[RBW] Re: TCO in general..
to jamb my shoe into my fender. Bicycles should not cause this kind of low-grade anxiety. It's unnecessary - if a bike has TCO, the wheels are too big. Design it out with smaller wheels! As GP argues, there are many other concerns in a bike design than TCO. Designing a bike so it will be a good fixie may make sense for a one off custom builder. No sense at all for someone who designs bike for a wide range of riders most of whom have zero interest in fixed gear bicycles. On Feb 2, 9:22 pm, james black chocot...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 23:36, Grant Petersen gr...@rivbike.com wrote: TCO ends up being a problem---in my opinion---only in theoretics, but not in practice. THere are some builders who would disagree; and although in the spirit of diplomacy and reasonableness and agreeing to disagree and all that, I accept thatI can't understand it. To fear TCO or to regard it as Dangerouswell, it's ust something that to me doesn't make any sense. I also disagree - I strongly dislike toe clip overlap, having encountered it on a few frames (I usually ride long-raked 60-62cm frames now, so have little problem). It can be a problem trackstanding, riding slowly, turning sharply while riding a fixed gear, riding offroad, and climbing slowly. If it doesn't make you crash, it's still annoying, inconvenient, and I don't want to sit around while riding constantly thinking, Oh, I better be careful not to jamb my shoe into my fender. Bicycles should not cause this kind of low-grade anxiety. It's unnecessary - if a bike has TCO, the wheels are too big. Design it out with smaller wheels! One cyclist's opinion. James Black Los Angeles, CA -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: TCO in general..
On Tue, Feb 2, 2010 at 22:32, Tim McNamara tim...@bitstream.net wrote: I think there are a number of us who want our cake and get to eat it too: sporty fast geometry with 45 mm tires, full fenders and no TCO. I'd say pick two. Some enchiladas can't be readily served whole. What we're talking about is a matter of how much value to place on various attributes. I understand that many of you will come to a reasoned point of view that the drawbacks of going to a smaller wheel size outweigh the benefits of eliminating TCO. Nearly every bike company makes some bikes with TCO. But there are also many cyclists who share my point of view that the benefits of the larger diameter wheel do not outweigh the disadvantage of TCO. Those who design bicycles would be urged to consider customers like myself, recognize that TCO is an offense (however significant), and deal with it proactively, either by eliminating it, or acknowledging that it is a necessary evil (however significant) to be tolerated. I am mildly annoyed and feel vaguely insulted by the point of view I sometimes encounter that TCO is an imaginary problem, or that I'm some kind of dimwit because it bothers me. There are other cyclists (customers) like me - bike designers should be attentive to this fact. James Black Los Angeles, CA -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: TCO in general..
On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 11:37 AM, james black chocot...@gmail.com wrote: ... I am mildly annoyed and feel vaguely insulted by the point of view I sometimes encounter that TCO is an imaginary problem, or that I'm some kind of dimwit because it bothers me. There are other cyclists (customers) like me - bike designers should be attentive to this fact. I agree. That's the part of this whole debate that bothers me. It's not that those of us who care about it can't appreciate that some people don't, it's that some people try to tell us it's an imaginary problem and that we should just get over it. On a single I'm willing to put up with some TCO, though I'm very glad that Mike Barry designed my Mariposa without it. On a tandem I would not consider putting up with it - it's too dangerous when the person controlling the bike doesn't have complete control of the pedals. -Ken -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Franklin Canyon Ride
On Feb 2, 10:16 am, Brad Gantt brdg...@gmail.com wrote: Phil, I am not familiar with the White Fence trail, at least by that name. Where specifically does it originate in Studio City? Thanks! I don't remember the street names but in the little housing area south of Ventura and west of Laurel it you just keep going south and west eventually you end up on the last street going that way and at the end is a trail going up the hill to the fire road. Going the other way if you go up the fire road from the little park on Laurel Canyon there's a flat about halfway up. The train joining on your right is White Fence. good luck. Phil Brown -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: TCO in general..
What we're talking about is a matter of how much value to place on various attributes. I agree that smaller wheels are a solution for TCO and other real and perceived problems, and my custom touring bike is basically a copy of my 58 Atlantis, but for 26 wheels. For some reason that isn't completely obvious, a lot of people have a reflexive distaste for smaller wheels. The 56 Atlantis was always a much harder sell than a 58 Atlantis, which I attribute to a widespread prejudice against smaller wheels. Over on the Long Haul Trucker forum, there are plenty of folks who do not understand (to the point of being angry about it) why Surly would offer the bigger LHT frames designed around 26 wheels. I'll be curious to see how the small-wheel Truckers sell, and if there's really sizable group clamoring for these. On Feb 3, 11:37 am, james black chocot...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Feb 2, 2010 at 22:32, Tim McNamara tim...@bitstream.net wrote: I think there are a number of us who want our cake and get to eat it too: sporty fast geometry with 45 mm tires, full fenders and no TCO. I'd say pick two. Some enchiladas can't be readily served whole. What we're talking about is a matter of how much value to place on various attributes. I understand that many of you will come to a reasoned point of view that the drawbacks of going to a smaller wheel size outweigh the benefits of eliminating TCO. Nearly every bike company makes some bikes with TCO. But there are also many cyclists who share my point of view that the benefits of the larger diameter wheel do not outweigh the disadvantage of TCO. Those who design bicycles would be urged to consider customers like myself, recognize that TCO is an offense (however significant), and deal with it proactively, either by eliminating it, or acknowledging that it is a necessary evil (however significant) to be tolerated. I am mildly annoyed and feel vaguely insulted by the point of view I sometimes encounter that TCO is an imaginary problem, or that I'm some kind of dimwit because it bothers me. There are other cyclists (customers) like me - bike designers should be attentive to this fact. James Black Los Angeles, CA -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: TCO in general..
On a single I'm willing to put up with some TCO, though I'm very glad that Mike Barry designed my Mariposa without it. You cannot compare a custom with a stock design. Unless the owner demands some wacky wheel size/geometry, a custom builder should have a lot more flexibility than a basic design carried through on several sizes. On Feb 3, 11:48 am, Kenneth Stagg kenneth.st...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 11:37 AM, james black chocot...@gmail.com wrote: ... I am mildly annoyed and feel vaguely insulted by the point of view I sometimes encounter that TCO is an imaginary problem, or that I'm some kind of dimwit because it bothers me. There are other cyclists (customers) like me - bike designers should be attentive to this fact. I agree. That's the part of this whole debate that bothers me. It's not that those of us who care about it can't appreciate that some people don't, it's that some people try to tell us it's an imaginary problem and that we should just get over it. On a single I'm willing to put up with some TCO, though I'm very glad that Mike Barry designed my Mariposa without it. On a tandem I would not consider putting up with it - it's too dangerous when the person controlling the bike doesn't have complete control of the pedals. -Ken -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: TCO in general..
For some reason that isn't completely obvious, a lot of people have a reflexive distaste for smaller wheels. The 56 Atlantis was always a much harder sell than a 58 Atlantis, which I attribute to a widespread prejudice against smaller wheels. Over on the Long Haul Trucker forum, there are plenty of folks who do not understand (to the point of being angry about it) why Surly would offer the bigger LHT frames designed around 26 wheels. I'll be curious to see how the small-wheel Truckers sell, and if there's really sizable group clamoring for these. Did not realize people were so hostile to 26. I will soon receive a custom that is built around 26 wheels - at just under 6', I guess you could call my bikes either larger or average. I did not spec 26 because of some TCO concern. Rather, I wanted to have a bike that could use the biggest Big Apples without putting my head up in sub- space. On Feb 3, 12:24 pm, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery thill@gmail.com wrote: What we're talking about is a matter of how much value to place on various attributes. I agree that smaller wheels are a solution for TCO and other real and perceived problems, and my custom touring bike is basically a copy of my 58 Atlantis, but for 26 wheels. For some reason that isn't completely obvious, a lot of people have a reflexive distaste for smaller wheels. The 56 Atlantis was always a much harder sell than a 58 Atlantis, which I attribute to a widespread prejudice against smaller wheels. Over on the Long Haul Trucker forum, there are plenty of folks who do not understand (to the point of being angry about it) why Surly would offer the bigger LHT frames designed around 26 wheels. I'll be curious to see how the small-wheel Truckers sell, and if there's really sizable group clamoring for these. On Feb 3, 11:37 am, james black chocot...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Feb 2, 2010 at 22:32, Tim McNamara tim...@bitstream.net wrote: I think there are a number of us who want our cake and get to eat it too: sporty fast geometry with 45 mm tires, full fenders and no TCO. I'd say pick two. Some enchiladas can't be readily served whole. What we're talking about is a matter of how much value to place on various attributes. I understand that many of you will come to a reasoned point of view that the drawbacks of going to a smaller wheel size outweigh the benefits of eliminating TCO. Nearly every bike company makes some bikes with TCO. But there are also many cyclists who share my point of view that the benefits of the larger diameter wheel do not outweigh the disadvantage of TCO. Those who design bicycles would be urged to consider customers like myself, recognize that TCO is an offense (however significant), and deal with it proactively, either by eliminating it, or acknowledging that it is a necessary evil (however significant) to be tolerated. I am mildly annoyed and feel vaguely insulted by the point of view I sometimes encounter that TCO is an imaginary problem, or that I'm some kind of dimwit because it bothers me. There are other cyclists (customers) like me - bike designers should be attentive to this fact. James Black Los Angeles, CA- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: TCO in general..
On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 10:48 AM, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com wrote: Those who design bicycles would be urged to consider customers like myself, recognize that TCO is an offense (however significant), and deal with it proactively, either by eliminating it, or acknowledging that it is a necessary evil (however significant) to be tolerated. Isn't that what Grant says in his post? He said: TCO ends up being a problem---in my opinion---only in theoretics, but not in practice. For me, TCO is a problem in practice. I don't mind hearing that the desire for no TCO has to be balanced with other design considerations. I do mind hearing that what is an actual problem for me is not an actual problem for me. -- -- Anne Paulson He who wills the ends wills the means -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: TCO in general..
Anne and James: I will readily concede that TCO not being a concern to me left less sensitive to GP's choice of words. On Feb 3, 1:05 pm, Anne Paulson anne.paul...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 10:48 AM, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com wrote: Those who design bicycles would be urged to consider customers like myself, recognize that TCO is an offense (however significant), and deal with it proactively, either by eliminating it, or acknowledging that it is a necessary evil (however significant) to be tolerated. Isn't that what Grant says in his post? He said: TCO ends up being a problem---in my opinion---only in theoretics, but not in practice. For me, TCO is a problem in practice. I don't mind hearing that the desire for no TCO has to be balanced with other design considerations. I do mind hearing that what is an actual problem for me is not an actual problem for me. -- -- Anne Paulson He who wills the ends wills the means -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: TCO in general..
On Feb 3, 2010, at 11:37 AM, james black wrote: Those who design bicycles would be urged to consider customers like myself, recognize that TCO is an offense (however significant), and deal with it proactively, either by eliminating it, or acknowledging that it is a necessary evil (however significant) to be tolerated. That's what it is. I thought that was pretty clear in Grant's post and my post, among others. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: TCO in general..
On Feb 3, 2010, at 12:54 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: For some reason that isn't completely obvious, a lot of people have a reflexive distaste for smaller wheels. The 56 Atlantis was always a much harder sell than a 58 Atlantis, which I attribute to a widespread prejudice against smaller wheels. Over on the Long Haul Trucker forum, there are plenty of folks who do not understand (to the point of being angry about it) why Surly would offer the bigger LHT frames designed around 26 wheels. I'll be curious to see how the small-wheel Truckers sell, and if there's really sizable group clamoring for these. Did not realize people were so hostile to 26. I will soon receive a custom that is built around 26 wheels - at just under 6', I guess you could call my bikes either larger or average. I did not spec 26 because of some TCO concern. Rather, I wanted to have a bike that could use the biggest Big Apples without putting my head up in sub- space. I get flak about it sometimes when I am out riding my All-Rounder with 26 wheels. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: TCO in general..
On Wed, 2010-02-03 at 18:17 -0600, Tim McNamara wrote: On Feb 3, 2010, at 12:54 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: Did not realize people were so hostile to 26. I will soon receive a custom that is built around 26 wheels - at just under 6', I guess you could call my bikes either larger or average. I did not spec 26 because of some TCO concern. Rather, I wanted to have a bike that could use the biggest Big Apples without putting my head up in sub- space. I get flak about it sometimes when I am out riding my All-Rounder with 26 wheels. I can't imagine why they'd care. Can you even see that the wheels are unusual? I've only really ever seen one Riv All-Arounder, I think a 58 cm, and it looks perfectly ordinary with nothing particular to note about the wheels other than some pretty fat looking tires. What do they say? And what do you say in return? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] 26 inch wheels
The TCO discussion appears to be morphing into a 26 inch wheel discussion. My 59cm All-Rounder has 26inch wheels. I have received a grand total of two comments about the wheels size during the 12 years I have owned the bike. One was what's with the small wheels? the second (apparently not realizing the wheels were small) said Wow, I've never seen a frame that big! He seemed so excited about the frame size I didn't have the heart to correct him. When I got the bike it was much easier to find BIG tires for 26inch wheels...650b wasn't that popular back then Angus -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 26 inch wheels
Based on my experiences with the LHT, XO-1 and Atlantis, 26 wheels are great for everything except fast road riding. Fat or skinny, it always felt like extra work. For me 650b is the perfect compromise. Ryan On Feb 3, 4:39 pm, Angus angusle...@sbcglobal.net wrote: The TCO discussion appears to be morphing into a 26 inch wheel discussion. My 59cm All-Rounder has 26inch wheels. I have received a grand total of two comments about the wheels size during the 12 years I have owned the bike. One was what's with the small wheels? the second (apparently not realizing the wheels were small) said Wow, I've never seen a frame that big! He seemed so excited about the frame size I didn't have the heart to correct him. When I got the bike it was much easier to find BIG tires for 26inch wheels...650b wasn't that popular back then Angus -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: 26 inch wheels
My three custom Riv Roads have been made for 559 or 571 wheels (no, I'm not short; I ride a 58 to 60) and they are by far the fastest bikes I've ridden.The light wheels are amazingly different when accelerating and climbing, at least compared to my heavy (24 mm Alex DH rims, 32 X 14 g spokes, 30 mm IRC Tandem tires, which aren't bad) 622 wheels. The 559 wheels weighed about 1525 grams the pair when they had Ultegra hubs on them.On the flats I expect they don't maintain speed as well, because when riding fixed -- all my road bikes are fixed -- they don't have that flywheel feel like the much heavier 700c wheels; but they are certainly faster overall. Of course, very many variables are involved beside wheel size, tire quality being the most important, so I read. The fatter tires for 559 are, unfortunately, all heavier, stiffer and slower, even the 1.25 Pasela, than good road tires like the 559 Turbos or 571 Conti GPs I use. FWIW, years ago I had a '92 XO-1 set up as a light 14 speed gofast (Sampson drop bar gripshifts! Sampson Stratics pedals! Purple 360 gram Sun rims! 22 mm Turbos!) and it was certainly very fast -- I did my lifelong PB on it -- (don't snicker) of 30 miles at 20 mph clock running, from my parents' house in RR down 528 to Bernalillo and back via 2nd street and back up the 528 hill, averaging 21 until the hill slowed me down. Headwind on way back, too. 1994, age 39. Again: say it loud: We want a racing quality 559 X 28, and we want it NOW! On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 6:11 PM, rcnute rcn...@hotmail.com wrote: Based on my experiences with the LHT, XO-1 and Atlantis, 26 wheels are great for everything except fast road riding. Fat or skinny, it always felt like extra work. For me 650b is the perfect compromise. Ryan On Feb 3, 4:39 pm, Angus angusle...@sbcglobal.net wrote: The TCO discussion appears to be morphing into a 26 inch wheel discussion. My 59cm All-Rounder has 26inch wheels. I have received a grand total of two comments about the wheels size during the 12 years I have owned the bike. One was what's with the small wheels? the second (apparently not realizing the wheels were small) said Wow, I've never seen a frame that big! He seemed so excited about the frame size I didn't have the heart to correct him. When I got the bike it was much easier to find BIG tires for 26inch wheels...650b wasn't that popular back then Angus -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comrbw-owners-bunch%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com (505) 227-0523 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: TCO in general..
On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 5:24 PM, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: I can't imagine why they'd care [about 26 wheels -- ed.]. Can you even see that the wheels are unusual? I've only really ever seen one Riv All-Arounder, I think a 58 cm, and it looks perfectly ordinary with nothing particular to note about the wheels other than some pretty fat looking tires. What do they say? And what do you say in return? FWIW, the most common comment I get, usually from full-lycra/crabon roadies, is nice bike or, even, most recently, Beautiful bike! The other one is, How old is it? I say, Hmmm, let's see -- delivered in March of '03 or I had it made in 1999, and that surprises them. Few have even noticed or remarked at the small wheels. -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com (505) 227-0523 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Carradice FS
Slightly Used Nelson LF saddle abg in black. Slight stitching tear at one of the leather straps on the flap, can be easily repaired with heavy-duty thread. $80.00 shipped in conus. Please reply offlist. Thanks . http://bikelovejones.livejournal.com http://veloquent.blogspot.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] FS: Nigel Smythe bag
Photos here: http://picasaweb.google.com/BERTIN753/ForSale03# It has one from-the-factory flaw (I paid full price for the bag; it is was not sold as a second): the leather binding on the right (facing back of bag) seam stopped about 3 cm short of the edge, and one from-me flaw, that the fabric was crudely bound with black button thread. You can easily repair my repair. $135 shipped CONUS. -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com (505) 227-0523 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: FS: Nigel Smythe bag
I forgot to mention: one, you needn't take the BVM medallion and, two, will take a nice Banana bag or croissant bag or Keven's bag or something similar in part trade. Speaking of bags: just got a shop demo tube bag prototype from Jim at Hiawatha; not of the excessive Smythe quality but decent and a very useful size: it fits a minipump. Now on the gofast. On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 7:14 PM, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote: Photos here: http://picasaweb.google.com/BERTIN753/ForSale03# It has one from-the-factory flaw (I paid full price for the bag; it is was not sold as a second): the leather binding on the right (facing back of bag) seam stopped about 3 cm short of the edge, and one from-me flaw, that the fabric was crudely bound with black button thread. You can easily repair my repair. $135 shipped CONUS. -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com (505) 227-0523 -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com (505) 227-0523 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 26 inch wheels
I think spending a lot of time on a particular wheel size, and riding with people who also ride that wheel size, makes you sort of xenophobic torwards other sizes. Having spent most of my bicycling miles on 20 wheels, I can say that _well_ into adulthood 'big' wheel bikes looked strange to me.That included anything from 24 upward. After getting over that, I certainly have no aversion to 26 wheels. I am totally sold on the 650b size, the way it works on the bombadil. Maybe a 26 wheeled bike in sizes larger than 59cm doesn't make sense structurally, but if there was a double top-tube on a 26 wheel bike in a larger size (to keep the frame well triangulated as Grant Petersen pointed out), I'd ride it in a second. I think people who avoid 26 wheels because they look funny are probably just afraid to break from the herd.And as for being significantly 'slower', I'd need some pretty compelling empirical data on that to believe it. On the other hand, I can readily believe that a smaller wheel can be quicker in terms of acceleration, as well as handling/ maneuverability. It's crazy that in the bicycling enthusiast community, where people obsess over the advantages of one-degree headtube-angle differences, or 1cm top-tube-length changes, or you-name-the-tiny-geometrical- change alterations for their custom frame, the same group of enthusiasts can get all freaked-out when someone like Grant Petersen comes along and tries to address a relatively huge 2.5 gap in wheel sizes with the re-ntroduction of 650b, and the suggestion of a size like 603. I know 603 hasn't been product-ized, but I kind of wish it was, just because if frame geometry variations are necessary in such small increments, it only makes sense to have wheel-sizes available in small increments as well. On Feb 3, 7:39 pm, Angus angusle...@sbcglobal.net wrote: The TCO discussion appears to be morphing into a 26 inch wheel discussion. My 59cm All-Rounder has 26inch wheels. I have received a grand total of two comments about the wheels size during the 12 years I have owned the bike. One was what's with the small wheels? the second (apparently not realizing the wheels were small) said Wow, I've never seen a frame that big! He seemed so excited about the frame size I didn't have the heart to correct him. When I got the bike it was much easier to find BIG tires for 26inch wheels...650b wasn't that popular back then AnguI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 26 inch wheels
Human nature can be baffling sometimes. One thing that never ceases to amaze me about bikes is the endless variations designers and builders can derive from what is in essence a very simple machine. Rather than break bad on some one's bike for being different seems someone into bikes would want to check out how the whole thing comes together. It may be the bike would not work for you at all. But it is still interesting to see another approach to what you take for granted. On Feb 3, 8:21 pm, newenglandbike matthiasbe...@gmail.com wrote: I think spending a lot of time on a particular wheel size, and riding with people who also ride that wheel size, makes you sort of xenophobic torwards other sizes. Having spent most of my bicycling miles on 20 wheels, I can say that _well_ into adulthood 'big' wheel bikes looked strange to me. That included anything from 24 upward. After getting over that, I certainly have no aversion to 26 wheels. I am totally sold on the 650b size, the way it works on the bombadil. Maybe a 26 wheeled bike in sizes larger than 59cm doesn't make sense structurally, but if there was a double top-tube on a 26 wheel bike in a larger size (to keep the frame well triangulated as Grant Petersen pointed out), I'd ride it in a second. I think people who avoid 26 wheels because they look funny are probably just afraid to break from the herd. And as for being significantly 'slower', I'd need some pretty compelling empirical data on that to believe it. On the other hand, I can readily believe that a smaller wheel can be quicker in terms of acceleration, as well as handling/ maneuverability. It's crazy that in the bicycling enthusiast community, where people obsess over the advantages of one-degree headtube-angle differences, or 1cm top-tube-length changes, or you-name-the-tiny-geometrical- change alterations for their custom frame, the same group of enthusiasts can get all freaked-out when someone like Grant Petersen comes along and tries to address a relatively huge 2.5 gap in wheel sizes with the re-ntroduction of 650b, and the suggestion of a size like 603. I know 603 hasn't been product-ized, but I kind of wish it was, just because if frame geometry variations are necessary in such small increments, it only makes sense to have wheel-sizes available in small increments as well. On Feb 3, 7:39 pm, Angus angusle...@sbcglobal.net wrote: The TCO discussion appears to be morphing into a 26 inch wheel discussion. My 59cm All-Rounder has 26inch wheels. I have received a grand total of two comments about the wheels size during the 12 years I have owned the bike. One was what's with the small wheels? the second (apparently not realizing the wheels were small) said Wow, I've never seen a frame that big! He seemed so excited about the frame size I didn't have the heart to correct him. When I got the bike it was much easier to find BIG tires for 26inch wheels...650b wasn't that popular back then AnguI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 26 inch wheels
After much consideration, a lot of dissatisfaction and grousing, and trying many, many tires on my 26 wheels, I found that Primo 26 x 1.0 and Pasela 26 x 1.25 at 100 psi are every bit as fast as any 700C road tire I have used. The Primos (spelled PR1MO on the sidewall) are too hard to find and too fragile, getting lots of flats, casing cuts and lasting only about 1500 miles on the rear. I ride the Paselas now. Good tires and cheap- bonus! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: TCO in general..
On Feb 3, 2010, at 6:24 PM, Steve Palincsar wrote: On Wed, 2010-02-03 at 18:17 -0600, Tim McNamara wrote: On Feb 3, 2010, at 12:54 PM, JoelMatthews wrote: Did not realize people were so hostile to 26. I will soon receive a custom that is built around 26 wheels - at just under 6', I guess you could call my bikes either larger or average. I did not spec 26 because of some TCO concern. Rather, I wanted to have a bike that could use the biggest Big Apples without putting my head up in sub- space. I get flak about it sometimes when I am out riding my All-Rounder with 26 wheels. I can't imagine why they'd care. Can you even see that the wheels are unusual? I've only really ever seen one Riv All-Arounder, I think a 58 cm, and it looks perfectly ordinary with nothing particular to note about the wheels other than some pretty fat looking tires. What do they say? And what do you say in return? Jeez, what's with the little wheels? Aren't those wheels awfully slow? Small wheels have higher rolling resistance. Etc. I tell them this wheel is 14 years old and I've never had to true it. Then I pass them going down the next hill. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: 26 inch wheels
Who makes the Primo? -- Not that it really matters, practically, as I have all of Ryan Watson's 26X1 Turbos in my stash. The Pasela certainly is light at 240 gr for the kevlar beaded model -- only 40-50 gr more than the skinnies -- but IME -- and I used it long -- it's not as easy rolling as the 1 Turbo or 1 Conti GP and in my use they were very flat prone -- more so than the Turbos and GPs, make of that what you will. AND they are very sensitive to pressure: at 90 psi they are like rocks (I'm 170) and at 70 they sag -- tho' I use very narrow rims, 19-20 mm wide. The Turbos and the GPs get hardly more flats, if any more at all, than the 30 mm and much heavier 622 IRC tandems on the Motobecane. I just got 1,700 out of a rear Turbo (on the commuter, where I carry loads a lot) and it still wasn't flatting tho' the tread was very thin; I replaced it pro-actively; and I've gotten over 3,000 out of a *rear* 571 GP, on the gofast. My question is: why do I get all my flats on the front, by a factor of at least 3 to 1? Again: gimme a top quality 559 28. (If I say it enough times maybe someone will do it.) On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 9:26 PM, Tim McNamara tim...@bitstream.net wrote: After much consideration, a lot of dissatisfaction and grousing, and trying many, many tires on my 26 wheels, I found that Primo 26 x 1.0 and Pasela 26 x 1.25 at 100 psi are every bit as fast as any 700C road tire I have used. The Primos (spelled PR1MO on the sidewall) are too hard to find and too fragile, getting lots of flats, casing cuts and lasting only about 1500 miles on the rear. I ride the Paselas now. Good tires and cheap- bonus! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.comrbw-owners-bunch%2bunsubscr...@googlegroups.com . For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com (505) 227-0523 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 26 inch wheels
On Feb 3, 8:26 pm, Tim McNamara tim...@bitstream.net wrote: After much consideration... [snip], I found that Primo 26 x 1.0 and Pasela 26 x 1.25 at 100 psi are every bit as fast as any 700C road tire I have used...[snip] I ride the Paselas now. Good tires and cheap-bonus! * Agreed. I often get asked if my All-Rounder isn't too small for me. It is, a little, but the top tube is perfect and if there's just a tad more seatpost and stem showing than the purists may like that's no big deal. The Paselas are an excellent road-y tire for the money and the ride is more than satisfactory for my day-rides out in the country -- but the tire is plenty durable for city commuting as well. Anyone out there try the Soma Everwear in 559? Just curious. Beth -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
