Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-15 Thread Ciaran McNulty
On Dec 14, 2007 6:45 PM, Andy Mabbett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a reasonable argument. It's not reasonable, though, to argue (which you're not, at least not here, but which others seem to be) that 16:03 is an abbreviation of what a human (geeks aside) would gather from the context as

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-15 Thread Ciaran McNulty
On Dec 15, 2007 1:40 AM, Scott Reynen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It seems to me 3:23 is already machine-readable Does 3:23 mean 3 mins 23 seconds, or 3 hours 23 mins, or 23 minutes past three o'clock? ;-) -Ciaran McNulty ___ microformats-discuss

Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-15 Thread Andy Mabbett
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Paul Wilkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes The least that could be got away with is 00:03:23, at which point it would be a toss up between that or PT3M23S Both of the above formats are valid and should be accepted by parsers as a part of the ISO 8601 time/date

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-15 Thread Martin McEvoy
On Sat, 2007-12-15 at 13:36 +1300, Paul Wilkins wrote: On Dec 15, 2007 1:21 PM, Martin McEvoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Sat, 2007-12-15 at 12:33 +1300, Paul Wilkins wrote: On Dec 15, 2007 12:18 PM, Martin McEvoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: you could perhaps do PT3:23 ? which seems more

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-15 Thread Andy Mabbett
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Ciaran McNulty [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes On Dec 14, 2007 6:45 PM, Andy Mabbett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That's a reasonable argument. It's not reasonable, though, to argue (which you're not, at least not here, but which others seem to be) that 16:03 is an

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-15 Thread Martin McEvoy
On Fri, 2007-12-14 at 16:23 -0800, Tantek =?ISO-8859-1?B?xw==?=elik wrote: On 12/14/07 3:55 PM, Martin McEvoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 2007-12-14 at 23:18 +, Martin McEvoy wrote: I do NOT however believe that machine data should be displayed in a people area such as @title, I

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-15 Thread Paul Wilkins
On Dec 15, 2007 8:21 AM, Ben Ward [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Agreed. I'll repost something I put into the GEO thread last week. It's quoting directly from the HTML4 specification. This doesn't actually need to have any concern with accessibility, or assistive technology tools. Frankly, the

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-15 Thread Scott Reynen
On Dec 15, 2007, at 3:08 AM, Ciaran McNulty wrote: It seems to me 3:23 is already machine-readable Does 3:23 mean 3 mins 23 seconds, or 3 hours 23 mins, or 23 minutes past three o'clock? ;-) My point is it's not productive to ask such questions outside the context of the actual problem,

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-14 Thread Ciaran McNulty
On Dec 13, 2007 3:19 PM, Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Robert O'Rourke wrote: 1. 16:03 isn't an abbreviation for 12 September 2007. That's /additional/ information. So that should be a SPAN not an ABBR. I'd disagree with this. 16:03 in the context of your original page *will*

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-14 Thread Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis
Ciaran McNulty wrote: On Dec 13, 2007 3:19 PM, Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Robert O'Rourke wrote: 1. 16:03 isn't an abbreviation for 12 September 2007. That's /additional/ information. So that should be a SPAN not an ABBR. I'd disagree with this. 16:03 in the context of

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-14 Thread Robert O'Rourke
Ciaran McNulty wrote: On Dec 13, 2007 3:19 PM, Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Robert O'Rourke wrote: 1. 16:03 isn't an abbreviation for 12 September 2007. That's /additional/ information. So that should be a SPAN not an ABBR. That was Benjamin's comment not mine.

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-14 Thread Andy Mabbett
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Ciaran McNulty [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes On Dec 13, 2007 3:19 PM, Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 1. 16:03 isn't an abbreviation for 12 September 2007. That's /additional/ information. So that should be a SPAN not an ABBR. I'd disagree with

Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-14 Thread Ben Ward
On 14 Dec 2007, at 14:06, Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis wrote: I think all of the following would be misuses of ABBR and TITLE: | Combien d'œufs ai-je vendre? J'ai vendu abbr title=quarante-cinq | 45/abbr aujourd'hui. | Combien d'œufs ai-je vendre? J'ai vendu abbr title=45 | œufs45/abbr aujourd'hui.

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-14 Thread Paul Wilkins
On Dec 15, 2007 9:19 AM, Martin McEvoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 2007-12-14 at 19:21 +, Ben Ward wrote: '3:23' IS NOT an abbreviation of the string 'PT3M23S' (hAudio). I think you're right. It should be P3M23S instead. A couple of us involved in the brainstorming and after,

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-14 Thread Martin McEvoy
On Sat, 2007-12-15 at 10:13 +1300, Paul Wilkins wrote: On Dec 15, 2007 9:19 AM, Martin McEvoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 2007-12-14 at 19:21 +, Ben Ward wrote: '3:23' IS NOT an abbreviation of the string 'PT3M23S' (hAudio). I think you're right. It should be P3M23S instead.

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-14 Thread Martin McEvoy
On Fri, 2007-12-14 at 23:18 +, Martin McEvoy wrote: I do NOT however believe that machine data should be displayed in a people area such as @title, I think machine data can be stored elsewhere in a document such as in the head in a list of link's or meta's No but seriously, with my web

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-14 Thread Paul Wilkins
On Dec 15, 2007 1:36 PM, Paul Wilkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Dec 15, 2007 1:21 PM, Martin McEvoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: hmm are you sure? 3:23 is expressed as whole plus a decimal fraction That's if you use a comma or a fullstop. With the full colon it's interpreted as hours and

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-14 Thread Scott Reynen
On Dec 14, 2007, at 12:21 PM, Ben Ward wrote: I am going to ask that we better define the problem. That we follow up the demand for a better pattern (regardless of whether your personal motivation is following the spec or assistive technology). I'd like to ask that people stop jumping

Re: Precise Expansion Patterns (was: Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes)

2007-12-14 Thread Tantek Çelik
On 12/14/07 3:55 PM, Martin McEvoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Fri, 2007-12-14 at 23:18 +, Martin McEvoy wrote: I do NOT however believe that machine data should be displayed in a people area such as @title, I think machine data can be stored elsewhere in a document such as in the head

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-13 Thread Michael Smethurst
Cc-ing (hopefully) interested bbc parties Hello Andy Long time no hear On 12/12/07 19:02, Andy Mabbett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Michael Smethurst [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes Just to say that hCalendar is used fairly extensively to describe broadcasts on

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-13 Thread Robert O'Rourke
Andy Mabbett wrote: In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Michael Smethurst [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes Just to say that hCalendar is used fairly extensively to describe broadcasts on bbc.co.uk/programmes here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/genres/music

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-13 Thread Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis
Robert O'Rourke wrote: I know it defeats the object semantically speaking but what are the other arguments against putting the machine-readable date/time in the class attribute and do they outweigh the gain in accessibility? For example, what's wrong with this: abbr

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-13 Thread Robert O'Rourke
Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis wrote: Robert O'Rourke wrote: I know it defeats the object semantically speaking but what are the other arguments against putting the machine-readable date/time in the class attribute and do they outweigh the gain in accessibility? For example, what's wrong with this:

Re: [uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-12 Thread Andy Mabbett
In message [EMAIL PROTECTED], Michael Smethurst [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes Just to say that hCalendar is used fairly extensively to describe broadcasts on bbc.co.uk/programmes here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/genres/music http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/formats/animation

[uf-discuss] Hcalendar in bbc.co.uk/programmes

2007-12-05 Thread Michael Smethurst
Hello! Just to say that hCalendar is used fairly extensively to describe broadcasts on bbc.co.uk/programmes here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/genres/music And here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/formats/animation And here: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b006qpgr/laston And etc