Re: [neonixie-l] ZM1350

[Richard Scales]

No drama - all is fair etc etc etc!

I am just two short for a project - if you ever find that you have 
spare!

I am currently working on a 12 digit smart socket based project for other 
displays - I've done a bit with Smart Sockets over the years - if you end 
up going that route I'd be happy to compare notes.
 - Richard

On Monday 29 April 2024 at 07:35:42 UTC+1 Michail Wilson wrote:

> Sorry bud, if I knew it was you…… Ummm, Ok, I would still have bid on 
> them.  Heh.
>
> Finally, after many years of waiting on them, they appeared on ebay (at 
> least that I have noticed) and barely got them because of the UK only 
> listing.
>
>  
>
> I’m excited to make ‘something’ with them.
>
>  
>
> Michail Wilson
>
> 206-920-6312 <(206)%20920-6312>
>
>  
>
> *From:* neoni...@googlegroups.com  *On Behalf 
> Of *Richard Scales
> *Sent:* Sunday, April 28, 2024 11:01 PM
> *To:* neonixie-l 
> *Subject:* Re: [neonixie-l] ZM1350
>
>  
>
> I bid too (I am in the UK and I was aware of their provenance and I live 
> just 20 minutes away from them!) - it was interesting watching the numbers 
> going up!
>
>  
>
> I'd be fairly confident that they were all good.
>
>  
>
> Well done on outbidding me ;-) 
>
> - Richard
>
>  
>
>  
>
> On Monday 29 April 2024 at 03:18:24 UTC+1 Michail Wilson wrote:
>
> I won the auction which some might wonder how since they were not sold to 
> the USA.
>
> I’ve been talking to a guy from the Ukraine and he sent me a link.  I 
> decided I wanted them, but seller would not ship out of the country.
>
>  
>
> I’m in a Bitcoin forum/chat rooms and someone I’ve dealt with for a while 
> had me thinking….. I had him bid and pay for me.
>
>  
>
> Story on the auction… Not tested.  Auction says 6, but 4 extra included 
> just in case.   So, possibly 10.   Since I’ve only ever had two, I decided 
> to win it.
>
> Talking to seller and it turns out they were part of the late John Smout’s 
> collection.  Now I got really excited and thinking all 10 should be good.
>
>  
>
> Two days prior to having a friend bid on them had me worried, because he 
> didn’t answer messages.  Uhhhg.  He came through and manually bid for me.
>
>  
>
> So, a double shipping, and I will find out in about a month.  Well, maybe 
> longer since I don’t have any project boards, etc.
>
>  
>
> My guess is about 1125 L total.  Around $150 each assuming all are good.  
> Not considering the extras in the package yet.
>
>  
>
> Note:  I picked up another of his auctions as well which was VFDs.  IV-25’s
>
>  
>
> Michail Wilson
>
> 206-920-6312 <(206)%20920-6312>
>
>  
>
> *From:* neoni...@googlegroups.com  *On Behalf 
> Of *Nicholas Stock
> *Sent:* Sunday, April 28, 2024 4:31 PM
> *To:* neoni...@googlegroups.com
> *Subject:* Re: [neonixie-l] ZM1350
>
>  
>
> I've given up thinking what a good price is now that looks like about 
> $200 each when taking tax/currency conversion into account.
>
>  
>
> They are very nice tubes when lit up. They've gone to a good home 
> (presumably Michail from his smiley face reply... ;)
>
>  
>
> On Sun, Apr 28, 2024 at 4:28 PM Robert  wrote:
>
> Good price?
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Rob
>
>  
>
> On 28 Apr 2024, at 16:16, Michail Wilson  wrote:
>
>  
>
> 
>
>  
>
> Michail Wilson
>
> 206-920-6312 <(206)%20920-6312>
>
>  
>
> *From:* neoni...@googlegroups.com  *On Behalf 
> Of *Robert
> *Sent:* Sunday, April 28, 2024 4:55 AM
> *To:* neoni...@googlegroups.com
> *Subject:* [neonixie-l] ZM1350
>
>  
>
> Not my auction but did anyone on here get them 
>
>  
>
>
>  
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/266778846760?mkcid=16=1=711-127632-2357-0=oUHk6HLEQUG=4429486=U1YeAcPgQ5y=_ver=artemis=COPY
>  
> <https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/266778846760?mkcid=16=1=711-127632-2357-0=oUHk6HLEQUG=4429486=U1YeAcPgQ5y=_ver=artemis=COPY>
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Rob
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "neonixie-l" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
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> To view this discussion on the web, visit 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/E7BC25D2-B3E4-4C9B-8D2D-B0B8BC7C5C10%40gmail.com
>  
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/E7BC25D2-B3E4-4C9B-8D2D-B0B8BC7C5C10%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
> .
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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> 

Re: [neonixie-l] ZM1350

[Richard Scales]

I bid too (I am in the UK and I was aware of their provenance and I live 
just 20 minutes away from them!) - it was interesting watching the numbers 
going up!

I'd be fairly confident that they were all good.

Well done on outbidding me ;-) 

- Richard


On Monday 29 April 2024 at 03:18:24 UTC+1 Michail Wilson wrote:

> I won the auction which some might wonder how since they were not sold to 
> the USA.
>
> I’ve been talking to a guy from the Ukraine and he sent me a link.  I 
> decided I wanted them, but seller would not ship out of the country.
>
>  
>
> I’m in a Bitcoin forum/chat rooms and someone I’ve dealt with for a while 
> had me thinking….. I had him bid and pay for me.
>
>  
>
> Story on the auction… Not tested.  Auction says 6, but 4 extra included 
> just in case.   So, possibly 10.   Since I’ve only ever had two, I decided 
> to win it.
>
> Talking to seller and it turns out they were part of the late John Smout’s 
> collection.  Now I got really excited and thinking all 10 should be good.
>
>  
>
> Two days prior to having a friend bid on them had me worried, because he 
> didn’t answer messages.  Uhhhg.  He came through and manually bid for me.
>
>  
>
> So, a double shipping, and I will find out in about a month.  Well, maybe 
> longer since I don’t have any project boards, etc.
>
>  
>
> My guess is about 1125 L total.  Around $150 each assuming all are good.  
> Not considering the extras in the package yet.
>
>  
>
> Note:  I picked up another of his auctions as well which was VFDs.  IV-25’s
>
>  
>
> Michail Wilson
>
> 206-920-6312 <(206)%20920-6312>
>
>  
>
> *From:* neoni...@googlegroups.com  *On Behalf 
> Of *Nicholas Stock
> *Sent:* Sunday, April 28, 2024 4:31 PM
> *To:* neoni...@googlegroups.com
> *Subject:* Re: [neonixie-l] ZM1350
>
>  
>
> I've given up thinking what a good price is now that looks like about 
> $200 each when taking tax/currency conversion into account.
>
>  
>
> They are very nice tubes when lit up. They've gone to a good home 
> (presumably Michail from his smiley face reply... ;)
>
>  
>
> On Sun, Apr 28, 2024 at 4:28 PM Robert  wrote:
>
> Good price?
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Rob
>
>
>
> On 28 Apr 2024, at 16:16, Michail Wilson  wrote:
>
>  
>
> 
>
>  
>
> Michail Wilson
>
> 206-920-6312 <(206)%20920-6312>
>
>  
>
> *From:* neoni...@googlegroups.com  *On Behalf 
> Of *Robert
> *Sent:* Sunday, April 28, 2024 4:55 AM
> *To:* neoni...@googlegroups.com
> *Subject:* [neonixie-l] ZM1350
>
>  
>
> Not my auction but did anyone on here get them 
>
>  
>
>
>  
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/266778846760?mkcid=16=1=711-127632-2357-0=oUHk6HLEQUG=4429486=U1YeAcPgQ5y=_ver=artemis=COPY
>  
> 
>
>  
>
>  
>
> Rob
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "neonixie-l" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
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> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/E7BC25D2-B3E4-4C9B-8D2D-B0B8BC7C5C10%40gmail.com
>  
> 
> .
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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> To view this discussion on the web, visit 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/SA0PR01MB617010535213044DDD4849CA82142%40SA0PR01MB6170.prod.exchangelabs.com
>  
> 
> .
>
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>  
> 
> .
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>  
> 
> .
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Re: [neonixie-l] SP-252 Smart Socket based device

[Richard Scales]

For some pictures see 
here: http://www.panaplex.co.uk/untitled-page-2023-08-29-045409/

 - Richard


On Tuesday 16 April 2024 at 14:26:43 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:

> I have made one of my regular green tint acrylic + copper coloured corners 
> and screws type of cases.
>
> I keep trying to post pictures but I just get 'Message has been deleted' 
> errors ?
>
> If anyone would like to make one of these then I do have a small number of 
> kits available with displays - please send me a PM.
>
>  - Richard
>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] SP-252 Smart Socket based device

[Richard Scales]

I have made one of my regular green tint acrylic + copper coloured corners 
and screws type of cases.

I keep trying to post pictures but I just get 'Message has been deleted' 
errors ?

If anyone would like to make one of these then I do have a small number of 
kits available with displays - please send me a PM.

 - Richard

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Re: [neonixie-l] SP-252 Smart Socket based device

[Richard Scales]

If anyone is interested in a kit to build one of these then please send a 
PM - I am investigating getting the small components on the Smart-Socket 
pre-fabbed to avoid all that tiny soldering and I have a number of displays 
on hand.
 - Richard


On Thursday 11 April 2024 at 20:22:19 UTC+1 Nick Andrews wrote:

> Well, if you can afford or find the Panaplex units, why not?  I have just 
> a couple salvaged from things.  Since I know what they are, so glad they 
> didn't get thrown away like so many of the old blue calculator/adding 
> machine display tubes...
>
> On Wed, Apr 10, 2024 at 12:46 AM Richard Scales  
> wrote:
>
>> If there was ever an example of over engineering then this must be it! 
>> Here we have 14 PCBs, 180 transistors, 360 resistors and 13 processors all 
>> working together to drive six SP-252 multi segment Panaplex displays using 
>> the Smart Socket circuit that was designed originally for B-7971 tubes.
>> It's taken quite some time to pull this all together, mostly because of 
>> all the SMD parts and my soldering skills - the resistors are 0603.[image: 
>> SP-252Pic2.jpg][image: SP-252Pic3.jpg][image: SP-252Pic1.jpg] 
>> Regardless, the hardware is done, now working on the software to take 
>> advantage of 12 digits of alpha numeric neon. 
>> Each display sits on its own PCB. Two Smart socket PCB's plug in to the 
>> back of the display board - one on top - one underneath - these then plug 
>> in to the backplane that has the power supplies, sensor and Wemos.
>>
>> Time is NTP synced, at 30 seconds past each minute it will display (in a 
>> scrolling  or some other transitioning style):
>>
>> The date - like" WEDNESDAY 10TH APRIL 2024"
>> or
>> Sensor Data which is temperature, humidity, pressure
>> or
>> One of 10 pre-defined text sequences
>> I plan to add a web gui to allow setting of the timezone and definition 
>> of the text messages to scroll at some point - Many thanks to Paul Andrews 
>> for his assistance with that. The thing now sits in a case and looks a lot 
>> more presentable - I'll get some pictures of that asap.
>> - Richard 
>>
>> -- 
>>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "neonixie-l" group.
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>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/ac447d2b-fc58-4a6c-b267-e70893883083n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] SP-252 Smart Socket based device

[Richard Scales]

Hello Peter and thank you.

Yes, well, that HV module is rated at 30mA max - with all segments on that 
should draw about 36mA (based on an average of 200uA per segment) which is 
TOO MUCH - so I allowed space on the board for 2 x NCH8300HV or 1 x 
NCH6300HV.

So, theoretically - as it stands it is under powered - in practice - all 
segments are never illuminated at the same time. Things are not getting hot 
at the moment. There is a jumper to link the two sides of the clock 
together in terms of the HV supplies which allows the thing to run  from a 
single NCH8200HV - or a single NCH6300HV. 

Further measurements are needed to be sure.

 - Richard


On Wednesday 10 April 2024 at 07:05:24 UTC+1 Peter Hall wrote:

> Stunning as usual..1 x Omnixie to power it all.Amazing
>
> FromPeter Hall insidiousnixies輦Utube 
>
> On 10 Apr 2024 1:46 pm, Richard Scales  wrote:
>
> If there was ever an example of over engineering then this must be it! 
> Here we have 14 PCBs, 180 transistors, 360 resistors and 13 processors all 
> working together to drive six SP-252 multi segment Panaplex displays using 
> the Smart Socket circuit that was designed originally for B-7971 tubes.
> It's taken quite some time to pull this all together, mostly because of 
> all the SMD parts and my soldering skills - the resistors are 0603.[image: 
> SP-252Pic2.jpg][image: SP-252Pic3.jpg][image: SP-252Pic1.jpg] 
> Regardless, the hardware is done, now working on the software to take 
> advantage of 12 digits of alpha numeric neon. 
> Each display sits on its own PCB. Two Smart socket PCB's plug in to the 
> back of the display board - one on top - one underneath - these then plug 
> in to the backplane that has the power supplies, sensor and Wemos.
>
> Time is NTP synced, at 30 seconds past each minute it will display (in a 
> scrolling  or some other transitioning style):
>
> The date - like" WEDNESDAY 10TH APRIL 2024"
> or
> Sensor Data which is temperature, humidity, pressure
> or
> One of 10 pre-defined text sequences
> I plan to add a web gui to allow setting of the timezone and definition of 
> the text messages to scroll at some point - Many thanks to Paul Andrews for 
> his assistance with that. The thing now sits in a case and looks a lot more 
> presentable - I'll get some pictures of that asap.
> - Richard 
>
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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>  
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/ac447d2b-fc58-4a6c-b267-e70893883083n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
> .
>
>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Anyone want to collaborate on electroluminescent display projects ?

[Richard Scales]

.. but if needed - I have a small stash of those  - I note that they are no 
longer available from Adafuit.
 - Richard


On Friday 5 April 2024 at 08:56:33 UTC+1 Paul Andrew Lafranchise wrote:

> Opto-triacs seemed to work fine for my segment driver setup (which I think 
> is essentially the same as Richard's). I would also be interested in the 
> details of the power supply you put together. The Adafruit "blue" EL 
> power supply <https://www.arrow.com/en/products/448/adafruit-industries> 
> I used is essentially a black (blue?  :-)) box and I'd love to replace it 
> with something I understand better and have built myself.  
>
> On Mon, Apr 1, 2024 at 9:08 PM Richard Scales  
> wrote:
>
>> I have a board which drives the displays just fine, opt triacs which I 
>> drive from a PIC using the B-7971 Smart Socket code (slightly modified) and 
>> i have had great success using the 'blue' EL power supply from Adafruit (I 
>> think that's where they came from - I bought a bag of them).
>>
>> For the sake of doing it right I would be interested in some of your HV 
>> EL power supplies - I am broadly assuming that the will perform better than 
>> what I have used so far.
>>  - Richard
>>
>> On Monday 1 April 2024 at 23:24:17 UTC+1 gregebert wrote:
>>
>>> Right now it looks like there will be 3 different PCB's: One for the HV 
>>> power supply, one for a single I-95, and another for 2-4 IEL-0-IV (I havn't 
>>> sized the board yet, but it needs to be less than 4" per side). I use a 
>>> modular design approach, and everything is connected with a 10-pin 
>>> ribbon-cable serial bus I call IOLINK. So if you are willing to adapt your 
>>> favorite controller to the IOLINK interface, which uses 12V signalling (2 
>>> inputs, 5 outputs), these boards will be workable for you.
>>>
>>> On Monday, April 1, 2024 at 7:59:59 AM UTC-7 Keith Moore wrote:
>>>
>>>> I am interested but not much help with the design. I'd love to use my 
>>>> displays though. 
>>>>
>>>> On Thursday, March 14, 2024 at 1:43:24 PM UTC-4 gregebert wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I'm finally at the point I have time to work on a design for my 
>>>>> Soviet-era electroluminescent displays. I have 2 types, the smaller 
>>>>> IEL-0-IV, and a much larger I-195. Both are the 'alien' style formats, 
>>>>> and 
>>>>> will make unusual clocks.
>>>>>
>>>>> I have done some very initial testing on the smaller one, and it 
>>>>> appears to be burning the phosphor after just a few hours of usage. It's 
>>>>> not lit very bright, so I dont know if this is a common burn-in phase, or 
>>>>> not. Documentation is pretty limited, and I've been running a 50-page 
>>>>> document page-by-page thru google translate; so far nothing has come up 
>>>>> regarding burn-in.
>>>>>
>>>>> If anyone out there is working-on IEL's, or planning-to do so, please 
>>>>> chime in so we can start a discussion here.
>>>>>
>>>>> [image: electrolum.jpg]
>>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>
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[neonixie-l] Re: Anyone want to collaborate on electroluminescent display projects ?

[Richard Scales]

I have a board which drives the displays just fine, opt triacs which I 
drive from a PIC using the B-7971 Smart Socket code (slightly modified) and 
i have had great success using the 'blue' EL power supply from Adafruit (I 
think that's where they came from - I bought a bag of them).

For the sake of doing it right I would be interested in some of your HV EL 
power supplies - I am broadly assuming that the will perform better than 
what I have used so far.
 - Richard

On Monday 1 April 2024 at 23:24:17 UTC+1 gregebert wrote:

> Right now it looks like there will be 3 different PCB's: One for the HV 
> power supply, one for a single I-95, and another for 2-4 IEL-0-IV (I havn't 
> sized the board yet, but it needs to be less than 4" per side). I use a 
> modular design approach, and everything is connected with a 10-pin 
> ribbon-cable serial bus I call IOLINK. So if you are willing to adapt your 
> favorite controller to the IOLINK interface, which uses 12V signalling (2 
> inputs, 5 outputs), these boards will be workable for you.
>
> On Monday, April 1, 2024 at 7:59:59 AM UTC-7 Keith Moore wrote:
>
>> I am interested but not much help with the design. I'd love to use my 
>> displays though. 
>>
>> On Thursday, March 14, 2024 at 1:43:24 PM UTC-4 gregebert wrote:
>>
>>> I'm finally at the point I have time to work on a design for my 
>>> Soviet-era electroluminescent displays. I have 2 types, the smaller 
>>> IEL-0-IV, and a much larger I-195. Both are the 'alien' style formats, and 
>>> will make unusual clocks.
>>>
>>> I have done some very initial testing on the smaller one, and it appears 
>>> to be burning the phosphor after just a few hours of usage. It's not lit 
>>> very bright, so I dont know if this is a common burn-in phase, or not. 
>>> Documentation is pretty limited, and I've been running a 50-page document 
>>> page-by-page thru google translate; so far nothing has come up regarding 
>>> burn-in.
>>>
>>> If anyone out there is working-on IEL's, or planning-to do so, please 
>>> chime in so we can start a discussion here.
>>>
>>> [image: electrolum.jpg]
>>>
>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Scope clock STM32

[Richard Scales]

I too would be interested in a kit if you are considering making such a 
thing available.

- Richard


On Monday 26 February 2024 at 18:50:05 UTC paulvr wrote:

> The flyback converter is built around the TI LM5156H. This IC was selected 
> because it has an external mosfet, which means the voltage on the primary 
> side can be increased considerably and the winding ratio does not have to 
> be very high. An external mosfet generally also has better properties that 
> improve efficiency. The chosen mosfet is very small and difficult to 
> solder, as an alternative I can recommend the IPP17N25S3-100.
> The flyback transformer is from Würth from the WE-FLEX series. The 
> insulation voltage is not great considering the output voltage, but I have 
> not been able to detect any problems. The achieved efficiency is between 70 
> and 80% depending on the input voltage and output power. The output power 
> easily reaches 6 to 7 Watts depending on the input voltage. Minimum input 
> voltage approximately 9 Volts, maximum 16 Volts limited by the LM5156H.
> The filament power supply is built around TI's SN6507. That is a fairly 
> new IC and one of the few forward converters I have found that can supply 
> up to an ampere and more. Together with a Würth push-pull transformer it is 
> a good combination to supply the 6.3 Volt up to 600 mA. The SN6507 has 
> programmable current limiting, but that doesn't really work well with the 
> filament which has a very low start-up resistance. The converter remains in 
> current limiting mode when the programmed current is too low. Efficiency in 
> combination with the buck converter approximately 80%.
>
> Op maandag 26 februari 2024 om 17:30:59 UTC+1 schreef David Forbes:
>
>> Paul,
>>
>> This is quite a nice project. It looks like a very clean display. 
>> I have run out of the custom transformers I had made in 2006, and I'm 
>> quite interested in using off-the-shelf ones in the future. Would you be 
>> willing to share a schematic of what you made? 
>> I also appreciate using SVG rather than rolling your own graphics. That's 
>> a nice standard solution that makes sense in this age. 
>>
>>
>> On 2/26/2024 2:12 AM, paulvr wrote:
>>
>> This is my first post in this forum and I would like to introduce you to 
>> my version of the scope clock. Mainly inspired by the work of David Forbes 
>> and Grahame Marsh.
>> The work is not finished yet, but I have reached a milestone for myself 
>> in that all components are on one PCB and only one voltage source is 
>> required, nm. 12 volts DC.
>> The high voltage is made using a standard Würth WE-flex transformer, plus 
>> and minus 250 Volt. The filament voltage is provided by a buck and forward 
>> converter and a standard Würth push-pull transformer (6.3 Volt to 600mA).
>> The MCU is an STM32G491, mainly chosen because of the integrated 12-bit 
>> DACs. The image composition is completely DMA controlled and works 
>> independently of the CPU, which therefore has a lot of time for other tasks.
>> The characters and graphic shapes are encoded as SVG path.
>> An ESP32 has been added to achieve the correct time according to the NTP. 
>> Operation is entirely via a web server running on the ESP32. The software 
>> is not finished, and not all functions work (work in progress).
>> The next step is to try out other CRT tubes and make a housing.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Paul
>>
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: EleksTubeIPS replacement firmware

[Richard Scales]

Many thanks for this - installation was a breeze, all looking lovely.
 - Richard

On Wednesday 21 February 2024 at 02:10:25 UTC Paul Andrews wrote:

> Last release for a while, barring the odd bug fix. Available at the usual 
> place . This is the 
> release notes:
>
>
>- Added a default clock face that includes colons, am, pm and empty 
>background.
>- Added an additional time display mode that uses four digits, a 
>flashing colon and a display of today's weather.
>- Changed the initial configuration to use this clock face and display 
>the four-digit clock with weather.
>- The default weather icons have also changed to *monochrome*. These 
>icons can be drawn against the blank background and the color can be 
>adjusted to match the color of the clock face (via the *Weather* page).
>- Where the GUI allows you to adjust colors the controls indicate what 
>will happen as you adjust the color
>- There is an additional color control that both displays the current 
>color and provides an alternate way to modify it.
>- The GUI is responsive to the state of the clock - it will hide 
>controls that aren't used for the current clock state.
>- The clock can now display BMP files that have 1, 2, 4, 8, 16 or 24 
>bits per pixel. batch_convert_images.py has been modified to produce files 
>with these various bit depths.
>
> This is a piccie:
>
> [image: original.jpg]
>
> On Saturday, February 10, 2024 at 2:39:34 PM UTC-5 Paul Andrews wrote:
>
>>
>> Tell me more about all this. I would like to provide access to a movement 
>> sensor, so I’ve ordered a aqara motion sensor and a sonoff zigbee dongle. 
>> I’m a little confused about the options from there on though. e.g. ESPHome, 
>> zigbee2mqtt, HA etc. It seems like just polling an mqtt broker would be 
>> easiest from the perspective of getting data from the sensor but I would 
>> like this to be as general as possible given the memory restrictions that I 
>> have in the clock. Any guidance would be gratefully received.
>> On Saturday, January 27, 2024 at 10:38:55 AM UTC-5 Benoit Tourret wrote:
>>
>>> I also like esp web tools, this is a great piece of art !!!
>>> I am using the version used on Home Assistant, called EspHome 
>>> . this is an esp32, 8266, rp2040 "os" used with 
>>> simple yaml configuration files.
>>> I use it with success for many sensors and displays in my home, and I 
>>> try to use it on my new clock: B-7971/eight equipped with SmartSockets.
>>> up to now I can display time / date and internal + external temperature. 
>>> I wish I could display message from HomeAssistant...
>>>
>>>
>>> Le samedi 27 janvier 2024 à 02:33:28 UTC+1, Paul Andrews a écrit :
>>>
 I recently did a search to see if EleksMaker had updated the firmware 
 for the EleksTubeIPS clock so that it could use the WiFi connectivity that 
 the ESP32 has. Well, they hadn't, but now *I* have - though I'm not 
 the first. Note that they released a *v2* of this clock that does have 
 WiFi connectivity, so this firmware is for the original *v1* clocks. I 
 went a bit crazy with it: It syncs with NTP, has a web-based GUI, you can 
 upload new clock faces from the GUI, you can configure it to display a 5 
 day weather forecast etc.- details are here 
 .

 My software engineer heart particularly loves the esp web tools 
  interface - you can flash 
 the firmware and connect the clock to WiFi directly from the page above.

 Anyhow, hope you like.

>>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Helping Nixie Tubes Fire in a Darkened Room

[Richard Scales]

That board was from weeks ago!!!

I had no idea things had got that serious.

My last order was No. 428 

... I need help

- Richard
On Tuesday 20 February 2024 at 07:05:16 UTC newxito wrote:

> The clock looks great! 
>
> It seems we have the same PCB manufacturer. Only 402 orders so far? I'm 
> already at 418 :-)
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Reaches for popcorn....

[Richard Scales]

I managed to resist - despite the almost overwhelming hoarding instinct!
 - Richard

On Monday 5 February 2024 at 12:47:32 UTC Paul Andrews wrote:

> Yeah. He could easily have got more I think. Possibly they were sold off 
> eBay, He posted on Nixie Tube Artists Facebook group before listing them.
>
> On Sunday, February 4, 2024 at 7:38:54 PM UTC-5 Audrey wrote:
>
>> Someone did the buy it now for $1650 for the CD47 listing, jeez...
>>
>> On Sun, Feb 4, 2024, 7:25 PM Nicholas Stock  wrote:
>>
>>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/176223472746
>>>
>>> Fugly tubes anyone? I kid (sort of...)..
>>>
>>> Super, super rare. Don't see these at auction often, not my listing!
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>>
>>> Nick
>>>
>>> -- 
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: [Review] A IN-17 mini clock kit and case by nixology.uk

[Richard Scales]

There are a few more details available at: https://www.nixology.uk/prism-18/

Use the contact form there or this forum to get in touch for more 
information.

- Richard


On Thursday 25 January 2024 at 13:18:34 UTC Richard Scales wrote:

>
> The case kit now includes these knurled head copper effect screws:
>
> [image: No photo description available.]
>
>  - Richard
> On Wednesday 24 January 2024 at 04:24:21 UTC Organs Grinder wrote:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> Recently, I finished assembling a clock kit and case I brought from 
>> Richard (nixology.uk).
>> I wanted a small Nixie clock that supported time sync via NTP vs GPS or 
>> other means.
>>
>> The clock kit was shipped and packaged well, making reuse of plastic 
>> Ziploc bags for parts.(thank you!)
>>
>> Instructions are provided in a PDF and the WEMOS microcontroller should 
>> come pre-programmed.
>> However, Richard is available via email and willing to help if there are 
>> issues.
>>
>> Assembling the clock was simple, and the smaller SMD parts had been pre 
>> soldered for you.
>> Pay extra attention to the direction of the boards when assembling, as it 
>> is possible to connect them upside down.
>> I believe this may be resolved in a newer kit version.
>> However it caused me no issue.
>>
>> You can also attach external PIR or microwave sensors, or install an 
>> optional LDR.
>> I plan to use an external PIR connected via the 3.5 mm socket on the rear 
>> later on.
>>
>> Setup of the software was also simple, connect to the AP, enter the 
>> password.
>> Set a few basic things like colon flashing type, time, and date 
>> scrolling, and you're off and running.
>> I've had zero need to connect to the web UI after the initial setup, and 
>> the clock has been running smoothly.
>>
>> I quite like the size of the IN-17 in this case, the clock is quite 
>> compact and visually the IN-17's takes up a lot of the front panel.
>>
>> I colour matched the front bolts to the 3d printed case sides, somewhat. 
>> The kit ships with black bolts normally.
>>
>>
>> Here you can see a few pictures I have taken, apologies for not amazing 
>> photos as that is not my best skill.
>> If anyone wants any further pictures, please do let me know.
>>
>> [image: nixology-in-17-on.jpg]
>> [image: nixology-in-17-front.jpg]
>> [image: nixology-in-17-rear.jpg]
>>
>> Many thanks, it's awesome.
>>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: [Review] A IN-17 mini clock kit and case by nixology.uk

[Richard Scales]

The case kit now includes these knurled head copper effect screws:

[image: No photo description available.]

 - Richard
On Wednesday 24 January 2024 at 04:24:21 UTC Organs Grinder wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> Recently, I finished assembling a clock kit and case I brought from 
> Richard (nixology.uk).
> I wanted a small Nixie clock that supported time sync via NTP vs GPS or 
> other means.
>
> The clock kit was shipped and packaged well, making reuse of plastic 
> Ziploc bags for parts.(thank you!)
>
> Instructions are provided in a PDF and the WEMOS microcontroller should 
> come pre-programmed.
> However, Richard is available via email and willing to help if there are 
> issues.
>
> Assembling the clock was simple, and the smaller SMD parts had been pre 
> soldered for you.
> Pay extra attention to the direction of the boards when assembling, as it 
> is possible to connect them upside down.
> I believe this may be resolved in a newer kit version.
> However it caused me no issue.
>
> You can also attach external PIR or microwave sensors, or install an 
> optional LDR.
> I plan to use an external PIR connected via the 3.5 mm socket on the rear 
> later on.
>
> Setup of the software was also simple, connect to the AP, enter the 
> password.
> Set a few basic things like colon flashing type, time, and date scrolling, 
> and you're off and running.
> I've had zero need to connect to the web UI after the initial setup, and 
> the clock has been running smoothly.
>
> I quite like the size of the IN-17 in this case, the clock is quite 
> compact and visually the IN-17's takes up a lot of the front panel.
>
> I colour matched the front bolts to the 3d printed case sides, somewhat. 
> The kit ships with black bolts normally.
>
>
> Here you can see a few pictures I have taken, apologies for not amazing 
> photos as that is not my best skill.
> If anyone wants any further pictures, please do let me know.
>
> [image: nixology-in-17-on.jpg]
> [image: nixology-in-17-front.jpg]
> [image: nixology-in-17-rear.jpg]
>
> Many thanks, it's awesome.
>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

Very nice work - a lot more sophisticated than I dare to dream to achieve!
 - Richard


On Tuesday 9 January 2024 at 08:55:39 UTC Jon wrote:

> >For the hardware I was thinking that one of the 595's would connect to 
> low sided drivers (MPSA42 etc) to ground the required cathodes whilst the 
> other 595 would connect to high sided drivers (MPSA42+MPSA92 etc) to 
> connect the >desired anode to the HV supply
>
> Yes, that approach works really well. See this clock from a few years 
> back: https://youtu.be/4FnxWsp58EM
>
> Each six tube row is a 2 x 3 multiplex controlled by a pair of 595s 
> driving discrete transistor high-side drivers for the anodes, low side 
> drivers for the decimal points and a pair of Russian K155ID1 (near 
> equivalents of the 141) to decode and low side drive the digits. The 
> K155ID1 route was chosen instead of a regular logic decoder and discrete 
> low side drivers to save board space without getting into lots of fiddly 
> SMD stuff. And then each of the seven rows simply have their pairs of 595s 
> hooked up to make a 14 device total daisychain that controls the whole 
> display. There's a single PIC18 running the show which bit blasts display 
> refreshes down the daisychain  as well as managing USB comms, talking to a 
> DS3232 RTC - plenty of compute time and power to do that. The nice thing is 
> that this approach reduces all the display composition and management to 
> software - multiplexing, cross-fading, all the funky display animations 
> shown in the video; it's all just a matter of figuring out what bits to set 
> when in the 144 bit output stream. Took me right back to my programming 
> roots writing for bit-mapped displays on 8 bit micros in the early 80s! :)
>
> Jon.
>
>
> On Tuesday, January 9, 2024 at 5:03:52 AM UTC Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> @ David - that is an interesting idea - I did that already in another 
>> design  where I wanted to reduce the workload on an ESP8266 so I used a 
>> Teensy running a state machine based piece of code to do the heavy lifting 
>> - the ESP8266 just fed data to the Teensy over a serial connection - I kid 
>> you not - it works really well - though that is all running a lot slower 
>> than what I need for this multiplexed display project.
>> I am actually hoping to do it all on ESP8266 this time round with a 
>> couple of 595's driven via SPI transfers and some state-machine based code 
>> which manages the display.
>>
>> The next part of my planning is to gain the understanding of what delays 
>> are required and where.
>>
>> I am broadly assuming that I need to do things in the following order:
>>
>> {
>> Set the cathodes for the number to be displayed
>> Delay before turning on anode
>> Set the desired anode on
>> Wait for the desired 'anode on' time
>> Set the anode off
>> Wait for the desired 'anode off ' time
>> Increment the current anode number (reset to 0 if we got past the max)
>> }
>>
>> In this way, the anode on and off times can be set - thus controlling 
>> fading etc
>>
>> My next question is - do I need to wait at all after setting the cathodes 
>> up and before turning the required anode on?
>>
>> For the hardware I was thinking that one of the 595's would connect to 
>> low sided drivers (MPSA42 etc) to ground the required cathodes whilst the 
>> other 595 would connect to high sided drivers (MPSA42+MPSA92 etc) to 
>> connect the desired anode to the HV supply.
>>
>> I was then thinking that all anodes and cathodes would connect to 
>> something like 80V via a suitable resistance - as per the Bally schematic 
>> for driving multiplexed panaplex displays in pinball machines.
>>
>> As detailed here: bally_as2518_15_6digit.pdf (pinitech.com) 
>> <https://www.pinitech.com/retrofit/schematics/bally_as2518_15_6digit.pdf>
>>
>> Am I anywhere near the right track on any of this?
>>
>> - Richard
>>
>>
>> On Friday 3 November 2023 at 12:12:03 UTC David Pye wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> Next time I do a clock, I am going to separate my hw into 2:
>>>
>>> A cheap ARM based MCU using SPI/DMA to do multiplexing and dimming, with 
>>> enough IO to drive anodes and cathodes via individual transistors, with 
>>> Comms to the main MCU via spi or i2c.
>>>
>>> An esp32 or esp8266 to provide application logic
>>>
>>> Using the ARM MCU and transistors solves the issues with the HV driver 
>>> ICs needing 9v and both the STM32 and the esp8266 can communicate with 3v3 
>>> signal levels and will be cheaper albeit with 

Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

@ David - that is an interesting idea - I did that already in another 
design  where I wanted to reduce the workload on an ESP8266 so I used a 
Teensy running a state machine based piece of code to do the heavy lifting 
- the ESP8266 just fed data to the Teensy over a serial connection - I kid 
you not - it works really well - though that is all running a lot slower 
than what I need for this multiplexed display project.
I am actually hoping to do it all on ESP8266 this time round with a couple 
of 595's driven via SPI transfers and some state-machine based code which 
manages the display.

The next part of my planning is to gain the understanding of what delays 
are required and where.

I am broadly assuming that I need to do things in the following order:

{
Set the cathodes for the number to be displayed
Delay before turning on anode
Set the desired anode on
Wait for the desired 'anode on' time
Set the anode off
Wait for the desired 'anode off ' time
Increment the current anode number (reset to 0 if we got past the max)
}

In this way, the anode on and off times can be set - thus controlling 
fading etc

My next question is - do I need to wait at all after setting the cathodes 
up and before turning the required anode on?

For the hardware I was thinking that one of the 595's would connect to low 
sided drivers (MPSA42 etc) to ground the required cathodes whilst the other 
595 would connect to high sided drivers (MPSA42+MPSA92 etc) to connect the 
desired anode to the HV supply.

I was then thinking that all anodes and cathodes would connect to something 
like 80V via a suitable resistance - as per the Bally schematic for driving 
multiplexed panaplex displays in pinball machines.

As detailed here: bally_as2518_15_6digit.pdf (pinitech.com) 
<https://www.pinitech.com/retrofit/schematics/bally_as2518_15_6digit.pdf>

Am I anywhere near the right track on any of this?

- Richard


On Friday 3 November 2023 at 12:12:03 UTC David Pye wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Next time I do a clock, I am going to separate my hw into 2:
>
> A cheap ARM based MCU using SPI/DMA to do multiplexing and dimming, with 
> enough IO to drive anodes and cathodes via individual transistors, with 
> Comms to the main MCU via spi or i2c.
>
> An esp32 or esp8266 to provide application logic
>
> Using the ARM MCU and transistors solves the issues with the HV driver ICs 
> needing 9v and both the STM32 and the esp8266 can communicate with 3v3 
> signal levels and will be cheaper albeit with higher component count.
>
> David
>
> On Fri, 3 Nov 2023, 11:15 Mike Mitchell,  wrote:
>
>> That's basically what I'm doing for my simple case.  The upkeep work is 
>> done after tubes are energized, where I have significantly more time before 
>> the next event.  The off time is only 200us so I don't do anything during 
>> the off time.  With the fast processors of today you could do "quick" 
>> things in the off time, but any complex computation I'd put in the longer 
>> on time.  I'm using the FastLED module to drive a short string of LEDs 
>> during my "DISP_EVEN" time, but calculate what to put into the LEDs in the 
>> "DISP_ODD" time.
>>
>> On Friday, November 3, 2023 at 12:43:40 AM UTC-4 Richard Scales wrote:
>>
>>> @Mike
>>> So, I have been getting my head around the whole state-machine concept. 
>>> I have one I did before - curiously also running on  a Teensy but that was 
>>> because I was worried about speed (I had no idea!).
>>> Regardless.
>>>
>>> Here is what I think my state-machine might look like:
>>>
>>> Set State to 'Turn Off Displays'
>>>
>>> :Main program loop
>>> If state = 'Turn off Displays' then turn off all the anodes and change 
>>> state to 'Delay before turn on'
>>>
>>> //This state exists to allow the injection of any required delay between 
>>> display of each digit / group of digits 
>>> if state = 'Delay before turn on' then if there there has been 
>>> sufficient delay, change state to 'Turn on desired display'
>>>
>>> //This state works out which cathodes and anodes to set and turns them on
>>> if state = 'Turn on desired display' then set the required cathodes and 
>>> anodes and turn them on and change state to 'Display is on'
>>>
>>> //This state works out whether the display has been on long enough
>>> if state = 'Display is on' then has it been on long enough? If so, 
>>> change state to 'Turn off Displays'
>>>
>>>
>>> Rest of clock code goes here - and by that I mean the business of 
>>> working out what to display be it time, date, temp, pressure etc.
>>> Obviously everything must be

[neonixie-l] Re: board with inverted fractions and digits tubes

[Richard Scales]

I have bought these before and might still have a fraction tube - I will 
have a look and report back.
I'll be bidding on this one too - so if lucky - I will most certainly have 
a fraction tube for you - if they work!
One such board arrived with 25% of the tubes smashed :-(
 - Richard

On Sunday 31 December 2023 at 23:10:44 UTC Audrey wrote:

> not my listing :p
> looks like 4x zm1237, and 22x matching digits tubes that I couldn't find 
> the part number for
> If someone ends up parting this board out I'd be interested in buying one 
> of the fractions tubes!
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/126261134203

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Re: [neonixie-l] Introduction & Telefunken Varisymbol alphanumeric advertisement sign ZM1350 ZM1360 & ZM1370

[Richard Scales]

Awesome find - very well done.

I am seriously envious!

I look forward to seeing how you get on.

- Richard


On Tuesday, 14 November 2023 at 06:07:17 UTC Magnedyne wrote:

> This sign was most likely built in the former Telefunken Röhrenfarbrik in 
> Ulm, Germany. I picked it up closeby as well. Luckily I live close to Ulm 
> because I wouldn’t have risked shipping such a delicate sign.
>
> Magnedyne schrieb am Dienstag, 14. November 2023 um 07:02:12 UTC+1:
>
>> You might just be correct. According to the seller this sign sat in a 
>> damp basement for the better part of fourth years which could easily result 
>> in corrosion on some of the sockets. Furthermore taking a look at the 
>> pictures in the listing it seems that whilst these three tubes were 
>> noticable, they weren't quite as bad as they are now. Fingers crossed it's 
>> just a bad connection.[image: Screenshot_20231114-065850.png]
>>
>> Audrey schrieb am Montag, 13. November 2023 um 22:45:53 UTC+1:
>>
>>> Bad connection somewhere possibly, wouldnt surprise me if the tubes are 
>>> socketed
>>>
>>> On Mon, Nov 13, 2023, 4:39 PM Nicholas Stock  wrote:
>>>
 Oh, it moves? Probably a leaky tube then I'm afraid.. unless anybody 
 else on the list has ideas?

 On Mon, Nov 13, 2023 at 1:22 PM Magnedyne  
 wrote:

>
> Furthermore I should mention that the partial glow does not affect 
> only specific elements of the tube but any element inside the tube. 
> Can this be caused by deposits?
> Nicholas Stock schrieb am Montag, 13. November 2023 um 21:56:10 UTC+1:
>
>> WHAT A FIND!!! OMG. I didn't even know there were smaller versions of 
>> the ZM1350 (shame on me!).
>>
>> The tubes with the partially lit segments can probably be revived 
>> with a little extra current... just be careful not to burn them during 
>> the 
>> healing process (if it works..).
>>
>> Wow..
>>
>> Welcome to the group,
>>
>> Nick
>>
>> On Mon, Nov 13, 2023 at 12:07 PM Magnedyne  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Well, this serves as my introduction and and as a thread about a 
>>> beautiful sign I just picked up.
>>> Firstly something about myself.
>>> I’m a 17 year old collector and (hobby) historian of vintage 
>>> computers, my interests are mainly minis, mainframes, early micros and 
>>> kit/diy computers. But I’ve got a few other different bits and bobs 
>>> throughout the history of technology as well.
>>> Now back to the reason I joined this group. 
>>> I came across an absolutely beautiful Telefunken advertising sign 
>>> for the, frankly underdocumented, Telefunken Varisymbol tubes. They 
>>> were 
>>> Telefunkens response to the Burroughs 7971 alphanumerical tubes. These 
>>> were 
>>> only sold for a very brief amount of time and exclusively in Europe. 
>>> Interestingly these are flat like panaplex tubes and the anode is 
>>> not a grid, but a coating on the inside of the tube. These are the 
>>> earliest 
>>> gas discharge tubes, well the ones I’m aware of anyhow, which used such 
>>> a 
>>> coating. 
>>> The sign is a handmade one off which was lugged around to fairs to 
>>> advertise the Varisymbol to potential Customers. It implements all 
>>> three 
>>> sizes of the Varisymbol ZM1350 ZM1360 & ZM1370. It can alternate 
>>> between 
>>> „TELEFUNKEN“ and „VARISYMBOL“ at four different speeds. Switching 
>>> between 
>>> the sign reading „TELEFUNKEN“  three times, then „VARISYMBOL“ three 
>>> times 
>>> and the sign reading „TELEFUNKEN VARISYMBOL TELEFUNKEN“/ „VARISYMBOL 
>>> TELEFUNKEN VARISYMBOL“  is possible as well. Unfortunately three tubes 
>>> don’t display quite properly. I’m hoping it’s just the electronics, I 
>>> haven’t had time for a detailed diagnosis yet. Even if it’s the tubes, 
>>> it 
>>> seems to be the most common type at least, the ZM1350 which seems to 
>>> have 
>>> popped up most often in the past.
>>> Any further info about the Varisymbol is greatly appreciated.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Magnedyne
>>> [image: IMG_0026.jpeg]
>>>
>>> [image: IMG_0025.jpeg]
>>> [image: IMG_0021.jpeg]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "neonixie-l" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, 
>>> send an email to neonixie-l+...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web, visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/20e32d2c-3ac1-4656-b532-77b22f6a35f1n%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>> -- 
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[neonixie-l] Re: DTF104B Tubes For Sale

[Richard Scales]

I have a kit!

- Richard

On Saturday, 11 November 2023 at 22:34:28 UTC Terry S wrote:

> Love those big numitrons. Anyone got a good clock schematic for them? I 
> have a bunch of smaller ones.
> (Sorry didn't mean to hijack your thread!)
>
> On Saturday, November 11, 2023 at 3:59:58 PM UTC-6 Nicholas Stock wrote:
>
>> Hi folks, if there are any more people who want to buy new, tested 
>> DTF104B tubes at the previous price ($22 each), please send me an email.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Nick
>>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] SP-252 Seeking drawings

[Richard Scales]

After much cross checking between digits I have now settled on what I 
believe the final measurements are and this is the result:


[image: crosscheck.JPG]

The left half will sit right on top of the right half so there is x & y 
consistency between the two characters, the risk of the part fitting is 
tending away from zero!

- Richard


On Monday, 6 November 2023 at 04:33:39 UTC Richard Scales wrote:

> Many thanks again,
> @Christian - that is a sound plan, will do/
>
> @Gregbert - noted though I never solder these things in, I make sockets 
> for them every time which makes insertion/removal and replacement 
> relatively easy. I purchase 40 way turned pin sockets and break the pin 
> sockets out of them to fit into the right sized hole on the PCB and I 
> always make an oversized hole for the 'glasshole'.
>
> I've already made footprints for many different displays including SP-33x, 
> SP-35x,  SP-101 and  SP-151 - made as sockets.
>
>
> [image: QQPic.JPG]
>
> This is the display board for a different clock that uses SP-332 displays.
>
>  - Richard
>
>
> On Sunday, 5 November 2023 at 23:06:21 UTC gregebert wrote:
>
>> Make sure the holes for the display pins are larger than minimum; I made 
>> my own footprint for the SP-151 and it was difficult to get the pins fully 
>> aligned when trying to solder it in. Larger holes makes it much easier to 
>> insert the display for soldering.
>>
>> Also beware of the *glasshole*, as I call it. It's the fill-tip when the 
>> display gets gassed-up, and you need to make the PCB hole large enough to 
>> accommodate slight manufacturing variances in diameter and location. I 
>> think I used a 5mm hole, and keep traces spaced away as much as possible in 
>> case you need to make the hole larger. I didn't have any glasshole  
>> problems on my boards.
>>
>> On Sunday, November 5, 2023 at 9:35:11 AM UTC-8 Christian Riise Wagner 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Can't help you with better drawings, but I can recommend 3D-printing a 
>>> small piece with the holes at the planned locations to verify the fit 
>>> before sending off the board for production. I've used this technique 
>>> myself a couple of times.
>>> søndag den 5. november 2023 kl. 16.12.59 UTC+1 skrev Dekatron42:
>>>
>>>> Have you asked Dieter if he has a better scan that he can share?
>>>>
>>>> /Martin
>>>>
>>>> On Sunday, 5 November 2023 at 05:30:53 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Thank you Benoit but I need actual data to make a footprint to use in 
>>>>> PCB design application.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think I'm mostly there but was really seeking a better picture so I 
>>>>> can confirm the accuracy of the supplied numbers and to which pins they 
>>>>> apply - some of the ones buried in the centre of the display are not so 
>>>>> clearly linked to the numbers at the side.
>>>>>  - Richard
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Saturday, 4 November 2023 at 14:37:27 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> try to find 0.5 mm inner diameter pipe, 10cm long, fit all the pins, 
>>>>>> pour some silicone, you should have a good representation of the 
>>>>>> socket... 
>>>>>> if you didn't forgot to add some wax or similar to unmold the silicon.
>>>>>> the more parallel your pipes will be, the more accurate your print 
>>>>>> will be.
>>>>>> for a good print, the end of the pins is not important, the most 
>>>>>> important is the place they have at the beginning, the nearest to the 
>>>>>> display. without sacrifying a display; I don't see any other way to have 
>>>>>> a 
>>>>>> good measurement.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Le samedi 4 novembre 2023 à 10:04:19 UTC+1, Richard Scales a écrit :
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello, there are indeed a few the line up - it's the ones that don't 
>>>>>>> that worry me the most!
>>>>>>>  - RIchard
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Saturday, 4 November 2023 at 08:54:44 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello Richard,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> have a look on the SP-351, 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://www.tube-tester.com/sites/nixie/data/datasheets/SP-351_SP-352-drawing-01.jpg
>&

Re: [neonixie-l] SP-252 Seeking drawings

[Richard Scales]

Many thanks again,
@Christian - that is a sound plan, will do/

@Gregbert - noted though I never solder these things in, I make sockets for 
them every time which makes insertion/removal and replacement relatively 
easy. I purchase 40 way turned pin sockets and break the pin sockets out of 
them to fit into the right sized hole on the PCB and I always make an 
oversized hole for the 'glasshole'.

I've already made footprints for many different displays including SP-33x, 
SP-35x,  SP-101 and  SP-151 - made as sockets.


[image: QQPic.JPG]

This is the display board for a different clock that uses SP-332 displays.

 - Richard


On Sunday, 5 November 2023 at 23:06:21 UTC gregebert wrote:

> Make sure the holes for the display pins are larger than minimum; I made 
> my own footprint for the SP-151 and it was difficult to get the pins fully 
> aligned when trying to solder it in. Larger holes makes it much easier to 
> insert the display for soldering.
>
> Also beware of the *glasshole*, as I call it. It's the fill-tip when the 
> display gets gassed-up, and you need to make the PCB hole large enough to 
> accommodate slight manufacturing variances in diameter and location. I 
> think I used a 5mm hole, and keep traces spaced away as much as possible in 
> case you need to make the hole larger. I didn't have any glasshole  
> problems on my boards.
>
> On Sunday, November 5, 2023 at 9:35:11 AM UTC-8 Christian Riise Wagner 
> wrote:
>
>> Can't help you with better drawings, but I can recommend 3D-printing a 
>> small piece with the holes at the planned locations to verify the fit 
>> before sending off the board for production. I've used this technique 
>> myself a couple of times.
>> søndag den 5. november 2023 kl. 16.12.59 UTC+1 skrev Dekatron42:
>>
>>> Have you asked Dieter if he has a better scan that he can share?
>>>
>>> /Martin
>>>
>>> On Sunday, 5 November 2023 at 05:30:53 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:
>>>
>>>> Thank you Benoit but I need actual data to make a footprint to use in 
>>>> PCB design application.
>>>>
>>>> I think I'm mostly there but was really seeking a better picture so I 
>>>> can confirm the accuracy of the supplied numbers and to which pins they 
>>>> apply - some of the ones buried in the centre of the display are not so 
>>>> clearly linked to the numbers at the side.
>>>>  - Richard
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Saturday, 4 November 2023 at 14:37:27 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> try to find 0.5 mm inner diameter pipe, 10cm long, fit all the pins, 
>>>>> pour some silicone, you should have a good representation of the 
>>>>> socket... 
>>>>> if you didn't forgot to add some wax or similar to unmold the silicon.
>>>>> the more parallel your pipes will be, the more accurate your print 
>>>>> will be.
>>>>> for a good print, the end of the pins is not important, the most 
>>>>> important is the place they have at the beginning, the nearest to the 
>>>>> display. without sacrifying a display; I don't see any other way to have 
>>>>> a 
>>>>> good measurement.
>>>>>
>>>>> Le samedi 4 novembre 2023 à 10:04:19 UTC+1, Richard Scales a écrit :
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello, there are indeed a few the line up - it's the ones that don't 
>>>>>> that worry me the most!
>>>>>>  - RIchard
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Saturday, 4 November 2023 at 08:54:44 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hello Richard,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> have a look on the SP-351, 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.tube-tester.com/sites/nixie/data/datasheets/SP-351_SP-352-drawing-01.jpg
>>>>>>> [image: SP-351_SP-352-drawing-01.jpg]
>>>>>>> not the same number of digit, but some of the pins should be 
>>>>>>> identical...
>>>>>>> On my SP-356, there is 0 aligned pins on a diagonal way. only in 
>>>>>>> horizontal.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Le samedi 4 novembre 2023 à 07:31:29 UTC+1, Richard Scales a écrit :
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I used to so that but it relies on all the pins being straight and 
>>>>>>>> for this particular display - there are 30+ pins in a very small space 
>>>>>>>> - 
>>>>>>>>

Re: [neonixie-l] SP-252 Seeking drawings

[Richard Scales]

Thank you Benoit but I need actual data to make a footprint to use in PCB 
design application.

I think I'm mostly there but was really seeking a better picture so I can 
confirm the accuracy of the supplied numbers and to which pins they apply - 
some of the ones buried in the centre of the display are not so clearly 
linked to the numbers at the side.
 - Richard


On Saturday, 4 November 2023 at 14:37:27 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:

> try to find 0.5 mm inner diameter pipe, 10cm long, fit all the pins, pour 
> some silicone, you should have a good representation of the socket... if 
> you didn't forgot to add some wax or similar to unmold the silicon.
> the more parallel your pipes will be, the more accurate your print will be.
> for a good print, the end of the pins is not important, the most important 
> is the place they have at the beginning, the nearest to the display. 
> without sacrifying a display; I don't see any other way to have a good 
> measurement.
>
> Le samedi 4 novembre 2023 à 10:04:19 UTC+1, Richard Scales a écrit :
>
>> Hello, there are indeed a few the line up - it's the ones that don't that 
>> worry me the most!
>>  - RIchard
>>
>>
>> On Saturday, 4 November 2023 at 08:54:44 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:
>>
>>> Hello Richard,
>>>
>>> have a look on the SP-351, 
>>>
>>> https://www.tube-tester.com/sites/nixie/data/datasheets/SP-351_SP-352-drawing-01.jpg
>>> [image: SP-351_SP-352-drawing-01.jpg]
>>> not the same number of digit, but some of the pins should be identical...
>>> On my SP-356, there is 0 aligned pins on a diagonal way. only in 
>>> horizontal.
>>>
>>> Le samedi 4 novembre 2023 à 07:31:29 UTC+1, Richard Scales a écrit :
>>>
>>>> I used to so that but it relies on all the pins being straight and for 
>>>> this particular display - there are 30+ pins in a very small space - the 
>>>> more accurate the better - especially when it finally comes to plugging 
>>>> the 
>>>> things in!
>>>> [image: TTPicture.JPG][image: PPpicture.JPG]
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps the differences are so subtle it's not worth worrying about. 
>>>> It's like staring at constellations! This group on the left seems a little 
>>>> out of alignment when compared with the image from Sperry, it's 
>>>> counterpart 
>>>> in the image for the character on the right looks more like my chart - yet 
>>>> - from the data I have logged - the chart shows similar groupings for left 
>>>> and right - is their image wrong ? is their data wrong?
>>>>
>>>> [image: DDpicture.JPG]
>>>>
>>>> When daylight comes I'll get eyes on the physical display though I fear 
>>>> at my age - that may be the least helpful method!
>>>>
>>>> - Richard
>>>>
>>>> On Saturday, 4 November 2023 at 06:09:25 UTC Audrey wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> You could scan the bottom of one using a scanner and convert to 
>>>>> inches/mm using the DPI.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Nov 4, 2023, 2:04 AM Richard Scales  
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm looking for any details of the pinout of the Sperry / Beckman 
>>>>>> SP-252 Multi Segment display which are any better than the one that I 
>>>>>> found 
>>>>>> over at tube-tester.com:
>>>>>> https://tube-tester.com/sites/nixie/data/SP-252/sp-252.htm
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm making a footprint and need to get the pin positions as accurate 
>>>>>> as possible. My usual process for this is to copy the pin positions into 
>>>>>> a 
>>>>>> spreadsheet and make a scattergram which should represent the pin 
>>>>>> positions. 
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This allows me to spot any obvious blunders. It's just that the image 
>>>>>> I have is not that clear and there is some information missing (IMHO) so 
>>>>>> if 
>>>>>> anyone can point me to anything better I would be most grateful.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I could not find it in the Sperry Information Systems catalogue for 
>>>>>> which I already have a PDF.
>>>>>> - Richard
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>>>>> Groups "neonixie-l" group.
>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, 
>>>>>> send an email to neonixie-l+...@googlegroups.com.
>>>>>> To view this discussion on the web, visit 
>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/171bf56b-7195-454e-8ebb-2ef9aceb2e78n%40googlegroups.com
>>>>>>  
>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/171bf56b-7195-454e-8ebb-2ef9aceb2e78n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>>>>> .
>>>>>>
>>>>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] SP-252 Seeking drawings

[Richard Scales]

Hello, there are indeed a few the line up - it's the ones that don't that 
worry me the most!
 - RIchard


On Saturday, 4 November 2023 at 08:54:44 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:

> Hello Richard,
>
> have a look on the SP-351, 
>
> https://www.tube-tester.com/sites/nixie/data/datasheets/SP-351_SP-352-drawing-01.jpg
> [image: SP-351_SP-352-drawing-01.jpg]
> not the same number of digit, but some of the pins should be identical...
> On my SP-356, there is 0 aligned pins on a diagonal way. only in 
> horizontal.
>
> Le samedi 4 novembre 2023 à 07:31:29 UTC+1, Richard Scales a écrit :
>
>> I used to so that but it relies on all the pins being straight and for 
>> this particular display - there are 30+ pins in a very small space - the 
>> more accurate the better - especially when it finally comes to plugging the 
>> things in!
>> [image: TTPicture.JPG][image: PPpicture.JPG]
>>
>> Perhaps the differences are so subtle it's not worth worrying about. It's 
>> like staring at constellations! This group on the left seems a little out 
>> of alignment when compared with the image from Sperry, it's counterpart in 
>> the image for the character on the right looks more like my chart - yet - 
>> from the data I have logged - the chart shows similar groupings for left 
>> and right - is their image wrong ? is their data wrong?
>>
>> [image: DDpicture.JPG]
>>
>> When daylight comes I'll get eyes on the physical display though I fear 
>> at my age - that may be the least helpful method!
>>
>> - Richard
>>
>> On Saturday, 4 November 2023 at 06:09:25 UTC Audrey wrote:
>>
>>> You could scan the bottom of one using a scanner and convert to 
>>> inches/mm using the DPI.
>>>
>>> On Sat, Nov 4, 2023, 2:04 AM Richard Scales  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm looking for any details of the pinout of the Sperry / Beckman 
>>>> SP-252 Multi Segment display which are any better than the one that I 
>>>> found 
>>>> over at tube-tester.com:
>>>> https://tube-tester.com/sites/nixie/data/SP-252/sp-252.htm
>>>>
>>>> I'm making a footprint and need to get the pin positions as accurate as 
>>>> possible. My usual process for this is to copy the pin positions into a 
>>>> spreadsheet and make a scattergram which should represent the pin 
>>>> positions. 
>>>>
>>>> This allows me to spot any obvious blunders. It's just that the image I 
>>>> have is not that clear and there is some information missing (IMHO) so if 
>>>> anyone can point me to anything better I would be most grateful.
>>>>
>>>> I could not find it in the Sperry Information Systems catalogue for 
>>>> which I already have a PDF.
>>>> - Richard
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>>> Groups "neonixie-l" group.
>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>>> an email to neonixie-l+...@googlegroups.com.
>>>> To view this discussion on the web, visit 
>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/171bf56b-7195-454e-8ebb-2ef9aceb2e78n%40googlegroups.com
>>>>  
>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/171bf56b-7195-454e-8ebb-2ef9aceb2e78n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>

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[neonixie-l] SP-252 Seeking drawings

[Richard Scales]

I'm looking for any details of the pinout of the Sperry / Beckman SP-252 
Multi Segment display which are any better than the one that I found over 
at tube-tester.com:
https://tube-tester.com/sites/nixie/data/SP-252/sp-252.htm

I'm making a footprint and need to get the pin positions as accurate as 
possible. My usual process for this is to copy the pin positions into a 
spreadsheet and make a scattergram which should represent the pin 
positions. 

This allows me to spot any obvious blunders. It's just that the image I 
have is not that clear and there is some information missing (IMHO) so if 
anyone can point me to anything better I would be most grateful.

I could not find it in the Sperry Information Systems catalogue for which I 
already have a PDF.
- Richard

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

@Mike - many thanks - I think I'm getting it.
 - Richard


On Friday, 3 November 2023 at 11:15:27 UTC Mike Mitchell wrote:

> That's basically what I'm doing for my simple case.  The upkeep work is 
> done after tubes are energized, where I have significantly more time before 
> the next event.  The off time is only 200us so I don't do anything during 
> the off time.  With the fast processors of today you could do "quick" 
> things in the off time, but any complex computation I'd put in the longer 
> on time.  I'm using the FastLED module to drive a short string of LEDs 
> during my "DISP_EVEN" time, but calculate what to put into the LEDs in the 
> "DISP_ODD" time.
>
> On Friday, November 3, 2023 at 12:43:40 AM UTC-4 Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> @Mike
>> So, I have been getting my head around the whole state-machine concept. I 
>> have one I did before - curiously also running on  a Teensy but that was 
>> because I was worried about speed (I had no idea!).
>> Regardless.
>>
>> Here is what I think my state-machine might look like:
>>
>> Set State to 'Turn Off Displays'
>>
>> :Main program loop
>> If state = 'Turn off Displays' then turn off all the anodes and change 
>> state to 'Delay before turn on'
>>
>> //This state exists to allow the injection of any required delay between 
>> display of each digit / group of digits 
>> if state = 'Delay before turn on' then if there there has been sufficient 
>> delay, change state to 'Turn on desired display'
>>
>> //This state works out which cathodes and anodes to set and turns them on
>> if state = 'Turn on desired display' then set the required cathodes and 
>> anodes and turn them on and change state to 'Display is on'
>>
>> //This state works out whether the display has been on long enough
>> if state = 'Display is on' then has it been on long enough? If so, change 
>> state to 'Turn off Displays'
>>
>>
>> Rest of clock code goes here - and by that I mean the business of working 
>> out what to display be it time, date, temp, pressure etc.
>> Obviously everything must be non-blocking so if I want to do fancy things 
>> like scrolling messages then I assume that I will need to introduce more 
>> 'states' to control all that
>>
>> :End of main program loop
>>
>> I think this differs from yours in as much as I have lumped all the 'rest 
>> of clock code' into one place on the basis that it should not be blocking 
>> anything and execute quickly.
>>
>> Is this at all wise?
>>
>>  - Richard
>>
>>
>> On Thursday, 2 November 2023 at 13:32:57 UTC Richard Scales wrote:
>>
>>> @Mike, many thanks.
>>>
>>> I'll work through that.
>>>
>>>  - Richard
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thursday, 2 November 2023 at 12:20:53 UTC Mike Mitchell wrote:
>>>
>>>> My most recent Nixie project uses ZM1032 tubes.  They are a 9-pin tube, 
>>>> with five cathode pins and two anodes.  I'm using direct-drive on all the 
>>>> cathodes, but skimp on the tens-of-hours digit where I only drive three 
>>>> cathodes instead of all five.  I'm using four SN75468 darlington arrays to 
>>>> drive the cathodes and two opto-isolators to drive the anodes, 
>>>> multiplexing 
>>>> the anodes as all evens and all odds.
>>>> I'm using a Teensy 4.1 processor to control everything, though I could 
>>>> have used an ESP32.  I just wanted something with a lot of pins to handle 
>>>> driving the 28 cathodes.  I'm not using a timing interrupt at all. In the 
>>>> main loop I use the built-in arduino "micros()" call to keep track of the 
>>>> time and compare it to the time of the next event.  I use a state variable 
>>>> to keep track of what to do next.  Here's some pseudo code:
>>>>
>>>> if (long)(micros() - timeNextDisp) >= 0 {
>>>>   switch(dispstate) {
>>>> case DISP_DELAY_EVEN:
>>>>   timeNextDisp = micros() + 200
>>>>   turn off all anodes, turn on all cathodes
>>>>   dispstate = DISP_EVEN
>>>>   break;
>>>> case DISP_EVEN:
>>>>   timeNextDisp = micros() + disp_even_time
>>>>   turn off all cathodes
>>>>   turn on appropriate cathodes
>>>>   turn on even anode
>>>>   dispstate = DISP_DELAY_ODD
>>>>   /* split work between even/odd anodes */
>>>>   read PIR
>>>>   read GPS
&g

Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

@Mike
So, I have been getting my head around the whole state-machine concept. I 
have one I did before - curiously also running on  a Teensy but that was 
because I was worried about speed (I had no idea!).
Regardless.

Here is what I think my state-machine might look like:

Set State to 'Turn Off Displays'

:Main program loop
If state = 'Turn off Displays' then turn off all the anodes and change 
state to 'Delay before turn on'

//This state exists to allow the injection of any required delay between 
display of each digit / group of digits 
if state = 'Delay before turn on' then if there there has been sufficient 
delay, change state to 'Turn on desired display'

//This state works out which cathodes and anodes to set and turns them on
if state = 'Turn on desired display' then set the required cathodes and 
anodes and turn them on and change state to 'Display is on'

//This state works out whether the display has been on long enough
if state = 'Display is on' then has it been on long enough? If so, change 
state to 'Turn off Displays'


Rest of clock code goes here - and by that I mean the business of working 
out what to display be it time, date, temp, pressure etc.
Obviously everything must be non-blocking so if I want to do fancy things 
like scrolling messages then I assume that I will need to introduce more 
'states' to control all that

:End of main program loop

I think this differs from yours in as much as I have lumped all the 'rest 
of clock code' into one place on the basis that it should not be blocking 
anything and execute quickly.

Is this at all wise?

 - Richard


On Thursday, 2 November 2023 at 13:32:57 UTC Richard Scales wrote:

> @Mike, many thanks.
>
> I'll work through that.
>
>  - Richard
>
>
> On Thursday, 2 November 2023 at 12:20:53 UTC Mike Mitchell wrote:
>
>> My most recent Nixie project uses ZM1032 tubes.  They are a 9-pin tube, 
>> with five cathode pins and two anodes.  I'm using direct-drive on all the 
>> cathodes, but skimp on the tens-of-hours digit where I only drive three 
>> cathodes instead of all five.  I'm using four SN75468 darlington arrays to 
>> drive the cathodes and two opto-isolators to drive the anodes, multiplexing 
>> the anodes as all evens and all odds.
>> I'm using a Teensy 4.1 processor to control everything, though I could 
>> have used an ESP32.  I just wanted something with a lot of pins to handle 
>> driving the 28 cathodes.  I'm not using a timing interrupt at all. In the 
>> main loop I use the built-in arduino "micros()" call to keep track of the 
>> time and compare it to the time of the next event.  I use a state variable 
>> to keep track of what to do next.  Here's some pseudo code:
>>
>> if (long)(micros() - timeNextDisp) >= 0 {
>>   switch(dispstate) {
>> case DISP_DELAY_EVEN:
>>   timeNextDisp = micros() + 200
>>   turn off all anodes, turn on all cathodes
>>   dispstate = DISP_EVEN
>>   break;
>> case DISP_EVEN:
>>   timeNextDisp = micros() + disp_even_time
>>   turn off all cathodes
>>   turn on appropriate cathodes
>>   turn on even anode
>>   dispstate = DISP_DELAY_ODD
>>   /* split work between even/odd anodes */
>>   read PIR
>>   read GPS
>>   break;
>> case DISP_DELAY_ODD:
>>   timeNextDisp = micros() + 200
>>   turn off all anodes, turn on all cathodes
>>   dispstate = DISP_EVEN
>>   break;
>> case DISP_ODD:
>>   timeNextDisp = micros() + disp_odd_time
>>   turn off all cathodes
>>   turn on appropriate cathodes
>>   turn on odd anode
>>   dispstate = DISP_DELAY_EVEN
>>   /* split work between even/odd anodes */
>>   read RTC
>>   read ADC
>>   calculate time display values
>>   break;
>> }
>>
>> In my case the even digits are behind a screen electrode which blocks 
>> their light.  I keep the even digits on for about twice as long as the odd 
>> digits to even out the brightness.  I could have increased the even digit's 
>> current by reducing the even's anode resistor, but I decided to keep the 
>> current the same for even/odd and just increase the "on" time.  My timings 
>> are roughly 10.1ms on for even, 0.2 ms for dead time, 5.1ms on for odd, 0.2 
>> ms dead time, for 15.625 ms per cycle (64 times a second).
>> A more typical multiplexing scheme could have two state variables, one 
>> selects either displaying a digit or discharging the tube, the other 
>> selects what tube to display.
>> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 12:56:33 AM UTC-4 gregebert wrote:
>>
>>> Where it all leads to, I 

Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

@Mike, many thanks.

I'll work through that.

 - Richard


On Thursday, 2 November 2023 at 12:20:53 UTC Mike Mitchell wrote:

> My most recent Nixie project uses ZM1032 tubes.  They are a 9-pin tube, 
> with five cathode pins and two anodes.  I'm using direct-drive on all the 
> cathodes, but skimp on the tens-of-hours digit where I only drive three 
> cathodes instead of all five.  I'm using four SN75468 darlington arrays to 
> drive the cathodes and two opto-isolators to drive the anodes, multiplexing 
> the anodes as all evens and all odds.
> I'm using a Teensy 4.1 processor to control everything, though I could 
> have used an ESP32.  I just wanted something with a lot of pins to handle 
> driving the 28 cathodes.  I'm not using a timing interrupt at all. In the 
> main loop I use the built-in arduino "micros()" call to keep track of the 
> time and compare it to the time of the next event.  I use a state variable 
> to keep track of what to do next.  Here's some pseudo code:
>
> if (long)(micros() - timeNextDisp) >= 0 {
>   switch(dispstate) {
> case DISP_DELAY_EVEN:
>   timeNextDisp = micros() + 200
>   turn off all anodes, turn on all cathodes
>   dispstate = DISP_EVEN
>   break;
> case DISP_EVEN:
>   timeNextDisp = micros() + disp_even_time
>   turn off all cathodes
>   turn on appropriate cathodes
>   turn on even anode
>   dispstate = DISP_DELAY_ODD
>   /* split work between even/odd anodes */
>   read PIR
>   read GPS
>   break;
> case DISP_DELAY_ODD:
>   timeNextDisp = micros() + 200
>   turn off all anodes, turn on all cathodes
>   dispstate = DISP_EVEN
>   break;
> case DISP_ODD:
>   timeNextDisp = micros() + disp_odd_time
>   turn off all cathodes
>   turn on appropriate cathodes
>   turn on odd anode
>   dispstate = DISP_DELAY_EVEN
>   /* split work between even/odd anodes */
>   read RTC
>   read ADC
>   calculate time display values
>   break;
> }
>
> In my case the even digits are behind a screen electrode which blocks 
> their light.  I keep the even digits on for about twice as long as the odd 
> digits to even out the brightness.  I could have increased the even digit's 
> current by reducing the even's anode resistor, but I decided to keep the 
> current the same for even/odd and just increase the "on" time.  My timings 
> are roughly 10.1ms on for even, 0.2 ms for dead time, 5.1ms on for odd, 0.2 
> ms dead time, for 15.625 ms per cycle (64 times a second).
> A more typical multiplexing scheme could have two state variables, one 
> selects either displaying a digit or discharging the tube, the other 
> selects what tube to display.
> On Thursday, November 2, 2023 at 12:56:33 AM UTC-4 gregebert wrote:
>
>> Where it all leads to, I think, is that you no longer need to do custom 
>> logic design, and you can skip the need for certain ICs such as realtime 
>> clocks, by switching to a software-based design, whether it's RasPi, 
>> Arduino, or any other embedded controller.
>>
>> It's gotten so "bad" that I rarely need to use a scope or logic analyzer 
>> to hunt down a bug. Several years ago I literally logged-in remotely to the 
>> RasPi controlling my NIMO clock and did quite a bit of software development 
>> and debug from thousands of miles away.
>>
>> Even now, I'm too lazy to get out of my chair, and go out into the chilly 
>> garage to work on my Pi+FPGA board. Instead, I will write a new test and 
>> run/debug logic simulations rather than push new (untested) code onto the 
>> FPGA to see if it works.
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 9:23:25 PM UTC-7 Richard Scales wrote:
>>
>>> Dual Core Processors - now my head really hurts - I mean - I love the 
>>> idea but don't think my programming skills are ever going to stretch that 
>>> far!
>>> Just woke early (03.13) - still full of Covid and had a wrestles 
>>> thinking session on this during which I reminded myself of all the success 
>>> that I have had with B-7971/ZM1350 Smart sockets - can you see where this 
>>> might be going?
>>>  - Richard
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 16:29:32 UTC Craig Garnett wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm using a Pico in my project, I run the tube driving routine on one 
>>>> core and everything else on the rest so it doesn't suffer from slowdowns.
>>>> I've had to introduce a delay to slow it down to a 1ms refresh!
>>>>
>>>> Craig
>>>> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 15:47:33 

Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

Dual Core Processors - now my head really hurts - I mean - I love the idea 
but don't think my programming skills are ever going to stretch that far!
Just woke early (03.13) - still full of Covid and had a wrestles thinking 
session on this during which I reminded myself of all the success that I 
have had with B-7971/ZM1350 Smart sockets - can you see where this might be 
going?
 - Richard


On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 16:29:32 UTC Craig Garnett wrote:

> I'm using a Pico in my project, I run the tube driving routine on one core 
> and everything else on the rest so it doesn't suffer from slowdowns.
> I've had to introduce a delay to slow it down to a 1ms refresh!
>
> Craig
> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 15:47:33 UTC gregebert wrote:
>
>> Multiplexing might not be possible in certain software environments. 
>> Several years ago I switched to Linux-based Raspberry Pi systems in my 
>> projects, and with the unpredictable overhead of Linux I cant rely on the 
>> CPU being available every millisecond to update the display. Instead of 
>> using Arduino or a custom OS, I add an FPGA or CPLD to handle the time- 
>> critical tasks.
>>
>> Just by coincidence, I'm putting the final touches on the software and 
>> RTL code for a board I recently had fabbed to do this. I know it's 
>> blasphemy, but the first project using this is LED-based...I got a bunch of 
>> large 8x8 red/green LED arrays for just under 1 USD apiece and the need a 
>> multiplexed driver. Dont worry, there are several nixie and nixie-ish 
>> projects in the pipeline that will use this board.
>>
>>
>> [image: raspi_fpga.JPG]
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 1, 2023 at 8:19:48 AM UTC-7 Richard Scales wrote:
>>
>>> @Paul - I have no idea of the sense of scale and the relative times 
>>> taken. If I were to hang another HV driver on the chain with associated 
>>> electronics to switch the HV, is there going to be enough time to do the 
>>> following:
>>>
>>> Set the bits for the segments required- I add this step just in case any 
>>> settling time might be be required
>>> Set the bits for the segments required and the anode(s) on
>>> Wait for 400us (typical on time for the panaplex segments I have in mind
>>> Set the digits and anode(s) off again
>>> Loop to the next set of digits
>>>
>>> With 12 individual anodes - there would be 12 passes - one for each 
>>> anode that needed to be switched on
>>> If I used 2 drivers (using 3 x 16 bits for cathodes, I could use bits 
>>> from the remaining 16 to control the anodes. Thus there would be only 3 
>>> passes.
>>>
>>> Please stop me when I've gone off the scent (still mid-covid) :-(
>>>
>>> In Summary:
>>> Using the HV55xx for cathodes AND anodes
>>> Given i want 12 characters:
>>> with 1 driver I have 16 segments and 16 spare for the 12 anodes - easy 
>>> but slowest
>>> with 2 drivers I have 3 lots of 16 segments and then group the displays 
>>> into lumps of 4 (12 characters/3) and still have 16 bits to control the 
>>> anodes, of which there will now only be 3)
>>>
>>> Am I anywhere near close with the driver split and the pseudocode for 
>>> the ISR?
>>> I was thinking that there should be some uS delays either before and/or 
>>> after lighting the segments
>>>
>>>
>>> - Richard
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 15:01:20 UTC Richard Scales wrote:
>>>
>>>> @David - many thanks for that caution though there will not be (nor 
>>>> ever will there be!) any LEDS for this project!
>>>> @Pauld - thank you - I had thought of that but I was endeavouring to 
>>>> keep the code inside the ISR to an absolute minimum so thought that it 
>>>> would be best handled outside of it and hence separate from the HV chain. 
>>>> Using SPI.Transfer  to send 32, 64 or 96 bits - I guess it all happens 
>>>> fairly quickly!
>>>> @Benoit - I will look at that - ESP32 - another bridge thus far 
>>>> uncrossed!
>>>>  - Richard
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 14:54:53 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello, 
>>>>>
>>>>> if an ESP8266 is not enough powerful, the ESP32 will do the job.
>>>>> the ESP_WROVER can be a good platfom.
>>>>> you should have a look to Mose's work on 
>>>>> https://neonixie.com/Z57XM6DV2/
>>>>> the code is a bit &q

Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

@David - I should have said - I'm not against LEDs and Nixies in any way - 
just not for this project - it is for panaplex displays which don't really 
lend themselves to backlighting - though I have done something recently 
with FFD21 Minitrons (which are equally opaque) by using side facing leds 
under the minitrons.
 - Richard


On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 15:19:48 UTC Richard Scales wrote:

> @Paul - I have no idea of the sense of scale and the relative times taken. 
> If I were to hang another HV driver on the chain with associated 
> electronics to switch the HV, is there going to be enough time to do the 
> following:
>
> Set the bits for the segments required- I add this step just in case any 
> settling time might be be required
> Set the bits for the segments required and the anode(s) on
> Wait for 400us (typical on time for the panaplex segments I have in mind
> Set the digits and anode(s) off again
> Loop to the next set of digits
>
> With 12 individual anodes - there would be 12 passes - one for each anode 
> that needed to be switched on
> If I used 2 drivers (using 3 x 16 bits for cathodes, I could use bits from 
> the remaining 16 to control the anodes. Thus there would be only 3 passes.
>
> Please stop me when I've gone off the scent (still mid-covid) :-(
>
> In Summary:
> Using the HV55xx for cathodes AND anodes
> Given i want 12 characters:
> with 1 driver I have 16 segments and 16 spare for the 12 anodes - easy but 
> slowest
> with 2 drivers I have 3 lots of 16 segments and then group the displays 
> into lumps of 4 (12 characters/3) and still have 16 bits to control the 
> anodes, of which there will now only be 3)
>
> Am I anywhere near close with the driver split and the pseudocode for the 
> ISR?
> I was thinking that there should be some uS delays either before and/or 
> after lighting the segments
>
>
> - Richard
>
>
> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 15:01:20 UTC Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> @David - many thanks for that caution though there will not be (nor ever 
>> will there be!) any LEDS for this project!
>> @Pauld - thank you - I had thought of that but I was endeavouring to keep 
>> the code inside the ISR to an absolute minimum so thought that it would be 
>> best handled outside of it and hence separate from the HV chain. Using 
>> SPI.Transfer  to send 32, 64 or 96 bits - I guess it all happens fairly 
>> quickly!
>> @Benoit - I will look at that - ESP32 - another bridge thus far uncrossed!
>>  - Richard
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 14:54:53 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:
>>
>>> Hello, 
>>>
>>> if an ESP8266 is not enough powerful, the ESP32 will do the job.
>>> the ESP_WROVER can be a good platfom.
>>> you should have a look to Mose's work on https://neonixie.com/Z57XM6DV2/
>>> the code is a bit "strong" as it can be used both on an 6 IV-9 clock and 
>>> a more traditional  6 digits Z57, superb clocks, all they need is 
>>> addressable LEDs for a more colorful background. and deactivable.
>>> the BH1750 luxmeter does a great job and is more sensible than a 
>>> standard photoresistor.
>>>
>>> Le mercredi 1 novembre 2023 à 14:38:44 UTC+1, David Pye a écrit :
>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> I offer you one caution with the ESP8266 boards - almost everything is 
>>>> implemented in the libraries in software rather than onchip hw. 
>>>>
>>>> That means doing things like updating addressable LEDs can cause the 
>>>> multiplexing to glitch slightly because of the need to send LED data at 
>>>> strict timings.   (Or, if you sacrifice led timings to run your multiplex 
>>>> interrupt routine, it can glitch the LEDs.  ).  Chips which have DMA/more 
>>>> complex peripherals might avoid this.
>>>>
>>>> You might get away with it with certain combinations of things but it 
>>>> was a bit of a pain for me.
>>>>
>>>> David
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, 1 Nov 2023, 11:54 Richard Scales,  
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Many thanks Nick. 
>>>>> Unless anything else comes to light I think I will forge ahead on that 
>>>>> basis. I want to drive 15 segment panaplex displays (16 including the DP) 
>>>>> so plan to use HV5530 or similar driver for the segments, probably two of 
>>>>> them. Then the same MPSA42/MPSA92 driver arrangement for the HV though 
>>>>> there are going to be 5 of those - I might be running low on pins it 
>>>>> usin

Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

@Paul - I have no idea of the sense of scale and the relative times taken. 
If I were to hang another HV driver on the chain with associated 
electronics to switch the HV, is there going to be enough time to do the 
following:

Set the bits for the segments required- I add this step just in case any 
settling time might be be required
Set the bits for the segments required and the anode(s) on
Wait for 400us (typical on time for the panaplex segments I have in mind
Set the digits and anode(s) off again
Loop to the next set of digits

With 12 individual anodes - there would be 12 passes - one for each anode 
that needed to be switched on
If I used 2 drivers (using 3 x 16 bits for cathodes, I could use bits from 
the remaining 16 to control the anodes. Thus there would be only 3 passes.

Please stop me when I've gone off the scent (still mid-covid) :-(

In Summary:
Using the HV55xx for cathodes AND anodes
Given i want 12 characters:
with 1 driver I have 16 segments and 16 spare for the 12 anodes - easy but 
slowest
with 2 drivers I have 3 lots of 16 segments and then group the displays 
into lumps of 4 (12 characters/3) and still have 16 bits to control the 
anodes, of which there will now only be 3)

Am I anywhere near close with the driver split and the pseudocode for the 
ISR?
I was thinking that there should be some uS delays either before and/or 
after lighting the segments


- Richard


On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 15:01:20 UTC Richard Scales wrote:

> @David - many thanks for that caution though there will not be (nor ever 
> will there be!) any LEDS for this project!
> @Pauld - thank you - I had thought of that but I was endeavouring to keep 
> the code inside the ISR to an absolute minimum so thought that it would be 
> best handled outside of it and hence separate from the HV chain. Using 
> SPI.Transfer  to send 32, 64 or 96 bits - I guess it all happens fairly 
> quickly!
> @Benoit - I will look at that - ESP32 - another bridge thus far uncrossed!
>  - Richard
>
>
> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 14:54:53 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:
>
>> Hello, 
>>
>> if an ESP8266 is not enough powerful, the ESP32 will do the job.
>> the ESP_WROVER can be a good platfom.
>> you should have a look to Mose's work on https://neonixie.com/Z57XM6DV2/
>> the code is a bit "strong" as it can be used both on an 6 IV-9 clock and 
>> a more traditional  6 digits Z57, superb clocks, all they need is 
>> addressable LEDs for a more colorful background. and deactivable.
>> the BH1750 luxmeter does a great job and is more sensible than a standard 
>> photoresistor.
>>
>> Le mercredi 1 novembre 2023 à 14:38:44 UTC+1, David Pye a écrit :
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I offer you one caution with the ESP8266 boards - almost everything is 
>>> implemented in the libraries in software rather than onchip hw. 
>>>
>>> That means doing things like updating addressable LEDs can cause the 
>>> multiplexing to glitch slightly because of the need to send LED data at 
>>> strict timings.   (Or, if you sacrifice led timings to run your multiplex 
>>> interrupt routine, it can glitch the LEDs.  ).  Chips which have DMA/more 
>>> complex peripherals might avoid this.
>>>
>>> You might get away with it with certain combinations of things but it 
>>> was a bit of a pain for me.
>>>
>>> David
>>>
>>> On Wed, 1 Nov 2023, 11:54 Richard Scales,  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Many thanks Nick. 
>>>> Unless anything else comes to light I think I will forge ahead on that 
>>>> basis. I want to drive 15 segment panaplex displays (16 including the DP) 
>>>> so plan to use HV5530 or similar driver for the segments, probably two of 
>>>> them. Then the same MPSA42/MPSA92 driver arrangement for the HV though 
>>>> there are going to be 5 of those - I might be running low on pins it using 
>>>> a Wemos - I might consider a port expander for the extra pins needed - I 
>>>> need to check pins required - I think 4 for the HV register chain, 6 for 
>>>> the Anode switching (two drivers driving a 12 digit device - perhaps 5 for 
>>>> a 10 digit device) plus I want to read a PIR and talk to a BMP-280 sensor. 
>>>> Certainly a Wemos + port expander would do it - might get away with a Node 
>>>> MCU or similar.
>>>> OK, I just realised that I can use a single 32 bit driver  with two 
>>>> sets of 16 bits, one going to each bank of displays.
>>>> It still has the same pin requirements of the processor I think. That 
>>>> will be a juggling excersise!
>>>>  - Richard
>>>&

Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

@David - many thanks for that caution though there will not be (nor ever 
will there be!) any LEDS for this project!
@Pauld - thank you - I had thought of that but I was endeavouring to keep 
the code inside the ISR to an absolute minimum so thought that it would be 
best handled outside of it and hence separate from the HV chain. Using 
SPI.Transfer  to send 32, 64 or 96 bits - I guess it all happens fairly 
quickly!
@Benoit - I will look at that - ESP32 - another bridge thus far uncrossed!
 - Richard


On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 14:54:53 UTC Benoit Tourret wrote:

> Hello, 
>
> if an ESP8266 is not enough powerful, the ESP32 will do the job.
> the ESP_WROVER can be a good platfom.
> you should have a look to Mose's work on https://neonixie.com/Z57XM6DV2/
> the code is a bit "strong" as it can be used both on an 6 IV-9 clock and a 
> more traditional  6 digits Z57, superb clocks, all they need is addressable 
> LEDs for a more colorful background. and deactivable.
> the BH1750 luxmeter does a great job and is more sensible than a standard 
> photoresistor.
>
> Le mercredi 1 novembre 2023 à 14:38:44 UTC+1, David Pye a écrit :
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I offer you one caution with the ESP8266 boards - almost everything is 
>> implemented in the libraries in software rather than onchip hw. 
>>
>> That means doing things like updating addressable LEDs can cause the 
>> multiplexing to glitch slightly because of the need to send LED data at 
>> strict timings.   (Or, if you sacrifice led timings to run your multiplex 
>> interrupt routine, it can glitch the LEDs.  ).  Chips which have DMA/more 
>> complex peripherals might avoid this.
>>
>> You might get away with it with certain combinations of things but it was 
>> a bit of a pain for me.
>>
>> David
>>
>> On Wed, 1 Nov 2023, 11:54 Richard Scales,  wrote:
>>
>>> Many thanks Nick. 
>>> Unless anything else comes to light I think I will forge ahead on that 
>>> basis. I want to drive 15 segment panaplex displays (16 including the DP) 
>>> so plan to use HV5530 or similar driver for the segments, probably two of 
>>> them. Then the same MPSA42/MPSA92 driver arrangement for the HV though 
>>> there are going to be 5 of those - I might be running low on pins it using 
>>> a Wemos - I might consider a port expander for the extra pins needed - I 
>>> need to check pins required - I think 4 for the HV register chain, 6 for 
>>> the Anode switching (two drivers driving a 12 digit device - perhaps 5 for 
>>> a 10 digit device) plus I want to read a PIR and talk to a BMP-280 sensor. 
>>> Certainly a Wemos + port expander would do it - might get away with a Node 
>>> MCU or similar.
>>> OK, I just realised that I can use a single 32 bit driver  with two sets 
>>> of 16 bits, one going to each bank of displays.
>>> It still has the same pin requirements of the processor I think. That 
>>> will be a juggling excersise!
>>>  - Richard
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 11:10:02 UTC Nick Sargeant wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi, 
>>>>
>>>> It’s not difficult. My fumbling attempts at a Nixie clock some time ago 
>>>> used a 4:1 multiplex ratio, using four digits and only one decoder. I used 
>>>> the same MPSA42/MPSA92 driver as your example. My multiplex function was 
>>>> called at 100Hz, so each digit was refreshing at 25Hz. It doesn’t flicker, 
>>>> and (whoa!) it is working 15 years later. 
>>>>
>>>> The only mod I had was when switching between digits, I turned the 
>>>> cathode drive off for a period of 20 microseconds, before selecting the 
>>>> correct anode and turning on the next digit. This helped prevent ghosting. 
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 10:14:25 UTC Richard Scales wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Actually - I just looked through an example over at: 
>>>>> https://www.hackster.io/doug-domke/multiplexed-nixie-tube-clock-759ff5
>>>>>
>>>>> ... and it all seems fairly understandable, have I overthought this?
>>>>>
>>>>>  - Richard
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 09:22:03 UTC Richard Scales wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The time has come when I need to get a handle the dark and mysterious 
>>>>>> art of multiplexing.
>>>>>> I have an understanding of what needs to happen though am mostly at a 
>>>>>> l

[neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

Many thanks Nick. 
Unless anything else comes to light I think I will forge ahead on that 
basis. I want to drive 15 segment panaplex displays (16 including the DP) 
so plan to use HV5530 or similar driver for the segments, probably two of 
them. Then the same MPSA42/MPSA92 driver arrangement for the HV though 
there are going to be 5 of those - I might be running low on pins it using 
a Wemos - I might consider a port expander for the extra pins needed - I 
need to check pins required - I think 4 for the HV register chain, 6 for 
the Anode switching (two drivers driving a 12 digit device - perhaps 5 for 
a 10 digit device) plus I want to read a PIR and talk to a BMP-280 sensor. 
Certainly a Wemos + port expander would do it - might get away with a Node 
MCU or similar.
OK, I just realised that I can use a single 32 bit driver  with two sets of 
16 bits, one going to each bank of displays.
It still has the same pin requirements of the processor I think. That will 
be a juggling excersise!
 - Richard


On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 11:10:02 UTC Nick Sargeant wrote:

> Hi, 
>
> It’s not difficult. My fumbling attempts at a Nixie clock some time ago 
> used a 4:1 multiplex ratio, using four digits and only one decoder. I used 
> the same MPSA42/MPSA92 driver as your example. My multiplex function was 
> called at 100Hz, so each digit was refreshing at 25Hz. It doesn’t flicker, 
> and (whoa!) it is working 15 years later. 
>
> The only mod I had was when switching between digits, I turned the cathode 
> drive off for a period of 20 microseconds, before selecting the correct 
> anode and turning on the next digit. This helped prevent ghosting. 
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 10:14:25 UTC Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> Actually - I just looked through an example over at: 
>> https://www.hackster.io/doug-domke/multiplexed-nixie-tube-clock-759ff5
>>
>> ... and it all seems fairly understandable, have I overthought this?
>>
>>  - Richard
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 09:22:03 UTC Richard Scales wrote:
>>
>>> The time has come when I need to get a handle the dark and mysterious 
>>> art of multiplexing.
>>> I have an understanding of what needs to happen though am mostly at a 
>>> loss of how to implement it.
>>> I am broadly assuming that I should be using some kind of interrupt 
>>> routine to make the actual display work whilst the rest of the code gets on 
>>> with the job of working out what to display and when to display it.
>>> Is it even going to be feasible to have some kind of interrupt routine 
>>> that decides what digits to light - set all the bits and then sets the 
>>> right anode(s) on and then off again giving enough time for the persistence 
>>> of vision to produce a non flickering display when using something like a 
>>> wemos D1?
>>>
>>> I am thinking that the interrupt routine needs to increment which 
>>> digit(s) is/are being illuminated - set up the right bit pattern for the 
>>> cathodes and turn on the relevant anode(s) - wait a little and then turn 
>>> them off again. 
>>> My worry is that the amount of time that the displays should be left on 
>>> might be a little too long for the ISR as my understanding is that these 
>>> should be kept as lean as possible.
>>>
>>> Do I even need multiple interrupts (my covid addled brain is struggling 
>>> to type let alone contemplate multiple ISR's!)?
>>> Can the rest of my code run in a non time critical manner as it works 
>>> out what it wants to display where whilst the interrupt routine merryly 
>>> illuminates digits based on values which I store in a buffer somewhere? 
>>> ... or does the rest of my code have to work in come kind of 
>>> state-machine fashion?
>>> I would expect (hope) to handle display brightness via PWM signals to HV 
>>> Drivers. 
>>> I have no need for cross fade effects either - just basic multiplexing 
>>> of say 10 different multi segment displays. I am more than happy to break 
>>> up the displays into say 2 (or more) groups in order to makes things a 
>>> little easier.
>>>
>>> Can anyone point me in the right direction - ideally with some code 
>>> snippets that I can use as a foundation?
>>>
>>> Just to confirm, it is only the general implementation  to drive the 
>>> displays that eludes me - the rest of the clock code is well defined and 
>>> working well in a direct drive capacity.
>>>
>>> The desire to move to multiplexed operation is born out the the desire 
>>> to drive a greater

[neonixie-l] Re: Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

Actually - I just looked through an example over 
at: https://www.hackster.io/doug-domke/multiplexed-nixie-tube-clock-759ff5

... and it all seems fairly understandable, have I overthought this?

 - Richard


On Wednesday, 1 November 2023 at 09:22:03 UTC Richard Scales wrote:

> The time has come when I need to get a handle the dark and mysterious art 
> of multiplexing.
> I have an understanding of what needs to happen though am mostly at a loss 
> of how to implement it.
> I am broadly assuming that I should be using some kind of interrupt 
> routine to make the actual display work whilst the rest of the code gets on 
> with the job of working out what to display and when to display it.
> Is it even going to be feasible to have some kind of interrupt routine 
> that decides what digits to light - set all the bits and then sets the 
> right anode(s) on and then off again giving enough time for the persistence 
> of vision to produce a non flickering display when using something like a 
> wemos D1?
>
> I am thinking that the interrupt routine needs to increment which digit(s) 
> is/are being illuminated - set up the right bit pattern for the cathodes 
> and turn on the relevant anode(s) - wait a little and then turn them off 
> again. 
> My worry is that the amount of time that the displays should be left on 
> might be a little too long for the ISR as my understanding is that these 
> should be kept as lean as possible.
>
> Do I even need multiple interrupts (my covid addled brain is struggling to 
> type let alone contemplate multiple ISR's!)?
> Can the rest of my code run in a non time critical manner as it works out 
> what it wants to display where whilst the interrupt routine merryly 
> illuminates digits based on values which I store in a buffer somewhere? 
> ... or does the rest of my code have to work in come kind of state-machine 
> fashion?
> I would expect (hope) to handle display brightness via PWM signals to HV 
> Drivers. 
> I have no need for cross fade effects either - just basic multiplexing of 
> say 10 different multi segment displays. I am more than happy to break up 
> the displays into say 2 (or more) groups in order to makes things a little 
> easier.
>
> Can anyone point me in the right direction - ideally with some code 
> snippets that I can use as a foundation?
>
> Just to confirm, it is only the general implementation  to drive the 
> displays that eludes me - the rest of the clock code is well defined and 
> working well in a direct drive capacity.
>
> The desire to move to multiplexed operation is born out the the desire to 
> drive a greater number of displays with a greater number of segments which 
> could be done via direct drive but I foresee that multiplexing the displays 
> will simplify the electronics required.
>
> So many questions I know. I would be grateful for any pointers, thank you.
>
>  - Richard
>
>

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[neonixie-l] Multiplexing Displays

[Richard Scales]

The time has come when I need to get a handle the dark and mysterious art 
of multiplexing.
I have an understanding of what needs to happen though am mostly at a loss 
of how to implement it.
I am broadly assuming that I should be using some kind of interrupt routine 
to make the actual display work whilst the rest of the code gets on with 
the job of working out what to display and when to display it.
Is it even going to be feasible to have some kind of interrupt routine that 
decides what digits to light - set all the bits and then sets the right 
anode(s) on and then off again giving enough time for the persistence of 
vision to produce a non flickering display when using something like a 
wemos D1?

I am thinking that the interrupt routine needs to increment which digit(s) 
is/are being illuminated - set up the right bit pattern for the cathodes 
and turn on the relevant anode(s) - wait a little and then turn them off 
again. 
My worry is that the amount of time that the displays should be left on 
might be a little too long for the ISR as my understanding is that these 
should be kept as lean as possible.

Do I even need multiple interrupts (my covid addled brain is struggling to 
type let alone contemplate multiple ISR's!)?
Can the rest of my code run in a non time critical manner as it works out 
what it wants to display where whilst the interrupt routine merryly 
illuminates digits based on values which I store in a buffer somewhere? 
... or does the rest of my code have to work in come kind of state-machine 
fashion?
I would expect (hope) to handle display brightness via PWM signals to HV 
Drivers. 
I have no need for cross fade effects either - just basic multiplexing of 
say 10 different multi segment displays. I am more than happy to break up 
the displays into say 2 (or more) groups in order to makes things a little 
easier.

Can anyone point me in the right direction - ideally with some code 
snippets that I can use as a foundation?

Just to confirm, it is only the general implementation  to drive the 
displays that eludes me - the rest of the clock code is well defined and 
working well in a direct drive capacity.

The desire to move to multiplexed operation is born out the the desire to 
drive a greater number of displays with a greater number of segments which 
could be done via direct drive but I foresee that multiplexing the displays 
will simplify the electronics required.

So many questions I know. I would be grateful for any pointers, thank you.

 - Richard

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Re: [neonixie-l] Four unidentified tubes

[Richard Scales]

Great finds indeed - love the multi segment tubes!
- Richard

On Saturday, 28 October 2023 at 22:00:17 UTC+1 Adam Piórko wrote:

> Auction on German ebay
>
> sobota, 28 października 2023 o 22:43:37 UTC+2 Audrey napisał(a):
>
>> Those are extremely unusual. Where did you find them?
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 28, 2023, 3:01 PM Adam Piórko  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> At the beginning, I apologize for any potential language errors.
>>>
>>> Recently, I purchased a Nixie tubes, including some without any labels 
>>> that I've never seen online before.
>>>
>>> To avoid influencing the responses to my questions by showing all the 
>>> pictures right away, I created a form with images and questions. 
>>>
>>> Link to the form: https://forms.gle/frmLGNC21vvtwB7a7
>>>
>>> For those interested in what others think, here's a spreadsheet with the 
>>> responses: 
>>>
>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nLfibsxU6VJlkkvQ5WDbqf5lvFvVf9YXliW_yJ_-SUo/edit?usp=sharing
>>>
>>> For those who want to see higher-resolution images: 
>>> https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1cweRUT3Vihw6jMqjabuwxRFCLpToSJAp?usp=sharing
>>>
>>>
>>> They don't know how to use the dekatron, so I won't check its operation. 
>>>
>>> As for the nixie tube, what value of limiting resistors do you suggest 
>>> for 170V? 
>>>
>>> -- 
>>>
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>>> "neonixie-l" group.
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>>> an email to neonixie-l+...@googlegroups.com.
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: New Nixie Clock on Kickstarter

[Richard Scales]

Very sad considering the backers they have.

- Richard


On Wednesday, 25 October 2023 at 03:55:19 UTC+1 Nicholas Stock wrote:

>
> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/inixie/glowing-with-nostalgia-the-resurgence-of-nixie-tubes/comments
>
> Looks like they hit a snag???
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: SP-431 panaplex displays, looking for opinions on whether to desolder from module

[Richard Scales]

If it was me - I would remove the displays and make an 8 digit panaplex 
clock, as Yohan said, if you want a 12hr clock then use the plus symbol as 
an am/pm indicator - otherwise - make it a 24hr clock and perhaps use the 
plus symbol for something else. I have made many different panaplex clocks, 
all direct drive using HV5x22 or HV5x30 drivers and i would apply the same 
design to these displays.
 - Richard


On Tuesday, 24 October 2023 at 15:43:17 UTC+1 Yohan Park wrote:

> You can use the + as a PM indicator
>
> On Monday, October 23, 2023 at 3:43:29 PM UTC+2 Adam Piórko wrote:
>
>> It looks like VFD displays. If the "plus" is lit, the module seems to be 
>> functioning properly. If you enjoy reverse engineering, you can try to make 
>> a clock from this module. Two things need to be discovered.
>>
>>1. How to send a digit? If it's a counter, it might be challenging. 
>>Incrementing by +1 might be too slow, and digit changes will be visible.
>>2. It's unknown if there's a reset to zero (reset function) - if not, 
>>you'll have to add up to 99. 
>>
>> You can make a 24-hour clock out of it. There's no "AM/PM" - unless you 
>> add it on the side or skip it.
>>
>>
>> niedziela, 22 października 2023 o 13:47:29 UTC+2 ZY napisał(a):
>>
>>> Pictures attached
>>>
>>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: SmartSocket

[Richard Scales]

For which tube?
- Richard


On Tuesday, 12 September 2023 at 20:32:43 UTC+1 Benoit Tourret wrote:

> Hello happy tax payers
>
> I am looking for some SmartSockets
>
> Where can I found that ? I saw Taylor Electronics, but is there something 
> in europe? Overseas shipping is so slow and expensive !!!
>
> regards,
>
> Benoit.
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: B-5972

[Richard Scales]

Hmm, there must be some difference between that and the B-5971 - though 
what, I don't know.

Is it the same in as much as it has the same segments (difficult to tell 
from your picture) ?

 - Richard


On Tuesday, 5 September 2023 at 08:45:04 UTC+1 Adam Piórko wrote:

> Hi,
> Does anyone know anything about b-5972?
>
> [image: 20230905_093151.jpg]
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Oops!

[Richard Scales]

356 - like a couple of 352 side by side and totally pin compatible - I 
collect those too!

- Richard


On Thursday, 31 August 2023 at 05:23:42 UTC+1 Audrey wrote:

> Indeed, I really rather like the SP-151, it's great that someone is 
> selling them cheaply on ebay ATM. This same board also has 2x "HB-356" 
> (4-digit panaplex).
>
> On Thu, Aug 31, 2023 at 12:10 AM Richard Scales  
> wrote:
>
>> On first glance I would see that as an SP-354 though there are variants 
>> without the keep-alive pin (which this one does seem to have). I wonder how 
>> it differs from a regular SP-354.
>>
>> I love these panaplex displays and have used several different types for 
>> various clock projects. The SP-354  does not lend itself quite so well to 
>> the task with just a leading '1' - there is an SP-151 variant which has the 
>> same digits, loses the + and - but gains 'A M P M' and colon parts - I have 
>> used those in a couple of designs.
>>
>> Interesting number variation though.
>>
>> - Richard
>>
>> On Thursday, 31 August 2023 at 03:49:41 UTC+1 Audrey wrote:
>>
>>> Looks like these were accidentally marked "HB33401", with a 5 later 
>>> written over the second 3.
>>> :P
>>>
>> -- 
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>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/f2c1aa49-487e-4bcc-b5fa-75cf63a0d63bn%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/f2c1aa49-487e-4bcc-b5fa-75cf63a0d63bn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Oops!

[Richard Scales]

On first glance I would see that as an SP-354 though there are variants 
without the keep-alive pin (which this one does seem to have). I wonder how 
it differs from a regular SP-354.

I love these panaplex displays and have used several different types for 
various clock projects. The SP-354  does not lend itself quite so well to 
the task with just a leading '1' - there is an SP-151 variant which has the 
same digits, loses the + and - but gains 'A M P M' and colon parts - I have 
used those in a couple of designs.

Interesting number variation though.

- Richard

On Thursday, 31 August 2023 at 03:49:41 UTC+1 Audrey wrote:

> Looks like these were accidentally marked "HB33401", with a 5 later 
> written over the second 3.
> :P
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Numitron and Minitron driving current and heat generated

[Richard Scales]

Thank you, I'm away right now but will get some temperature readings when I 
get back and compare.

 - Richard

On Monday, 17 July 2023 at 09:47:55 UTC+1 Benoit Tourret wrote:

> Hello Richard,
> I don't have any Minitron (yet?) so I had a look to my Numitron tubes.
> My IV-9 clock was in the sunlight, I checked 47°C (on  the center of a 0)
> I put it in the shadow it goes down to 36°C
> my Apollo DA-2000 Numitron is at same temperature 36°C, both in a 26°C 
> environment (up to now...)
> the IV-9 is given for -60 / +100°C
> the DA-2000 for -50 / +70°C
>
> Regards,
> Benoit.
>
> Le lundi 17 juillet 2023 à 06:41:21 UTC+2, Richard Scales a écrit :
>
>> I have recently built a clock using FFD21 Numitrons / Minitrons/ The spec 
>> sheet says that the segment current should be 15mA +/- 2mA - I have 
>> measured it at 14.7mA so that should be fine.
>>
>> I note that after 10 minutes of operation, the displays are warm to the 
>> touch.
>>
>> Now then, I know these things are essentially light bulbs and work on the 
>> exact same principle as my reflow oven but...
>>
>> I appreciate that  there are glowing elements just below the glass so one 
>> might expect it but I wonder how warm they should get.
>>
>> The spec says operating range up to 70 degrees C and they are nowhere 
>> near that warm. 
>>
>> I just wondered if anyone  had any experience of operating this kind of 
>> display and what kind of heat you might expect to be generated?
>>
>>  - Richard
>>
>>  
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Numitron and Minitron driving current and heat generated

[Richard Scales]

I have recently built a clock using FFD21 Numitrons / Minitrons/ The spec 
sheet says that the segment current should be 15mA +/- 2mA - I have 
measured it at 14.7mA so that should be fine.

I note that after 10 minutes of operation, the displays are warm to the 
touch.

Now then, I know these things are essentially light bulbs and work on the 
exact same principle as my reflow oven but...

I appreciate that  there are glowing elements just below the glass so one 
might expect it but I wonder how warm they should get.

The spec says operating range up to 70 degrees C and they are nowhere near 
that warm. 

I just wondered if anyone  had any experience of operating this kind of 
display and what kind of heat you might expect to be generated?

 - Richard

 

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[neonixie-l] Re: Diving VFD such as IV-22 etc DC Vs AC Filament drive

[Richard Scales]

Many thanks for all your replies and advice.
DC seems t be the way then, with some series resistance on the filament 
supply.
I'll start in that direction and get something working on the bench.
 - Richard



On Friday, 16 June 2023 at 20:32:01 UTC+1 Moses wrote:

> Richard,
>
> Same here! I started to experiment with the IV-21 tube and how to drive it 
> recently. I have some drivers on the way. I don't have much experience with 
> VFDs at the moment.. but I did light one up on the bench recently.
>
> I used the datasheet recommended filament voltage/current on the IV-21 of 
> about 2.7v at 35ma, and I lit up all the segments/girds manually without a 
> driver IC. With everything on, I was able to perceive a difference in the 
> brightness but I had to be looking for it, it was not obvious. Now in 
> operation as a clock, as opposed to a static display with all segments on, 
> I would expect it to be less noticeable.
>
> The IV-21 is one of those 8 digit small calculator type tubes, the 
> filament is about 40cm long or so. I believe the IV-22 single digit tube 
> would have a shorter filament, and hence less of an effect? Maybe.
>
> Keep us updated on your progress.
>
> Regards,
> -Moses
>
> On Thursday, June 15, 2023 at 10:45:02 PM UTC-7 Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> Greetings all,
>>
>> I am starting to look at VFD displays and am reading all I can about them.
>>
>> I am trying to get a better understanding of the pros and cons of using a 
>> AC filament drive rather than an DC one.
>>
>> I am aware that on larger displays (like those monster ones from Russia) 
>> it is necessary in order to create a more even glow across segments. I 
>> wonder however how important this is for smaller segments like those in 
>> IV-22 for example.
>>
>> Making the filament drive AC adds a small degree of complexity but if the 
>> difference is visible and beneficial then I'd like to go that way.
>>
>> My project would be direct drive, no multiplexing required.
>>
>> Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
>>
>> - Richard
>>
>>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Diving VFD such as IV-22 etc DC Vs AC Filament drive

[Richard Scales]

Greetings all,

I am starting to look at VFD displays and am reading all I can about them.

I am trying to get a better understanding of the pros and cons of using a 
AC filament drive rather than an DC one.

I am aware that on larger displays (like those monster ones from Russia) it 
is necessary in order to create a more even glow across segments. I wonder 
however how important this is for smaller segments like those in IV-22 for 
example.

Making the filament drive AC adds a small degree of complexity but if the 
difference is visible and beneficial then I'd like to go that way.

My project would be direct drive, no multiplexing required.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

- Richard


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[neonixie-l] Re: Anyone seen these in real life?

[Richard Scales]

I filled out their contact form and received this:

-

Thanks for your interest.

Currently the project is on a low note due to other activities and because 
we've not a stable customer for tubes (as we don't want to put much effort 
in customer support, marketing, etc.)

So if you are interested in buying on a regular base (but smaller batches) 
our tubes let us know and we can discuss pricing or possible partnership 
for when we will pick up production again. (Our pricing is 145eur/tube but 
if we can deliver in batches at regular base this can be discussed)
-

- Richard

On Monday, 22 May 2023 at 22:22:48 UTC+1 Paul Andrews wrote:

The artifacts from the web site date from Jan 2021, so it is almost 2.5 
years old.

On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 2:28:55 PM UTC-4 gregebert wrote:

They also chose to make an actual pin-base like a traditional vacuum tube; 
not a trivial accomplishment. Time will tell if they have something that is 
manufacturable and reliable.



On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 10:48:15 AM UTC-7 MichaelB wrote:

No, but it's a nice looking tube!

On Monday, May 22, 2023 at 9:44:03 AM UTC-7 Nicholas Stock wrote:

https://kepler-labs.com/

Did these ever make it into production?

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Re: [neonixie-l] Need advice on a new scope...

[Richard Scales]

At the risk of being thrown out of the group - for all fixing and related 
activities I got a £140 dual channel 'Hantek' scope from Aliexpress and it 
has been rock solid for the 5 years I've had it.

The current equivalent would be something like 
this: 
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001845215723.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.main.89.79a739d44I0AEE_pvid=8e4801c6-632d-48d6-946b-80ea3ee2baae_p4p_detail=20230421053633684959269571028384012_exp_id=8e4801c6-632d-48d6-946b-80ea3ee2baae-44_npi=3%40dis%21GBP%21287.48%21155.23%21%21%21%21%21%402145279016820805933988046d0715%211217827964326%21sea%21UK%21720874442=0ARjNYpxmHuE_pvid=20230421053633684959269571028384012_9_pvid=20230421053633684959269571028384012_9

There have been occasions when I wished for just one more channel but I got 
over it!


 - Richard


On Friday, 21 April 2023 at 13:18:56 UTC+1 Joe Croft wrote:

> My Siglent 1202X-E is a real nice scope for a digital scope. 200Mhz, 2 
> channels.
>
> -joe
>
> On Thu, Apr 20, 2023 at 10:44 PM martin martin  wrote:
>
>> My Tek 2236 is nearly 30 moons old and no longer stays on for more than a 
>> few minutes.  I am sure it's fixable, but on the other hand maybe time for 
>> a new digital!
>>
>> What do you guys suggest for general use and of course clock fixing?
>>
>>
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Babcock SP-252 Data Sheet

[Richard Scales]

Thank you - having focussed as closely as possible on the data - I have 
mapped out the tube positions and am assessing the feasibility of making 
some kind of socket.

Workings suggest that the closest any two pins get is 90mil - that's all 
fine on the PCB.

The pin sockets I have are 70mil at the widest - so - that plenty of 
clearance.

[image: Pins.jpg]

The picture is really bad but confirms my measurements - we are good to go!

 - Richard


On Saturday, 1 April 2023 at 05:54:45 UTC+1 J Forbes wrote:

> I doubt that better glasses will help a lot, the image is so small. 
> Resizing it gives you the info that is available in the image, which should 
> be enough to get you what you need to know. If you have the part in hand, 
> you can measure the dimensions that are unclear?
>
>
>
> On Friday, March 31, 2023 at 9:08:56 PM UTC-7 Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> Hello everyone,
>>
>> I am seeking data on the pin locations for the Babcock (Sperry, Beckman) 
>> SP-252 Panaplex display.
>>
>> There is data over at tube-tester.com though the image of the pin 
>> locations is not that clear and I was wondering whether anybody had any 
>> clearer information?
>>
>> They do not feature in the Sperry 'Information Displays and Accessories' 
>> catalogue from 1973 - which I already have.
>>
>>
>> [image: sp-252_outline.gif]
>>
>>
>>  or do I just need better glasses ?!?!
>>
>> - Richard
>>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Babcock SP-252 Data Sheet

[Richard Scales]

Hello everyone,

I am seeking data on the pin locations for the Babcock (Sperry, Beckman) 
SP-252 Panaplex display.

There is data over at tube-tester.com though the image of the pin locations 
is not that clear and I was wondering whether anybody had any clearer 
information?

They do not feature in the Sperry 'Information Displays and Accessories' 
catalogue from 1973 - which I already have.


[image: sp-252_outline.gif]


 or do I just need better glasses ?!?!

- Richard

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: DTF104B Group Buy

[Richard Scales]

If anyone is interested I do have a solution for driving these, please send 
me a PM.
 - Richard

On Tuesday, 7 March 2023 at 12:25:20 UTC Mattelec wrote:

> I would be in for 10 tubes!
>
> El martes, 7 de marzo de 2023 a las 9:58:33 UTC+1, Michail Wilson escribió:
>
>> I don’t think so. 
>>
>> What is the socket used for these tubes?
>>
>> Sent from Space
>>
>> On Mar 7, 2023, at 12:54 AM, Alan Tan  wrote:
>>
>>  
>>
>> Is there a readily available kit for these tubes? I'll grab some if there 
>> is.
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 7, 2023 at 10:32 AM Olivier  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Nick, 
>>>
>>> Count me in for 15 please.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Olivier 
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, 7 March 2023 at 6:22:19 am UTC+8 Nicholas Stock wrote:
>>>
 Folks, we have secured 500 DTF104Bs, so the $22 price is in effect. 
 Thanks to everyone who emailed. There's still time for others to jump in 
 if 
 they want as I (and one other) chipped in on the number to bring us up to 
 500. I'll be in touch with everyone individually about 
 address/shipping/payment in due course.

 Any questions, then you should know where to reach me.. 

 Cheers,

 Nick

 On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 12:16 PM Nicholas Stock  
 wrote:

> Fellow enthusiasts. I have a vendor (someone I have done business with 
> before) who wants to sell some DTF104B's (NOS) for $25 dollars each. If 
> you 
> wish to buy some, then please contact me directly and I can organize. 
>
> Best,
>
> Nick
>
 -- 
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>>>  
>>> 
>>> .
>>>
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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: New nixie power supply released - NCH8200HV

[Richard Scales]

I have used over 100 of them without issue - what are the comments that you 
have seen saying?
 - Richard


On Tuesday, 31 January 2023 at 08:32:51 UTC Nigel wrote:

> Hi
>
> I've bought some of these modules from here 
> 
> .
>
> Here's one new in the packet and another attached to a PCB.
>
> [image: IMG_9652.jpeg]
>
> [image: IMG_9653.jpeg]
>
> I was very pleased with the one in use but I'm now very concerned about 
> them given the comments that I found on this Reddit 
> 
> thread.
>
> I'd be interested in hearing from the OP regarding this.
>
> Has anyone had any issues with this module or know about the topic raised 
> in the thread ?
>
> Thanks.
>
> On Saturday, 7 September 2019 at 09:10:24 UTC+1 newxito wrote:
>
>> 96.7% at 10 mA, that’s amazing, Yan! 
>>
>> Please release these power supplies soon :-) 
>>
>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] thyraton & dekatron

[Richard Scales]

I was stood next to that last Sunday  - we actually got right in to the 
coding and how all the instructions worked as we single stepped through the 
code. Our guide said that some people use Dekatrons to garnish their clocks 
so  I showed him a picture of my 'Harwell' from Sgitheach - which he found 
suitably impressive!
 - Richard

On Friday, 27 January 2023 at 10:53:28 UTC Sgitheach wrote:

> This is probably the best known dekatron computer
>
> https://www.tnmoc.org/witch
>
> Dekatrons both "compute" and "display" making them very versatile. Read 
> the chapter in the book by JB Dance that Jon referenced and you'll see how 
> they work.
> On 27/01/2023 10:35, Benoit Tourret wrote:
>
> When I was learning at the Control Data Institute in the early eightees, 
> we worked on a computer whitch only had discrete components. no IC, only 
> transistors, diodes, resistors and condensators. and a tore memory. there 
> was a backbone and hundreds of small cards where pluged on, each card was a 
> or, a nand or any logical door or a flip-flop (register). 
> there was no keyboard nor screen, just 28 switches and 28 lights, one raw 
> for address, the other for the data. but it was 0 and 1, the beginning of 
> the ordinary logic
> are the dekatrons working on 0 and 1 (1 + 1 = 10) or working on differents 
> level of tension ? such as in Concorde (the plane) where 1V + 1V = 2V
>
> is this tube is only a "display" or does it have an active part of the 
> compute process ?
>
> fot the MTX-90, if there is a gate, this is not just a display.
> Does it is just a light activated with a small input or rather a 
> "transistor" ?
>
> Le vendredi 27 janvier 2023 à 10:16:53 UTC+1, Jon a écrit :
>
>> Welcome Ben, good to have you here.  It's a bit difficult to know where 
>> to start with your question on dekatrons without writing pages of stuff 
>> which might not be on point. A good start might be to get hold of a copy of 
>> Electronic Counting Circuits by JB Dance - that has a long chapter on 
>> dekatrons and related tubes, and there are scans floating around (can't 
>> remember if we have one here). Are there specific tubes you want to 
>> understand better? 
>>
>> Jon.
>>
>> On Thursday, January 26, 2023 at 10:14:24 PM UTC Terry Bowman wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 26, 2023, at 4:48 PM, Benoit Tourret  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I am looking for information about Dekatron device "as a compute 
>>> device", what are the main differences between all the models, 
>>> and also about the thyraton mtx-90.
>>> what was their first usage and so on...
>>>
>>>
>>> I'd like to know more about the MTX-90 as well. Have you seen these?:
>>>
>>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/175204420312
>>>
>>>
>>> Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
>>> "The Mac Doctor"
>>>
>>> https://www.astarcloseup.com
>>>
>>> “...the book said something astonishing, a very big thought. The stars, 
>>> it said, were suns but very far away. The Sun was a star but close 
>>> up.”—Carl Sagan, "The Backbone Of Night", *Cosmos*, 1980
>>>
>>>
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> 
> .
>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Dalibors Colon Tower Tubes

[Richard Scales]

Found it!

https://docs2.daliborfarny.com/documentation/driving-circuit-seperator-tube/

 - Richard

On Sunday, 1 January 2023 at 06:43:20 UTC Richard Scales wrote:

> Has anyone here used or have any knowledge of the Colon Tower tubes from 
> Dalibor Farny?
>
> Specifically I am looking for details of the recommended current 
> requirements and maintaining voltage so that I can correctly calculate the 
> required series resistors.
>
> Thank you  all.
>
> - Richard
>
>
>
>

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[neonixie-l] Dalibors Colon Tower Tubes

[Richard Scales]

Has anyone here used or have any knowledge of the Colon Tower tubes from 
Dalibor Farny?

Specifically I am looking for details of the recommended current 
requirements and maintaining voltage so that I can correctly calculate the 
required series resistors.

Thank you  all.

- Richard



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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Welcome & please introduce yourself!

[Richard Scales]

If anyone needs to source the various tubes required - I have up to date 
pricing for a couple of UK suppliers - PM if needed.

 - Richard


On Wednesday, 14 December 2022 at 15:34:56 UTC Pramanicin wrote:

> For those putting the trigger tube clock together, I'm in the process of 
> building one board set up and writing the construction manual. It's not 
> really necessary, as you can just follow the eagle files etc on the Dropbox 
> from Grahame, but it may be useful for some. If any builders have comments 
> or suggestions when constructing the boards, please drop me a private 
> message. 
>
> Cheers,
>
> Nick
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Dec 14, 2022, at 07:28, Richard Scales  wrote:
>
> Welcome to the group.
>
>
> I am particularly interested to hear that you are building the Trigger 
> clock as I am embarking on that same project. I have the boards and am 
> securing the tubes as we speak.
>
> It would be good to keep in touch regarding progress and anything that 
> I/You/We find out along the way.
>
> Either reply here or via PM - easy either way.
>
> I am in the UK, where are you located? 
>
>
> - Richard 
> On Wednesday, 14 December 2022 at 13:34:49 UTC Olivier wrote:
>
>> Hi there,
>>
>> I joined recently the group and read with interest the conversations.
>> I came accros the Web page of Grahame and his various clocks and got 
>> interested in the cold cathode trigger clock project which I am going to 
>> build.
>> I have an academic background in physics and electronics but did not 
>> really work in that area, rather my professional job is in finance software.
>> Electronics is then a hobby for a very long time and I build all sorts of 
>> projects. So the next one is that trigger clock :)
>> I hope I can learn interesting things in the nixie world and I look 
>> forward to interacting here!
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Olivier 
>>  
>>
> -- 
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> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/68fb87a9-954a-463c-9d33-abb2f62be7d3n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
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>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Welcome & please introduce yourself!

[Richard Scales]

Welcome to the group.

I am particularly interested to hear that you are building the Trigger 
clock as I am embarking on that same project. I have the boards and am 
securing the tubes as we speak.

It would be good to keep in touch regarding progress and anything that 
I/You/We find out along the way.

Either reply here or via PM - easy either way.

I am in the UK, where are you located? 


- Richard 
On Wednesday, 14 December 2022 at 13:34:49 UTC Olivier wrote:

> Hi there,
>
> I joined recently the group and read with interest the conversations.
> I came accros the Web page of Grahame and his various clocks and got 
> interested in the cold cathode trigger clock project which I am going to 
> build.
> I have an academic background in physics and electronics but did not 
> really work in that area, rather my professional job is in finance software.
> Electronics is then a hobby for a very long time and I build all sorts of 
> projects. So the next one is that trigger clock :)
> I hope I can learn interesting things in the nixie world and I look 
> forward to interacting here!
>
> Cheers,
> Olivier 
>  
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Anyone purchased one of these clocks?

[Richard Scales]

>From the pictures I would say that it does use pin sockets therefore I 
would expect them to be included.

The evidence being that A) - you can just see them in the top view of the 
clock and B) the holes on the PCB look too small for the pins on IN-12 
tubes.

... though for $25.38 including shipping - who knows what you'll end up 
with!

For my money - if I was looking for a pre manufactured board then I would 
look no further than here: https://www.nixieclock.biz/StoreMNC6.html

OK, no case, 6 digits and not IN-12 but you are getting a feature rich well 
designed clock from a respected supplier. He does have a kit for 4 digits 
of IN-12 but you would need to assemble that yourself.

- Richard


On Tuesday, 13 December 2022 at 03:15:01 UTC Terry S wrote:

> https://www.ebay.com/itm/314168311777
>
> Many sellers on ebay.
>
> Does it come with pins for the tubes?
>
> Terry
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: New oddity

[Richard Scales]

Ah, am I right in thinking those are the multiplexed PV remote kits?

Had you thought about adding a GPS or NTP sync device to give you a hassle 
free method of making both clocks show the exact same time?
 - Richard




On Sunday, 11 December 2022 at 22:10:09 UTC martin martin wrote:

> Just finished this one. 
> Boards from from PV Electronics

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[neonixie-l] Re: NEW MOD-SIX LUMINA

[Richard Scales]

My only real question is - where to I sign?
 - Richard


On Sunday, 11 December 2022 at 04:14:15 UTC MichaelB wrote:

> New MOD-SIX 'LUMINA' is released and ready. Please have a look and contact 
> me directly with questions! Badnixie.com

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Re: [neonixie-l] Nixie clock sighting

[Richard Scales]

Similar sightings over on the FB group - popular with us nixie fans this 
series is!
- Richard


On Sunday, 4 December 2022 at 03:16:23 UTC OrangeGlow wrote:

> Also at the end of the first episode.
> On 12/3/2022 4:12 PM, 'Grahame' via neonixie-l wrote:
>
> "Wednesday" Episode 6 about 27 minutes.
>
>
>
>
>
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: IN-17 Direct Drive WiFi Enabled Clock

[Richard Scales]

I'm working on making this a  kit at some point - it is direct drive using 
HV5622's so it's not the most frugal of designs.

How are you  with SMD?

One of the parts in the PSU (in the first batch!) is 0402 - are you OK with 
that? I can always do that for you if needed.

If I re-order boards I will make it  0805 instead.

Otherwise its 0805, 1206, neopixels, A CD40109B in SOIC-16 and HV5622's in 
QFP-44 package that need soldering.

Then it's all the board interconnections, wemos mounting, power and PIR 
connections and a push switch.

I have board sets now as well as most (if not all) of the other components 
- including IN-17's. 

PM me if interested.

- RIchard


On Wednesday, 30 November 2022 at 13:32:21 UTC blkadder wrote:

> I love the look of the tiny IN17s.  I would buy a kit for sure.
>
> On Wednesday, November 30, 2022 at 7:27:57 AM UTC-5 hall...@hotmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> Looks great Mate..Now I know,what you were makeing,space for...Like the 
>> seperate -Bulbs have there own.circuit board,Design.
>> Cheers.Peter
>>
>> On Wednesday, November 30, 2022 at 8:15:04 PM UTC+8 Richard Scales wrote:
>>
>>> Following a recent post elsewhere I challenged myself to come up with an 
>>> IN-17 version of the open source Prism design by Ian Sparkes.
>>>
>>> This is the result. It's hardly the most frugal design. HV5622 drivers, 
>>> wemos controller and an Omnixie HV module.
>>>
>>> The 5V supply is all new as I needed to make it much smaller than the 
>>> regular LM2596 design.
>>>
>>> Most T. I. switchers are unobtainable but eventually I found something 
>>> that worked. Thanks to John Ash for the power supply advice.
>>>
>>> All the usual features including WiFi NTP sync and Web gui, optional PIR 
>>> via 3.5mm jack, tube underlighting for those that like it.
>>>
>>> Testing going well, now I need to stick it in a case - I am thinking of 
>>> something that might sit on top of, or underneath (easier) a monitor - the 
>>> IN-17's are not best suited to distance viewing!
>>>
>>>  - Richard
>>>
>>> [image: IN-17-1.jpg][image: IN-17-2.jpg][image: IN-17-3.jpg][image: 
>>> IN-17-4.jpg][image: IN-17-5.jpg]
>>>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: IN-17 Direct Drive WiFi Enabled Clock

[Richard Scales]

I ended up using the LMR16006YDDC  - I got hold of some of the fixed 5V 
ones.
- Richard



On Wednesday, 30 November 2022 at 13:44:43 UTC newxito wrote:

> Nice clock!
> For 5V I like the AP63205WU-7, small, cheap and available again...
>
> Richard Scales schrieb am Mittwoch, 30. November 2022 um 13:15:04 UTC+1:
>
>> The 5V supply is all new as I needed to make it much smaller than the 
>> regular LM2596 design.
>>
>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Where to get numitron/DT1705C tubes?

[Richard Scales]

PM sent
- Richard


On Sunday, 20 November 2022 at 22:45:36 UTC tntm...@gmail.com wrote:

> Wait for them to show up on ebay or by chance someone here who has some 
> offers you some for sale based on this post
>
> On Sun, Nov 20, 2022, 5:31 PM Chris  wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I am looking for a set of numitrons like the DR2000 round top, IV9 or 
>> equivalent.
>>
>> I am also looking for 1 piece of the DT1705C as i already have 5.
>>
>> Does anyone know where to get any of these?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Chris
>>
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Clock boards for sale

[Richard Scales]

I have too many projects and need to make some space!

Accordingly I offer the following completed kits by PV Electronics to 
anyone making a reasonable offer:

Spectrum 18 x 1 (no tubes) 
Spectrum 1040 x 2 (no tubes)
Stainless steel case for Spectrum boards (original version) still wrapped 
as supplied new. 
QTC  (Original red PCB) with a set of IN-14 tubes
QTC (Original red PCB)  (no tubes)
Frank3 with all tubes (4 x IN-12 and 2 x IN-17)
IN-8   (no tubes)

Also available, one of Ian Sparkes Arduino based boards with WiFi for 
remote tubes including 6 x IN-1 tubes in sockets, mounted and wired to the 
clock pcb.

All kits have been recently tested with tubes and run the startup tests and 
clock functions, there may be the odd missing neon or switch but these can 
all be made good.
These are excellent clocks with excellent support.

Sets of tubes (IN-18 and Z566 or ZM1042) available only to purchase with 
the spectrum boards.

PM only if interested for pictures or if you wish to make an offer or ask 
questions.

 - Richard

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[neonixie-l] Re: Designing Nixie Clock with ZM1082T drived by HV528 and using ESP8266 as MCU

[Richard Scales]

For the general driving of shift registers - take a look at the Arduino 
ShiftOut function 
(https://www.arduino.cc/reference/en/language/functions/advanced-io/shiftout/)  
- this shifts out 8 bits at a time - you can modify the code in the 
ShiftOut function to work with 16,32,64 bits etc. You just need the three 
pins that you have already identified.
A step up from that is to use SPI transfer - which works like shiftout but 
instead - the processor handles the transfer.
Please check the suitability of this device for nixes - the spec seems to 
suggest that it will sink or drive 1mA and I believe that the ZM1080 has a 
2mA cathode current.
I usually use HV5522 or HV5622 which handle the current and are easy to 
drive via ShiftOut or SPI.transfer commands. They also support a blanking 
signal which can be used to vary tube brightness.
 - RIchard


On Thursday, 3 November 2022 at 21:45:03 UTC scipa...@gmail.com wrote:

> Hi, as my final Masters Degree thesis in Microelectronics I decided to 
> create portable/small form-factor nixie tube clock using ZM1082T. Whole 
> project is circled around modern connectivity, so I am using USB type-c for 
> programing and powering plus Wi-Fi connectivity and all that. So simply 
> put, I designed my own PCB, which is thing I do and it's fine, but besides 
> some pinout and footprint miss-steps, everything about that is fine, all my 
> features (temp, buzzer, RGB Neopixel backlight, Wi-Fi, USB-C powering and 
> programing, protections, RTC) are working flawlessly. My problem is, I am 
> not a programmer, and all the features mentioned above were tested using 
> example libraries and that's fine for having something from which I can 
> kick-off and create final whole code, but with HV528 it's different story. 
> In this whole Group there is not much about using push-pull configuration 
> HV chips from microchip (which, believe me, if I could, I wouldn't have 
> chosen this chip, but chip shortage, availability, money, my country 
> shipping, etc. that's why and this is what I got). With poor datasheet 
> details from microchip, POL and BP pins are for me quite a mystery and when 
> creating schematic and PCB I left BP open and POL with LE, CLK, DIN were 
> connected to ESP (on SPI pins, POL and LE to GPIO). which should be fine 
> based on my reasearch, but for the love of god, I can't seem to figure out 
> to test it, and control it. Only thing I could manage was that all cathodes 
> were glowing :D. But basically I am too lazy and time limited to create 
> some code "now" to test it. I was hoping for some libraries and examples or 
> some simple shift registers examples, which could be transferred to this, 
> but no luck. 
>
> So if anyone, is interested in this "problem" and shows some interest, I 
> am willing to show more, fotos, schematics, but for now, I don't want to 
> post anything (our school algorithms would thing I copied from here and I 
> would be flagged for plagiarism, stupid, I know, but no point in risking 
> it...). So thanks everyone for any comment.
> Looking forward to interesting conversations.
>
> PS: probably to catch your interest, here are some unrendered 3D models 
> from Altium.
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Speaking of Panaplex!

[Richard Scales]

I love my Due, Graham and Nick as you say - super helpful, supportive and 
knowledgeable, looking forward very much to seeing what comes out from them 
next.
 - Richard



On Saturday, 1 October 2022 at 07:20:28 UTC+1 flata...@gmail.com wrote:

> I have a ScopeClock Duo from Sgitheach. See attached, very pleased with 
> it. Plus Graham is a pleasure to deal with. Open software/open hardware. 
> One of my favourite features is the PIR sensor with soft start, which 
> reduces the current to the heater when it's still cold, extending its life. 
> Very clever. 
>
> I'm currently working on a solar nixie watch. As soon as I'm done, I'll 
> try to work out the maths for the custom transformer of the ScopeClock by 
> Cathode Corner. I like how that clock has a relatively compact design. I'll 
> make only one or two clocks. 
>
>  Original message 
> From: martin martin  
> Date: 30/09/2022 22:38 (GMT+00:00) 
> To: neonixie-l  
> Subject: [neonixie-l] Re: Speaking of Panaplex! 
>
> Was thinking of going to the CRT clock from Cathode Corner
>
> On Friday, September 30, 2022 at 7:43:00 AM UTC-7 Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> Very nice - love a Heathkit Panaplex clock.
>>
>> What CRT clock are you looking at or are you cooking up one yourself?
>>
>> I built a Scope Clock Due : http://www.sgitheach.org.uk/scope3.html  - a 
>> spectacular scope clock - very pleased.
>>
>> - Richard
>>
>>
>> On Friday, 30 September 2022 at 14:02:16 UTC+1 martin martin wrote:
>>
>>> I built this somewhere in the 80s. Still works great (after new disc 
>>> caps). I even have the original manual.
>>>
>>> For sale if someone's interested- time to make room for CRT clock!
>>>
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[neonixie-l] Re: Speaking of Panaplex!

[Richard Scales]

Very nice - love a Heathkit Panaplex clock.

What CRT clock are you looking at or are you cooking up one yourself?

I built a Scope Clock Due : http://www.sgitheach.org.uk/scope3.html  - a 
spectacular scope clock - very pleased.

- Richard


On Friday, 30 September 2022 at 14:02:16 UTC+1 martin martin wrote:

> I built this somewhere in the 80s. Still works great (after new disc 
> caps). I even have the original manual.
>
> For sale if someone's interested- time to make room for CRT clock!
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: NIMO...

[Richard Scales]

So sorry - the unit on the bay is the 'regular' single digit type NIMO tube.
- Richard

On Thursday, 22 September 2022 at 05:55:28 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:

> There is a single unit on the bay right now in the UK.
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/115535226656 
> <https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/115535226656?fbclid=IwAR3IALwcHyLAUptCye7RO4Rtq7gH1i_2eMszNnNxfPxDQo8-AbvWzyXYIBs>
> Not my auction etc.
> - Richard
>
>
> On Wednesday, 21 September 2022 at 23:38:38 UTC+1 gregebert wrote:
>
>> Heh-hehI would gladly by a dozen at that price
>>
>> On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 3:37:30 PM UTC-7 gregebert wrote:
>>
>>> There was another twist on the NIMO tube that used an external 
>>> deflection yoke to show multiple digits on a single line; I believe it 4 or 
>>> 6 digits.
>>> Never saw this 8x8 tube before; that must be one RARE device.
>>> In order for a NIMO tube to display multiple lines of multiple 
>>> characters (like a CRT), it would need a deflection yoke for X and Y 
>>> direction.
>>>
>>> I feel sad for the folks at IEE who put so much time and effort into the 
>>> NIMO tube. It's technologically clever, but a colossal execution and 
>>> marketing failure; it missed the market window by about 10 years.
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 3:02:23 PM UTC-7 Pramanicin wrote:
>>>
>>>> Turns out there was!!
>>>>
>>>> http://lampes-et-tubes.info/cd/cd080.php?l=e
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Sep 21, 2022 at 3:01 PM Nicholas Stock  
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Were these ever a thing?
>>>>>
>>>>> [image: image.png]
>>>>>
>>>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: NIMO...

[Richard Scales]

There is a single unit on the bay right now in the UK.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/115535226656 

Not my auction etc.
- Richard


On Wednesday, 21 September 2022 at 23:38:38 UTC+1 gregebert wrote:

> Heh-hehI would gladly by a dozen at that price
>
> On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 3:37:30 PM UTC-7 gregebert wrote:
>
>> There was another twist on the NIMO tube that used an external deflection 
>> yoke to show multiple digits on a single line; I believe it 4 or 6 digits.
>> Never saw this 8x8 tube before; that must be one RARE device.
>> In order for a NIMO tube to display multiple lines of multiple characters 
>> (like a CRT), it would need a deflection yoke for X and Y direction.
>>
>> I feel sad for the folks at IEE who put so much time and effort into the 
>> NIMO tube. It's technologically clever, but a colossal execution and 
>> marketing failure; it missed the market window by about 10 years.
>>
>> On Wednesday, September 21, 2022 at 3:02:23 PM UTC-7 Pramanicin wrote:
>>
>>> Turns out there was!!
>>>
>>> http://lampes-et-tubes.info/cd/cd080.php?l=e
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 21, 2022 at 3:01 PM Nicholas Stock  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Were these ever a thing?

 [image: image.png]

>>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] VFD Filament Current

[Richard Scales]

Thank you all for your input.

Currently (!) I am looking at a small A/C driver - one per display - I 
should be able to report back once tests have been performed - waiting on 
board fabrication - I would also only have the whole thing 'on' once 
triggered (that includes both filament and segment supplies) so most of the 
time - the device will be 'cold'.

As for the segments - the plan is to use a 74595 coupled to a TD62783 for 
switching the 24V - each tube will attach to an individual PCB - the PCB's 
can then be chained together - 6 planned for this clock plus a couple of 
colons using IV-26's (multiple dot action is planned).

- Richard





On Wednesday, 14 September 2022 at 16:26:23 UTC+1 gregebert wrote:

> Another thing to consider is when to turn filaments on and off. Having a 
> PIR motion sensor to turn-off the segment supply is important, because 
> long-term you will see dark regions on the phosphor closest to the filament.
>
> Turning filaments on and off too many times will wear them out from 
> thermal cycling. Having series resistance to reduce the peak inrush current 
> will help a lot to extend their life. But leaving them on 24/7 might lead 
> to wearout as well.
>
> I have the same issue with my NIMO tube clock (I expect to post more 
> details and a video in a few weeks). NIMO tubes are basically 
> irreplaceable, so burning-out a filament is a death sentence for the tube. 
> For now, I have programable timers for 3 states:
>
> cold (filaments off)
> warm (filaments on, high voltage off)
> on (filaments and HV on) - Tubes are readable
>
> To go from cold-to-warm, the software requires a few seconds of PIR 
> activity so that peeking into the room wont trigger it.
> Warm-to-on will happen with any PIR activity.
>
> What I dont yet know is how long I should keep the clock in the warm 
> state. Too short, and there will be excessive filament cycling. Too long, 
> and it leads to wearout. For now, the warm timeout is 100 seconds, and the 
> cold timeout is 24 hours. After the novelty of this clock wears off, it 
> will be put in standby mode where it's just keeping time and the display is 
> disabled.
>
> On Wednesday, September 14, 2022 at 6:35:29 AM UTC-7 Paul Andrews wrote:
>
>> Arghh - I accidentally hit send on that last one. So anyway, if you don't 
>> plan to use the grid to turn the tube off, you can wire it to the segment 
>> positive voltage and ignore the need for a bias. You still might want to 
>> put the series resistor in though. The exact value you use is going to 
>> depend on the cold and hot resistance of the filament. Oh, also if it 
>> wasn't clear from my second point, the series resistor acts as a voltage 
>> divider, so you have to figure out what the total total voltage across that 
>> resistor and filament should be.
>>
>> In my VFD clock I needed two different filament voltages, so I use a buck 
>> converter to get the larger of the two and used a series resistor to 
>> produce the lower. In retrospect it might have been better to use series 
>> resistors for both and have a higher regulated voltage - the resistances 
>> are all very small and it would help smooth over any variations in 
>> individual tubes and resistors.
>>
>> So the easiest way to figure out these values is to measure the filament 
>> resistance when cold to get an initial value for the series resistor, then 
>> start experimenting and measuring.
>>
>> On Wednesday, September 14, 2022 at 9:25:57 AM UTC-4 Paul Andrews wrote:
>>
>>> I don't know the specs for these specific tubes, but a resistor in 
>>> series with the filament servers a couple of purposes:
>>>
>>>1. It reduces the inrush current (i.e. when the filaments are cold). 
>>>The resistance of the filaments is low when they are cold, so if you put 
>>>the steady-state voltage across them in that state, there will be a much 
>>>greater current. For this purpose the series resistor value should be 
>>> high 
>>>enough to drop that current within the specified limits of the filament.
>>>2. Putting a resistor between 0V and the filament raises the base 
>>>voltage of the filament above 0V. If the tube has a grid, it is 
>>> typically 
>>>specified to be at a negative voltage with respect to the filament so 
>>> that 
>>>it can be guaranteed to cut off the current when pulled to that voltage. 
>>> An 
>>>easy way to achieve this negative bias is to raise the filament voltage 
>>>above 0V and keep the grid at 0V.
>>>3. 
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, September 

Re: [neonixie-l] VFD Filament Current

[Richard Scales]

I think I already see blunders in my original post - the filament is the 
cathode (I think) at 5V, the segments (individual anodes) at 25V giving a 
19V difference over the grid which is at 5V.
I am unsure as to the correct value of the series resistor for the heaters- 
10R has been used by others though I would prefer to know how that was 
calculated and indeed whether there are significant gains to be made by 
moving to an A/C drive for the filaments.
- Richard

On Wednesday, 14 September 2022 at 09:02:24 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:

> Hello everyone,
> I have just managed to acquire a set of these and would ideally like to 
> drive them the best possible way.
> I had initially though about a 5V for the filament and then 24V for the 
> cathodes and grid.
> The clock would only have segments activated when someone is nearby - the 
> segments will not be left on all of the time.
> Now I read about A/C supply to the filaments and wonder if I should be 
> going that way.
> Would anyone be able to post their findings and/or suggest the right way 
> forward?
> [image: VFDsnip.JPG]
>
> I just noted that the picture above shows the connection for the grid (pin 
> 9 on H1) connected to 5V and not the 24V as used on the cathodes.
> The more I think about it - the less clear this all becomes!
> I need to get it right in my head before I go breaking something and then 
> I would like to get the best possible result via reasonably straight 
> forward means.
> Would anyone be able to point me in the right direction and/or share 
> proven drive methods?
> - Richard
>
>
> On Monday, 16 September 2019 at 22:23:47 UTC+1 gregebert wrote:
>
>> Yes! That's exactly what happens. The current through the center-tap is 
>> the sum of the anode (segment) current and the grid current. And the peak 
>> current through the filament wires is actually *greater* than just the 
>> current to heat the filaments.
>>
>>
>> *Tomasz* - As you found out, those VFDs draw a lot of current. I have a 
>> future design for a 6-tube ILC1-1/8 (smaller tubes than the ILC1-1/7) and 
>> I'm just going to use a high-current filament transformer with the 
>> center-tap at GND. Grids will NOT be pure DC; closer to full-wave rectified 
>> around 15-16V. Segment anodes will be pure DC around 36-40V with 
>> current-regulators and non-multiplexed.
>>
>> I actually have an Op-amp summer+ADC+Software to monitor the current thru 
>> the center-rap  on my NIMO clock to determine the tube health, though it's 
>> orders of magnitude smaller (30uA per tube).
>>
>>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] VFD Filament Current

[Richard Scales]

Hello everyone,
I have just managed to acquire a set of these and would ideally like to 
drive them the best possible way.
I had initially though about a 5V for the filament and then 24V for the 
cathodes and grid.
The clock would only have segments activated when someone is nearby - the 
segments will not be left on all of the time.
Now I read about A/C supply to the filaments and wonder if I should be 
going that way.
Would anyone be able to post their findings and/or suggest the right way 
forward?
[image: VFDsnip.JPG]

I just noted that the picture above shows the connection for the grid (pin 
9 on H1) connected to 5V and not the 24V as used on the cathodes.
The more I think about it - the less clear this all becomes!
I need to get it right in my head before I go breaking something and then I 
would like to get the best possible result via reasonably straight forward 
means.
Would anyone be able to point me in the right direction and/or share proven 
drive methods?
- Richard


On Monday, 16 September 2019 at 22:23:47 UTC+1 gregebert wrote:

> Yes! That's exactly what happens. The current through the center-tap is 
> the sum of the anode (segment) current and the grid current. And the peak 
> current through the filament wires is actually *greater* than just the 
> current to heat the filaments.
>
>
> *Tomasz* - As you found out, those VFDs draw a lot of current. I have a 
> future design for a 6-tube ILC1-1/8 (smaller tubes than the ILC1-1/7) and 
> I'm just going to use a high-current filament transformer with the 
> center-tap at GND. Grids will NOT be pure DC; closer to full-wave rectified 
> around 15-16V. Segment anodes will be pure DC around 36-40V with 
> current-regulators and non-multiplexed.
>
> I actually have an Op-amp summer+ADC+Software to monitor the current thru 
> the center-rap  on my NIMO clock to determine the tube health, though it's 
> orders of magnitude smaller (30uA per tube).
>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: SIngle B-7971 being sold

[Richard Scales]

... and now that one's been sold - a good friend of mine has just told me 
that he is looking for one (or ideally two) B-7971.

He is in AUS, is there anyone listening that might be willing to part with 
one (or two) working/tested B-7971 to ship to AUS?

- Richard


On Wednesday, 24 August 2022 at 04:57:40 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:

> Not my auction - but it is from someone I know: 
> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/195303524715
> - Richard
>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] ZM1350 smart socket

[Richard Scales]

I could not find this board when I needed some so - ultimately I designed 
my own but to keep the footprint as small as possible I used two boards - 
one on the back of the other.
I strongly suspect that the boards you have will follow the 'standard' 
circuit design which used MPSA42's fed from a PIC 16F690 via 33K resistors 
and then individual cathode resistors per segment.
Let me know if you need any more info.
'Check the Smart Sockets' group site for more information if needed - 
including code for the PIC. https://groups.io/g/smartsocket

 - Richard


On Friday, 26 August 2022 at 09:33:35 UTC+1 Guus Assmann wrote:

> Hello Jeffrey, 
>
> I've not seen them in this fashion. 
> However I'm pretty sure that I've made the original design. 
> Please find attached file, that should contain all info you need. 
>
> BR/ 
> Guus Assmann 
>
> P.S. 
> Original design was made with Ulticap and Ultiboard. 
> These programs no longer work on my current PC's. 
>
> Op 25-08-2022 23:56 schreef Jeffry P : 
>
>
>
> Does anyone know who designed this board? I need a BOM and instructions. 
> [image: 
> am1350 smart socket back.jpg] [image: zm 1350 smart socket front.jpg] 
>
>
> -- 
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>  
> .
>  
>
>
>

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[neonixie-l] SIngle B-7971 being sold

[Richard Scales]

Not my auction - but it is from someone I 
know: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/195303524715
- Richard

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Re: [neonixie-l] Self-introduction & tube trading

[Richard Scales]

Good morning,

I have nothing of any note to trade but would be interested in purchasing 
some of your large VFD's/ I am in the UK, please let me know if you would 
be happy to ship there and if so, what you would like to sell some for?
 - RIchard


On Sunday, 21 August 2022 at 22:56:34 UTC+1 dunc...@gmail.com wrote:

> Martin: I'd never heard of pandicon tubes before! That's so cool! Driving 
> them seems like a real pain, though, what with all the mandatory 
> multiplexing going on. Probably less of a pain if you're willing to use a 
> microcontroller? I would love to see some of your work, if you have a 
> link.
>
> One of Dance's chapters is about beam switching/trochotron counting 
> circuits, so I'm already stealing wholesale from that to build a clock.
>
> Eric: when I was investigating options for my tuning fork timebase, I came 
> across a plethora of vacuum tube quartz crystals in the low-hundreds to 
> tens of kilohertz range. Of course, they're pretty old and probably have 
> poor temperature compensation, but it would solve your frequency problem 
> without "cheating". I've also seen some people using astable 
> multivibrators as frequency dividers, but by all accounts they're fiddly 
> beasts.
>
> --Duncan
>
> On Sun, 21 Aug 2022, Tidak Ada wrote:
>
> > Hi Duncan,
> >
> > I have some Elesta EZ10 A/B tubes (1MHz resp. 500kHz) that could do the 
> > job if I can get the MHz of the 4MHz TCXO at 400kHz in a 'fair' way. 
> > There must be a way using heterodyne mixing, but that goes beyond my 
> > technical knowledge. HP used the technology in some counters in their 
> > early years.
> > The trouble is that the EZ10A is a hydrogen filled tube. Hydrogen 
> > diffuses through glass, so there is a good chance that the tube is dead.
> >
> > Another less fair way is to use (High levl)TTL or CMOS chips there. 
> > After all, the TCXO is also a semiconductor oscillator.
> >
> > The lower frequencies have to be divided by some Sylvania 6879 dekatrons.
> > The display part should exist by a GS12C, GS12D and GC12/4B and some 
> > 10-counters from the Ericsson house.
> >
> > I am at the level to set up a test circuit for the Elesta's, but time 
> and age are the bottlenecks.
> > Anyhow, I like to save some of the Elesta's for my tube collection.
> > Another guy who may be able to help you is Graham McGuire, also a 
> Neonixie-L member
> >
> > Cheers,
> > eric
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: neoni...@googlegroups.com [mailto:
> neoni...@googlegroups.com] Namens Duncan Townsend
> > Verzonden: zondag 21 augustus 2022 17:17
> > Aan: neoni...@googlegroups.com
> > Onderwerp: RE: [neonixie-l] Self-introduction & tube trading
> >
> > Thanks for the warm welcome!
> >
> > Michail: part of the challenge for the 1j24b CPU is to build the whole 
> thing without any silicon. Building the muxing and decoding circuitry for 
> the 5971s without using a PIC is part of the fun! Of course, sourcing 
> high-voltage germanium diodes is a slog.
> >
> > eric: I had read Joe's research radiomuseum.org but did not know that 
> we shared an _alma mater_. Thanks for the connection and the pointer to 
> tubecollectorsassociation! Re: quartz oscillators, how did you get the 
> frequency down into the dekatron range? IIRC, most dekatrons don't work 
> until you're down in the tens of kilohertz.
> >
> > --Duncan
> >
> > P.S. correction to my original email: I have a large quantity of ILC1 
> 1/7 VFDs not ICL1 1/7.
> >
> > On Sun, 21 Aug 2022, Tidak Ada wrote:
> >
> >> Hello Duncan,
> >>
> >> Interesting projects.
> >>
> >> About those Russian rod-gridded tubes I will refer you to TCA-member [
> >> tubecollecto...@groups.io ] Joe Sousa (MIT). He did a lot of
> >> research on these tubes. His reports are also published at
> >> Radiomuseum.org [
> >> https://duckduckgo.com/?q=radiomuseum.org+english+language=1=v
> >> 261-1=web
> >> ]
> >>
> >> I had plans for a clock with moving coil meter readouts, but I stopped 
> after calculating the power consumption of the project.
> >> Intention was to start with a TC X-tal oscillator (400kHz) then count 
> down with dekatrons to the 0,1Hz region. Then a clock counter with a D/A 
> converter to the meters.
> >>
> >> Unfortunately, the power consumption is irresponsible, especially in 
> this time of scarcity and hi prices in Europe.
> >>
> >> Success!
> >> eric (Tidak Ada)
> >>
> >> -Oorspronkelijk bericht-
> >> Van: neoni...@googlegroups.com [mailto:neoni...@googlegroups.com]
> >> Namens Duncan Townsend
> >> Verzonden: zondag 21 augustus 2022 3:53
> >> Aan: n, the eoni...@googlegroups.com
> >> Onderwerp: [neonixie-l] Self-introduction & tube trading
> >>
> >> Hello everybody!
> >>
> >> I'm Duncan, an American software engineer by day and vacuum tube 
> enthusiast when I'm not distracted by other things. I have an unreasonable 
> number of pokers in the fire right now, but they include:
> >>
> >> * a clock based on each of J.B. Dance's Electronic Counting Circuits

[neonixie-l] Re: WWVB clock

[Richard Scales]

Check the Open Source PRISM design by Ian Sparkes - I have used this for 
several different clocks based on Dalibors tubes - I have changed the 
design to suit my needs but overall - it is the PRISM and uses his software 
to setup and control it.
 - Richard


On Saturday, 20 August 2022 at 05:38:51 UTC+1 gregebert wrote:

> I've been using Raspberry Pi for all my designs now; built-in WiFi makes 
> auto-adjusting clocks trivially simple, as long as I have internet 
> service.. My RZ568m clock is still under construction. The basic design 
> uses HV5530's in a serial chain, with each chip driving 2 tubes. The boards 
> are chained with 10-conductor ribbon-cable, and I have a small 
> level-shifter PCB to boost the signals of the RasPi or FPGA to 12V. Let me 
> know if you want any of the design; nothing special in the design though. I 
> dont have any usable software (it's diagnostic-only), because the actual 
> clock is far more complex and will run with the FPGA and RasPi doing a lot 
> of other non-nixie work.
>
> The timekeeping software is really pretty simple: grab the time-of-day 
> from the OS, then map the 6 digits onto specific bits in the serial chain, 
> and send the serial bits at least once per second (I use 10x/second), and 
> "roll" the digits rapidly when the minutes or seconds hit 59.
>
> On Friday, August 19, 2022 at 8:39:05 PM UTC-7 Terry S wrote:
>
>> As I mentioned in a previous thread -- my Jeff Thomas WWVB clock is 
>> broken. A couple members here offered help, which I appreciate. But as 
>> novel and cool as the WWVB clock approach is, it's a bit of a dated design 
>> and I'm investigating doing something more "modern" with the big Z568M 
>> tubes.
>>
>> For those that may not know, the clock uses a modified "atomic" clock 
>> module from an ordinary WWVB sync'd wall clock. An 8 pin PIC set up as a 
>> timer manipulates the lone input on the clock board as if a user was 
>> pressing the button, setting the initial time and then allowing the WWVB 
>> receiver to speed up or slow down the conventional CMOS counters on the 
>> clock board to sync with WWVB time. It was truly an ingenious approach to 
>> have precise timekeeping back in the day.  (Hours still had to be set 
>> manually by the user, using a magnet and reed switch.)
>>
>> With the advent of easy WIFI this approach is dated, the clock modules 
>> are difficult to find, and there is some tedious clock board rework to do, 
>> which I admit was easier to do when I had the right tools and magnification 
>> at my disposal. Problem I need to solve.
>>
>> S.. I'm seeking out an open source design I can use/adapt for my 
>> big tubes. I'd like to lay out the boards myself so I can match the current 
>> footprint and use my existing enclosure. I'm not hung up on the whole "not 
>> invented here" syndrome -- I'm happy to use something well tested.
>>
>> Arduino based would be ideal, but I can work with most anything. Retired 
>> now so looking to learn new tools.
>>
>> Any suggestions?
>>
>> Terry
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: HVPS in parallel

[Richard Scales]

On my boards for 6 x  RZ568M tubes I do exactly that - I use two HV 
supplies and have divided the HV supply line into two - one for the left 
and one for the right, one HV module for each.

If using 4 tubes and one colon - and you still want to share the load 
between two supplies - then why not  split the supply to the two neons in 
the colon - one to the left and one to the right?

If your colon has only one neon then are you concerned that the effect of 
lighting one neon will make a visible difference to the overall tube 
brightness on one side? I would have thought (but have not tested) that the 
difference would not be noticable (ready to be proven wrong!).

Assuming that is the case - then what effect would the difference between 
displaying an '1' or and '8' one one tube (different currents) have on the 
adjacent tube on the same HV Supply?

Put yet another way - is there a visible effect on any tube on any clock 
when a colon neon is illuminated? (there could be - I've just never noticed 
it - also I have a head full of a cold at the moment and all thinking is 
clouded!).

I don't know what HV modules you are thinking of using and although I've 
not done this myself - I did see a neat trick where someone was using 
Omnixie NCH8200HV modules which they recessed into a suitable hole in the 
PCB - assuming space permits - this allows you to trim the PCB thickness 
off the overall height.

- RIchard




On Saturday, 20 August 2022 at 00:14:23 UTC+1 mo...@neonixie.com wrote:

> Going to clarify a but.. I was referring to using separate supplies for 
> tubes, NOT paralleling them together. As others have said problems arise 
> when you parallel two switch mode supplies.
>
> Back to the comment, if you use one supply for one tube or two or ?? And 
> another for colons or other tubes, doesn't matter the number. I really 
> don't see a problem.
>
> Regards,
> -Moses
>
> On Friday, August 19, 2022 at 3:28:40 PM UTC-7 Moses wrote:
>
>> If the voltage from both supplies are about the same and the resistors on 
>> the tubes are the same.. the brightness will be about the same. I don't see 
>> how there would be a difference.
>>
>> Regards,
>> -Moses
>>
>> On Friday, August 19, 2022 at 3:12:00 PM UTC-7 flata...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> As mentioned in one of my previous posts, I'm building a nixie clock 
>>> with Dalibor's RZ568M tubes.
>>>
>>> The idea is to make the base as thin as possible and to achieve that I 
>>> am using two power supplies, each with a transformer that is about 6mm tall.
>>>
>>> If I build a clock with 6 tubes and 2 colons, I can allocate 3 tubes + 1 
>>> colon to each power supply and the brightness is nicely balanced.
>>>
>>> If I build a clock with 4 tubes and 1 colon divider, then I am not sure 
>>> if I should allocate 2 tubes + 1 colon to a power supply and 2 tubes only 
>>> to the other power supply. If I do so, the brightness in the 2 tubes only 
>>> will be different than in the 2 tubes connected to the colon. I could use 
>>> PWM to adjust brightness but let's assume that I just do direct drive with 
>>> no PWM.
>>>
>>> I thought, is it possible to put two HVPS in parallel as you'd do with 
>>> the batteries to increase overall current for a higher load? I don't think 
>>> that's possible with DC/DC boost converters as it messes up the voltage on 
>>> the top resistor of the voltage divider/feedback loop. I can always try and 
>>> experiment but wanted to hear any suggestions before frying two power 
>>> supplies.
>>>
>>> I have built a larger power supply that can take all 6 Nixies etc but 
>>> the transformer is much taller of course, so I am not using that one.
>>>
>>> I could add a third mini power supply just for the colon, but it seems 
>>> overkill to have 3 power supplies!
>>>
>>> Any thoughts?
>>>
>>> Thanks, as always.
>>> Max
>>>
>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Nixie Clock - Direct Drive HV5530

[Richard Scales]

I've used HV5522 and HV5622 a lot without any issue - I always use a 
CD40109B level shifter to convert from 3v3V or 5V to 12V (I know many do 
not).

In Arduino Land there is a function called ShiftOut which does all the 
required clocking - it's for 8 bits as standard but can easily be re-worked 
for however many bits you want.

I have one clock with 4 x HV5522 in series for which I made a 128 bit 
ShiftOut function.

See here for details of the shiftout process: Arduino shiftOut(): Control 
chips with a 3 wire Serial Interface. (best-microcontroller-projects.com) 


It's an interesting page with scope traces to help explain.

Ultimately I moved over to using SPI transfers which are driven purely by 
the processor but the theory is all very similar.

- Richard





On Saturday, 13 August 2022 at 22:28:27 UTC+1 flata...@gmail.com wrote:

> You are a legend! I've looked at the schematics, very neat.
>
> I'm traveling on business tonight, back next weekend. Then I'll design my 
> own board for 4 beautiful Rz568m (present for my parents on Christmas). 
>
> Glad I now understand how the HV5530 etc work. 
>
> Looking forward to playing around with the code. 
>
> I'll definitely include RTC, GPS receiver and IR motion sensor (I finally 
> designed and tested a circuit using the cheap Ds203 ir sensor. I'm trying 
> to design a microwave sensor but only with minor success so far, the 
> antenna is very challenging to design without proper training and 
> measurement tools). 
>
> Thanks everyone for jumping in with so many suggestions. 
>
> I'll send a pic of my clock when ready. 
>
>
>
>  Original message 
> From: "SWISSNIXIE - Jonathan F."  
> Date: 13/08/2022 22:16 (GMT+00:00) 
> To: neonixie-l  
> Subject: Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Nixie Clock - Direct Drive HV5530 
>
> Yes, the code is open source :)
>
> You can download it at the bottom of the page
> https://www.swissnixie.com/sunixs/
>
>
> I programmed it in Arduino with the atmeag328, but it should be a good 
> start to look at the function "setOutputs" in the code, it contains the 
> actual shifting process.
> Also it's easier to layout the outputs of the IC and cathode-pins as 
> "numbered" with the output number unless you are very experienced with the 
> code.  This allows bitwise operations for creating the variable containing 
> the value.
> For example, if your Cathode 0 is connected to output 1, and cathode 9 to 
> pin 10, you can use a function to shit as a single bit according to the 
> current digit number. If your digit is 8, you can do " 0x01<<8". If your 
> cathodes are randomly connected (to make an easy layout) you will need to 
> implement more code. 
>
> On Saturday, 13 August 2022 at 22:35:13 UTC+2 flata...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Jonathan,
>>
>> I just found this, it's excellent. 
>>
>> http://swissnixie.com/projects/SUNIX-S/SN_SUNIX_S_R1.2_WTB_SCHEMATIC.png
>>
>> From this post:
>> https://groups.google.com/g/neonixie-l/c/S1oX30hLrmw
>>
>> If the code is open source, I'll just use that otherwise I'll adapt mine 
>> to use hv5530 and hef4104. 
>>
>> Awesome! 
>>
>>
>>  Original message 
>> From: "SWISSNIXIE - Jonathan F."  
>> Date: 13/08/2022 20:51 (GMT+00:00) 
>> To: neonixie-l  
>> Subject: Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Nixie Clock - Direct Drive HV5530 
>>
>> The time to shift out the bits is not critical, the clock rate is as fast 
>> as you implement it, there is only a minimum clock time, but no maximum one.
>> Brightness should be the same as putting the tube pin directly to ground, 
>> the internal resistance of the mosfet in the HV5530 is in the Ohms range, 
>> while your anode resistor will probably will be a few kiloohms, so no 
>> visible issue.
>>
>> About voltage:
>> The HV5530 is specified for 10.8 to 13.2V, but alot of people seem to use 
>> it with 5V logic and it works. If you want do operate ith with 12V logic, 
>> you need a 12V source and a level shifter. HEF4104 
>> 
>>  
>> could work
>>
>>
>> On Saturday, 13 August 2022 at 19:04:21 UTC+2 flata...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>> In terms of nixie brightness, is there any advantage in using serial to 
>>> parallel converter+shift register vs multiplexing using high voltage 
>>> transistors on anodes and cathodes of the nixies? Other than saving 
>>> component and uC pins, of course. 
>>>
>>>  Original message 
>>> From: Bill Stanley  
>>> Date: 13/08/2022 17:32 (GMT+00:00) 
>>> To: neonixie-l  
>>> Subject: [neonixie-l] Re: Nixie Clock - Direct Drive HV5530 
>>>
>>> I use that part for my NIXIE, Panaplex and LED displays and I also write 
>>> in assembly (8051, not PIC)
>>> For my code, I send the serial data for NEXT time 

[neonixie-l] Re: New 8091 clock

[Richard Scales]

I just took another look at your site - this time scrolling down - awesome 
- very awesome!

New Mod-6 you say - exciting - can you advise what changes you might be 
making?

-Richard


On Thursday, 11 August 2022 at 03:26:34 UTC+1 MichaelB wrote:

> Thank you all for your kind words This one was a real labor of love with 
> the emphasis on labor!  I was shooting for a design where i could use hex 
> stock and so this is what I settled on without being too gaudy. I'm 
> infatuated with that the hex shape and wanted to use hex stock since I had 
> some stock.
>  And I love those brass cap nuts! Not practical, but way cool! And I love 
> fasteners! I have no qualms about making them very obvious and i think they 
> can actually add to a design. Anyway, rambling now. Thanks. This site is 
> and has always been a great outlet for useful feedback for all things NIXIE!
> On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 1:15:20 PM UTC-7 Paul Andrews wrote:
>
>> Great concept - I love that the board is exposed like this. Your clocks 
>> are always an inspiration.
>>
>> On Monday, August 8, 2022 at 7:15:54 PM UTC-4 MichaelB wrote:
>>
>>> Been working in this bad boy for quite a while now and am finally 
>>> finished. One of Pete's past offerings. More work than any of the the ones 
>>> i have made in the past . Have a look:at the page on my site: 
>>> http://badnixie.com/NL8091_Angle_Deck_Nixie.html
>>> [image: IMG_1866a.jpg]
>>>
>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Another half of nixie

[Richard Scales]

Here is a nicer picture that I grabbed from www.jb-electronics.de:


[image: pic10.JPG]

- Richard
On Saturday, 23 July 2022 at 06:15:51 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:

> Ah, M1, I see that you see what I did there!
> [image: pic1.JPG][image: pic2.JPG][image: pic3.JPG][image: pic6.JPG][image: 
> pic7.JPG][image: pic8.JPG][image: pic9.JPG]
>
> I just grabbed these with a phone, I tried setting the ISO low to show the 
> numbers better - as ever - much better in real life.
>
> - Richard
>
> On Saturday, 23 July 2022 at 05:12:38 UTC+1 M1 wrote:
>
>> “removed from scales”   Ha.
>>
>>  
>>
>> Michail 
>>
>>  
>>
>> *From:* neoni...@googlegroups.com  *On Behalf 
>> Of *Richard Scales
>> *Sent:* Friday, July 22, 2022 8:44 PM
>> *To:* neonixie-l 
>> *Subject:* Re: [neonixie-l] Another half of nixie
>>
>>  
>>
>> I have a few upside down tubes also removed from scales, with the same 
>> range of fractions - both Mullard and ITT variants - the Mullards have the 
>> fine horizontal mesh which I particularly like.
>>
>>  
>>
>> I will dig out some pictures.
>>
>>  
>>
>>  - Richard Scales
>>
>>  
>>
>> On Friday, 22 July 2022 at 09:29:13 UTC+1 Bogdan Paduraru wrote:
>>
>> I think you have the ITT GF-37AH 
>>
>> but if you have any Hivac version will be nice to see some photos too 
>>
>> On Friday, July 22, 2022 at 11:03:21 AM UTC+3 tntm...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>> Real interesting andy! I would love to see some pictures sometime!
>>
>>  
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 22, 2022, 4:02 AM andybiker  wrote:
>>
>> I think these match the XN3 - looking at the coarse mesh.
>>
>>  
>>
>> Somewhere I have a couple of upside-down nixies that came from a scale.
>>
>>  
>>
>> They are in poor condition with corroded leads (but working)
>>
>>  
>>
>> They show 1/8, 1/4, 3/8, 1/2, 5/8, 3/4, 7/8
>>
>>  
>>
>> really unusual!
>>
>>  
>>
>> Andrew
>>
>> On Thursday, July 21, 2022 at 10:00:53 PM UTC+1 Terry Bowman wrote:
>>
>>  
>>
>> On Jul 21, 2022, at 4:48 PM, 'Bogdan Paduraru' via neonixie-l <
>> neoni...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>
>>  
>>
>> Just want to share one of my latest finds 
>>
>> XNS 6839 from HIVAC that  show only 1/2 sign
>>
>>  
>>
>> Good score. I'm insanely jealous and have nothing to trade. 8D
>>
>>  
>>
>> Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
>> "The Mac Doctor"
>>
>> https://www.astarcloseup.com
>>
>> "Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it 
>> out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and 
>> enthusiasm for science intact."—Carl Sagan, *Psychology Today*, 1996
>>
>>  
>>
>> -- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "neonixie-l" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
>> email to neonixie-l+...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web, visit 
>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/6e8a7683-5f73-40b0-83da-4903d5ea2d0cn%40googlegroups.com
>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/6e8a7683-5f73-40b0-83da-4903d5ea2d0cn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>> -- 
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>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/b1d691c6-ffa5-48f7-a4fe-bfd8c151e3dbn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Another half of nixie

[Richard Scales]

I have a few upside down tubes also removed from scales, with the same 
range of fractions - both Mullard and ITT variants - the Mullards have the 
fine horizontal mesh which I particularly like.

I will dig out some pictures.

 - Richard Scales


On Friday, 22 July 2022 at 09:29:13 UTC+1 Bogdan Paduraru wrote:

> I think you have the ITT GF-37AH 
>
> but if you have any Hivac version will be nice to see some photos too 
>
>
> On Friday, July 22, 2022 at 11:03:21 AM UTC+3 tntm...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Real interesting andy! I would love to see some pictures sometime!
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 22, 2022, 4:02 AM andybiker  wrote:
>>
>>> I think these match the XN3 - looking at the coarse mesh.
>>>
>>> Somewhere I have a couple of upside-down nixies that came from a scale.
>>>
>>> They are in poor condition with corroded leads (but working)
>>>
>>> They show 1/8, 1/4, 3/8, 1/2, 5/8, 3/4, 7/8
>>>
>>> really unusual!
>>>
>>> Andrew
>>> On Thursday, July 21, 2022 at 10:00:53 PM UTC+1 Terry Bowman wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Jul 21, 2022, at 4:48 PM, 'Bogdan Paduraru' via neonixie-l <
>>>> neoni...@googlegroups.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Just want to share one of my latest finds 
>>>> XNS 6839 from HIVAC that  show only 1/2 sign
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Good score. I'm insanely jealous and have nothing to trade. 8D
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
>>>> "The Mac Doctor"
>>>>
>>>> https://www.astarcloseup.com
>>>>
>>>> "Every kid starts out as a natural-born scientist, and then we beat it 
>>>> out of them. A few trickle through the system with their wonder and 
>>>> enthusiasm for science intact."—Carl Sagan, *Psychology Today*, 1996
>>>>
>>>> -- 
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>> Groups "neonixie-l" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send 
>>> an email to neonixie-l+...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web, visit 
>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/6e8a7683-5f73-40b0-83da-4903d5ea2d0cn%40googlegroups.com
>>>  
>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/6e8a7683-5f73-40b0-83da-4903d5ea2d0cn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>>> .
>>>
>>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: B-7971 single tube device

[Richard Scales]

No other changes. I fyou were to examine your clock carefully you may see 
that this change was actually implemented by a track cut and wire link - so 
operationally identical - I just implemented the change on the PCB.
 - Richard

On Wednesday, 6 July 2022 at 17:49:06 UTC+1 Robert wrote:

> No other changes?
>
> Thanks
> Rob
>
> On 6 Jul 2022, at 16:18, Richard Scales  wrote:
>
> V2.0 has a slight change in the way that the PIR connects,
>
> Shown here with clear acrylic case:
>
>
> - RIchard
>
> [image: P1.JPG][image: P2.JPG][image: P3.JPG][image: P4.JPG][image: 
> P5.JPG][image: P6.JPG][image: P7.JPG][image: P8.JPG]
>
> On Sunday, 22 August 2021 at 04:10:25 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> If desired, I can also supply the parts to make that acrylic case. I'd 
>> need get more acrylic so - if interested, please let me know your chosen 
>> colour (clear, green tinted etc) and I can make all the parts as well as 
>> include fixings like I have shown in my picture - PM me for details.
>> - Richard
>>
>>
>> On Sunday, 22 August 2021 at 04:05:55 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:
>>
>>> I can supply built and tested units - consisting of the circular  Smart 
>>> Socket board with LED's sitting on top of the circular controller board 
>>> which has the WeMos, NCH8200HV supply, USB connector for power and PIR 
>>> connector. 
>>> All you need to do is to apply power, connect to the AP which it 
>>> broadcasts and then set it up for your own WiFi etc for 85 UKP plus 
>>> shipping at cost.
>>> I can send you the source code for the software in the Wemos so you can 
>>> change it any way you like.
>>> All you need to do is plug in your B-7971 and connect power via the USB.
>>> PM me if interested.
>>> - Richard
>>>
>>> On Saturday, 21 August 2021 at 08:53:41 UTC+1 Robert wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Very nice, how much are the completed units?
>>>>
>>>> Rob
>>>>
>>>> On 21 Aug 2021, at 05:02, Richard Scales  
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> 
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hello Bill, 
>>>> I have sold some completed units as well as bare boards (they come in 
>>>> pairs, one is the smart socket and one is for the wemos and HV supply 
>>>> which 
>>>> sits underneath). 
>>>> What is it you are interested in - Just he SMart Socket, the board 
>>>> pair, how many sets or boards?
>>>> I was also thinking about making a more conventional square or oblong 
>>>> shaped one but I too have a stack of the original - with over a dozen 
>>>> already made up so I will be using those - when I get around to that 
>>>> project!
>>>> - Richard
>>>>
>>>> On Friday, 20 August 2021 at 17:25:44 UTC+1 Bill Notfaded wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Richard-
>>>>>
>>>>> I like the idea of modernized smartsockets using SMD and more modern 
>>>>> parts!  Are you selling these?  I have a bunch of populated and 
>>>>> unpopulated 
>>>>> original 7971 smartsockets.  Such a great original idea!
>>>>>
>>>>> Bill
>>>>>
>>>>> On Friday, August 13, 2021 at 8:53:54 PM UTC-7 Richard Scales wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you. I'd love to say it was an original idea but it was 
>>>>>> inspired by a case that Roddy Scott once made for a clock which layered  
>>>>>> thin wooden parts using thick brass pieces between the layers.Originally 
>>>>>> I 
>>>>>> had planned to have three 'corners' but after some discussion I went to 
>>>>>> 5 
>>>>>> which looks nicer and still allows easy access to the USB connector 
>>>>>> (back 
>>>>>> right) as well as visual access to the two neons at the front, one each 
>>>>>> side of centre.
>>>>>> - Richard
>>>>>> On Friday, 13 August 2021 at 15:16:15 UTC+1 Jon Blaylock wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fantastic use of nixie
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, Aug 13, 2021 at 1:49 AM newxito  wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Great job, beautiful case! 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google 
>>>&g

[neonixie-l] Re: A Custom machined case and electronics with Tubes from Dalibor.

[Richard Scales]

I've not had hands on the housing myself but I suspect 'solid' is  avery 
good description!
- Richard

On Wednesday, 15 June 2022 at 03:57:26 UTC+1 严泽远 wrote:

> Nice job, I like it, looks very solid ;)
>
>
> 在2022年6月14日星期二 UTC+8 19:36:52 写道：
>
>> I am posting this on behalf of the creator of this piece, I laid out the 
>> electronics for it and he came up with the concept and the precision 
>> machined case - so it's actually his project.
>>
>> From an initial post elsewhere:
>> "Hi everyone,
>> I would like to present my first Nixie clock design. My goal was to think 
>> outside the box and to do something different to what I have seen until now.
>>
>> All the housing parts are custom and made in Germany. They were machined 
>> from aluminum blocks using CNC mill & lathe. The surfaces of the aluminum 
>> parts were anodized for protection and to achieve the characteristic dark 
>> grey tone.
>>
>> The size of the clock seen from the front is approximately 0.5 meters.
>>
>> The electronics are mounted from the bottom of the housing. The cover 
>> enclosing the electronics is made from clear polycarbonate to allow a 
>> connection to Wi-Fi if desired.
>> Richard Scales has done a great job in developing the electronics. They 
>> consist of a main board, six sockets and six ribbon cables with connectors 
>> and is a development of the ‘PRISM’ open source design by Ian Sparkes. The 
>> electronics are feature rich and include WiFi connection, NTP sync, 
>> optional RTC, Web GUI, Anti Cathode poisoning, configurable tube 
>> underlighting and optional PIR connection for motion activation.
>>
>> Below the BOM for this project:
>> -1x Housing + screws
>> -1x Electronic board
>> -6x Sockets
>> -6x Ribbon cables
>> -6x Tubes RZ568M
>> -1x Charger (12VDC,2A)
>>
>> Anyone interested in this unique DIY Nixie clock project do not hesitate 
>> in letting me know. I can gladly provide all the housing parts and point 
>> you in the right direction to get the rest of components needed."
>>
>> Anyone interested in this project could PM me in the first instance and I 
>> will pass the details on.
>>
>> - Richard
>>
>> [image: P1.jpg][image: P2.jpg][image: P3.jpg][image: P4.jpg][image: 
>> P5.jpg][image: P6.jpg][image: P7.jpg][image: P8.jpg][image: P9.jpg][image: 
>> P10.jpg][image: P11.jpg][image: P12.jpg]- 
>>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: 7971 Burroughs question

[Richard Scales]

I have sockets for these. There are also 'smart sockets' which include a 
PIC microcontroller which does all the 'heavy lifting' making it very easy 
to drive.
I also have a design for a single tube clock which incorporates a 'smart 
socket'.
- Richard


On Tuesday, 17 May 2022 at 18:47:21 UTC+1 Paul Andrews wrote:

> This is one I made a while back. It uses the tube socket pins that LB(?) 
> referred to. I see it isn't very well labelled, in terms of what value of 
> resistors to use, and it uses surface mount resistors. Anyway, there it is. 
> https://oshpark.com/shared_projects/G9c1wPoq
>
> On Monday, May 16, 2022 at 5:02:23 PM UTC-4 SD wrote:
>
>> Hello
>> I was referred to this mail list, thank you
>> I am sitting on for years a 7971 that I want to use/adapt but cannot find 
>> any sockets from ebay that are not very expensive. I do not want to 
>> permanently solder to a perfboard, etc.  these things are super pricey 
>> now.  
>> any help appreciated
>>
>> thanks
>> scott
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Neons for all!

[Richard Scales]

I got so disappointed at how extended neon leads on colons looked - I ended 
up making a tiny PCB which sits inside the glass tube with a metal base to 
match Dalibors tubes. 
I used to spend ages with enamel copper wire and such like - not any more!
- Richard

On Tuesday, 12 April 2022 at 13:39:42 UTC+1 Greg P wrote:

> Nice that they still sell the NE-2's with the 60mm leads.  Really wish 
> someone would offer those with even longer leads so you don't have to 
> extend the wire when making clocks with larger tubes.
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, April 12, 2022 at 12:31:43 AM UTC-4 gregebert wrote:
>
>> Nice that they sell single-units. Years ago I had to buy them in a box of 
>> 1000, so I bought green ones and sold some to folks on neonixie. I've also 
>> seen blue ones.
>> They dont seem to have as long of a lifetime as traditional neon bulbs; 
>> the phosphor coating "wears out" after a few years so be sure to keep 
>> spares around.
>>
>> On Monday, April 11, 2022 at 8:17:43 PM UTC-7 martin martin wrote:
>>
>>> For anyone needing nice colons for their pretty clock, allspectrum.com 
>>> has a new website!
>>>
>>> Neon Lamps - All Spectrum Electronics 
>>> 
>>>
>>> Enjoy!
>>>
>>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Harwell Dekatron build + Open source firmware build tooling

[Richard Scales]

Awesome work Brendan, really nice writeup and really interesting details on 
the software build process.
I particularly like the sleeving that you used - it really finishes things 
off very nicely can you share your source?
I don't suspect that it will be an easy process to retrofit to my Harwel, 
but it would be nice to have a go.
So, what's next?
 - Richard

On Monday, 4 April 2022 at 07:38:54 UTC+1 Organs Grinder wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> Long time lurker/reader here, but I thought this build log and images 
> would be worth sharing.
>
> One of my favorite things was the day I saw the Harwell Dekatron 
> computer(WITCH) at tnmoc.
> So when I heard about a clock using Dekatron's that paid homage to WHICH, 
> I had to have one!
>
> I ordered the kit and Dekatron's from Grahame at:
> http://www.sgitheach.org.uk/harwell.html
>
> The case kit (with some changes) from Nick:
> https://stocksclocks.com/index.php/harwell-a-dekatron-clock
>
> It's taken me many months to get this all done as I have very little free 
> time.
>
> I am going to say up front that I am a little odd, and all this "bling" of 
> LEDs and sounds puts me off.
> Thankfully, the software that Grahame wrote is feature-rich and open 
> source, with massive amounts of custom options for everything out of the 
> box.
> There are options to suit everyone's tastes and needs.
>
> One thing I don't like the most is additional noise... Nick was very nice 
> to help me create a custom front plate for the Harwell clock at an 
> additional cost.
> This front plate removed the holes/cutouts for the speakers. I have not 
> installed the speakers into my kit at all.
>
> Many thanks, Nick, I think it looks amazing. Along with the rest of the 
> case.
> Here is my front plate:
> [image: IMG_8598.jpg]
>
> I also sleeved/braided all internal cabling and used only one colour of 
> wire in the entire build.
> Keen to know what everyone thinks! 
> [image: IMG_8576.jpg]
> [image: IMG_8579.jpg]
> [image: IMG_8600.jpg]
> I also sleeved the PSU:
> [image: IMG_8603.jpg]
> [image: IMG_8602.jpg]
>
>
> One goal I did have is to be able to build all the source code from 
> Grahame's Dropbox zip files.
> I've now achieved that goal and all the firmware on my clock is running 
> from builds I created from Grahame's source code.
>
> You can find the build system here:
> https://github.com/brendanhoran/sgitheach-harwell-earthly-build
>
> The main branch (default) will build all firmware needed by the clock.
> The tooling can be run on Windows, MacOS, and Linux. Making use of Docker 
>  and Earthly . This gives us 
> portability and reproducibilityIt.
> It will emit build artifacts that then can be used with Grahame's 
> tooling/instructions as per the build manuals(s) or tooling of your choice 
> to flash the devices.
>
> I have a testing branch that also builds BOSSA to flash the Atmel SAM:
>
> https://github.com/brendanhoran/sgitheach-harwell-earthly-build/tree/bossa-1-9-1-14-flash-sam
>
> At the moment the testing branch only builds BOSSA for Linux.
> I have used this testing branch to flash the Atmel SAM firmware with no 
> issues, but again it is testing at this stage.
> It needs some tweaking on the timing of some steps but it works.
>
> Example output of the BOSSA flash step (firmware is built in another step 
> before hand)
> [image: flash-sam-bossa.jpg]
>
> Please reach out to me directly or raise a PR if you have any questions or 
> fixes for the build system.
> Many thanks to Grahame for his countless detailed emails replying to my 
> questions, would not have been possible without his help.
>
>
> My next goal is to fix console output when connecting to the clock in a 
> Linux environment (Minicom).
> For now, you must disable colour output. (There is an option for that in 
> the system.ini and a hardware jumper!)
>
> I also plan to design a more minimal FACE for the clock later on, that I 
> will send back to Grahame as well.
>
>
> Many thanks,
> Brendan
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Tube Storage

[Richard Scales]

I was fortunate to pick up an old plan chest which is basically lots of 
deep and wide draws but the draws are not that tall.
Each shelf is lined with polystyrene and tubes push in to the polystyrene - 
or lay flat - or in boxes. Lots of tubes in a single footprint.
 - Richard


On Thursday, 24 March 2022 at 01:15:15 UTC LB wrote:

> For smaller tubes, I use standard 7/9 pin miniature tube boxes, and for 
> the larger ones, I have both found cardboard boxes, and modified boxes to 
> better fit the tubes. I keep all of the boxes inside an ikea cardboard box, 
> but it’s pretty unorganized.
>
> On Mar 23, 2022, at 2:45 PM, Paul Andrews  wrote:
>
> That's essentially what I use, and a dymo or brother labeler, except for 
> the big ones, and they stay in boxes on a shelf with the contents written 
> on them in sharpie on all sides.
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, March 23, 2022 at 4:51:28 PM UTC-4 Terry Bowman wrote:
>
>> This is a "how do you guys do it?" question...
>>
>> I need a way to organize and safely store the odds and ends of tubes that 
>> I have. Nixies, Dekatrons, bargraphs, Magic Eyes etc. as well as a lot 
>> of the weird things from the WWII era.
>>
>> Half of this stuff is loose except for some bubble wrap. Most of the 
>> Soviet surplus items are still in the box sent from Ukraine, all different 
>> shapes and sizes. It makes finding a particular tube a real hassle and 
>> handling a box like this can lead to disaster.
>>
>> Then there's cabinets. You can't find anything decent anymore. Everything 
>> is overpriced flimsy crap. The drawers all fall out if you tip it 30°. 
>> Standing cabinets are only four feet high and can't take more than five 
>> pounds of stuff on top.
>>
>> I did manage to find this:
>>
>> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003P2UOCO
>>
>>
>> From the video it appears that at least the drawers don't slide all of 
>> the way out.
>>
>>
>> I also need boxes for my bubble lights and bubble tubes. If I had a a 18 
>> x 26 laser cutter I'd make custom boxes and inserts out of heavy C1S stock 
>> but I don't have a place to set one up. Can't afford one that size right 
>> now, anyway.
>>
>>
>> Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
>> "The Mac Doctor"
>>
>> https://www.astarcloseup.com
>>
>> Edward R. Murrow: “Who owns the patent on this vaccine?”
>> Dr. Jonas Salk: “Well, the people, I would say. There is no patent. Could 
>> you patent the sun?”—*See It Now*, 12 April 1955
>>
>> -- 
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Clock for NL-8091

[Richard Scales]

Yes - I have three sets left. There is the tube board which has the longer 
pin sockets as opposed to the Harwin Style - I chose those to be less 
stressful to the tubes. It also has 2 x HV5622 and  4 x MTX-90 for the 
colons. 

On the back there is a small board with the 5V power supply and wemos etc. 
The tube board also holds 2 x HV supply modules.

There is one mistake on the board which requires a single track to be cut 
and two short links to be made once the components are loaded (so the ends 
of the links can be soldered directly to the ends of SMD resistors etc)
I am able to supply full kits if at all interested.

 - Richard

On Sunday, 20 March 2022 at 13:34:10 UTC Bill Notfaded wrote:

> Also I love what Ian has done and have a few of his clocks!
>
> Bill
>
> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 6:32:02 AM UTC-7 Bill Notfaded wrote:
>
>> Also BTW I'm big fan of OSS so I love to see open source software and 
>> hardware..  We use redhat at work because it's supported but I love Linux.  
>> Solaris is kinda on it's way out being replaced by redhat Linux.  Do you 
>> have any more boards for the 8091?
>>
>> Bill
>>
>> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 6:25:07 AM UTC-7 Bill Notfaded wrote:
>>
>>> Also another project in the works... I scored 6 NL-7037 to build another 
>>> clock.  Perhaps they deserve a special build.
>>>
>>> Bill
>>>
>>> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 6:20:04 AM UTC-7 Bill Notfaded wrote:
>>>
>>>> Something wasn't right in building the main board.  I've got a great 
>>>> Metcal soldering station so I know it wasn't a joint issue.  I need to dig 
>>>> that project back out again... Check this I got the strange IN-18 tubes.  
>>>> They arrived!
>>>> [image: PXL_20220220_011208711.jpg]p
>>>> Bill
>>>> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 6:11:43 AM UTC-7 Bill Notfaded wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Richard-
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes mine is the PV Electronics board.  At one point of the build it 
>>>>> says to test the voltage and I wasn't getting what the instructions said 
>>>>> I 
>>>>> should.  At that point I put the project down sadly.  I boxed it all back 
>>>>> up and told myself I'd revisit it later.  This was hard for me because I 
>>>>> really love these tubes!!!
>>>>>
>>>>> Bill
>>>>>
>>>>> On Saturday, March 19, 2022 at 9:55:40 PM UTC-7 Richard Scales wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you . I believe that might be the Remote System from PV 
>>>>>> Electronics - I have used that elsewhere but for this I wanted to make a 
>>>>>> compact unit with all the WiFi, Web Gui, underlighting and other 
>>>>>> features 
>>>>>> from the Open Source 'Prism' design by Ian Sparkes. 
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am pleased with the result, yesterday I made a simple acrylic case 
>>>>>> for it - because it is going to take me an age to get anything more 
>>>>>> interesting together - I'll post a picture of it when completed - an 
>>>>>> injustice the the tubes I know - but better than a bare board sat on my 
>>>>>> shelf ticking away!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have a couple of PV Remote Systems lined up to populate old 
>>>>>> Australian Valve Tested units that I acquired  - yet another project 
>>>>>> waiting in the wings!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What issues did you have with the main board for the Remote System? I 
>>>>>> had a couple of the early ones and had to replace the LM2596-5 on both 
>>>>>> boards. Apart from that - rock solid.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Richard
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Saturday, 19 March 2022 at 12:18:29 UTC Bill Notfaded wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nice clock Richard.  I too have collected these tubes.  I've been 
>>>>>>> sitting on my stock.  I know Nick made a clock with these too fairly 
>>>>>>> recently.  I bought the kit he used and also ordered the dekatron side 
>>>>>>> board for it.  I ran into some issues with the main board and put 
>>>>>>> project 
>>>>>>> on the back burner.  I suppose I should dig it out again to 
>>>>>>> troubleshoot 
>>>>>>> some that looks great Richard!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>&g

[neonixie-l] Re: Clock for NL-8091

[Richard Scales]

Thank you . I believe that might be the Remote System from PV Electronics - 
I have used that elsewhere but for this I wanted to make a compact unit 
with all the WiFi, Web Gui, underlighting and other features from the Open 
Source 'Prism' design by Ian Sparkes. 

I am pleased with the result, yesterday I made a simple acrylic case for it 
- because it is going to take me an age to get anything more interesting 
together - I'll post a picture of it when completed - an injustice the the 
tubes I know - but better than a bare board sat on my shelf ticking away!

I have a couple of PV Remote Systems lined up to populate old Australian 
Valve Tested units that I acquired  - yet another project waiting in the 
wings!

What issues did you have with the main board for the Remote System? I had a 
couple of the early ones and had to replace the LM2596-5 on both boards. 
Apart from that - rock solid.

- Richard


On Saturday, 19 March 2022 at 12:18:29 UTC Bill Notfaded wrote:

> Nice clock Richard.  I too have collected these tubes.  I've been sitting 
> on my stock.  I know Nick made a clock with these too fairly recently.  I 
> bought the kit he used and also ordered the dekatron side board for it.  I 
> ran into some issues with the main board and put project on the back 
> burner.  I suppose I should dig it out again to troubleshoot some that 
> looks great Richard!
>
> Bill
>
> On Tuesday, March 15, 2022 at 2:34:44 AM UTC-7 Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> I recently came up with a version of the open source Prism design by Ian 
>> Sparkes for NL-8091 tubes.
>>
>> The Prism design includes WiFi, NTP Sync, RTC, PIR activation, under tube 
>> lighting and web gui.
>>
>> A small board at the rear has the Wemos, 5V supply circuit and level 
>> shifters. The main board has two HV5622's and two HV power supply modules 
>> to keep things cool.
>>
>> I used MTX-90 thyratrons for the colons which were a little blinky to 
>> start with but now seem to have settled down.
>>
>> These are beautiful tubes and the pictures do not do them justice.
>>
>> Now I need to come up with some kind of casing - something I struggle 
>> with a lot!
>>
>> - Richard
>>
>> [image: IMG_20220313_115140.jpg]
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Nail Head pins

[Richard Scales]

My application is to make a small circular PCB which will 'plug' in place 
of a Z566 tube - hence the need for 1mm diameter pins. This small board 
will then have some interconnecting pins (positioned within the confines of 
the Z566 pin positions) that reach up to a similar small board which has 
matching positions for the interconnecting pins. The top board will have 
pin sockets (Harwin style) for an IN-18 tube.

The track layout takes care of all the required pin mapping. The boards 
will be spaced sufficiently far enough apart to avoid any electrical 
contact between them other than that provided by the interconnecting pins.

For the board interconnects I plan to use pins clipped from a strip of 0.1" 
spaced header pins - the commonly available type - there are no special 
requirements of these pins apart from being long enough!

Ultimately - the completed item will allow an IN-18 to be used in a socket 
designed for a Z566. A variant of this would allow a Z566 to be plugged in 
on the top board so that IN-18 and Z566 could be intermixed and presented 
at the same height.

This is something that I was asked to make for a colleague who wants to 
showcase different tubes on the same clocks - no other aesthetic 
justification (positive or negative) required!

- Richard

On Saturday, 12 March 2022 at 02:21:28 UTC nei...@gmail.com wrote:

> Richard, I have quite a bit of experience with these in a number of 
> different applications.  On the off chance you haven't discovered this, 
> here are links to the two biggest manufacturers:
>
> Mill-Max (obviously you've found them)
> https://www.mill-max.com/products/new/pcb-sockets-and-micro-plugs
>
> TE Connectivity (legacy AMP)
> https://www.te.com/usa-en/plp/Y30gv.html
>
> About Chinese suppliers . . . generally the quality is good but the number 
> of sizes and styles offered is extremely limited.  Basically they "cherry 
> pick" their offerings to high market volume/demand versions.
>
> It would help to know details about your desired application or more 
> specific question(s).
>
> Neil Q.
>
>
> On Wednesday, March 9, 2022 at 11:17:28 PM UTC-6 Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> Hello everyone.
>>
>> I want to make a board that plugs in to a tube socket which has minimal 
>> height on the 'top' side. 
>>
>> The image is from a 'Nail Head' pin from Millmax. 
>>
>> Has anyone used these or anything similar?
>>
>> - Richard
>> [image: NailHead.JPG]
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Nail Head pins

[Richard Scales]

Very nice looking adapters though. I am looking at some pins that have a 
slight shoulder which will (hopefully) mitigate against them being pushed 
through the board.
- Richard


On Thursday, 10 March 2022 at 12:11:57 UTC Dekatron42 wrote:

> I haven't used that exact type of pins but I tried a similar type and had 
> some problems with them when they were subjected to pressure from the side 
> which resulted in them coming loose. I had to minimize the hole diameter in 
> the circuit board almost to a press-fit size so they couldn't flex/bend but 
> then I also got some problems with a few that were pushed up when inserted 
> as I guess that there was to little solder fastening them - a proper 
> press-fit pin would have been better for my case but I didn't find any that 
> fit my needs. It could probably have been done better but I didn't have the 
> space nor the time to experiment much more so I decided to go with longer 
> pins and two circuit boards on top of each other. I ended up buying cheap 
> gilded longer pins without the head from eBay (Chinese seller), similar to 
> the ones used in the adapter below.
>
> [image: Tube-pins.jpg]
>
> On Thursday, 10 March 2022 at 06:17:28 UTC+1 Richard Scales wrote:
>
>> Hello everyone.
>>
>> I want to make a board that plugs in to a tube socket which has minimal 
>> height on the 'top' side. 
>>
>> The image is from a 'Nail Head' pin from Millmax. 
>>
>> Has anyone used these or anything similar?
>>
>> - Richard
>> [image: NailHead.JPG]
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Nail Head pins

[Richard Scales]

Hello everyone.

I want to make a board that plugs in to a tube socket which has minimal 
height on the 'top' side. 

The image is from a 'Nail Head' pin from Millmax. 

Has anyone used these or anything similar?

- Richard
[image: NailHead.JPG]

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[neonixie-l] Seeking VFDl ICL1-1/7's

[Richard Scales]

Late to the party as ever I am seeking ICL1-1/7's and wondered if anyone in 
the group had any that they were willing to part with.

I watched these things for months without pushing the button and now they 
seem to have gone unobtanium  - it may well be the situation in The Ukraine 
right now which is causing the issue - no idea.

- Richard

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Low profile board for Dalbors tubes

[Richard Scales]

For the enclosures I use the following process:

FIrstly I lay out the design using Solid Edge 2D drafting software from 
which I export a DXF File.

I use my own laser cutter (Triumph 6040) to cut the parts - their software 
reads the DXF, I then control which parts I want to cut.

Their software is called 'Lasersoft' http://www.triumphlaser.com

I find that their software does absolutely everything that I would want it 
to do - Can anyone recommend any alternatives or are all these products 
tied to the cutters that the software is supplied with?

- Richard



On Sunday, 13 February 2022 at 23:09:54 UTC Terry Bowman wrote:

>
> On Feb 13, 2022, at 12:47 AM, Richard Scales  
> wrote:
>
> I just made a version with green-tint acrylic for a special request.  
>
>
> What software are you using to design your enclosures? Who's cutting them? 
> Just curious.
>
>
> Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
> "The Mac Doctor"
>
> https://www.astarcloseup.com
>
> “...the book said something astonishing, a very big thought. The stars, it 
> said, were suns but very far away. The Sun was a star but close up.”—Carl 
> Sagan, "The Backbone Of Night", *Cosmos*, 1980
>
>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Low profile board for Dalbors tubes

[Richard Scales]

Hello,

The colon tower is constructed of several parts as follows:

Small circular base PCB which has the pins which push in to the clock PCB, 
on top of the PCB is a single neopixel.
THere is  tall vertical PCB that holds two neons. This sits directly on top 
of the neopixel and attaches to the tops of the pins via short leads.
THere is a metal base part which sits over the small circular PCB (snug 
fit).
A glass tube then sits over the tall vertical PCB and sits inside the top 
of the metal base part.

Do you see what I mean?

- Richard


On Sunday, 13 February 2022 at 20:45:53 UTC palafr...@gmail.com wrote:

> Well, that is just beautiful! I quite like the green tint with the dark 
> board underneath. I don't quite understand the colon towers. Do they 
> consist of a PCB with leds mounted inside a glass/acrylic tube? 
>
> On Sat, Feb 12, 2022 at 9:47 PM Richard Scales  
> wrote:
>
>>
>> I just made a version with green-tint acrylic for a special request.  
>>
>> - Richard
>>   
>> [image: Green1.jpg]  [image: Green2.jpg]  [image: Green3.jpg]
>> On Wednesday, 19 January 2022 at 04:36:04 UTC Richard Scales wrote:
>>
>>> I have made a few different boards to support Dalibor Farny's tubes as 
>>> well as Z568 etc. though my solution consisted of a tube board on top of a 
>>> driver board.
>>> I decided to make a single board version - given the amount of space 
>>> available between and around the tubes.
>>> I still wanted to make the board as 'small' as possible with minimal 
>>> space around the tubes between front and back as well as to the left and 
>>> right.
>>> The clock is based on the open source PRISM design so it features WiFi 
>>> connect, web GUI, NTP Sync with optional connection for a motion detect 
>>> device.
>>> The result is a single board with all components underneath which extend 
>>> no more than 11mm below the PCB.
>>> I also made a cut acrylic case which is a snug fit to emphasise the size.
>>> The board also features Dalibors 'proper' drive method so each cathode 
>>> has its own series resistor in an effort to produce an 'even' glow across 
>>> all digits.
>>> I've also constructed my own colon towers which feature underlighting, 
>>> the neons are mounted on a tall thin PCB (no pictures yet) though I only 
>>> have a handful of silver bases left - plenty of black ones (anodised 
>>> aluminium).
>>> I am contemplating making bare boards or a full kit available - PM me if 
>>> interested.[image: UP4.jpg][image: UP3.jpg][image: UP2.jpg][image: 
>>> UP1.jpg]
>>>
>> -- 
>>
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>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/neonixie-l/ac4736cf-163d-4e96-ab49-ea9485237fe2n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Anyone here own a Millclock ZIN-70 besides me?

[Richard Scales]

Ah, good question, it is set up for Z568 - that could be an issue!
... though if there was sufficient interest I would make one for Millclock 
pinout.
 - Richard


On Wednesday, 9 February 2022 at 03:32:02 UTC sbu...@gmail.com wrote:

> Is the board setup for z568m or the millclock in house pinout?
>
> On Tue, Feb 8, 2022, 10:27 PM Richard Scales  
> wrote:
>
>> I don't have their clock - but i do have a board that drives 6 of their 
>> tubes as a wifi connected, ntp synced clock with motion detect option, web 
>> config, automatic time zone and DST , tube underlighting - just in case 
>> things go really bad
>> Actually - I even have some boards for a two board version which take 
>> their colon towers too!
>>  - Richard
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, 9 February 2022 at 01:26:50 UTC sbu...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> Love my clock but there seems to be some bugs in the firmware. If any of 
>>> you have one of these I'd love discuss the clock with you and see if some 
>>> of my experiences are in line with yours.
>>
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>> .
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: Anyone here own a Millclock ZIN-70 besides me?

[Richard Scales]

I don't have their clock - but i do have a board that drives 6 of their 
tubes as a wifi connected, ntp synced clock with motion detect option, web 
config, automatic time zone and DST , tube underlighting - just in case 
things go really bad
Actually - I even have some boards for a two board version which take their 
colon towers too!
 - Richard


On Wednesday, 9 February 2022 at 01:26:50 UTC sbu...@gmail.com wrote:

> Love my clock but there seems to be some bugs in the firmware. If any of 
> you have one of these I'd love discuss the clock with you and see if some 
> of my experiences are in line with yours.

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Re: [neonixie-l] Where to get PCBs from, some companies blocked by PayPal and credit card issuers......

[Richard Scales]

+1 for JLCPCB - extremely affordable and delivery options to suit all 
circumstances. I am generally happy to wait over 2 weeks if the delivery 
charge is only $5 to the UK. Similarly if I absolutely positively have to 
have it in a few days then their expedited service is excellent.
I am completely unsure but ny first ever order with them cost about $9 for 
10 boards and I got them in a couple of days (beginners luck?) - nothing 
like that since then but production and delivery status information is 
available at all times.
 - RIchard


On Friday, 24 December 2021 at 00:23:38 UTC gregebert wrote:

> I've been using PCBway for several years now. Their standard thruput is 24 
> hoursyes, that's the standard time, not expedited.
> Shipping by DHL is about 2 days; if you choose cheaper shipping such as 
> USPS,  it can take almost a month.
> Their quality is excellent.
>
> Once, I had my gerber files go out Friday afternoon, and boards delivered 
> Monday afternoon.
>
> On Thursday, December 23, 2021 at 2:47:51 AM UTC-8 mikeselectricstuff 
> wrote:
>
>> I usually use JLCPCB and ALLPCB
>>
>> On Thu, 23 Dec 2021 02:45:07 -0800 (PST), you wrote:
>>
>> >Hi,
>> >
>> >Recently I've been unable to buy circuit boards that I've designed 
>> myself 
>> >from the PCB manufacturing companies in China that I regularly use as I 
>> was 
>> >told by my credit card issuer that PayPal and MasterCard have 
>> >blocked/banned these companies due to involvement in crypto currency 
>> scams 
>> >and sale of crypto currency mining equipment. I can't even pay with 
>> PayPal 
>> >to email addresses registered by these companies nor those registered by 
>> >people involved with these companies, they have all been blocked by 
>> PayPal 
>> >I was told. It took me some time to find this out and I am not sure that 
>> my 
>> >credit card issuer was allowed to give me this much information as they 
>> >have declined to answer any of my followup questions.
>> >
>> >I was mainly using some Chinese companies as they were quite cheap at 
>> just 
>> >USD $4.90 for 10 PCBs up to 100mm by 100mm plus shipping and they have 
>> >always had good quality no matter what strangely looking circuit boards 
>> >that I made, even with complicated outlines and holes and up to 2 
>> layers, 
>> >just a tad bit more expensive for 4 layers. The price has been a big 
>> factor 
>> >for me when making prototypes, sometimes just ordering the PCBs to see 
>> how 
>> >they fit in the enclosure they were intended for, without actually 
>> >soldering any components, just trying them out for space.
>> >
>> >Are there any other companies out there that have similarly low prices, 
>> I 
>> >tried PCBWAY and OSHPARK with a small 2 layer circuit board just 71mm by 
>> >82mm and they were asking 10 times the cost and would only supply 1 or 3 
>> >circuit boards for that price plus the shipping cost was 4-5 times as 
>> >expensive.
>> >
>> >So, what cheap, but still acceptable quality, PCB manufacturers do you 
>> use?
>> >
>> >/Martin
>>
>

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[neonixie-l] Re: A video about all things nixie

[Richard Scales]

Nicely put together - good work indeed!
- Richard

On Thursday, 23 December 2021 at 04:09:25 UTC Kevin A. wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Since discovering the joy of nixie tubes a few years ago, I have learned a 
> tremendous amount from not only collecting but also making clocks, both 
> kits and from scratch. 
>
> There are a lot of videos on youtube showcasing this or that nixie tube 
> product, or briefly discussing what a nixie tube is and how to use one, but 
> no one video that really encompasses nixies from their conception to modern 
> day, with a little bit of technical background trickled in. 
>
> I just finished putting together this video about nixies; with segments 
> about nixie history, how they work, different styles, and what the market 
> looks like today. Its only a 13 minute video, so there is no way I can 
> cover everything about everything when it comes to any of these subjects, 
> but I intended it to be a relatively brief but informative watch for 
> newcomers or beginners in the hobby who want to know more. 
>
> Enjoy and let me know what you think: 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmiJsM5oGag  
> 
>

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