into tomcat-dev) - watchdog-dev (collapse into tomcat-dev) Lists to modify (-mu instead of -mU): - taglibs-user (Get me off moderation for this one please!) Please advise (ASAP, please)... Pier (CCing general@jakarta since there
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 23:44, Pier Fumagalli wrote: Things I also noticed: - cactus-user I don't know what this is all about... There is no archive, cactus is related to the commons project, so, it should be really a commons-user@jakarta... I think when it was initially voted on it was to be named commons-cactus-user@ or commons-cactus@ or similar. Not sure what happened though. The reason for keeping it separate was that it was generating a fair number of messages that most commons users didn't want to see ;) -- Cheers, Pete Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. -- Benjamin Franklin - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
- Original Message - From: Peter Donald [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, September 06, 2001 2:45 PM Subject: Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval On Thu, 6 Sep 2001 23:44, Pier Fumagalli wrote: Things I also noticed: - cactus-user I don't know what this is all about... There is no archive, cactus is related to the commons project, so, it should be really a commons-user@jakarta... I think when it was initially voted on it was to be named commons-cactus-user@ or commons-cactus@ or similar. Not sure what happened though. The reason for keeping it separate was that it was generating a fair number of messages that most commons users didn't want to see ;) You're right. The name [EMAIL PROTECTED] was the voted name. I seem to remember that the list name was changed at the last minute to be cactus-user@... because there was the intention to make Cactus a root project in the future and a name change being a major change it was preferred to name right away cactus-user@... However, you're right and I don't think it was done in a orderly manner and I don't remember any voting on the subject. Maybe now is the right time to vote for making Cactus a top level project ? Are there conditions for that (like number of hits,downloads, community) ? Who decides, PMC members ? Thanks -Vincent Massol - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
Vincent Massol [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: just sent a request for vote now on [EMAIL PROTECTED] ... :) Since you're at it already, can you please also tell them that I'm going to change the mailing list name from [EMAIL PROTECTED] to [EMAIL PROTECTED] ? :) Let me know... Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: lists that don't require subscriber approval
on 9/6/01 7:45 AM, Pier Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: P.S. Perhaps the right fix here is to create a jakarta-cactus subproject. Agreed... I would kindly ask to the Jakarta-Commons people, to vote on making Cactus become a top-level subproject of Jakarta, we'll move from there... Pier Or: jakarta-commons-cactus -jon (who is enjoying the current low creation rate of top level projects) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
