Re: [HACKERS] GiST consistent function, expected arguments; multi-dimensional indexes

2007-07-02 Thread Eric
Everything is always passed as a Datum, so yes, it's is determined by the storage clause in CREATE TYPE. Still not sure what to do in some scenarios. One example is the gist example code for btree (btree_gist). If you look at the int4 example consistent function, it gets an int32 value

Re: [HACKERS] todo: Hash index creation

2007-07-02 Thread Hannu Krosing
Ühel kenal päeval, E, 2007-07-02 kell 04:27, kirjutas Naz Gassiep: I've been warned away from hash indexes before, however I had no idea that it's performance was that abysmal that BTREE beat it and I was definitely not aware that they were not included in WAL logs. I was told it wasn't as

R: R: [postgresql-it] [HACKERS] no cascade triggers?

2007-07-02 Thread Manera, Villiam
To be honest..No trigger necessary... I have 1300 triggers and 345 functions (53500 lines of code), most of them written 15 years ago for ALLBASE/SQL (the old Hewlett Packard relational dbms) and converted to pl/pgsql last year. I admit that some of them may look eccentric, but some of them

Re: [HACKERS] GiST consistent function, expected arguments; multi-dimensional indexes

2007-07-02 Thread Martijn van Oosterhout
On Sun, Jul 01, 2007 at 07:20:08PM -0700, Eric wrote: Everything is always passed as a Datum, so yes, it's is determined by the storage clause in CREATE TYPE. Still not sure what to do in some scenarios. One example is the gist example code for btree (btree_gist). If you look at the

[HACKERS] ANALYZE and index/stats degradation

2007-07-02 Thread Jeroen T. Vermeulen
Hi all, I've run into a case where I get bad performance that doesn't sound too hard to solve. Question is: is it worth solving? The situation is this: I have a table that can grow to a large number of rows, then shrink to zero over a large number of quick, consecutive transactions. The

[HACKERS] Postgresql.conf cleanup

2007-07-02 Thread Josh Berkus
All, I'm working on cleaning up postgresql.conf and pg_settings for the release. Attached is a sample WIP. It's not in patch form because I'm not done yet; I've just been editing postgresql.conf and need to fix the docs and pg_settings to match. Issues encountered and changes made:

Re: [HACKERS] Postgresql.conf cleanup

2007-07-02 Thread Josh Berkus
This time *with* the attachment. All, I'm working on cleaning up postgresql.conf and pg_settings for the release. Attached is a sample WIP. It's not in patch form because I'm not done yet; I've just been editing postgresql.conf and need to fix the docs and pg_settings to match. Issues

Re: [HACKERS] ANALYZE and index/stats degradation

2007-07-02 Thread Gregory Stark
Jeroen T. Vermeulen [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: So I suppose the planner has a good reason to ignore the index at that point. I'm assuming that this is something to do with the correlation between the index and the column's statistics degrading in some way. Best to post explain analyze query

Re: [HACKERS] ANALYZE and index/stats degradation

2007-07-02 Thread Jeroen T. Vermeulen
On Mon, July 2, 2007 18:15, Gregory Stark wrote: So I suppose the planner has a good reason to ignore the index at that point. I'm assuming that this is something to do with the correlation between the index and the column's statistics degrading in some way. Best to post explain analyze

Re: [HACKERS] ANALYZE and index/stats degradation

2007-07-02 Thread Gregory Stark
Jeroen T. Vermeulen [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Actually, come to think of it, I don't think I'd want any vacuums at all on this particular table. Just the analyze on the primary key, no vacuums, no statistics on anything else. Unfortunately it's not just one table, but a set of tables that

Re: [HACKERS] Configurable Additional Stats

2007-07-02 Thread Simon Riggs
On Fri, 2007-06-29 at 14:43 -0400, Tom Lane wrote: Dave Page [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Yes, it's not intended to insert more stats, but to get the raw data out for external analysis during development and testing of applications and systems etc. Mph --- the proposal was very poorly

Re: [HACKERS] what is difference between LOCAL and GLOBAL TEMP TABLES in PostgreSQL

2007-07-02 Thread Jim Nasby
On Jul 1, 2007, at 4:46 PM, Tom Lane wrote: I have question. Is correct implementation of global temp in Oracle or Firebird, where content of glob.temp table is session visible and metadata of g.t.t is persistent? It's correct per spec. Whether it's more useful than what we do is highly

Re: [HACKERS] Postgresql.conf cleanup

2007-07-02 Thread Jim Nasby
On Jul 2, 2007, at 6:03 AM, Josh Berkus wrote: (change requires restart): this phrase appears over 20 times in the notes. This is enough times to be really repetitive and take up a lot of scrolling space, while not actually covering all startup- time parameters. We should either (a) remove

Re: [HACKERS] Postgresql.conf cleanup

2007-07-02 Thread Tom Lane
Josh Berkus [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I'm working on cleaning up postgresql.conf and pg_settings for the ... seq_scan_cost: this is independant of all of the other _costs. So? All the other costs are independent of it, too. I don't understand what problem you have with it. (change

Re: [HACKERS] ANALYZE and index/stats degradation

2007-07-02 Thread Jeroen T. Vermeulen
On Mon, July 2, 2007 22:17, Gregory Stark wrote: The way you described it there were records being inserted and later deleted. Why wouldn't you need vacuums? Or are all the records eventually deleted and then the table truncated or dropped before the next batch of inserts? In a nuthshell,

Re: [HACKERS] Configurable Additional Stats

2007-07-02 Thread Gregory Stark
Simon Riggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 2) Charge-back accounting. Keep track by userid, user group, time of access etc of all accesses to the system, so we can provide chargeback facilities to users. You can put your charging rules into the plugin and have it spit out appropriate chargeback

Re: [HACKERS] what is difference between LOCAL and GLOBAL TEMP TABLES in PostgreSQL

2007-07-02 Thread Tom Lane
Jim Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I've often thought that having global temp tables would be a really good idea, since it would drastically reduce the need to vacuum catalog tables, I rather doubt that. The most likely implementation would involve cloning a template entry into pg_class.

Re: [HACKERS] Configurable Additional Stats

2007-07-02 Thread Tom Lane
Gregory Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sure, but I think Tom's question is how do you get from the plugin to wherever you want this data to be? There's not much you can do with the data at that point. You would end up having to reconstruct the entire stats collector infrastructure to ship the

Re: [HACKERS] Postgresql.conf cleanup

2007-07-02 Thread Joshua D. Drake
Tom Lane wrote: (change requires restart): this phrase appears over 20 times in the notes. This is enough times to be really repetitive and take up a lot of scrolling space, while not actually covering all startup-time parameters. We should either (a) remove all such notes and rely on

Re: [HACKERS] Configurable Additional Stats

2007-07-02 Thread Simon Riggs
On Mon, 2007-07-02 at 17:41 +0100, Gregory Stark wrote: Simon Riggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 2) Charge-back accounting. Keep track by userid, user group, time of access etc of all accesses to the system, so we can provide chargeback facilities to users. You can put your charging rules

Re: [HACKERS] SetBufferCommitInfoNeedsSave and race conditions

2007-07-02 Thread Simon Riggs
On Fri, 2007-06-29 at 11:13 -0400, Tom Lane wrote: Simon Riggs [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Thu, 2007-06-28 at 20:23 -0400, Tom Lane wrote: The methodology I suggested earlier (involving tracking LSN only at the level of pg_clog pages) isn't going to make that work, unless you somehow

Re: [HACKERS] what is difference between LOCAL and GLOBAL TEMP TABLES in PostgreSQL

2007-07-02 Thread Pavel Stehule
I 2007/7/2, Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Jim Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I've often thought that having global temp tables would be a really good idea, since it would drastically reduce the need to vacuum catalog tables, I rather doubt that. The most likely implementation would involve

[HACKERS] SOLVED: unexpected EIDRM on Linux

2007-07-02 Thread Tom Lane
It's a plain old Linux kernel bug: it returns EIDRM when it really ought to say EINVAL, and apparently always has. The surprising part is really that we've not seen it many times before. Kudos to Michael Fuhr for thinking to write a test program investigating whether randomly-chosen IDs would

Re: [HACKERS] Postgresql.conf cleanup

2007-07-02 Thread Greg Smith
On Mon, 2 Jul 2007, Tom Lane wrote: # wal_buffers = 1MB Is there really evidence in favor of such a high setting for this, either? I noticed consistant improvements in throughput on pgbench results with lots of clients going from the default to 256KB, flatlining above that; it seemed

Re: [HACKERS] GiST consistent function, expected arguments; multi-dimensional indexes

2007-07-02 Thread Eric
I guess you can also get this before writing code from select typbyval from pg_type where typname='mytype' ...thanks again. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq

Re: [HACKERS] SOLVED: unexpected EIDRM on Linux

2007-07-02 Thread Tom Lane
I wrote: I'm going to generate a smaller test program showing this and file a bug report at Red Hat. Filed as https://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=246509 in case anyone wants to track it. (I suspect the Red Hat kernel guys will just bounce it upstream, but that's their call not

Re: [HACKERS] [COMMITTERS] pgsql: Fix failure to restart Postgres when Linux kernel returns EIDRM

2007-07-02 Thread Gregory Stark
Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Per reports from Michael Fuhr and Jon Lapham --- it's a bit surprising we have not seen more reports, actually. Oh, fwiw I've seen this. I stop and start postmasters so often I just assumed something wasn't getting cleaned up perfectly. The last time was a

Re: [HACKERS] Postgresql.conf cleanup

2007-07-02 Thread Tom Lane
Greg Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: On Mon, 2 Jul 2007, Tom Lane wrote: # wal_buffers = 1MB Is there really evidence in favor of such a high setting for this, either? I noticed consistant improvements in throughput on pgbench results with lots of clients going from the default to 256KB,

Re: [HACKERS] GiST consistent function, expected arguments; multi-dimensional indexes

2007-07-02 Thread Martijn van Oosterhout
On Mon, Jul 02, 2007 at 10:44:55AM -0700, Eric wrote: I guess you can also get this before writing code from select typbyval from pg_type where typname='mytype' Note that the flag might not be constant. For example int8 is not byval currently whereas it could be on a 64-bit architecture.

Re: [HACKERS] [COMMITTERS] pgsql: Fix PGXS conventions so that extensions can be built against

2007-07-02 Thread Robert Treat
On Tuesday 26 June 2007 18:05, Tom Lane wrote: Log Message: --- Fix PGXS conventions so that extensions can be built against Postgres installations whose pg_config program does not appear first in the PATH. Per gripe from Eddie Stanley and subsequent discussions with Fabien Coelho

[HACKERS] Still recommending daily vacuum...

2007-07-02 Thread Jim C. Nasby
From http://developer.postgresql.org/pgdocs/postgres/routine-vacuuming.html : Recommended practice for most sites is to schedule a database-wide VACUUM once a day at a low-usage time of day, supplemented by more frequent vacuuming of heavily-updated tables if necessary. (Some installations with

Re: [HACKERS] what is difference between LOCAL and GLOBAL TEMP TABLES in PostgreSQL

2007-07-02 Thread Alvaro Herrera
Tom Lane escribió: Jim Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I've often thought that having global temp tables would be a really good idea, since it would drastically reduce the need to vacuum catalog tables, I rather doubt that. The most likely implementation would involve cloning a

Re: [HACKERS] Updated tsearch documentation

2007-07-02 Thread Bruce Momjian
Oleg Bartunov wrote: On Wed, 20 Jun 2007, Bruce Momjian wrote: We need to decide if we need oids as user-visible argument. I don't see any value, probably Teodor think other way. This is a good time to clean up the API because there are going to be user-visible changes anyway.

Re: [HACKERS] what is difference between LOCAL and GLOBAL TEMP TABLES in PostgreSQL

2007-07-02 Thread Jaime Casanova
On 7/3/07, Alvaro Herrera [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tom Lane escribió: Jim Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I've often thought that having global temp tables would be a really good idea, since it would drastically reduce the need to vacuum catalog tables, I rather doubt that. The most

Re: [HACKERS] what is difference between LOCAL and GLOBAL TEMP TABLES in PostgreSQL

2007-07-02 Thread Gregory Stark
Jaime Casanova [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: while not just a new rekind indicating this is a template and not and actual table. and using that template for creating the actual tables? For precisely the reason stated upthread. That would mean creating and deleting catalog entries for every

Re: [HACKERS] what is difference between LOCAL and GLOBAL TEMP TABLES in PostgreSQL

2007-07-02 Thread Tom Lane
Alvaro Herrera [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Tom Lane escribió: I rather doubt that. The most likely implementation would involve cloning a template entry into pg_class. How about a new relkind which causes the table to be located in PGDATA/base/dboid/pg_temp_backendid/relfilenode So each

Re: [HACKERS] Still recommending daily vacuum...

2007-07-02 Thread Robert Treat
On Monday 02 July 2007 17:52, Jim C. Nasby wrote: From http://developer.postgresql.org/pgdocs/postgres/routine-vacuuming.html : Recommended practice for most sites is to schedule a database-wide VACUUM once a day at a low-usage time of day, supplemented by more frequent vacuuming of

Re: [HACKERS] Still recommending daily vacuum...

2007-07-02 Thread Tom Lane
Jim C. Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: http://developer.postgresql.org/pgdocs/postgres/routine-vacuuming.html : Well, with autovac defaulting to ON in 8.3, that's certainly obsolete text now. Is there a reason to say anything beyond use autovac? regards, tom lane

Re: [HACKERS] Still recommending daily vacuum...

2007-07-02 Thread Joshua D. Drake
Tom Lane wrote: Jim C. Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: http://developer.postgresql.org/pgdocs/postgres/routine-vacuuming.html : Well, with autovac defaulting to ON in 8.3, that's certainly obsolete text now. Is there a reason to say anything beyond use autovac? Did we change the default

Re: [HACKERS] Still recommending daily vacuum...

2007-07-02 Thread Alvaro Herrera
Joshua D. Drake wrote: Tom Lane wrote: Jim C. Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: http://developer.postgresql.org/pgdocs/postgres/routine-vacuuming.html : Well, with autovac defaulting to ON in 8.3, that's certainly obsolete text now. Is there a reason to say anything beyond use autovac?

Re: [HACKERS] Still recommending daily vacuum...

2007-07-02 Thread Joshua D. Drake
Alvaro Herrera wrote: Joshua D. Drake wrote: Tom Lane wrote: Jim C. Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: http://developer.postgresql.org/pgdocs/postgres/routine-vacuuming.html : Well, with autovac defaulting to ON in 8.3, that's certainly obsolete text now. Is there a reason to say anything

Re: [HACKERS] what is difference between LOCAL and GLOBAL TEMP TABLES in PostgreSQL

2007-07-02 Thread Pavel Stehule
How about a new relkind which causes the table to be located in PGDATA/base/dboid/pg_temp_backendid/relfilenode So each backend can have its own copy of the table with the same relfilenode; there's no need for extra catalog entries. Uh-huh. And what do you do with relpages, reltuples,

Re: [HACKERS] what is difference between LOCAL and GLOBAL TEMP TABLES in PostgreSQL

2007-07-02 Thread Pavel Stehule
2007/7/3, Gregory Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Jaime Casanova [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: while not just a new rekind indicating this is a template and not and actual table. and using that template for creating the actual tables? For precisely the reason stated upthread. That would mean creating