Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[TOM7601]

keith_w wrote:

David E. Ross wrote:

On 2/21/2009 8:51 AM, Ray_Net wrote:
 > > David E. Ross wrote:
 >> >> On 2/14/2009 7:22 AM, Ray K wrote:

 >>> >>> If I go here,
 >>> >>>
 >>> >>> 
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx, 


 >>> >>>
 >>> >>> or to many other pages of the above site, vertical scrolling is 
strange,

 >>> >>> whether dragging the scrolling bar or using the mouse wheel.
 >>> >>>
 >>> >>> Using the wheel as an example, and scrolling from top to 
bottom, the
 >>> >>> right 2/3 or so of the screen scrolls upward ahead of the left 
1/3, with
 >>> >>> the left portion about one-half a line behind the right. Once 
the right
 >>> >>> 2/3 stops scrolling, the left 1/3 catches up (in less than a 
second) and
 >>> >>> everything looks okay. Same situation exists scrolling the 
other way:

 >>> >>> the left 1/3 lags a fraction of a line for a fraction of a second.
 >>> >>>
 >>> >>> I haven't observed this behavior at other sites; it does not 
occur using

 >>> >>> Internet Explorer.
 >>> >>>
 >>> >>> Any idea about the cause of this odd annoyance? Are there internal
 >>> >>> settings in SM I can change to correct it?
 >>> >>>
 >>> >>> Thanks,
 >>> >>>
 >>> >>> Ray




As I said in another thread, IE is programmed to "guess" what a Web
developer meant when invalid HTML was used.  Mozilla's Gecko engine and
other browsers do the same thing.

The problem is that different browsers guess differently.  Thus, the
results in IE and SeaMonkey will likely not be the same when trying to
display a pathological Web page.  If the invalid HTML is sufficiently
buggy, one browser might (by unplanned coincidence) guess correctly
while another will just display garbage.


This happen when the website developper use only a microsoft tool to 
create the site, and use only IE to check his pages...if all goes 
well, he think that it's the case for all the world.



According to various surveys (including my own), IE's share of the
browser market has declined to 45%-60%.  This is down as much as 44%
since a peak in March 2003.  (Gecko browsers now hold 33%-46% of the
market.)

Any developer who creates a Web site "best viewed with Internet
Explorer" has tied his or her fate to a fading star and is ignoring half
the potential audience.


You and I know that. It seems some sites are way too casual about changing.
It really seems they don't take the 'net seriously enough!
This is not some fad, a whim on the part of computer geeks!  This is the 
future, and it's time they allowed their IT guys freer reign, to make 
their internet sites more sophisticated!


And capable of working with SeaMonkey, of course!  :-D

keith whaley


And pay their people what they're really worth!!!
--
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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[keith_w]

David E. Ross wrote:

On 2/21/2009 8:51 AM, Ray_Net wrote:
> > David E. Ross wrote:
>> >> On 2/14/2009 7:22 AM, Ray K wrote:

>>> >>> If I go here,
>>> >>>
>>> >>> 
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx,

>>> >>>
>>> >>> or to many other pages of the above site, vertical scrolling is strange,
>>> >>> whether dragging the scrolling bar or using the mouse wheel.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Using the wheel as an example, and scrolling from top to bottom, the
>>> >>> right 2/3 or so of the screen scrolls upward ahead of the left 1/3, with
>>> >>> the left portion about one-half a line behind the right. Once the right
>>> >>> 2/3 stops scrolling, the left 1/3 catches up (in less than a second) and
>>> >>> everything looks okay. Same situation exists scrolling the other way:
>>> >>> the left 1/3 lags a fraction of a line for a fraction of a second.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> I haven't observed this behavior at other sites; it does not occur using
>>> >>> Internet Explorer.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Any idea about the cause of this odd annoyance? Are there internal
>>> >>> settings in SM I can change to correct it?
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Thanks,
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Ray




As I said in another thread, IE is programmed to "guess" what a Web
developer meant when invalid HTML was used.  Mozilla's Gecko engine and
other browsers do the same thing.

The problem is that different browsers guess differently.  Thus, the
results in IE and SeaMonkey will likely not be the same when trying to
display a pathological Web page.  If the invalid HTML is sufficiently
buggy, one browser might (by unplanned coincidence) guess correctly
while another will just display garbage.


This happen when the website developper use only a microsoft tool to 
create the site, and use only IE to check his pages...if all goes well, 
he think that it's the case for all the world.



According to various surveys (including my own), IE's share of the
browser market has declined to 45%-60%.  This is down as much as 44%
since a peak in March 2003.  (Gecko browsers now hold 33%-46% of the
market.)

Any developer who creates a Web site "best viewed with Internet
Explorer" has tied his or her fate to a fading star and is ignoring half
the potential audience.


You and I know that. It seems some sites are way too casual about changing.
It really seems they don't take the 'net seriously enough!
This is not some fad, a whim on the part of computer geeks!  This is the future, 
and it's time they allowed their IT guys freer reign, to make their internet 
sites more sophisticated!


And capable of working with SeaMonkey, of course!  :-D

keith whaley

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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[David E. Ross]

On 2/21/2009 8:51 AM, Ray_Net wrote:
> David E. Ross wrote:
>> On 2/14/2009 7:22 AM, Ray K wrote:
>>> If I go here,
>>>
>>> http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx,
>>>
>>> or to many other pages of the above site, vertical scrolling is strange, 
>>> whether dragging the scrolling bar or using the mouse wheel.
>>>
>>> Using the wheel as an example, and scrolling from top to bottom, the 
>>> right 2/3 or so of the screen scrolls upward ahead of the left 1/3, with 
>>> the left portion about one-half a line behind the right. Once the right 
>>> 2/3 stops scrolling, the left 1/3 catches up (in less than a second) and 
>>> everything looks okay. Same situation exists scrolling the other way: 
>>> the left 1/3 lags a fraction of a line for a fraction of a second.
>>>
>>> I haven't observed this behavior at other sites; it does not occur using 
>>> Internet Explorer.
>>>
>>> Any idea about the cause of this odd annoyance? Are there internal 
>>> settings in SM I can change to correct it?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> Ray
>>>
>>>
>> As I said in another thread, IE is programmed to "guess" what a Web
>> developer meant when invalid HTML was used.  Mozilla's Gecko engine and
>> other browsers do the same thing.
>>
>> The problem is that different browsers guess differently.  Thus, the
>> results in IE and SeaMonkey will likely not be the same when trying to
>> display a pathological Web page.  If the invalid HTML is sufficiently
>> buggy, one browser might (by unplanned coincidence) guess correctly
>> while another will just display garbage.
>>
> This happen when the website developper use only a microsoft tool to 
> create the site, and use only IE to check his pages...if all goes well, 
> he think that it's the case for all the world.

According to various surveys (including my own), IE's share of the
browser market has declined to 45%-60%.  This is down as much as 44%
since a peak in March 2003.  (Gecko browsers now hold 33%-46% of the
market.)

Any developer who creates a Web site "best viewed with Internet
Explorer" has tied his or her fate to a fading star and is ignoring half
the potential audience.

-- 
David E. Ross


Go to Mozdev at  for quick access to
extensions for Firefox, Thunderbird, SeaMonkey, and other
Mozilla-related applications.  You can access Mozdev much
more quickly than you can Mozilla Add-Ons.
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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[Ray_Net]

David E. Ross wrote:

On 2/14/2009 7:22 AM, Ray K wrote:

If I go here,

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx,

or to many other pages of the above site, vertical scrolling is strange, 
whether dragging the scrolling bar or using the mouse wheel.


Using the wheel as an example, and scrolling from top to bottom, the 
right 2/3 or so of the screen scrolls upward ahead of the left 1/3, with 
the left portion about one-half a line behind the right. Once the right 
2/3 stops scrolling, the left 1/3 catches up (in less than a second) and 
everything looks okay. Same situation exists scrolling the other way: 
the left 1/3 lags a fraction of a line for a fraction of a second.


I haven't observed this behavior at other sites; it does not occur using 
Internet Explorer.


Any idea about the cause of this odd annoyance? Are there internal 
settings in SM I can change to correct it?


Thanks,

Ray




As I said in another thread, IE is programmed to "guess" what a Web
developer meant when invalid HTML was used.  Mozilla's Gecko engine and
other browsers do the same thing.

The problem is that different browsers guess differently.  Thus, the
results in IE and SeaMonkey will likely not be the same when trying to
display a pathological Web page.  If the invalid HTML is sufficiently
buggy, one browser might (by unplanned coincidence) guess correctly
while another will just display garbage.

This happen when the website developper use only a microsoft tool to 
create the site, and use only IE to check his pages...if all goes well, 
he think that it's the case for all the world.

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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[David E. Ross]

On 2/14/2009 7:22 AM, Ray K wrote:
> If I go here,
> 
> http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx,
> 
> or to many other pages of the above site, vertical scrolling is strange, 
> whether dragging the scrolling bar or using the mouse wheel.
> 
> Using the wheel as an example, and scrolling from top to bottom, the 
> right 2/3 or so of the screen scrolls upward ahead of the left 1/3, with 
> the left portion about one-half a line behind the right. Once the right 
> 2/3 stops scrolling, the left 1/3 catches up (in less than a second) and 
> everything looks okay. Same situation exists scrolling the other way: 
> the left 1/3 lags a fraction of a line for a fraction of a second.
> 
> I haven't observed this behavior at other sites; it does not occur using 
> Internet Explorer.
> 
> Any idea about the cause of this odd annoyance? Are there internal 
> settings in SM I can change to correct it?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Ray
> 
> 

As I said in another thread, IE is programmed to "guess" what a Web
developer meant when invalid HTML was used.  Mozilla's Gecko engine and
other browsers do the same thing.

The problem is that different browsers guess differently.  Thus, the
results in IE and SeaMonkey will likely not be the same when trying to
display a pathological Web page.  If the invalid HTML is sufficiently
buggy, one browser might (by unplanned coincidence) guess correctly
while another will just display garbage.

-- 

David E. Ross
.

Don't ask "Why is there road rage?"  Instead, ask
"Why NOT Road Rage?" or "Why Is There No Such
Thing as Fast Enough?"

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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[JeffM]

>Arne wrote:
>>That site is a disaster! The page the given url goes to:
>>Has Total HTTP Requests: 301
>>Total Size is: 1012882 bytes
>>and has 1040(!) Errors, 24 warning(s)
>>
>>All that and the fact it is aspx makes it a nightmare and probably cause
>>the described effect when scrolling. It's wonder it works at all! ;)
>>
Ray K wrote:
>Odd you are having all those problems.
>My only problem with the site was the scrolling annoyance.

"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"

As Arne noted, he ran the page's HTML thru
the mechanism that checks the quality of the work put into the page.
(Imagine your English teacher correcting your term paper.)
The page came back with over 1000 red marks on it.
You can do the test yourself; click this link:
http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx

A single page that has that much junk crammed into it
http://google.com/search?q=site:mercola.com+intitle:Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes+-inurl:blogs
(977kB) is another indication that the webmaster there
has no clue what he is doing.

The problem with Web authoring tools
is that they hide the details from the clueless people who use them
--who then blindly accept the junky HTML they produce
and don't know how to check the quality of the output of their tools
(or don't care that they are producing crap).
Mostly these are people who have drunk the Windoze Kool-Aid.
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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[Arne]

Ray K wrote:

Arne wrote:



That site is a disaster! The page the given url goes to:

Has Total HTTP Requests: 301
Total Size is: 1012882 bytes
and has 1040(!) Errors, 24 warning(s)

All that and the fact it is aspx makes it a nightmare and probably 
cause the described effect when scrolling. It's wonder it works at 
all! ;)


Odd you are having all those problems. My only problem with the site was 
the scrolling annoyance.


I don't have "problems" other than the same as you have. I just 
pointed out what probably cause the problem, e.g. a lot (but not all) 
of the 1040 errors in the HTML code. But also a page with 1 Mb of code 
and content can make it hard to scroll smoothly.

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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[Ray K]

Arne wrote:



That site is a disaster! The page the given url goes to:

Has Total HTTP Requests: 301
Total Size is: 1012882 bytes
and has 1040(!) Errors, 24 warning(s)

All that and the fact it is aspx makes it a nightmare and probably cause 
the described effect when scrolling. It's wonder it works at all! ;)


Odd you are having all those problems. My only problem with the site was 
the scrolling annoyance.


Ray

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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[JeffM]

Ray K wrote:
>If I go here,
>http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx,
>or to many other pages of the above site, vertical scrolling is strange,
>whether dragging the scrolling bar or using the mouse wheel.
>
As Arne pointed out, the page is a steaming pile.
http://validator.w3.org/check?uri=http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx
It was constructed by a moron.

As Michael pointed out, the tool that was used was also garbage.
The moron using it also wasn't aware that
Web pages need to be validated against the W3C standard.

>I haven't observed this behavior at other sites;
>
Bookmark this link and next time you have a problem with a page,
feed its URL into the WorldWide Web Consortium's HTML Validator:
http://validator.w3.org

>it does not occur using Internet Explorer.
>
"IE Shines On Broken Code"
http://google.com/search?q=cache:7-myeaT_Ew4J:it.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/10/19/0236213+IE.Shines.On.Broken.Code+rss+IE.was.dynamically.rewriting.my.JavaScript.replacing.the.incorrect.delimiters.with.the.correct.ones#10563498
http://groups.google.com/group/mozilla.support.seamonkey/browse_frm/thread/5433c73b8b814610/bab28202f8f2981f?q=zz-zz+slashdot-*+IE-Shines-On-Broken-Code+guesses

>Any idea about the cause of this odd annoyance?
>
Incompetent webmasters/developers.
(Just as you did, they use M$'s broken browser
to look at their garbage work and say "That works"
--when it is, in fact, a total mess.)

Professional Web developers despise Microsoft's software:
http://google.com/search?q=cache:1WVAWYE4mFQJ:linux.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/01/27/008227+*.*-formed-*+*.*-*-*-*-work-in-all-*-*+*-*.*-*-*-time-*-*-to-*-*-*-*-*-*-implement-*-*+*-*-PITA-*-*-*+*-*-costs-*-*-a-ton-*-*+*-*-painful-*+*-standards-compliant-browsers+*-*-*-get-your-site+*-*-works-in-one-*+*-render-*-in-IE+elegant+*-*-*-renders-properly-*-*-*-*+*-*.*-*.*-*.*-etc+mangle#26617861

>Are there internal settings in SM I can change to correct it?
>
The problem is NOT at *your* end.
Your standards-compliant browser isn't the problem.
Ignorant/lazy people using bad (M$ ?) tools are the problem.
http://google.com/search?q=cache:74WFzGYogbYJ:www.mozilla.org/projects/tech-evangelism/+there-is-more-than-one-browser-*-*-*+Learn.more+a.free.and.open.web+*-bottom-line+*-*-*-*-*-have-problems-*-*-*+*-modified+*-*-not-controlled-by-a-few+via+upgrade+CVS+Complaining-*-*-*+Page+standards.based
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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[Arne]

Michael Gordon wrote:

Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo replied On 2/14/2009 12:07 PM


Ray K wrote:

If I go here,

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx, 



or to many other pages of the above site, vertical scrolling is 
strange, whether dragging the scrolling bar or using the mouse wheel.


Using the wheel as an example, and scrolling from top to bottom, the 
right 2/3 or so of the screen scrolls upward ahead of the left 1/3, 
with the left portion about one-half a line behind the right. Once 
the right 2/3 stops scrolling, the left 1/3 catches up (in less than 
a second) and everything looks okay. Same situation exists scrolling 
the other way: the left 1/3 lags a fraction of a line for a fraction 
of a second.


I haven't observed this behavior at other sites; it does not occur 
using Internet Explorer.


Any idea about the cause of this odd annoyance? Are there internal 
settings in SM I can change to correct it?


Thanks,

Ray




nope, I see nothing wrong.  I get the same thing in SM 1.1.14 as I do 
in opera, FF3, Safari, and IE7.


What happens in a test profile?



Peter,

It happens here on my SeaMonkey as well.

It's not a profile thing, its a web page thing.

It most likely is caused by the .aspx application that made the page in 
the first place.  It is like the browser cannot render the whole page at 
one instant, but renders only that which is shown in the open window on 
the monitor.


The effect here is after the screen is fully displayed, note the large 
blocks of text, then using the mouse and the vertical scroll handle 
scroll down while watching the text render into new vertical positions 
on the monitor.


The lines of text become 1/2 line offset as the page moves up.

Michael


That site is a disaster! The page the given url goes to:

Has Total HTTP Requests: 301
Total Size is: 1012882 bytes
and has 1040(!) Errors, 24 warning(s)

All that and the fact it is aspx makes it a nightmare and probably 
cause the described effect when scrolling. It's wonder it works at all! ;)

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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[Michael Gordon]

Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo replied On 2/14/2009 12:07 PM


Ray K wrote:

If I go here,

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx, 



or to many other pages of the above site, vertical scrolling is strange, 
whether dragging the scrolling bar or using the mouse wheel.


Using the wheel as an example, and scrolling from top to bottom, the 
right 2/3 or so of the screen scrolls upward ahead of the left 1/3, with 
the left portion about one-half a line behind the right. Once the right 
2/3 stops scrolling, the left 1/3 catches up (in less than a second) and 
everything looks okay. Same situation exists scrolling the other way: 
the left 1/3 lags a fraction of a line for a fraction of a second.


I haven't observed this behavior at other sites; it does not occur using 
Internet Explorer.


Any idea about the cause of this odd annoyance? Are there internal 
settings in SM I can change to correct it?


Thanks,

Ray




nope, I see nothing wrong.  I get the same thing in SM 
1.1.14 as I do in opera, FF3, Safari, and IE7.


What happens in a test profile?



Peter,

It happens here on my SeaMonkey as well.

It's not a profile thing, its a web page thing.

It most likely is caused by the .aspx application that made the page in 
the first place.  It is like the browser cannot render the whole page at 
one instant, but renders only that which is shown in the open window on 
the monitor.


The effect here is after the screen is fully displayed, note the large 
blocks of text, then using the mouse and the vertical scroll handle 
scroll down while watching the text render into new vertical positions 
on the monitor.


The lines of text become 1/2 line offset as the page moves up.

Michael
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Re: Strange scrolling problem at some sites

[Peter Potamus the Purple Hippo]

Ray K wrote:

If I go here,

http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2009/02/14/A-Possible-Cure-for-Diabetes-Ignored-by-Big-Pharma.aspx, 



or to many other pages of the above site, vertical scrolling is strange, 
whether dragging the scrolling bar or using the mouse wheel.


Using the wheel as an example, and scrolling from top to bottom, the 
right 2/3 or so of the screen scrolls upward ahead of the left 1/3, with 
the left portion about one-half a line behind the right. Once the right 
2/3 stops scrolling, the left 1/3 catches up (in less than a second) and 
everything looks okay. Same situation exists scrolling the other way: 
the left 1/3 lags a fraction of a line for a fraction of a second.


I haven't observed this behavior at other sites; it does not occur using 
Internet Explorer.


Any idea about the cause of this odd annoyance? Are there internal 
settings in SM I can change to correct it?


Thanks,

Ray




nope, I see nothing wrong.  I get the same thing in SM 
1.1.14 as I do in opera, FF3, Safari, and IE7.


What happens in a test profile?

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