Chances are, Bruce, that Eric simply replied via email, so had no way to
see the thread was deleted prior to your response.
With abandon,
Patrick
On Friday, March 20, 2020 at 6:27:48 PM UTC-6, Fullylugged wrote:
>
> Eric:
>
> Jim deleted the parent thread to this post and asked that we stop
Eric:
Jim deleted the parent thread to this post and asked that we stop it. Please
do.
Thanks
Bruce
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It’s only a very tiny bit of snake oil.
On Friday, March 20, 2020, Joe Bernard wrote:
> Yeah no, I'm not buying snake oil.
>
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PS I sent my reply above before the ones calling for “stick to bikes.” Sorry!
They came through after I hit send. I shall now remain mum.
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This virus is terrifying. At first people dismissed it. Then they said, “Oh, we
won’t worry; it’s just going to affect the frail and elderly - *I* will be
fine.” (How can that be a comfort to you?! This lack of concern for one’s
fellow man and preoccupation with self nearly did me in.) Now the
Yeah, I agree let’s not debate these unrelated issues. I defended DP from
others but I think the last post may be a bridge too far. Let’s stick to bikes.
Doug
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Hey all. Homeopathic remedies have no place on this bike list. Specifically
arguing about it. Can we please stop posts either way?
I hope the virus crisis passes soon and with as little impact as possible so we
can all worry about saddle height and if chainstays have gotten too long
Regards
As the stakes are so high, we should be careful not to spread
misinformation. To be clear, it has repeatedly been proven that Homeopathy
is not effective as medicine. Look up the original sources on your own,
they go back to the early 20th century. Great source of hydration tho!
For the
Yeah no, I'm not buying snake oil.
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As the stakes are so high I am posting this. It seems reasonable to flatten
the curve by reasonable and available means, and as homeopathy is readily
available and inexpensive, and the supply chain is in the US or France, and
thus costs $5 to use the preventative per person for weeks (without
Glad you're on the mend, neighbor!
David B also in Brooklyn
On Fri, Mar 20, 2020 at 9:25 AM lambbo wrote:
> I just tested positive for Coronavirus!
>
> Good news is I'm healthy (after flu-like symptoms that were no fun) and my
> baby daughter and wife (who is a CNM, NP and works at Mount Sinai
Glad you are feeling better and your family is fine.
Curtis
El Cajon, CA
On Fri, Mar 20, 2020, 6:25 AM lambbo wrote:
> I just tested positive for Coronavirus!
>
> Good news is I'm healthy (after flu-like symptoms that were no fun) and my
> baby daughter and wife (who is a CNM, NP and works at
Best wishes for a speedy and complete recovery.
Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA
On Friday, March 20, 2020 at 6:25:07 AM UTC-7, lambbo wrote:
>
> I just tested positive for Coronavirus!
>
> Good news is I'm healthy (after flu-like symptoms that were no fun) and my
> baby daughter and wife (who is
I just tested positive for Coronavirus!
Good news is I'm healthy (after flu-like symptoms that were no fun) and my
baby daughter and wife (who is a CNM, NP and works at Mount Sinai West),
are all fine and have not bad symptoms, and in fact we've done a great job
quarantining, and *could *go
Yes you posted this already. I'm in California, not Alabama, and I'm not
convinced a group ride of any distances from each other will be allowed. I mean
obviously it's hard to enforce and you may not get stopped, but it's not in the
spirit of what we're being asked to do here.
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You
19, 2020 10:11 PMTo: RBW Owners BunchSubject: Re: [RBW] Re: Group Riding / New Covid-19 World In California - we were already under the Shelter In Place this week in Marin County - it means you can walk and bike alone, and drive to get groceries, gas, takeout food. I've been out there and there's
Daniel, it's good to hear that's the "if we did nothing" number, although I
suspect the eventual "we did something" number will still be harrowing.
All, I have no interest in debates about homeopathy, I just know this: Right
now we have a shockingly contagious virus that's killing people,
Patrick (Moore, not Deacon),
I agree with your assessment that “if there is anything unscientific, it's
blanket, unanalyzed statements about what is and what isn't science.” I
assume that you are referring to what I said about homeopathy given that
you make specific mention of it in your
Patrick (Moore, not Deacon),
I agree with your assessment that “if there is anything unscientific, it's
blanket, unanalyzed statements about what is and what isn't science.” I
assume that you are referring to what I said about homeopathy given that
you make specific mention of it in your
A spokesperson for Newsom later told Politico that the 56 percent number
reflects the infection rate if "mitigation efforts aren't taken into account."
https://m.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/california-coronavirus-numbers-newsom-trump-15144169.php
On Thursday, March 19, 2020 at 8:11:29 PM UTC-7,
19, 2020 10:11 PMTo: RBW Owners BunchSubject: Re: [RBW] Re: Group Riding / New Covid-19 World In California - we were already under the Shelter In Place this week in Marin County - it means you can walk and bike alone, and drive to get groceries, gas, takeout food. I've been out there and there's
In California - we were already under the Shelter In Place this week in Marin
County - it means you can walk and bike alone, and drive to get groceries, gas,
takeout food. I've been out there and there's a few cars and bikes around, but
it's unusually quiet. What you don't want to do is get
I enjoyed a nice ride here in Reno today. Lots of families out at the parks
with kids which seemed weird. Good to get out. Sorry no photos. Rode one of my
beautiful Della Santas. Came home with a smile on my face.
Addison
RENO
Sent from my iPhone
> On Mar 19, 2020, at 7:43 PM, Eric
I’m a rationalist, humanist, atheist, Buddhist, and find Deacon Patrick’s last
response reflective and poignant. Whatever faith we have or don’t have this is
a time to not only think of others but “serve” them as well. We are in this
together!
Much respect and love to you all,
Addison
Reno
We are not locked down in Vancouver BC, but we live on a well used bike
route (York Avenue). One of my pastimes is sitting on the balcony watching
the bikes go by. What fun! Great way to drink my coffee.
Anyway, in the last week, almost no group rides, certainly none greater
than say 4. However,
So to move on... what does the stay at home thing mean for biking? Also weren’t
you SF people already under this ordinance? Are people actually doing it?
Unfortunately I don’t really see people in LA adhering to this without some
sort of repercussions for not.
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The mistake was mine. I never intended to stir up discord and apologize for
doing so. I bow out of this thread and topic and pray the healing balm of
peace may wrap each of us in the challenges we face, freeing us to serve
those around us.
With abandon,
Patrick
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Meanwhile California is in a statewide Stay At Home, whatever-the-hell THAT
means. So yay.
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Thank you for posting this Patrick Moore. It is tiring hearing cliches such as
climate denier and science denier used to ridicule a person who has obviously
given these topics much thought, right or wrong they may be. And, to also
ridicule their religion in one post and then in the next post of
Those of you making blanket statements about what science is or is not, or
what is scientific and what is not, please post your probative research,
including methodology and procedures. Also clearly isolate and state your
assumed premises. Or post research by others who have done this.
If there
I withdraw. Enjoy the ride.
With abandon,
Patrick
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On Thursday, March 19, 2020 at 9:58:51 AM UTC-7, ted wrote:
>
> I think it is more incumbent on the rest of us to evaluate dp’s
> reliability as a source for such guidance than it is for him to self censor
> his views.
You are right, and I humbly apologize to the group for asking Patrick
Deacon Patrick,
With all due respect, the United Kingdom's high court ordered NHS to stop
funding Homeopathy in 2017
(https://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2018/06/05/high-court-backs-nhs-decision-stop-funding-homeopathy/)
They did this because the fact that it is ineffective makes it
ile device From: tapebu...@gmail.comSent: March 19, 2020 6:37 AMTo: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.comReply-to: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.comSubject: [RBW] Re: Group Riding / New Covi
Well Said Ted
On Thursday, March 19, 2020 at 12:58:51 PM UTC-4, ted wrote:
>
> I think it is more incumbent on the rest of us to evaluate dp’s
> reliability as a source for such guidance than it is for him to self censor
> his views.
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Steve asked:
"Do you stay out of the bathtub for the same reason? "
Great question. I probably have averaged 1 or 2 baths per year over the
last 2 decades, but that's mainly for water conservation reasons. I
probably take about 5 showers per week on average. I confess that fear of
injury does
I think it is more incumbent on the rest of us to evaluate dp’s reliability as
a source for such guidance than it is for him to self censor his views.
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Homeopathy is completely anti-science. It doesn’t really take much beyond
rational thought to debunk the idea that diluting a drug makes it stronger, but
there are loads of studies that do just that. Many alternative medicine
modalities work for various ailments, but homeopathy works for
I'm sorry Patrick, but you seem to have cherry picked your facts:
from Bloomberg News:
Why Boris Johnson Reversed Britain’s Virus Response
Excerpt:
"With no mitigation measures at all, the Imperial Team said they would
expect 80% of the population to be infected, resulting in 510,000 deaths in
Haha. Good one. I'm wearing my helmet right now while typing. Can I
remove it safely?
Bill Lindsay
El Cerrito, CA
On Thursday, March 19, 2020 at 8:00:01 AM UTC-7, William deRosset wrote:
>
> Dear Bill,
>
>
> Don't ride drunk, paceline, or sprint for town limit signs and the bike
> ride is
Dear Bill,
Don't ride drunk, paceline, or sprint for town limit signs and the bike ride is
less likely to result in injury or death than hiding in your home, assuming you
shower from time to time.
Best Regards,
Will
William M deRosset
Fort Collins CO USA
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On 3/19/20 9:37 AM, Bill Lindsay wrote:
This thought is weighing on me as well. I ride solo >95% of the time.
Two very old and very dear friends wanted to get together for a
leisurely ride, and I begged off for this reason. It's an extremely
low risk, but if one of us crashes, and needs to
This thought is weighing on me as well. I ride solo >95% of the time. Two
very old and very dear friends wanted to get together for a leisurely ride,
and I begged off for this reason. It's an extremely low risk, but if one of
us crashes, and needs to go to the ER, I just don't want to be a
Och, Drw! That's frustrating. Here's how my kids, ages 7-19, would respond
to me if I did something like that. "Uh, Papa? Part to whole." Part to
whole is a fallacy of logic. Just like now is a great time to ride, it's
also a great time to read. Here is the book we use to homeschool our kids
The mortality rate should go down as more people are tested and we get a more
realistic figure of how many have it and are surviving. But even a 2% mortality
rate for a virus this monstrously contagious..well..I hoped I would never see
this day...
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no idea how accurate any of the data is right now. Kind of sobering. (8,411 deaths and 84,121 recoveries as I type this) Bruce Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Nick PayneSent: Wednesday, March 18, 2020 10:52 PMTo: RBW Owners BunchSubject: [RBW] Re: Group Riding / New Covid-19 World Present US
I’d classify members of my family as science-skeptical, like a number of the
higher up posts, so I am not As deeply offended as others, but I’m growing more
and more curious. I would ask what anyone who resists doing what every
scientist and expert is suggesting expects to gain from such
I wish I could could call those numbers alarmist, but I'm seeing NO evidence
that we aren't in for a truly world-changing event over the next year. Like a
'Morgan Freeman in Deep Impact speech' event, "Life will go on. We will
prevail."
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Present US population ~330 million. On Johns Hopkins figures
(https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6)
so far from COVID-19 there are ~8800 deaths from 218000 cases - that's
about 4% death rate. If half the US population gets this in
There is another perspective on this from Spain. A doctor there (who is
also a cyclist) made a video pleading with cyclists not to ride at all in
this point in this point in the outbreak as there are simply not doctors
and space to handle cycling accidents on top of the virus patients. My
People really appreciate the bell on the trail, even more than the usual
gushing. Lots of great interactions from a few steps back, as folks release
the tensions they have. Interactions are easier now that everyone social
distances (which I've long tried to do because of the scents of most
Dear Patrick
True re: 2017-2018 flu season. Also, our novel coronavirus is more
infectious, nobody has partial immunity (yet), and the death/complication
rate is rather higher than it was for the flu strain you cite.
The point of all the social distancing, closing schools etc is to slow the
For those who don't like to click on links to articles, the Bicycling
Magazine article linked in this post interviews a doctor who recommends
that solo-riding is the safest course of action. It also says being
outdoors by yourself is good for you and also makes clear that UV exposure
kills
I was thinking the same thing of you Patrick. I appreciate everyone
all of this . I appreciate LIFE and all of LIFE's Aliveness which
is as much "us"... as "we" LIFE .
This comes to mind about dis-agreement, and how that simply never happens
in reality. Think about about
Shall we virtual pace line in a museum hop and discuss art? I'm partial to
the classics.
https://www.travelandleisure.com/attractions/museums-galleries/museums-with-virtual-tours
With abandon,
Patrick
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Jan's piece is well done, and puts it all in perspective with reference to
cycling limitations during WWII.
https://www.renehersecycles.com/adjusting-to-new-realities/
With abandon,
Patrick
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As a RUSA RBA, my events are still on, and I have reminded riders about social
distance, no snot rockets, don't come if you have a cough or are sneezing etc.
As ride committee chair for our local bike club, our rides are still on, same
rules. The # of riders is not large on any given outing.
( ( ( smiling ) ) )
We're all kinda just looking out for our friends after all, like Sid the
Science Kid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa_cIOFfqrQ
And a Barnyard Boogieing with the Muppets you just can't stand still
!
The trick here - which I've tried to impress on the group a couple times - is
to focus on not doing stupid stuff to spread the virus. Honestly I don't care
what your personal thoughts on science are as long as you treat this thing like
it's bad and stay away from people, especially crowds of
As a healthcare worker myself along with a partner who also works in the
healthcare field, I agree with what Justin has said.
This group is great for lurking people who spend far too much money and
time on bikes as opposed to just riding them.
However, If people are too ignorant to take the
Thanks Justin
totally agree
This group needs to stay in it's lane or it's really not worth being a part
of.
On Sunday, March 15, 2020 at 8:16:07 PM UTC-4, Justin, Oakland wrote:
>
> As someone who has two loved ones on the front lines and another at high
> risk all of this anti-science
As chance would have it; I lost my job just as this was starting to blow
up, but I can't breath easy even though the kids are out of school because
my wife is a nurse. :-(
As an aside (and qualifying it with a disclaimer, because I am not a
medical professional) I *THINK* this YouTube channel
My wife and I are both hospital-based physicians in northwest Washington
state so we are very much on the front lines of this. I have also noticed
plenty of anti-science in this thread, but have resisted (and will continue
to resist) calling it out because a listserv dedicated to Rivendell
The answer to the OP's question is riding in groups with decent distance yes,
pacelines no
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Again, anti-science? Please, help me understand what this means and where
it appears in this conversation. Please, be specific.
With abandon,
Patrick
On Sunday, March 15, 2020 at 6:57:29 PM UTC-6, Daniel M wrote:
>
> Thank you for calling it out, Justin.
>
> It's insidious and it's dangerous.
Thank you for calling it out, Justin.
It's insidious and it's dangerous.
Daniel M
Berkeley, CA
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Who here has voiced anything anti-science, Justin?
On Sunday, March 15, 2020 at 6:16:07 PM UTC-6, Justin, Oakland wrote:
>
> As someone who has two loved ones on the front lines and another at high
> risk all of this anti-science dismissal confirms my choice to step away
> from this group as a
As someone who has two loved ones on the front lines and another at high risk
all of this anti-science dismissal confirms my choice to step away from this
group as a contributing member.
It’s fucking gross, dangerous and will potentially have seriously damaging
impacts on people.
Grow up.
We do need all of us, in humble kindness. The world is experiencing
something unprecedented, both in the rapidly spreading new coronavirus and
the more rapidly spreading virus of fear. That we may the better apply
ourselves to addressing the virus, let kindness and reason rule our hearts,
Party on, Garth! 藍
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Garth -- I appreciate your good nature.
Patrick
On Sun, Mar 15, 2020 at 4:59 PM Garth wrote:
>
> ( ( ( ( Laughing ) ) ) )With Patrick Moore.
>
>
>
> You know . if anyone appreciates lullabies as I do . here's a
> couple of my favorites. It's amazing the depth and breadth
You know, we just need all of us. That’s what I’m going with from now on.
Just got word Nevada has no school until middle of April at least. We’re
grounded these days, I imagine we’ll all be ”seeing” each other a bit more
here. Like family!
Sent from my iPhone
> On Mar 15, 2020, at 3:59 PM,
( ( ( ( Laughing ) ) ) )With Patrick Moore.
You know . if anyone appreciates lullabies as I do . here's a
couple of my favorites. It's amazing the depth and breadth what one feels,
hears and sees from what appears to be "mere child's play".
In celebration of what LIFE
Deborah - this supports what I heard on the local news channel last night.
Our governor, like many, has nixed all get-togethers, whether schools,
churches, movies, or other social events of over 250 people for a period of
2 weeks, i.e., until the end of the month. However, a comment from a
No over the shoulder loogies applies at all times, not just during
pandemics!
And here's something that will eat up 8 minutes of your isolation if you've
never seen it:
The Backwards Bicycle Brain
https://youtu.be/MFzDaBzBlL0
Cheers,
Austin
Sykesville, MD
On Sunday, March 15, 2020 at
:) and no over the shoulder loogies!
On Sunday, March 15, 2020 at 3:32:16 PM UTC-4, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> And no snot rockets.
> On 3/15/20 3:26 PM, Joe Bernard wrote:
>
> Truth is Truth: Ride steel bikes with at least one lug, don't paceline
> ♀️♂️
>
>
> --
> Steve Palincsar
>
And no snot rockets.
On 3/15/20 3:26 PM, Joe Bernard wrote:
Truth is Truth: Ride steel bikes with at least one lug, don't paceline ♀️♂️
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Alexandria, Virginia
USA
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Truth is Truth: Ride steel bikes with at least one lug, don't paceline ♀️♂️
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I agree with this as long as I am able to yank Garth's chain.
On Sun, Mar 15, 2020 at 12:13 PM lambbo wrote:
> While a great source of community and bike/Rivendell related
> information...it is easy to consider this entire endeavor a foolish waste
> of time if we're shutting people down and
*He delighted to tread upon the brink of meaning, where light and darkness
begin to mingle; to approach the precipice of absurdity, and hover over the
abyss of unideal vacancy ...*
Patrick Moore, who did not either have to look that up, in ABQ, NM
On Sun, Mar 15, 2020 at 11:43 AM Garth wrote:
While a great source of community and bike/Rivendell related
information...it is easy to consider this entire endeavor a foolish waste
of time if we're shutting people down and arguing about who should be able
to say what when. I appreciate Garth's odd posts.
I'm personally quarantined
It's not censorship to think your comments on this issue are a foolish
waste of time.
On 3/15/20 1:43 PM, Garth wrote:
What I expressed is as worthy of expression as anything else on this
or any topic, including yours.
What's done is done . censorship censored.
On Sunday, March 15,
What I expressed is as worthy of expression as anything else on this or any
topic, including yours.
What's done is done . censorship censored.
On Sunday, March 15, 2020 at 11:25:15 AM UTC-4, Steve Palincsar wrote:
> If you have nothing worthwhile to say on the subject, perhaps not
Keeping this in mind:
Half of the overall cases are expected within a period of a few weeks, with 95%
in a period of around 10 weeks.
>From columnist Megan McArdle: There’s an old brain teaser that goes like this:
>You have a pond of a certain size, and upon that pond, a single lilypad. This
“I keep hearing "10-20 times more deadly than the flu" and then "80% of
infected people are invisible because they are untested and asymptomatic."
Those two statements seem to not make sense together except to say we have yet
to understand what is happening.”
Not so hard for me to grasp. Even
Doug, you’re a *sweetheart* and thanks for your kind words. I am not on the
front lines of this for now; I echo your sentiments for all the healthcare
workers who ARE. I’ve followed the stories of some of the nurses fighting
COID-19 in other countries and it’s demoralizing.
I hope you all are
Leah,
I want to thank you and other health care workers who put themselves in harms
way to treat others. Your sense of humanity and selflessness is awe-inspiring
and certainly much appreciated.
Doug
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The flu vaccine is designed to produce “herd immunity.” Those weakest and
immune-compromised cannot take the vaccine. The rest of us get the vaccine to
shield babies, the sick, and the elderly. The more people protected, the lower
the spread. “The” flu isn’t always the “same” flu, which is why
If you have nothing worthwhile to say on the subject, perhaps not saying
anything might be a wise choice.
On 3/15/20 10:09 AM, Garth wrote:
You have no say in the matter.
On Sunday, March 15, 2020 at 8:39:57 AM UTC-4, Steve Palincsar wrote:
Garth, this really isn't the time for
“I keep hearing "10-20 times more deadly than the flu" and then "80% of
infected people are invisible because they are untested and asymptomatic."
Those two statements seem to not make sense together except to say we have yet
to understand what is happening.”
The issue is that people do not
You have no say in the matter.
On Sunday, March 15, 2020 at 8:39:57 AM UTC-4, Steve Palincsar wrote:
>
> Garth, this really isn't the time for this kind of prattle.
>
>
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Garth, this really isn't the time for this kind of prattle.
On 3/15/20 6:41 AM, Garth wrote:
Reminds of these few movie scene words with Uncle Jack and Tom
"You want answers ?
.I want the Truth
You can't handle the Truth"
The Truth is The Truth is The Truth . Truth, The Whole
On 3/14/20 11:38 PM, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:
Philip, as it’s been in our country for ages, we have some natural immunity to
influenza.
Not to mention vaccines that provide acquired immunity.
We have none to COVID-19. COVID-19 is a virus new to us,
and a vaccine is
If you're responding to me, Philip, no, I am not making any particular
conclusion other than we don't know far more than we realize, including
what we think we know. I keep hearing "10-20 times more deadly than the
flu" and then "80% of infected people are invisible because they are
untested
Reminds of these few movie scene words with Uncle Jack and Tom
"You want answers ?
.I want the Truth
You can't handle the Truth"
The Truth is The Truth is The Truth . Truth, The Whole Truth and
nothing but Truth is Truth .
Unchallengingly unchallengeable . Indivisibly
Philip, as it’s been in our country for ages, we have some natural immunity to
influenza. We have none to COVID-19. COVID-19 is a virus new to us, with a much
higher death rate than flu, and unknown long-term effects. We are trying
“flatten the curve” so as not to cause a collapse with our
So you’re saying we should have already been taking these precautions in order
to have lessened the deaths from the flu last year? And in addition to the flu
again this year we have the corona virus? So we should double down, clearly.
Philip
Santa Rosa, Cal.
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CoronaCone for all your mobile social distancing needs... Grin (pilfered
from facebook).
[image: IMG_6235.jpeg]
On Saturday, March 14, 2020 at 8:11:55 AM UTC-6, Jock Dewey wrote:
>
> Y'all:
>
> So here in Athens, GA we've got many ops for group riding. I ride with a
> couple of different
Here in Seattle, I'm out and about on my bike, but wouldn't ride in close
quarters. As to whether warmer temperatures will cause this virus to go away
for now, we do not yet know. One thing we DO know is it is currently spreading
in Singapore and Australia, so that could mean it's not going
Aye, Joe, we are likely similarly qualified, and I'd argue logic and reason
take us a long way, in a cordial conversation like this, to be more
qualified than zero. A few clarifications:
- I understand how you may have read what I wrote this way; however, I did
not say we should treat it "like
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