Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Daniel Smith]

well, you're the one who mentioned money.
being somewhat older now i would also very much note the need for a
good circle of friends and community, and a committed life's partner
etc for when you can't take care of yourself (or perhaps make any
money).
believe it or not it's a real possibility. I can't believe looking
back how many of my friends never made it past 30.
but here was the actual page that made me stop and think about typekit:
http://www.briangardner.com/typekit-fonts/
and this was a good article:
http://www.briangardner.com/minimalist-design/
have a good day.
dan

On 12/16/12, Alexandre Prokoudine  wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Daniel Smith wrote:
>> Alexandre,
>> well, design has never really been considered a high paid occupation
>> now, has it?
>
> By whom? :) Besides, a lot depends on lifestyle. Living frugally on
> $60K vs. living lavishly on $120K turns out to be pretty much the same
> thing or even better.
>
> The point I'm trying to make is that in the long run "whatever works
> best" is still the best approach. We can argue about licenses and
> "evil" vendors all we like, but once you do paid projects and treat
> this job seriously, justifying software expenses can be not such a big
> deal. Similarly, it's quite OK for people to buy Apple hardware if
> they have a project to pay the expense off nicely.
>
> This is really about looking at things through investment lens.
>
>> Like I said before, to view open source as if it's all white knights
>> is a misnomer.
>
> Indeed :)
>
> Alexandre Prokoudine
> http://libregraphicsworld.org
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Alexandre Prokoudine]

On Fri, Dec 14, 2012 at 9:04 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 12, 2012 at 10:53:42PM +0100, MasterRahl wrote:
>> #1: in over all view how does gimp stack up to Photoshop and all of its
>> features, are they compairable? to each other.
>
> I've tried to answer this from a photography point of view here
>
>  http://photo.stackexchange.com/a/7691/1943

Matthew, unfortunately the link to a paper on skin color selection is
no longer working. Could you please say what paper exactly it was?

Alexandre Prokoudine
http://libregraphicsworld.org
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Alexandre Prokoudine]

On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 5:08 PM, Daniel Smith wrote:
> Alexandre,
> well, design has never really been considered a high paid occupation
> now, has it?

By whom? :) Besides, a lot depends on lifestyle. Living frugally on
$60K vs. living lavishly on $120K turns out to be pretty much the same
thing or even better.

The point I'm trying to make is that in the long run "whatever works
best" is still the best approach. We can argue about licenses and
"evil" vendors all we like, but once you do paid projects and treat
this job seriously, justifying software expenses can be not such a big
deal. Similarly, it's quite OK for people to buy Apple hardware if
they have a project to pay the expense off nicely.

This is really about looking at things through investment lens.

> Like I said before, to view open source as if it's all white knights
> is a misnomer.

Indeed :)

Alexandre Prokoudine
http://libregraphicsworld.org
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Daniel Smith]

Alexandre,
well, design has never really been considered a high paid occupation
now, has it?
I'm even on this list only because i have a partial interest in
graphics coming from the
ten years i considered myself a "potential designer".
Boy was that a mistaken period. Followed by my equally painful "period
of revelations".
Like I said before, to view open source as if it's all white knights
is a misnomer. A lot of the original creators of open source, as much
as I love it, are now sitting very fat and sassy:
http://nactag.info/map.asp?addr=4RB3%20QK5N&label=Linus%20Torvalds%27%20House
:)
dan

On 12/16/12, Alexandre Prokoudine  wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 5:46 AM, Ofnuts wrote:
>> On 12/15/2012 01:39 AM, Daniel Smith wrote:
>>>
>>> it also has After Effects, Premiere Pro, etc. Lots of good stuff. For
>>> 30 a month?
>>>
>> You mean, 360 a year? For plenty of stuff I may never use?
>
> As in "I make $60K as a designer and I ain't paying 360 a year for my
> tools"? :-P
>
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> http://libregraphicsworld.org
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Alexandre Prokoudine]

On Sun, Dec 16, 2012 at 5:46 AM, Ofnuts wrote:
> On 12/15/2012 01:39 AM, Daniel Smith wrote:
>>
>> it also has After Effects, Premiere Pro, etc. Lots of good stuff. For
>> 30 a month?
>>
> You mean, 360 a year? For plenty of stuff I may never use?

As in "I make $60K as a designer and I ain't paying 360 a year for my
tools"? :-P

Alexandre Prokoudine
http://libregraphicsworld.org
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Alexandre Prokoudine]

On Sat, Dec 15, 2012 at 3:44 AM, Steve Kinney wrote:

> In re mathemagical upscaling, I have been using a plugin called
> "upsize" that seems to give consistently better results than cubic
> interpolation.  I don't know who made it or what math it uses; I
> think I got it from the plugin registry site.

http://libregraphicsworld.org/blog/entry/advanced-samplers-for-gegl-to-be-crowdfunded

"It started with a GIMP plug-in called Upsize that was written in 2008
by Adam Turcotte and Nicolas Robidoux. The plug-in implemented an
early version of upscaling algorithms.

You can still use it to get a basic idea about the kind of
improvements. But bear in mind that the present day interpolation
methods are far ahead of that. One might say, those are outdated
prototypes.

After publishing the plug-in Nicolas was notified about GEGL which
resulted in a Google Summer of Code 2009 project. Two students, Adam
Turcotte and Eric Daoust, were mentored by Nicolas and implemented a
few advanced samplers for downscaling and upscaling."

Alexandre Prokoudine
http://libregraphicsworld.org
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Daniel Smith]

well you actually download the software.
i haven't tried to run it without a connection.
and yeah the 360 a year is probably only the first year.
but some people like adobe and typekit fonts a lot.
and not having to pay for them takes it down to 310 right there.
there are a lot of other alternatives out there too fontwise, and
that space is only going to grow. you could make the same
"may never use" argument to prove that every single person
in the world should not download anything, some people have no use for it.
i just know video seems to be a big deal coming on lately esp with html5 and
maybe some people who had an interest in pshop or gimp might have an interest in
AE or Premiere etc.
Dan

On 12/15/12, Steve Kinney  wrote:
> On 12/15/2012 08:46 PM, Ofnuts wrote:
>> On 12/15/2012 01:39 AM, Daniel Smith wrote:
>>> it also has After Effects, Premiere Pro, etc. Lots of good stuff. For
>>> 30 a month?
>>>
>> You mean, 360 a year? For plenty of stuff I may never use?
>
> I could be wrong but... For stuff that fails if your network
> connection goes down?
>
> :o)
>
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Daniel Smith]

Oh, and one more thing, I am in no way denigrating gimp by
suggesting an alternative. In fact, if I had enough money, and
i probably will someday soon, I would use gimp in a way that would
turn it into a powerhouse of usefulness that i believe is being completely
ignored by this community, but like a lot of others here I'll just keep my
mouth shut till i try it.
Thanks again
Dan

On 12/15/12, Daniel Smith  wrote:
> well you actually download the software.
> i haven't tried to run it without a connection.
> and yeah the 360 a year is probably only the first year.
> but some people like adobe and typekit fonts a lot.
> and not having to pay for them takes it down to 310 right there.
> there are a lot of other alternatives out there too fontwise, and
> that space is only going to grow. you could make the same
> "may never use" argument to prove that every single person
> in the world should not download anything, some people have no use for it.
> i just know video seems to be a big deal coming on lately esp with html5
> and
> maybe some people who had an interest in pshop or gimp might have an
> interest in
> AE or Premiere etc.
> Dan
>
> On 12/15/12, Steve Kinney  wrote:
>> On 12/15/2012 08:46 PM, Ofnuts wrote:
>>> On 12/15/2012 01:39 AM, Daniel Smith wrote:
 it also has After Effects, Premiere Pro, etc. Lots of good stuff. For
 30 a month?

>>> You mean, 360 a year? For plenty of stuff I may never use?
>>
>> I could be wrong but... For stuff that fails if your network
>> connection goes down?
>>
>> :o)
>>
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Steve Kinney]

On 12/15/2012 08:46 PM, Ofnuts wrote:
> On 12/15/2012 01:39 AM, Daniel Smith wrote:
>> it also has After Effects, Premiere Pro, etc. Lots of good stuff. For
>> 30 a month?
>>
> You mean, 360 a year? For plenty of stuff I may never use?

I could be wrong but... For stuff that fails if your network
connection goes down?

:o)

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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Ofnuts]

On 12/15/2012 01:39 AM, Daniel Smith wrote:

it also has After Effects, Premiere Pro, etc. Lots of good stuff. For
30 a month?


You mean, 360 a year? For plenty of stuff I may never use?
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Daniel Smith]

See this page for "multi-threaded gimp"
https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gimp-user-list/2012-October/thread.html
(they attended to the topic of cores during saving, etc.)

I already tried to post once in response to this topic, but i'll try again.
i will always have gimp on my machine, but i worked in graphics for
a long time, and i think the ability to have cross-program filters is
invaluable. such as photoshop to illustrator etc. If you use that kind of thing
or could find a use to learn it.

a while back my brother found an unopened box of photoshop cs2 in a
thrift store for 2 bucks. And i pushed a little with adobe and
registered it online.
And now I heard about this "adobe creative cloud" and that old cs2
qualified me to
join at 30/month. and that includes all the major 18 adobe programs,
64 bit, and
typekit premium, which is 50/yr by itself. so i took it. i mean, gimp
is great, and i guess
you can get a lot of graphics geek factor with using it, but let's
face it, one of the
other features about photoshop is that a lot of studios and designers
use it, templates are made for or from it, etc. It's just the standard
for a lot of the art/.design world.
And a lot of the great thing about that creative cloud is photoshop is
just the entry point,
it also has After Effects, Premiere Pro, etc. Lots of good stuff. For
30 a month?
Daniel

On 12/14/12, Chris Mohler  wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 14, 2012 at 5:44 PM, Steve Kinney  wrote:
>> In re adjustment layers, I may be missing something fundamental but
>> I seem to be doing the same thing, more or less, in the GIMP:
>
> Nah. In PS I can insert a "levels" layer.  Everything under the layer
> is affected by the levels operation.  But here's the kicker - you can
> always go back and adjust the levels settings.  I don't use PS all
> that much anymore, but there were a few adjustment layers that real
> time-savers ("colorize" being one).
>
> As you say, you can "sort of" get the same result in GIMP manually but
> the mechanism is not the same at all.
>
> Chris
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Chris Mohler]

On Fri, Dec 14, 2012 at 5:44 PM, Steve Kinney  wrote:
> In re adjustment layers, I may be missing something fundamental but
> I seem to be doing the same thing, more or less, in the GIMP:

Nah. In PS I can insert a "levels" layer.  Everything under the layer
is affected by the levels operation.  But here's the kicker - you can
always go back and adjust the levels settings.  I don't use PS all
that much anymore, but there were a few adjustment layers that real
time-savers ("colorize" being one).

As you say, you can "sort of" get the same result in GIMP manually but
the mechanism is not the same at all.

Chris
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Steve Kinney]

On 12/14/2012 12:04 PM, Matthew Miller wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 12, 2012 at 10:53:42PM +0100, MasterRahl wrote:
>> #1: in over all view how does gimp stack up to Photoshop and all of its
>> features, are they compairable? to each other.
> 
> I've tried to answer this from a photography point of view here
> 
>  http://photo.stackexchange.com/a/7691/1943
> 
> as fairly as possible. (If there's anything missing or which should be
> corrected, let me know.) This is aimed squarely at photography, though;
> graphic design or image creation and related features aren't considered.

It looks like you are very familiar with both packages, which is
unusual.  Thanks for taking the time to write a detailed feature
comparison, I have not seen one before.

In re mathemagical upscaling, I have been using a plugin called
"upsize" that seems to give consistently better results than cubic
interpolation.  I don't know who made it or what math it uses; I
think I got it from the plugin registry site.

In re adjustment layers, I may be missing something fundamental but
I seem to be doing the same thing, more or less, in the GIMP:

1)  To run the filter against one layer, duplicate the layer and
work on that.  To run it against a multi-layer image, do "copy
visible" and paste this in as a new top layer.  This will be the
"adjustment layer."

2)  Apply the desired filter, with a stronger effect than your
finished result should have.  Try to go "just a little" overboard.

3)  Adjust the transparency of the layer to adjust the net effect of
the applied filter on the image.  As/when indicated, set the
filtered layer's mode so that only the values you want to change are
affected by it.

I find that deliberately overdoing a filter and dialling back its
strength with transparency and mode adjustments, gets better results
than guesswork and undo/tweak/redo operations - and does so in a
tiny fraction of the time.  It's also non-destructive with regard to
other layers, which is a Very Good Thing.  If this is the workflow
an adjustment layer helps the user do in Photoshop, props to Adobe
for creating a feature that makes this paradigm more accessible to
the user.

:o)

Steve




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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Kevin Cozens]

On 12-12-12 04:53 PM, MasterRahl wrote:

I have photoshop, and i have gimp installed, and I dont know much about gimp and
how it is compaired to Photoshop

I want to stop using photoshot and only use gimp, exclusivly.

i have a few questions in general


It would be better if you first answer a question about your use of 
Photoshop. What features in the program are important to you in what you do? 
Are you generating images for a web site or for print media?


You can do (almost?) anything with GIMP that you can do with Photoshop but 
the ease with which you can do so will vary. If you need high bit depth GIMP 
is getting there but the support isn't fully there yet. If you need a colour 
managed work flow (ie. for print work), GIMP may or may not have what you 
need. I don't use GIMP to create images for print media so I can't give you 
any hard details on using it for print images.


--
Cheers!

Kevin.

http://www.ve3syb.ca/   |"Nerds make the shiny things that distract
Owner of Elecraft K2 #2172  | the mouth-breathers, and that's why we're
| powerful!"
#include  | --Chris Hardwick
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Matthew Miller]

On Wed, Dec 12, 2012 at 10:53:42PM +0100, MasterRahl wrote:
> #1: in over all view how does gimp stack up to Photoshop and all of its
> features, are they compairable? to each other.

I've tried to answer this from a photography point of view here

 http://photo.stackexchange.com/a/7691/1943

as fairly as possible. (If there's anything missing or which should be
corrected, let me know.) This is aimed squarely at photography, though;
graphic design or image creation and related features aren't considered.


-- 
Matthew Miller   mat...@mattdm.org  
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Shlomi Fish]

Hi all,

On Thu, 13 Dec 2012 05:25:36 +0100
MasterRahl  wrote:

> >I don't know, I guess the limit is higher then your computer could
> >offer ;)
> >you're welcome!
> 
> I plan on getting a 64 or 128 core amd or intel server, with as much ram as
> posibble aprox 1TB(1024GB) or 2 TB if i happen to find one.
> 
> 
> I I've had computers that support 64GB ram and loading any computer game you
> play, into ram, loads really quick, there is no lag when playing a game, from
> copying to a ram disk to game start-up and loading the first game level such
> as diablo 3 or WoW or BF3 it is very sweet.
> 

I was a little confused by this message, so I consulted the ##hardware channel
on irc.freenode.net, and based on what they told me MasterRahl is most probably
joking given that:

1. I got indirect access (by proxy) to some High Performance machines,
hosted at several universities, and the most I could get was 512 GB (or half a
TB) per node (running RHEL Linux or something). These computers are very pricey
and I'm not sure they sell them to individuals, and they had many CPUs.

2. The largest DIMMs you can get now have 16 GB of RAM and you'll need 64 slots
to make them into a 1 TB.

I guess MasterRahl was speaking tongue in chick. In any case, I think GIMP can
utilise 1 TB or 2 TB of RAM, when and if they will be available, but I'm not
sure if it was ever tested. Anyway, 16 GB (or less) should be more than enough
for most needs. Regarding 128 cores - GIMP may not be able to fully utilise
them to their maximal capacity, but utilising SMP properly is a hard problem,
and it was an ongoing focus of programming language research (with some costs
of making such languages less simple and less easy to learn and use).

Regards,

Shlomi Fish

-- 
-
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List of Text Editors and IDEs - http://shlom.in/IDEs

COBOL is the old Java.

Please reply to list if it's a mailing list post - http://shlom.in/reply .
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Re: [Gimp-user] Questions about gimp compairing gimp to PS

[Steve Kinney]

On 12/12/2012 08:39 PM, devvv wrote:

>> #2: are gimp's tool's brushes filters and ect.. are they as good as
>> photoshop. do they give the same quality output that PS does?
> 
> the brushes are great, there are hundreds of them available in the web to
> enhance GIMP. they give you the same quality output. GIMPs brushes "engine" is
> getting more awesome with every release.

Also note that you can scale brush sizes on the fly with the mouse
wheel - if you enable that function in the Preferences menus.  I
think this is a really important function.  Picture worth thousand
words:

http://pilobilus.net/img/mouse-scale-brush.jpg

IMO this key binding should be a default.

I also like to do "create new" in the Brushes dialog box, to open a
brush editor window that I can drag and drop into a dock.  I save a
generic default brush with the name "000" to assure it is always
first in the brushes menu.  With the brush editor tab docked, it is
possible to quickly adjust the shape, aspect ratio, and hardness of
the "000" brush.  I often find this more convenient than repeatedly
switching between multiple brushes.  You can also make your own
custom brushes, any shape, color, etc., in the GIMP.

With the upcoming version 3.0, the GIMP will have a new, much higher
resolution color model.  This will close the last remaining
performance gap between GIMP and Photoshop that I see in the kind of
work I do.

:o)

Steve




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