re
manages it instead of the application. it has a builtin mutex so you
don't have to use one or declare somthign shared. it does not stop you
from sharing stuff but it provides an core level interface for
comunications.
uri
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"NI" == Nick Ing-Simmons [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
NI Uri Guttman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
i think we do because a thread can block on a mailbox while it can't on
an array.
NI Why not ? - I see no reason that a "shared" array could not have
NI whatev
ink making mailboxes in some form is a good idea. but they should be
special objects (even if they are filehandles) with their own methods to
support the desired semantics.
uri
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how does this work with RFC 63 (Exception handling syntax proposal - it
wants the Error.pm syntax) written by peter scott? you should look at
that and work with peter on this. and we are already discussing that rfc
in flow so please followup there only.
thanx,
uri
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ar of code that we can use as a first draft.
uri
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(maybe tagged?) from the class 'in' and
handle that. then you don't have to update all the delegation calls each
time the 'in' object changes.
i like this RFC a lot. but i like most of damian's stuff. or at least
what i understand. :-)
uri
--
Uri Guttman - [EMAIL PROTECTE
(or with the parent object) would you have to
worry. and then you might just control the order or manually deal with
the method in question.
uri
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t for them with s/// and thereby remove the
copy penalty. but my idea would work in both cases and puts it under
program control so we could just use that.
uri
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there any reason not to standardize these down
DS to one notation (i.e., eliminate one or the other)?
because $1 having be set previously will be interpolated INTO the new
regex. so you have to have another notation to refer to grabbed stuff
from the current regex.
uri
--
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age-switch, which would get its own chair and charter
s independently of -flow.
ok with me. it was not clear how the lists were organized. in any case
the rfc will cover many issues and proposals.
uri
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please move this thread to the mlc list.
thanx,
uri
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-all abyss of
alt.sysadmin.recovery.
if you reply is not on topic with the subject, please rename the
subject. and please don't use generic subjects like 'what will be in
perl6'.
thanx,
uri
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, is we do a deep copy like someone mentions with Storable like
semantics. it handles circles already. but again caveat coder as it can be
a dangerous call to make.
as for tied objects and databases, a hornets' nest awaits.
uri
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=head1 TITLE
Safe Signals
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Uri Guttman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: 07 Aug 2000
Version: 1
Mailing List: perl6-language-flow
Number: TBD
=head1 ABSTRACT
This RFC describes how Perl6 can support safe signals with multiple
techniques.
=head1
please move this thread to flow as we have the error RFC posted there.
thanx,
uri
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al default values for those handles which hve
not had theirs set? you can still set the global $/ and affect all
handles which don't have private $/.
i like the ability to set global defaults here.
uri
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a naked chomp
would assume the $/ from STDIN or the global default $/. the ref
vs. value fixes the do i return a chomped string or the count of chomped
letters.
uri
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"TA" == Ted Ashton [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
TA Thus it was written in the epistle of Jonathan Scott Duff,
On Tue, Aug 08, 2000 at 01:56:12PM -0400, Uri Guttman wrote: a
couple of ideas. one, i proposed we keep a global $/ and $\ for
default use by handles which h
"JSD" == Jonathan Scott Duff [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
JSD On Tue, Aug 08, 2000 at 01:46:41PM -0400, Uri Guttman wrote:
interesting point: we are all in agreement for filehandle specific
$/ and $\. but what about global default values for those handles
which hve not had
the string to be chomped.
OO chomp:
this is a method of a filehandle object. the string to chomp is take
from the filehandle or the global default $/. if a second arg is passed
or the main arg is a ref, then the above behaviors work as well.
i think that sums it up well.
uri
--
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it to be too strange.
idea: use a special here doc token
my $help = POD ;
this will be in \$help as well
as seen by pod
POD
ducking
uri
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from many mothers. :-)
uri
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the wheel with this code? we have modules which do
close to this now, and we have talked about using the GC traverse engine
as well.
uri
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"JV" == Johan Vromans [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
JV Uri Guttman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
i think reading the file may have issues like finding it. or doc strings
for each sub vs. parsing that out of the whole pod. i just bothers me to
have to read that file
od in data are not the same and
probably won't use the same mechanisms. all i want is pod in perl
strings and that is nothing like having perl code be seen by pod as
well.
uri
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at least we'll know they didn't read the bit in the documentation
ASwhere it will specifically warn _not_ to do this.
well, if it is only a string, why use . as the separator? use something
else like : and no one will try any fancy math tricks on it.
uri
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types including
the warning and die ones we have now.
uri
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ow can you tell the
difference between an AUTOLOAD returning a coderef to be executed as if
it was there or a coderef to be returned to the caller.
so i think the mechanism of how AUTOLOAD can decline needs further
work.
uri
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RL missing places in the order in which they appear, from left to right.
well you answer that here but it should be mentioned above as well.
uri
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how does this work with RFC 63 (Exception handling syntax proposal - it
wants the Error.pm syntax) written by peter scott? you should look at
that and work with peter on this. and we are already discussing that rfc
in flow so please followup there only.
thanx,
uri
--
Uri Guttman
a sublist is to make
some reports and send them to the parent list. though i don't think
anyone has done that yet.
uri
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The Perl
t new list posts and
moving their email threads (the third overload of threads!) to the
proper list. i agree with skud, there is too much on the main language list.
uri
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ist of its keys to a list of its values.
uri
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ng that set. someone kick me to do it.
uri
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.)
"The world"? This problem only exists in English!
We pronounce it something similar to "way way way".
BCW I, personally, prefer the Stoogian "Whoop whoop whoop!"
the variation i learned somewhere was "wuh wuh wuh".
it's about the shortest vowel
would load the sort implementation with damian's constant time
sort and overload the sort function as well.
my advanced I/O rfc (to be released soon) uses something like that to
appease the language minimalists (sockets out of base language) and the
binary minimalists (sockets loaded as desired).
ELOAD=/etc/sysperl:/home/uri/.perlrc
perl foo
simple, out of the way if you don't need it. on any site where the
admins like to control stuff this way, they already preset many env
values for you in the shared shell startup files. adding one more value
would be trivial.
uri
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the system shell rc file) the rc files that perl will load. it
needs to be separate from the env vars the user might want to set.
TC Heck, I bet you could do a cleverness with .perldb, too. :-)
i don't want to go there.
uri
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/-T on all scripts, etc.
uri
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"s" == skud [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
s On Fri, Aug 04, 2000 at 01:07:07PM -0400, Uri Guttman wrote:
s - case/switch
try/catch
s Any thoguhts on the errors sublist? should this be there, or in -flow,
s or what?
s Can we predict any of these potential sublists? Or r
is an object, the optional method can be called (e.g. CLONE).
each node could also be handled by a switch on its type.
so this traverse engine could be shared by GC, clone, Data::Dumper,
Storable, etc.
just musing,
uri
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e double quoted range had a \E in it? either directly or
via interpolation? maybe the end escape should be another char than \E?
uri
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The Perl
le handler like optional timeouts, private data, method
callbacks, safe delivery, etc. i need to update it and my few other
rfc's soon.
uri
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manual reset problem.
uri
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which can be run
directly.
but dump isn't the way to go as it is broken, you need a flaky undump
program (from emacs), it is not portable, etc.
uri
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"DS" == Dan Sugalski [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
DS At 05:35 PM 9/21/00 -0400, Uri Guttman wrote:
i proposed some of that in my rfc47 (universal async i/o). at the perl
level you need a delivery interface as with events.
DS I'm not really worried about the perl level for this
ackage level handler. with WARN it looks
like a global handler to me.
uri
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"SC" == Simon Cozens [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
SC On Mon, Sep 25, 2000 at 03:10:47PM -0400, Uri Guttman wrote:
in what order? like BEGIN and END?
SC Whatever, yes.
what if you wanted a block scoped warn handler?
SC What about it? (Or did someone eat the "local&q
nger names as an option, but it should be a
pragma/module and the namespace has to be clean.
uri
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"AT" == Adam Turoff [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
AT On Tue, Sep 26, 2000 at 02:13:41PM -0400, Uri Guttman wrote:
AT But I wouldn't want that pragma to override any other aspect of the
AT core library, such as async I/O.
agreed. but we can reconcile the name spaces then. or le
does perl parse -r now vs - r()?
uri
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your right
and left hands fighting again? executable is probably the better term
and who cares about 2 chars more if you are using this.
uri
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entionally. Probably change it to executable
AT in v3 anyway.
who gave you permission to invent new words? :)
uri
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ed) but trigger like stuff like your handlers seems ok.
for one thing, this is not hard to describe in basic terms (until you
get to the inheritance stuff) and it is useful in many ways. maybe you
should rename this as triggers as handlers have a meaning is signals and
in event callbacks.
uri
--
ably based on Lincoln's code.
on the geek cruise, lincoln told me he had almost completed a total
rewrite of CGI.pm. i have not heard anything about it since then. we
should find out what he has done and possibly integrate it into perl6.
uri
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. :-)
uri
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that.
uri
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"SC" == Simon Cozens [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
SC On Mon, Oct 23, 2000 at 05:18:15PM -0400, Uri Guttman wrote:
basically the emitted machine code for TIL is very simplified C
routine calls and their argument setup and return. all the routine calls
are to perl ops
"DS" == Dan Sugalski [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
DS At 12:48 AM 10/24/00 +0100, Simon Cozens wrote:
On Mon, Oct 23, 2000 at 05:18:15PM -0400, Uri Guttman wrote:
basically the emitted machine code for TIL is very simplified C
routine calls and their argument setup and r
"DS" == Dan Sugalski [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
DS At 08:33 PM 10/23/00 -0400, Uri Guttman wrote:
as for ziggy's comments on the overload of builtins issue there could be
a simple dispatch table used instead of direct calls. it would be fast
with just an indexed lookup based
"SC" == Simon Cozens [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
SC On Mon, Oct 23, 2000 at 08:33:23PM -0400, Uri Guttman wrote:
so the TIL generated code would still to parameter setup, then an
indirect function call and then result handling. it should still be
faster than an interpreter a
til we get to
that actual code.
uri
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verloading, that is
a fine tradeoff to me. i doubt i would ever overload a builtin but who
knows the future with out using PSI::ESP?
uri
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The
"NT" == Nathan Torkington [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
NT Uri Guttman writes:
overall i agree. but i use objects much more now and don't think about
the runtime cost at all (estimated to be %30)
NT All the world is not an Uri.
and aren't we all glad about that! :)
still easy due to the template
nature of the generated code.
uri
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eant about using TIL code for anything but
an end product meant to be execute only.
uri
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"JP" == John Porter [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
JP Uri Guttman wrote:
if i want TIL and lose builtin overloading, that is
a fine tradeoff to me.
JP No, no, no! That is one of the things that absolutely must be
JP fixed in the next major version of Perl!
i was referring
that we do specify perl6's sort to be
stable. we can at this point do that and by keeping our sort algorthm
choices to stable ones, we can deliver it. i would never sepc perl5's
sort as stable due to all the older versions out there with unstable
quicksorts.
uri
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t. :)
uri
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cording to this
perl5.6.0 -le '%h = qw( a b c d ); $_ .= 1 for %h ; print values %h ; chop %h ; print
values %h'
b1d1
bd
it doesn't appear to be a chop specific thing. unraveling a hash always
seems to use aliases for the values. chop just takes a list like it
always has.
uri
--
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"N" == [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
N snooze() is a better name ;-)
TK::button-new( -name = 'snooze', -action = 'press' ) ;
uri
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utoloading of user level modules. that should be
left to a module like schwern's.
uri
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figure out the code
for a schwartz (drop the 'ian') or GR transform.
the basic design and coding was done but not finished. it got code
reviewed and than i shelved it.
any interest? i would help out but i can't drive the project now.
uri
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"JP" == John Porter [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
JP Uri Guttman wrote:
records can be strings, or any perl [LH]o[LH].
JP y/L/A/;
tell that to perllol :)
for a schwartz (drop the 'ian') or GR transform.
JP Why? So it conforms with the "Guttman-Rosler" naming
on to make this built in.
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(currently shelved)
Sort::Records.
uri
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unt of all the key
values. this is one win of the ST over the GRT, you don't need to know
as much about the key as perl will do the comparisons right with just
cmp and =. you still need sort order and multikey support. otherwise
you don't gain so much.
uri
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many case. most of the time i see issues with the ST is with key
extraction.
uri
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"SC" == Simon Cozens [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
SC On Mon, Mar 26, 2001 at 04:36:35PM -0500, Uri Guttman wrote:
and even creating a function to extract the key is not for
beginners in many case. most of the time i see issues with the ST
is with key extraction.
SC Wi
"RA" == Russ Allbery [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
RA Uri Guttman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
"SC" == Simon Cozens [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
SC No, it wouldn't, don't be silly. The ST can always be generalized to
SC ST(data, func, compare) =
SC map { $_-[0] } sort
"RA" == Russ Allbery [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
RA Uri Guttman [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
map { $_-[0] } sort { compare($a-[1], $b-[1]) } map { [$_, f($_)] } data
^^^ ^^^
and there is only extracted key being compared to another at the same
level, not multiple
nly doable for
bytecode and then you run that. this shouldn't be an issue with many
systems who want that optimization pass.
uri
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The Perl
ek roots, whims, etc.). english is so broad because of its
history of borrowing and allowances for change. you don't get
vocabularies of .5-1M words without a license to steal!
uri
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"DS" == Dan Sugalski [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
DS We have been stuck in a sort of Gilbert and Sullivan debate,
DS haven't we? Silly, definitely silly.
o/' perl6 is the very model of a modern major interpreter o/'
:-)
uri
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assignment and ce would break that (e for = isn't visual enough).
.= could still be left working as that is a complete separate op from
method invocation. i can live with most any other form of . including
none. join is fine for that.
uri
--
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, etc. i don't know if we (or larry) wants to make all code have a
maximum iteration/count value implicitly passed into them and have such
lazy evaluation at all times.
uri
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or a file instead of only sending over a socket.
also dealing with sending object thingies over a socket is a perfect
thing to do with an event loop. just had to bring that up again. :)
uri
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= 1, bar = '=', baz = 1 )
uri
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Learn Advanced Object Oriented Perl from Damian Conway - Boston, July 10-11
Class and Registration info
. embedded white space and = as a string are not simple.
uri
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Class
each one.
a core event loop will support all of those features. delivery methods
can be chosen by the coder, either polling in the op code loop or
running a proper event loop with no polling (which will be faster).
uri
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( $foo, 'Purpose' ) ;
DC print (+$var).Purpose; # prints val demo, not var demo
or use value_props( $foo, 'Purpose' ) ;
uri
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can assign an explict undef but that is not the same as
deletion.
so a delete_value_prop func/method should be supported in some fashion.
uri
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Uri Guttman - [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.sysarch.com
SYStems ARCHitecture and Stem Development -- http
that the range arguments are also indices and not
just integers.
i don't have any syntax ideas for this at the moment.
uri
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Uri Guttman - [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.sysarch.com
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not get into a war on core or not for modules. it will depend
on how each one wants to interact with the core and parser.
uri
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Uri Guttman - [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.sysarch.com
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to in the block. there
may be other optimizations.
one related point is that this symbol table will be accessible via
caller() so you could access/install lexical symbols in a parent block
on the call stack. scary!
uri
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Uri Guttman - [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.sysarch.com
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a variant op
code loop that is run when you profile. just having runtime flags for
that may be too slow. i will bring it up at the op code bof.
uri
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Uri Guttman - [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.sysarch.com
SYStems ARCHitecture and Stem Development -- http
?
it should provide a core API HOOK for debugger and profiler like
stuff. and prolly a standard profiler module would be in the distro. but
a normal program would not load the profiler so it is not in the core
(by that def of core). it should be in the standard lib
uri
--
Uri Guttman - [EMAIL
= foo() ;
is fine too, since no compile time detection of OO values is made.
uri
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Uri Guttman - [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.sysarch.com
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BD == Brent Dax [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
BD # From: Uri Guttman [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
BD # use strict 'typing' ;
BD #
BD # my $foo = Dog.new() ;
BD #
BD # that fails at compile time.
BD #
BD # my Dog $spot = Dog.new() ;
BD #
BD # that is ok
of these checks can
so easily be circumvented that method writing should still be as
defensive as they are (or should be) now.
uri
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Uri Guttman - [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- http://www.sysarch.com
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