On Sun, Jun 09, 2013 at 10:11:08AM -0400, Nadim Kobeissi wrote:
On 2013-06-09, at 10:08 AM, Rich Kulawiec r...@gsp.org wrote:
Second: stupidity, in all forms, fully deserves to be slapped down --
This is where I stop reading.
I have to admit, even though I've read this half a dozen times,
I
Hold on...
On Jun 11, 2013 12:27 AM, Yosem Companys compa...@stanford.edu wrote:
snip The distinction between direct or indirect access is semantic, not
substantive, and likely irrelevant to most Americans. snip
And then...
As I said, a recent NY Times article spoke specifically of the
Rich Kulawiec:
On Sun, Jun 09, 2013 at 10:11:08AM -0400, Nadim Kobeissi wrote:
On 2013-06-09, at 10:08 AM, Rich Kulawiec r...@gsp.org wrote:
Second: stupidity, in all forms, fully deserves to be slapped down --
This is where I stop reading.
I have to admit, even though I've read this half
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 10:27:33PM +0200, Guido Witmond wrote:
The big deal is that now it's become impossible to believe the lies, and
that you [Americans] are forced to accept the truth.
Reality check: https://twitter.com/_nothingtohide
[mailto:liberationtech-boun...@lists.stanford.edu] On Behalf Of Eugen Leitl
Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2013 6:21 AM
To: liberationtech@lists.stanford.edu
Subject: Re: [liberationtech] Boundless Informant: the NSA's secret tool to
track global surveillance data
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 10:27:33PM +0200, Guido Witmond
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 01:48:23PM -0700, x z wrote:
@Rich, those are good movie scripts :-). But it does not work for 9 firms,
and hundreds of execs all with diverse values and objectives.
Two responses.
hundreds? Not necessary. Not desirable, from the NSA's point of view,
either. One
On 11-06-13 12:21, Eugen Leitl wrote:
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 10:27:33PM +0200, Guido Witmond wrote:
The big deal is that now it's become impossible to believe the lies, and
that you [Americans] are forced to accept the truth.
Reality check: https://twitter.com/_nothingtohide
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 01:30:19AM -0700, x z wrote:
First of all, I don't feel offended by Jacob's reply to my email at all,
probably because I know and expect his style of wording. So far I think the
discussion is still pretty civil.
I concur. This is what spirited discussion looks like.
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 12:01 PM, x z xhzh...@gmail.com wrote:
Occam's razor would give us the following is what has actually happened in
the past three days: a semi-clueless whistle blower fed an overzealous
journalist a low-quality powerpoint deck, which met the privacy-paranoia and
Maxim Kammerer:
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 12:01 PM, x z xhzh...@gmail.com wrote:
Occam's razor would give us the following is what has actually happened in
the past three days: a semi-clueless whistle blower fed an overzealous
journalist a low-quality powerpoint deck, which met the
On 10-06-13 21:36, Jacob Appelbaum wrote:
Maxim Kammerer:
On Mon, Jun 10, 2013 at 12:01 PM, x zxhzh...@gmail.com wrote:
Occam's razor would give us the following is what has actually
happened in the past three days: a semi-clueless whistle blower
fed an overzealous journalist a low-quality
Nadim Kobeissi na...@nadim.cc wrote:
What qualifies a journalist as overzealous? Is it passion and hard work?
When this passion produces a consistent stream of intelligent arguments and
debate, is it still overzealous? Ask yourself these questions.
I don't think Glenn Greenwald is
x z:
@Jacob, I agree with your points regarding American exceptionalism.
@Eugen, to prepare for the worst scenario is one thing, to advocate some
shady rumor as fact is another.
@Rich, those are good movie scripts :-). But it does not work for 9 firms,
and hundreds of execs all with diverse
On 2013-06-10, at 6:09 PM, Jacob Appelbaum ja...@appelbaum.net wrote:
x z:
@Jacob, I agree with your points regarding American exceptionalism.
@Eugen, to prepare for the worst scenario is one thing, to advocate some
shady rumor as fact is another.
@Rich, those are good movie scripts :-).
On 2013-06-10, at 6:26 PM, Yosem Companys compa...@stanford.edu wrote:
The distinction between direct or indirect access is semantic, not
substantive, and likely irrelevant to most Americans. What Americans want to
know is whether there is access to their personal data, and I would bet
I argue that direct access or not is is substantive, not semantic. We have
the following two versions of the story:
*A: The Guardian story alleges that NSA has direct access to user data from
major internet firms, and these firms are willingly cooperating with NSA
for the capability of en masse
x z:
I argue that direct access or not is is substantive, not semantic. We have
the following two versions of the story:
*A: The Guardian story alleges that NSA has direct access to user data from
major internet firms, and these firms are willingly cooperating with NSA
for the capability of
Heu!
On 11.06.2013, at 01:11, x z xhzh...@gmail.com wrote:
I argue that direct access or not is is substantive, not semantic. We have
the following two versions of the story:
*A: The Guardian story alleges that NSA has direct access to user data from
major internet firms, and these firms
x z:
2013/6/8 Jacob Appelbaum ja...@appelbaum.net
Oh man, Glenn Greenwald is my hero and a hero to us all.
Do you still believe Glenn's reporting that NSA has direct access to
servers of firms including Google, Apple and Facebook?
Yeah, I think it is clearly a FISA interface or API of
Jake,
I don't agree with x z (and rather agree with you), but I'm really tired of
just how aggressive and rude you always are on Libtech. And it doesn't appear
to just be towards me. I'm not the only person who feels like this.
Even if you're right, tone your ego knob down already. Be nice. I
On Sun, Jun 09, 2013 at 09:45:31AM -0400, Nadim Kobeissi wrote:
I don't agree with x z (and rather agree with you), but I'm really tired of
just how aggressive and rude you always are on Libtech.
First: you've got to be kidding. I've never seen a single message on
this list that goes past
On 2013-06-09, at 10:08 AM, Rich Kulawiec r...@gsp.org wrote:
On Sun, Jun 09, 2013 at 09:45:31AM -0400, Nadim Kobeissi wrote:
I don't agree with x z (and rather agree with you), but I'm really tired of
just how aggressive and rude you always are on Libtech.
First: you've got to be
complete agreement with Rich on my part.
On Sun, Jun 9, 2013 at 10:08 AM, Rich Kulawiec r...@gsp.org wrote:
On Sun, Jun 09, 2013 at 09:45:31AM -0400, Nadim Kobeissi wrote:
I don't agree with x z (and rather agree with you), but I'm really tired
of just how aggressive and rude you always are
+1 to the tone comments, but my verdict is still out on greenwald, though
until I see the lawyers and privacy people talking a big game (not just
executives) I would tend to believe there is more than a grain of accuracy.
On Jun 9, 2013 6:45 AM, Nadim Kobeissi na...@nadim.cc wrote:
Jake,
I
This is very silly. The list would be much better served if people
would restrain from metaflaming on stuff that's not really a
flame - especially in this case, it sounds to me that's just another
instance of friendly fire
Best Regards | Cordiales Saludos | Grato,
Andrés L. Pacheco Sanfuentes
+1000 on Nadim's comment who is not always that civil either. If you notice who
speaks on this list- it's geeky men. And not just speak but flame at times and
engage in silly meta discussions best filtered out.
The discourse on this list, in general, does not encourage truly thoughtful
On 2013-06-09, at 11:49 AM, Katrin Verclas kat...@mobileactive.org wrote:
+1000 on Nadim's comment who is not always that civil either.
It's absolutely right that I also sometimes can get riled up or passionate.But
they key word there is sometimes. Some on this list are just almost *always*
From our list guidelines:
3. We have a zero-tolerance policy for anyone who posts inflammatory,
extraneous, or off-topic messages, so please keep discussions
constructive and civil. We urge you to use the list to ask for (or
offer) advice, discuss issues, and share information. But please
refrain
Nadim Kobeissi:
Jake, I don't agree with x z (and rather agree with you), but I'm
really tired of just how aggressive and rude you always are on
Libtech. And it doesn't appear to just be towards me. I'm not the
only person who feels like this.
Even if you're right, tone your ego knob down
On 2013-06-09, at 1:02 PM, Jacob Appelbaum ja...@appelbaum.net wrote:
Nadim Kobeissi:
Jake, I don't agree with x z (and rather agree with you), but I'm
really tired of just how aggressive and rude you always are on
Libtech. And it doesn't appear to just be towards me. I'm not the
only
Nadim Kobeissi:
On 2013-06-09, at 1:02 PM, Jacob Appelbaum ja...@appelbaum.net
wrote:
Nadim Kobeissi:
Jake, I don't agree with x z (and rather agree with you), but
I'm really tired of just how aggressive and rude you always are
on Libtech. And it doesn't appear to just be towards me. I'm
It seems Europe isn't safe either from data mining, due to overreach:
http://www.zdnet.com/blog/igeneration/google-admits-patriot-act-requests-handed-over-european-data-to-u-s-authorities/12191
NK
On 2013-06-09, at 1:22 PM, Jacob Appelbaum ja...@appelbaum.net wrote:
Nadim Kobeissi:
On
Oh man, Glenn Greenwald is my hero and a hero to us all. Everyone on
this list who was looking for 'some evidence' about global surveillance
and previously ignored all other evidence, well, here you go!
Revealed: The NSA's powerful tool for cataloguing data – including
figures on US collection
On 06/08/2013 09:35 PM, Jacob Appelbaum wrote:
This screenshot from the program is very web 2.0:
http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/pictures/2013/6/8/1370715185657/boundless-heatmap-large-001.jpg
Just noticed this Map by Ammap.com in the screenshot
http://www.ammap.com/
amMap is
2013/6/8 Jacob Appelbaum ja...@appelbaum.net
Oh man, Glenn Greenwald is my hero and a hero to us all.
Do you still believe Glenn's reporting that NSA has direct access to
servers of firms including Google, Apple and Facebook? In my view, he
misled the world intentionally (the few prism
From the Washington Post, just published:
Intelligence community sources said that this description, although
inaccurate from a technical perspective, matches the experience of
analysts at the NSA. From their workstations anywhere in the world,
government employees cleared for PRISM access may
I guess the question is still, is it just them using the already existing API's
or do they have colocated sniffing tools?
-Andrew
On Jun 9, 2013, at 3:13 PM, Trevor Timm tre...@eff.org wrote:
From the Washington Post, just published:
Intelligence community sources said that this
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