Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Le 12/09/2019 à 20:51, Peter Kokot a écrit : > Just a dumb idea, since there clearly is a majority in favor of the > change with these warnings and strictness and all that now... Why not > making something like an LTS PHP 7.x where all the legacy code would > work OK as long as practically possibl

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Fri, Sep 13, 2019 at 11:59 AM Olumide Samson wrote: > "We know it is bad or can be devastating Actually, that's not at all what we're saying. I think that doing something like @$foo++ is absolutely fine. Many others on this (and related) threads think so too. I find all the 'improvements'

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> On 13 Sep 2019, at 15:28, Mark Randall wrote: > > the notion of > > declare(sloppy=1); > > Has already been jokingly proposed, Who ever said it was a joke proposal? :-P -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

I'm thinking this thread is receiving much attention than really required. Irrespective of the left and right argument, I think everyone wants a better language, the leftist are just arguing on a very lazy fact, not that they don't see anything bad in their wrong argument they are all just trying

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> Many of these are ticking bombs - unmaintained extensions with possible > security issues. Totally agree. > Right now the biggest problem of WordPress ecosystem is quality of community > extensions and themes. Being intimately involved in the WordPress ecosystem, I do not know If it is the

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On 13/09/2019 09:10, Christian Schneider wrote: Is it really worth it? It's absolutely worth it. Stopping execution flow at erroneous or ambiguous statements is an essential part of secure, reliable programming. A notice or warning offers no protection at all. Unless you've taken some very

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Hello Zeev Would you mind sharing with us why you specifically would be able to single handedly decide what gets merged into PHP and what not? Kind regards Brent On 13 Sep 2019, 01:56 +0200, Zeev Suraski , wrote: > > > On 13 Sep 2019, at 2:50, Joe Watkins wrote: > > > > Zeev, > > > > > Without

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Fri, Sep 13, 2019 at 10:10 AM Christian Schneider wrote: > Am 13.09.2019 um 09:41 schrieb Lester Caine : > > On 12/09/2019 23:16, Mike Schinkel wrote: > >> Those who vote on this list will decide if breaking WordPress > end-user's site bothers them or not. > > That's something too few people o

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> Upgrading the ~68,000 open source plugins available on wordpress.org > , thousands of commercial plugins, and and an untold > number of custom-developed bespoke plugins and custom themes is where the > concern lies. Many of these are ticking bombs - unmaintained extens

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Am 13.09.2019 um 09:41 schrieb Lester Caine : > On 12/09/2019 23:16, Mike Schinkel wrote: >> Those who vote on this list will decide if breaking WordPress end-user's >> site bothers them or not. That's something too few people on this list seem to be aware of: Breaking other people's perfectly fu

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On 12/09/2019 23:16, Mike Schinkel wrote: How many of those are actually developers? Because the way I understand this numbers, "powering the web", that doesn't mean 34% are also developers. It wouldn't surprise me if a big portion of these applications could've also be a system written in ano

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019, 10:15 PM Chase Peeler wrote: > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 4:59 PM Alexandru Pătrănescu > wrote: > >> Hi guys, >> >> > Many of us don't consider it bad code. I've also always initialized >> > variables when it was required (and many times when it wasn't) even >> though >> >

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> On 13 Sep 2019, at 2:50, Joe Watkins wrote: > > Zeev, > > > Without getting to the technicalities, simply put, no. > > I'm not sure what you intend to do to stop it. I sincerely hope reason will prevail and we won't have to find out (as I was hoping this part of the RFC won't be put up for

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Hi Zeev, I just reminded the rules so everyone remembers we have them for this mailing list. I actually was not referring to hints 1 and 2, even if I still believe they are good hints to follow in order to have the discussion more productive and respectful to everyone. I was actually referring to

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Zeev, > Without getting to the technicalities, simply put, no. I'm not sure what you intend to do to stop it. Once again, I remind you that you don't have the authority that your behaviour communicates you have, at all. I wasn't starting a conversation, I was communicating facts, and I'm finish

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On 13 Sep 2019, at 2:21, Joe Watkins mailto:krak...@gmail.com>> wrote: Zeev, I'm going to keep this really short and simple ... I'll do the same. You don't have the authority to make unilateral decisions for PHP,. Neither does anybody else on this list. Not even a plurality or a majority o

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Zeev, I'm going to keep this really short and simple ... You don't have the authority to make unilateral decisions for PHP,. Nothing you are saying is going to have any effect, the people who actually work on the language will merge whatever is voted in. Cheers On Fri, 13 Sep 2019, 00:17 Mike

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> How many of those are actually developers? Because the way I understand this > numbers, "powering the web", that doesn't mean 34% are also developers. It > wouldn't surprise me if a big portion of these applications could've also be > a system written in another language, deployed, plugins ins

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Fri, Sep 13, 2019 at 12:35 AM Lynn wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 10:58 PM Peter Bowyer > wrote: > > > > > One can argue that WordPress, with it powering 34% of the web (source: > > wordpress.org) represents more than 50% of PHP users, and therefore > > aligning the language to how they use

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> It's not a matter of won't upgrade, but that they can't upgrade. If Wordpress > decides to take their time supporting PHP 8, wordpress users won't have any > option but to wait on upgrading. To be clear, WordPress core upgrading to support PHP won't be a big issue. And WordPress core code ha

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> Whenever one of these errors will occur, you can initialize either the array > key or variable with null and it will work again without changing behavior. Whatever the case, changing warnings to errors would require fixing working code. And for many people, that would requiring investing lots

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Fri, Sep 13, 2019 at 12:00 AM Alexandru Pătrănescu wrote: > Also, I would also like to remind of this: > https://github.com/php/php-src/blob/master/docs/mailinglist-rules.md > I think some parts might have been violated multiple time in this thread. As was already pointed out in a different

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Sep 12, 2019, at 11:06 AM, Olumide Samson wrote: > I think they could switch to using null instead, or perhaps get something > else to differentiate what they have initialized or not, Perhaps, but switching the code requires finding the right people to do the work and then funding the change

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 10:58 PM Peter Bowyer wrote: > > One can argue that WordPress, with it powering 34% of the web (source: > wordpress.org) represents more than 50% of PHP users, and therefore > aligning the language to how they use it would be sensible, as they are the > majority of users.

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 4:59 PM Alexandru Pătrănescu wrote: > Hi guys, > > > Many of us don't consider it bad code. I've also always initialized > > variables when it was required (and many times when it wasn't) even > though > > I wasn't forced to do so. A lot of other people do as well. If it's

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Hi guys, > Many of us don't consider it bad code. I've also always initialized > variables when it was required (and many times when it wasn't) even though > I wasn't forced to do so. A lot of other people do as well. If it's so > important to you, start a program to teach people how you think the

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, 12 Sep 2019 at 19:10, Lynn wrote: > Whenever one of these errors will occur, you can initialize either the > array key or variable with null and it will work again without changing > behavior. If anything, Wordpress shouldn't be an argument to not improve > PHP, though I think it's import

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:29 PM Chase Peeler wrote: > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 3:17 PM Olumide Samson > wrote: > >> On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:11 PM Michael Babker >> wrote: >> >> > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 2:06 PM Olumide Samson >> > wrote: >> > >> >> On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:00 PM Michael

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 3:17 PM Olumide Samson wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:11 PM Michael Babker > wrote: > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 2:06 PM Olumide Samson > > wrote: > > > >> On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:00 PM Michael Babker < > michael.bab...@gmail.com> > >> wrote: > >> > >>> On Thu, Se

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 2:17 PM Olumide Samson wrote: > Most of these changes wouldn't have been problematic to you if the > language has prevented you from writing what we can now consider bad code, > so please allow the new PHP developer that newly start using PHP to not > follow that your path

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:15 PM Chase Peeler wrote: > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 3:06 PM Olumide Samson > wrote: > >> On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:00 PM Michael Babker >> wrote: >> >> > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:51 PM Peter Kokot >> wrote: >> > >> > > Just a dumb idea, since there clearly is a m

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:11 PM Michael Babker wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 2:06 PM Olumide Samson > wrote: > >> On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:00 PM Michael Babker >> wrote: >> >>> On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:51 PM Peter Kokot >>> wrote: >>> >>> > Just a dumb idea, since there clearly is a major

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 3:06 PM Olumide Samson wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:00 PM Michael Babker > wrote: > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:51 PM Peter Kokot > wrote: > > > > > Just a dumb idea, since there clearly is a majority in favor of the > > > change with these warnings and strictnes

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 2:06 PM Olumide Samson wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:00 PM Michael Babker > wrote: > >> On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:51 PM Peter Kokot wrote: >> >> > Just a dumb idea, since there clearly is a majority in favor of the >> > change with these warnings and strictness and

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 8:00 PM Michael Babker wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:51 PM Peter Kokot wrote: > > > Just a dumb idea, since there clearly is a majority in favor of the > > change with these warnings and strictness and all that now... Why not > > making something like an LTS PHP 7.x

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 2:35 PM Zeev Suraski wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:39 PM Andreas Heigl wrote: > > > > > > > > You may be wondering, in that case, what processes do we have to deal > > with > > > such changes then? The answer is simple. We don't. We don't have to > > have > > > th

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 2:51 PM Peter Kokot wrote: > On Thu, 12 Sep 2019 at 20:35, Zeev Suraski wrote: > > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:39 PM Andreas Heigl wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > You may be wondering, in that case, what processes do we have to deal > > > with > > > > such changes then?

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:51 PM Peter Kokot wrote: > Just a dumb idea, since there clearly is a majority in favor of the > change with these warnings and strictness and all that now... Why not > making something like an LTS PHP 7.x where all the legacy code would > work OK as long as practically

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, 12 Sep 2019 at 20:35, Zeev Suraski wrote: > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:39 PM Andreas Heigl wrote: > > > > > > > > You may be wondering, in that case, what processes do we have to deal > > with > > > such changes then? The answer is simple. We don't. We don't have to > > have > > > the

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:39 PM Andreas Heigl wrote: > > > > You may be wondering, in that case, what processes do we have to deal > with > > such changes then? The answer is simple. We don't. We don't have to > have > > them either - the fundamental language behaviors are here to stay. > > Bu

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Indeed, for the case of local variables that were undefined before, this can usually be fixed in a straightforward way by initializing to NULL. The goal here is to get rid of the error or notice while preserving the original behavior (even if it was buggy). This is IF this is your own custom code,

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

I'm sure that some people wrote code like this, expecting it to always work in PHP: if ($some_condition) define("HELLO", 0); if (HELLO) { var_dump("got here"); } The equivalent, relying on buggy behaviour, PHP code looks like if ($some_condition) $hello = 1; if (!$hello) { var_dump("got here");

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> On 13 Sep 2019, at 01:07, Chase Peeler wrote: > > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:58 PM Stephen Reay wrote: > > > On 13 Sep 2019, at 00:41, Chase Peeler wrote: > > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:33 PM Matthew Brown > > wrote: > > > >> What if Java suddenly said that all properties are su

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 2:10 PM Lynn wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:59 PM Mike Schinkel wrote: > > > > > > > Just a few weeks ago I was refactoring some particularly horrible code > > developed by previously employed developers — a code based that has a > 1400 > > line function and many othe

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:10 PM Lynn wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:59 PM Mike Schinkel wrote: > > > > > > > Just a few weeks ago I was refactoring some particularly horrible code > > developed by previously employed developers — a code based that has a > 1400 > > line function and many othe

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:58 PM Olumide Samson wrote: > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 6:54 PM Chase Peeler > wrote: > >> On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:33 PM Matthew Brown >> wrote: >> >> > What if Java suddenly said that all properties are suddenly private, and >> >> can only be accessed through gett

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:59 PM Mike Schinkel wrote: > > > Just a few weeks ago I was refactoring some particularly horrible code > developed by previously employed developers — a code based that has a 1400 > line function and many other functions 100s of lines long, and I added some > initializa

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 2:07 PM Olumide Samson wrote: > I think it would do this list more good than not, if we talk or assume > about some people who will ever or never upgrade... > Seriously? > How do you know if they would never or ever upgrade, you can only and > should probably speak for you

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

I think it would do this list more good than not, if we talk or assume about some people who will ever or never upgrade... Seriously? How do you know if they would never or ever upgrade, you can only and should probably speak for yourself... If they want more customers(translating to revenue), the

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:58 PM Stephen Reay wrote: > > > On 13 Sep 2019, at 00:41, Chase Peeler wrote: > > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:33 PM Matthew Brown > > wrote: > > > >> What if Java suddenly said that all properties are suddenly private, and > >>> can only be accessed through getter/se

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 6:54 PM Chase Peeler wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:33 PM Matthew Brown > wrote: > > > What if Java suddenly said that all properties are suddenly private, and > >> can only be accessed through getter/setter methods? > >> > > > > If Java announced that the next major

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> On Sep 12, 2019, at 10:37 AM, Lynn wrote: > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:22 PM Chase Peeler wrote: > >> There are valid reasons for not always initializing variables or array >> keys. It might be a bad >> reason in your opinion, but others view it as perfectly acceptable. >> > > I recently h

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> On 13 Sep 2019, at 00:41, Chase Peeler wrote: > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:33 PM Matthew Brown > wrote: > >> What if Java suddenly said that all properties are suddenly private, and >>> can only be accessed through getter/setter methods? >>> >> >> If Java announced that the next major ve

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:33 PM Matthew Brown wrote: > What if Java suddenly said that all properties are suddenly private, and >> can only be accessed through getter/setter methods? >> > > If Java announced that the next major version was to make the change after > 95% of userland developers fav

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:39 PM Olumide Samson wrote: > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 6:22 PM Chase Peeler > wrote: > >> On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:05 PM Matthew Brown >> wrote: >> >> > that don't fundamentally change the language >> > >> > >> > There's clearly a big disagreement about whether thi

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:33 PM Matthew Brown wrote: > What if Java suddenly said that all properties are suddenly private, and >> can only be accessed through getter/setter methods? >> > > If Java announced that the next major version was to make the change after > 95% of userland developers fav

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 6:22 PM Chase Peeler wrote: > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:05 PM Matthew Brown > wrote: > > > that don't fundamentally change the language > > > > > > There's clearly a big disagreement about whether this is a fundamental > > change or not. > > > > Preventing something that

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 7:22 PM Chase Peeler wrote: > There are valid reasons for not always initializing variables or array > keys. It might be a bad > reason in your opinion, but others view it as perfectly acceptable. > I recently had to fix a bug where a variable was renamed, caused a merge

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> > What if Java suddenly said that all properties are suddenly private, and > can only be accessed through getter/setter methods? > If Java announced that the next major version was to make the change after 95% of userland developers favoured it and over 2/3rds of their internals team did, I'd th

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:05 PM Matthew Brown wrote: > that don't fundamentally change the language > > > There's clearly a big disagreement about whether this is a fundamental > change or not. > > Preventing something that the entire field of software engineering frowns > upon (and that most PHP

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> > that don't fundamentally change the language There's clearly a big disagreement about whether this is a fundamental change or not. Preventing something that the entire field of software engineering frowns upon (and that most PHP developers avoid like the plague) doesn't seem like a *fundamen

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

t;> >> But we shouldn't accept his door-shutting terms just because he says so. >> >> Respectfully, >> >> Scott Arciszewski >> Chief Development Officer >> Paragon Initiative Enterprises <https://paragonie.com> >> >> Scott Arciszewski >> Chief

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

tive Enterprises <https://paragonie.com> > > Scott Arciszewski > Chief Development Officer > Paragon Initiative Enterprises > > > On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 11:11 AM Zeev Suraski wrote: > > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > >

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

gt; > Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2019 5:59 PM > > To: Zeev Suraski > > Cc: PHP Internals List > > Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors > > > > If you want to have an authoritative say on what the RFC process is for or > > not, > >

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Hey Zeev. I'm not that deep into @internals and might not get the subtle subtext. English is not my native tongue so I might phrase things in a way that doesn't transport the whole meaning of my thoughts. But your Mail really left me curious: On Thu, 12 Sep 2019 at 10:44, Zeev Suraski wrote: >

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> > From: Marco Pivetta > > Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2019 5:59 PM > > To: Zeev Suraski > > Cc: PHP Internals List > > Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors > > > > If you want to have an authoritative say on what the RFC proc

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Without your contributions in the early 2000s, PHP likely would not enjoy the popularity it does today. But I don't think that gives you veto power over the entire process. You haven't made any significant contributions to the codebase in over a decade, and yet the language has still gained many m

RE: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> -Original Message- > From: Olumide Samson > Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2019 6:03 PM > To: Dan Ackroyd > Cc: Zeev Suraski ; PHP internals > Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors > > The RFC is Request for Comment on any changes,

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 11:01 AM Jordi Boggiano wrote: > On 12/09/2019 16:44, Zeev Suraski wrote: > > Similarly - adding typed variables - is certainly a future option. > Changing > > PHP to require typed variables (without opting in) - is well outside of > the > > internals@ mandate. > > > > > >

RE: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

> -Original Message- > From: Marco Pivetta > Sent: Thursday, September 12, 2019 5:59 PM > To: Zeev Suraski > Cc: PHP Internals List > Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors > > If you want to have an authoritative say on what the RFC

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

You first me on that reply Dan, I guess I should just say "the naysayers are back", I can see their footprint all around. The RFC is Request for Comment on any changes, is there an explicit or implicit mention about what kind of proposed changes can be made? Mr/Mrs Zeev are you for PHP or against

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On 12/09/2019 16:44, Zeev Suraski wrote: Similarly - adding typed variables - is certainly a future option. Changing PHP to require typed variables (without opting in) - is well outside of the internals@ mandate. For areas like that - our options are either doing nothing, or providing opt-

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

чт, 12 сент. 2019 г. в 16:53, Dan Ackroyd : > On Thu, 12 Sep 2019 at 15:44, Zeev Suraski wrote: > > > > The RFC process was never, ever meant to handle fundamental changes to > the > > language. > > The only appropriate response to this is "lolwat?". > > You keep making up rules...that don't exis

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

Hi Zeev, On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 4:44 PM Zeev Suraski wrote: > I was really really hoping that we will avert having to dive into this and > instead go for the alternative solution that was proposed of changing > default php.ini error levels. But since the RFC went on to a vote - we > need > to

Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors

On Thu, 12 Sep 2019 at 15:44, Zeev Suraski wrote: > > The RFC process was never, ever meant to handle fundamental changes to the > language. The only appropriate response to this is "lolwat?". You keep making up rules...that don't exist. You can't expect people to suddenly stop using RFCs to cha