Fargusson.Alan wrote:
But if you use an index register instead of HL you could use an offset. Now the 8080 didn't have index registers, so this may have been an issue on these.
But the index registers are for weenies... ;-) one extra byte of
opcode, and 12 T-states. Doing an INC (IX+1) takes
:
Sent by: Linux onSubject: Re: [LINUX-390] Fwd: Re: big
and little endian
390 Port
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
IST.EDU
08/06/2003 01:36
PM
Please respond
On Iau, 2003-08-07 at 18:58, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
But if you use an index register instead of HL you could use an offset. Now the
8080 didn't have index registers, so this may have been an issue on these.
At a cost of 2 bytes and if I remember rightly going up to 23 clocks
with the prefix
Don't forget that the Zilog Z-130 was based on the Bell chip
(so it was
using the same instruction set as the 3b2).
Anybody remember? ISTR the 3b2 having a muddled byte sex.
3B2? UUUGHH!
Now you've ruined my whole day. I hope you're proud of yourself.
-- db
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, Beinert, William wrote:
The explanations have been posted...
S/390 is Big Endian. Little boxes can be either...
Peecees (IA32) are little.
PPCs can be either, in Linux big, in PS/2 little.
--
Cheers
John.
Join the Linux Support by Small Businesses list at
http
ATT missed so many possibilities with a product line suggestive
of feminine foundation garment sizes... and could have done
better being *more* aggressive w/ such names.
Remember, dealing with Thoroughbred BASIC exposed me to a
LOT of different platforms, even if I handled the portation issues
On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 11:24:18AM -0400, Mark D Pace wrote:
I keep seeing references to big endian and little endian. I am going to
show off my ignorance here and ask - What does this mean? I do not know
what the term endian means.
From the Jargon File:
(http://catb.org/~esr/jargon/html/B
A computer with the massive overengineering common to Western Electric
bakelite-encased telephone handsets? What's not to love!? ;)
I still remember dodging shrapnel from an exploding capacitor when I and
a co-worker were attempting to resuscitate one of these a few years
ago. Possibly the only
I think you explained it fairly well. Perhaps you could make another try at
saying what you don't understand.
-Original Message-
From: Bernd Oppolzer [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 9:23 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
What I never
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 10:03 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
On Wed, 2003-08-06 at 11:44, Wolfe, Gordon W wrote:
Ah, yes, but when you look at a NUMBER, whether it be base-2, base-10 or base-16,
you tend to look at it with the MOST
Yep, it's all in the perception.
-Original Message-
From: Wolfe, Gordon W [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 12:45 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
Ah, yes, but when you look at a NUMBER, whether it be base-2, base-10 or base-16, you
Fargusson.Alan
[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
tb.ca.gov cc:
Sent by: Linux onSubject: Re: [LINUX-390] Fwd: Re: big
and little endian
390 Port
[EMAIL
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, Ferguson, Neale wrote:
A couple of interesting references:
http://www.noveltheory.com/TechPapers/endian.asp
http://oss.software.ibm.com/pipermail/icu4c-support/2003-June/001664.html
I'm not sure that AIX was/is necessarily tied to big-endian CPUs. Wasn't
there an '86
)
(This company dedicates this E-Mail to Master Yoda )
-Original Message-
From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of
Fargusson.Alan
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 1:53 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [LINUX-390] big and little endian
I am fairly sure
: Alan Cox [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2003 3:38 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
On Iau, 2003-08-07 at 18:58, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
But if you use an index register instead of HL you could use an offset. Now the
8080 didn't have index
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
I agree that IBM should have used the Z8000. However, I know that Zilog could not
have produced enough working chips. In the 1981-1982 period we had a hard time
getting enough working chips for our own internal use. The ones we got were much
On Wed, 2003-08-06 at 12:49, Dougie G Lawson wrote:
big-endian but byte reversed.
OK, *now* I'm confused. How is that different from Little-endian ?
PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 7:30 PM
Subject: Re: big and little endian
Yea, they were really unhappy that the 8085 didn't have any of there
ideas incorporated into it, so they started Zilog and built the Z80.
snip2eof
) for performing the
same task. You just use different tricks. If you are use to little endian you tend
to like them, but if you are use to big endian the little endian quirks can be
confusing.
-Original Message-
From: Alan Cox [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, August 08, 2003 3:58 AM
What I never understood about this: how can big ENDian be explained ?
Because, the number formats called big ENDian have the LEAST significant
byte at the END, and the little ENDians have the MOST significant byte
at the END.
Can anybody explain ?
Regards
Bernd
Am Mit, 06 Aug 2003 schrieben
On Iau, 2003-08-07 at 23:49, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
Did you mean 2-3 clocks? It wasn't anything near 23 clocks on the Z80s I used.
I am fairly sure that there was a one byte prefix to specify the index register.
1 byte for the prefix (DD/FD) then byte 3 is the offset (so 2 bytes
added). I may
A couple of interesting references:
http://www.noveltheory.com/TechPapers/endian.asp
http://oss.software.ibm.com/pipermail/icu4c-support/2003-June/001664.html
PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: big and little endian
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
I think that the 68000 is a simple bigendian. On the other hand I worked
Yeah. I've got some round here: they're in the early Macs. I've also got
a newer version of it (SMT) inside a JTEC terminal
Ok ok, I see:
big endian: the big END is stored at the BEGINNING
little endian: the little END is stored at the BEGINNING
Strange for me. I prefer the terms normal vs. Intel format :-)
Regards
Bernd
-- Weitergeleitete Nachricht --
Subject: Re: big and little endian
Date
On Wed, 2003-08-06 at 18:47, John Summerfield wrote:
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, David Boyes wrote:
3B2? UUUGHH!
Now you've ruined my whole day. I hope you're proud of yourself.
So sue
Wrong David Bo[iy]es.
Adam
as fast. It just requires a
little different logic.
-Original Message-
From: Alan Cox [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2003 4:16 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
On Mer, 2003-08-06 at 18:49, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
I suspect that little endian
On Mer, 2003-08-06 at 18:49, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
I suspect that little endian was an accident. It is easy to design little
endian for a serial adder as John pointed out. You can't tell the
difference on a word addressed machine since you need to be able to see the
same data with different
OK, ok, maybe you've got a point.
I'm reminded of an event, probably an urban legend, of an IBM'er
commenting on the joys and wonders of the 6670:
If this were a boat anchor, it would sink intermittently.
Is it time for recess yet? ;)
-dan.
David Boyes wrote:
A computer with the massive
I keep seeing references to big endian and little endian. I am going to
show off my ignorance here and ask - What does this mean? I do not know
what the term endian means.
Thanks.
Mark D Pace
Senior Systems Engineer
Mainline Information Systems
1700 Summit Lake Drive
Tallahassee, FL. 32317
to be able to see the
same data with different views to tell how it is stored. Oddly enough a
left shift is defined as shifting to the most significant bit in both little
endian and big endian systems, which is one reason I think that little
endian was an accident.
-Original Message-
From
: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 12:23 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
What I never understood about this: how can big ENDian be explained ?
Because, the number formats called big ENDian have the LEAST significant
byte at the END, and the little ENDians have the MOST significant
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, John Campbell wrote:
Please note that this has also been referred to as byte sex as well.
Back (many years ago) I worked in a company where I ported their Business
BASIC interpreter to multiple platforms so the byte sex / endianness was
one of the first things
Summerfield [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 10:48 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, John Alvord wrote:
The way I understand it, the little endian scheme is optimized for
mini/micro hardware of the middle 1970s (4004. 8080
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, Gregg C Levine wrote:
Hello again from Gregg C Levine
David, thank you for summing up the whole business in a nutshell.
I wonder what actually happened to all of that hardware. G Speaking
of which, I think someone is still avidly making Z8K devices, if only
to support
A computer with the massive overengineering common to Western Electric
bakelite-encased telephone handsets? What's not to love!? ;)
Um, the lack of TCPIP support in the v1 OS? The anemic performance, even on
the 3b2-400, top of the line (beaten handily by a 11/730 with 512K of RAM
and one
architecture. I don't know why. Note that Microsoft has stated that Windows/NT
cannot be ported to big endian. I suspect that the reasons are the same for OS/2, and
NT. Unix has been ported to both little endian, and big endian systems. I suspect
porting AIX to a little endian would
Acctually, where I worked a few years back, some of the companies other
divisions were doing new designs with Z80 and other 'old' devices in
them. BUT, they did not buy those chips. Zilog's programmable gate arrays
have downloads for them to make them operated like all the old popular
chips.
I keep seeing references to big endian and little endian. I am going to
show off my ignorance here and ask - What does this mean? I do not know
what the term endian means.
Basically, it is how numbers are stored ... if i have the number 0x01020304
and I store it in memory
On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 10:32:31AM -0700, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
| I don't know much about the 6502. The Z80 had some 16 bit operations
| that were little endian. Does the 6502 not have any 16 bit operations?
Yes, it does have some 16 bit operations. I believe it is big endian
but I don't
On Wed, 2003-08-06 at 12:32, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
I don't know much about the 6502. The Z80 had some 16 bit operations that were
little endian. Does the 6502 not have any 16 bit operations?
Even if you have not native 16 bit operations you might need to work with data from
other systems.
Ah, yes, but when you look at a NUMBER, whether it be base-2, base-10
or base-16,
you tend to look at it with the MOST significant digit on the LEFT. It
depends
entirely upon whether you're looking at it as a NUMBER or as the
contents of a
STRING OF ADDRESSES.
You know, we didn't have to
On Wed, 2003-08-06 at 10:24, Mark D Pace wrote:
I keep seeing references to big endian and little endian. I am going to
show off my ignorance here and ask - What does this mean? I do not know
what the term endian means.
What order bytes within a word are: 1234 or 4321. Most-significant
AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
On Wed, 2003-08-06 at 12:32, Fargusson.Alan wrote:
I don't know much about the 6502. The Z80 had some 16 bit operations that were
little endian. Does the 6502 not have any 16 bit operations?
Even if you have not native 16 bit
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, David Boyes wrote:
Don't forget that the Zilog Z-130 was based on the Bell chip
(so it was
using the same instruction set as the 3b2).
Anybody remember? ISTR the 3b2 having a muddled byte sex.
3B2? UUUGHH!
Now you've ruined my whole day. I hope you're
]
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 11:24 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: big and little endian
I keep seeing references to big endian and little endian. I
am going to
show off my ignorance here and ask - What does this mean? I
do not know
what the term endian means.
Thanks.
Mark D
, August 06, 2003 12:23 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
What I never understood about this: how can big ENDian be explained ?
Because, the number formats called big ENDian have the LEAST significant
byte at the END, and the little ENDians have the MOST significant byte
Message-
From: John Summerfield [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 10:31 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: big and little endian
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, John Campbell wrote:
Please note that this has also been referred to as byte sex as well.
Back (many years
On Wed, 2003-08-06 at 11:44, Wolfe, Gordon W wrote:
Ah, yes, but when you look at a NUMBER, whether it be base-2, base-10 or base-16,
you tend to look at it with the MOST significant digit on the LEFT. It depends
entirely upon whether you're looking at it as a NUMBER or as the contents of a
On Wed, 6 Aug 2003, John Alvord wrote:
The way I understand it, the little endian scheme is optimized for
mini/micro hardware of the middle 1970s (4004. 8080, PDP etc). Those
I don't think the 4004 (4-bit words) could have ben either;-)
You neglected the 8008, after the 4004 and before the
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: big and little endian
Perception of end.
visually, most folks look at low addresses in storage as on the left
hand and ascending to the right. Big Endian puts the most significant
digits on the left and hence the lower address, puts the big end of the
number
to Master Yoda )
-Original Message-
From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of
Phil Howard
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 1:55 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [LINUX-390] big and little endian
On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 10:32:31AM -0700, Fargusson.Alan
to General Obi-Wan Kenobi )
(This company dedicates this E-Mail to Master Yoda )
-Original Message-
From: Linux on 390 Port [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of
David Boyes
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 4:31 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [LINUX-390] Fwd: Re: big and little
[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
-online.de cc:
Sent by: Linux onSubject: [LINUX-390] Fwd: Re: big and
little endian
390 Port
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
IST.EDU
.
-Original Message-
From: Mark D Pace [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 10:24 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: big and little endian
I keep seeing references to big endian and little endian. I
am going to
show off my ignorance here and ask - What does
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