s blend ZIP codes and census boundaries, you'd muddy a lot of water by
using ZCTAs, especially as you use OSM data.
I, too, (like Clifford) wish you good luck and hope you have fruitful results
you might share with us here at the completion of your project.
SteveA
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uters, one-to-many inners (inholdings) and both tags on the multipolygon
itself (protect_class=6, operator=USFS, protection_title=National Forest...)
AND tags on the individual inner members which are different (operator=BLM, for
example). I've understood this and tagged like this for many years (an
nd owned by the People, and managed for us properly, under
law, BY our federal employees, the USFS."
I retreat to more of a "watching mode" to see if more discussion shakes out of
this. Again, it is fascinating.
SteveA
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USFS may or might "have influence to someday manage."
If we ignore 3) as "not real, but rather aspirational or in the future rather
than the present, and certainly not on-the-ground" then an OSM multipolygon
consists of simply 1) plus 2).
Yes?
SteveA
My apologies (it was my error): the correct link to Chuck's post is
https://wiki.osm.org/wiki/Talk:OpenRailwayMap/Tagging_in_North_America
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I am finding quite a few of these with
quite-poorly tagged boundaries. Surely, OSM can do better than this, but Tod
asks an excellent question: "with what tags, please?"
SteveA
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tion / standardization can happen later. This
seems a workable approach, though I'd like to hear from others who might posit
that a "no, let's globalize such tagging immediately" approach is better.
SteveA
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is in both our tagging and in
our wiki, and again, quite extensively.
SteveA
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It is absolutely fascinating (to me, anyway) to watch this conversation!
I thanked Russ Nelson on wiki for his comments at New York/Railroads. (And we
still have a ways to go there).
SteveA
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https
offer "status reporting"
with color-coded tables.
I am bowled over that Nathan Proudfoot says "Researchers utilize OSM as we have
the most up to date railway map in the country of any data source...". Wow!
Go OSM,
SteveA
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two sides
and I'm not sure which is more important: convenience or accuracy. I lean
towards accuracy, that is simply me (and my nature). Others are welcome to
disagree, which means some discussion must continue. Honestly, I think the
discussion is productive, provided we remain civil, and w
hime in to the
Talk page if this matters to you. Thanks!
SteveA
California
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My apologies: the correct link is:
https://wiki.osm.org/wiki/Talk:OpenRailwayMap/Tagging_in_North_America
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ot; vs. "potential landuse," (does
take place vs. can or might take place) where some say to "tag only what is
actual." Others see this approach as a removal of land rights, further
muddying what OSM means by landuse.
These issues truly are complicated,
treetMap is valueable because it
> provides local knowledge of what is really there.
The "land, as it is being used, residentially" (denoted in OSM as
landuse=residential) is really there, so I do.
SteveA
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now map and perhaps might map with tags we
agree are more accurate (or not). The topics are rich and complex, indeed.
SteveA
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nversation. But what else would we call "the
remainder of land which is used for residential purposes which does not
strictly contain the footprint of a building (hut, apartment, tent, hogan, mud
daub dwelling)?" Something other than residential? It is residential!
SteveA
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as rendering support, or lack
thereof, for various values of protect_class), it is possible I lack full
clarity into either the present exception of or intended effects of these tags
and the Carto renderer. Here, I only offer my best explanation of present
tag
thank Taylor for his quick reply
to my request for state-issued county boundary data: I appreciate the pointer.
SteveA
California
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ow it was previously though
incorrectly tagged."
SteveA
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If any Colorado or Rocky Mountain area mappers know where data may be acquired
to fix some missing segments in the boundary of Clear Creek County
(relation/442310), I ask that they either be pointed to or that those data
please be repaired.
SteveA
rstanding.
As the issue seems to be "at the highest zoom levels" (where I assume it wasn't
before), I defer to the authors of the renderer code to determine what the root
cause may be.
SteveA
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(Answered off-list).
SteveA
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Please tag boundary=census on census tracts. These are distinct from
boundary=administrative + admin_level=8 (for city or town boundaries, at least
in California). See United States/admin_level for what works out to be all
fifty states and six "other things" like Territories and
Hi, it's stevea from California. Some of us in the USA are crafting a proposal
(https://wiki.osm.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Park_boundary), may be two or
three staged proposals, intended to better express the wide inclusive semantic
"we" (OSM-wide, but including US English-spea
Not muddy at all, your clarifications are excellent. Much obliged, mate!
SteveA
On Oct 22, 2020, at 6:25 PM, Greg Lauer wrote:
> Good question
>
> To be clear I am a Kiwi (New Zealand) who lives in Australia (and has spent
> many years in the US) so my interpretation may be slig
On Jun 17, 2021, at 2:14 AM, Andrew Harvey via Talk-au
wrote:
> It's a fair point that Vicmap's own postcode field shouldn't be taken as 100%
> correct, it looks like it might have been assigned based on postcode
> boundaries so might still suffer issues because of this, but where
>
On Jun 17, 2021, at 2:14 AM, Andrew Harvey via Talk-au
wrote:
>> It's a fair point that Vicmap's own postcode field shouldn't be taken as
>> 100% correct, it looks like it might have been assigned based on postcode
>> boundaries so might still suffer issues because of this, but where
>>
I know (I know), I’m talking to the Australia list and I’m in the USA
(California). I have friends from Oz, but I’ve never been (I’d love to visit
as a tourist, it’s on my bucket list).
In the USA, the USPS (postal service) uses five-digit “ZIP” codes (Zone, digit
1; Improvement, digits 2 and
Very nice work, Mike King. Thank you.
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No reason to get harsh. OSM has historically, does now and will into the
future map abandoned rail. OHM is an interesting project, but it isn't OSM.
It is neither harmful nor incorrect to "continue to include" a tag of
railway=abandoned on a railway which is abandoned. It is a simple
Looks like a fantastic resource, Graeme. Great work!
SteveA
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ot;loose places" where we
might compromise security) by cute people with tasty-looking pectoral muscles
or polka-dot bikinis.
Or both.
Glad to see the DWG "raises an eyebrow of suspicion" when we mortals on the
ground "raise an eyebrow of suspicion." It's good.
Carefu
onkers." I wish you the best in your efforts to enter high-quality,
"fresh" data!
SteveA
[1] https://maproulette.org
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To be clear, Ian, I'm not saying this use of data is an import, as you have
said and as it appears to me and others, it is / would be using the data as a
"filtering process" in a workflow. As such, I'm good with that.
The points I was making are that 1) data drift over time and 2) there are
"Orthorectification" is the cartographic process here. This means "stretching" an image to remove distortion so it will match (or closely match given mathematical constraints) the spatial accuracy of a given map (like OSM's data) so that a close-enough match between the image and the existing map
Apologies to any / all who got my missive twice. (Mailserver glitch on my end).
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Apologies to any / all who got my missive twice. (Mailserver glitch on my end).
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Getting a MapRoulette dataset (.json, perhaps) just right can be challenging,
at least it was for me after I got the knack of these. For a while, I
struggled with some "around" syntax in OT to garden my data more nicely. Even
before that, the "rough cut" I started with bore a lot of fruit (it
A challenge (with MapRoulette) is in correctly writing the query to return the
"proper" dataset. Once you do, it's great!
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On Oct 12, 2021, at 11:08 PM, Adam Horan wrote:
> Is this something that could be pushed to maproulette? Not as reversions, but
> tasks to validate or update OSM entries that match a pattern - eg edited by
> this user and now has bicycle=no, highway=footway etc?
I don’t want to say “absolute
answer any
more email ping-pongs.
I had all primed my next email how to install a reverter, but didn't send that
because it seems he remained in a low gear, and running a JOSM reverter is for
those who are, um, "in a higher gear."
Good luck getting your data in shape, there, m
Sebastian, I'd be willing to help you off-list get your (alas, Intel-based
only) macOS running JOSM. It starts with downloading a JRE (Java Runtime
Environment) from here:
https://java.com/en/download/apple.jsp
After success with that, please send me an email and we can go from there
Wow, thank you, Ian, that makes these particular circumstances absolutely
crystal-clear. Well-stated and paints a bright light forward.
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That's what I'd say about starting up using JOSM again, Andrew: "start small."
If you've already got it up and running (proper Java runtime environment
installed, a good command-line to start it, if that's how you do it...), yes,
it can be intimidating: like piloting a jet plane or an
Looks like the issues are well-at-hand and being discussed.
Cheers,
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On Dec 17, 2021, at 1:52 PM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> On Sat, 18 Dec 2021 at 06:27, stevea wrote:
> My goodness, there are hundreds of them!
> Thought there would have been!
>
> Do you know if many have been mapped, & if so, as what?
>
> I can see that most of t
On Dec 16, 2021, at 1:49 AM, Phil Wyatt wrote:
> My feeling is these two flags should be changed to flag:type=indigenous on
> the wiki rather than national given what has been found during this
> discussion.
>
> I am also not confident in changing the wiki but I think there is consensus
>
Whoops, I made a mistake: I meant to say that Navajo "Chapter Houses" are over
a hundred years old, not that there are over a hundred of them.
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On Dec 17, 2021, at 3:25 PM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> Thanks again everybody for your thoughts, & apologies if the subject is
> boring to you!
You are welcome / it is my distinct pleasure. No apology necessary, I don't
find this boring in the least, it's quite interesting.
On Dec 17, 2021, at 2:46 PM, Phil Wyatt wrote:
> I have found one example where the Australian aboriginal flag looks to have
> been mapped as flag:type=cultural
Yes, see, I don't wholly disagree with flag:type=cultural, as that is "also"
true. What seems to happen (quite often with First
On Dec 16, 2021, at 2:19 PM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> Stevea, what do you have up there? Are there Apache & Navajo or any other
> First Peoples flags?
My goodness, there are hundreds of them!
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Flags_of_Native_Americans_in_the_United_States
(there
On Jan 4, 2022, at 3:51 PM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> On Mon, 3 Jan 2022 at 16:51, stevea wrote:
> But it is a bit better than it was five minutes ago.
>
> & has now disappeared from Inspector, so you obviously did something right :-)
>
> I'll also leave the bus rout
Mmm, mostly, I’d say, Warin. But let’s be careful not to encourage “only what
my use cases are” too much. When you say “if it cannot be seen from a public,
customer or permissive place then I don't really care to map it,” I ask for
caution with this sort of attitude. This is too parochial
-drive Yank
and don’t know the route or local area, I defer to others to tidy this up to
perfection. But it is a bit better than it was five minutes ago.
SteveA
> On Jan 2, 2022, at 10:37 PM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
>
> Been looking at OSM Inspector & it is showing an er
This is an identification of something I have noticed has been going on for
some time (as Phil mentions, since the early '90s, before OSM's time): other
mappers (governments, especially) "use" OSM as a reference, and OSM's data
influence other GISs. In my case, I've been watching as certain
On Jan 3, 2022, at 7:47 PM, Andrew Davidson wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 4, 2022 at 1:42 PM Andrew Hughes wrote:
>> In the interest of stirring up a hornets nest (jokes). I'd like to know what
>> could be said for tagging ways (streets/roads) with add:suburb (or
>> addr:county...) where the suburb (or
I repeat something I have said a number of times, say for example, about
bicycle infrastructure / routes. Although it can be said about "pedestrian
infrastructure / routes" pretty much one-for-one (as bicycle infrastructure /
routes). It is this:
There is "infrastructure" tagging, like
I'm mixed in this reply and not quite able to invest the time right now on the
necessary research to revert.
On the one hand, the changeset is 3 months old and that's plenty of time for a
snarl to result from revert, because of temporal drift. On the other hand, the
geographical area is
I've seen the solution Warin notes here in USA, too. "Walk along the beach"
(somewhat lengthily) yet the tide removes all the sandy footprints of any
implicit or explicit "trail." It's a route, though one that is invisible upon
the ground. But not among people who say "yep, mate, I'm walking
I've said this in other contexts and places and times:
> Displaying a closed trail on a map (like OSM) does NOT cause people to
> navigate that trail. Such behavior is completely up to the individual who
> "concludes" from reading said map "hey, I'm going to hike that closed trail
> anyway."
something to be said for
people taking responsibility for using technology (like maps), not expecting it
to be "closed shut."
Let's fix how people (and software, like routers) read our map, if there is
something broken or deficient about that. Let's not censor our map.
SteveA
__
epartments of transportation...) things DO slowly "watch each other"
and blend into a harmony. It can take a decade, or forever. It unfolds as it
unfolds, including here and now.
Good on ya; keep up the great work.
That Yank SteveA
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_level scheme are great, and so far, not completely
"solved." On the other hand, if these are indeed "sovereign," then you're in
better luck than we are! Really, this can be a challenging problem to solve
(where there are "overlapping" or &qu
to make them do so).
The other proposed changes to Australia's table? I step aside, good Australian
OSM Contributors.
SteveA
[1] https://wiki.osm.org/wiki/United_States_admin_level
[2] https://wiki.osm.org/wiki/United_States/Boundaries
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Such stunningly beautiful flags you have in your corner of our globe!
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I will "go here," too.
Years and years before this talk (I participated in the OSM-US sponsored Mappy
Hour where this talk of "fragile trails" in the USA's southwestern deserts
where "even a human footstep crunches to death slowly crystallizing soil" was
presented) my local area had similar
On OSM's USA Bicycle Networks wiki [1], the introductory section posits a nice
section on "What to map." (In the realm of bicycle routes / networks in the
USA). We distinguish between "infrastructure tagging" and "route tagging." We
talk about mapping SIGNED routes (and planned routes that
On Mar 7, 2022, at 12:41 AM, David Wales wrote:
> ...I took the opportunity to belatedly add this.
It’s like a good story with a wonderful happy ending.
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This might be tangential to the discussion, on the other hand, it might be a
kind of "hidden" or unstated assumption about how ways are "interpreted" in OSM
to mean some implied given semantic, which in my opinion, they shouldn't do.
So it could be revealing. Here goes: any given way should
Yes, as someone very involved with bicycle routing (and infrastructure), thank
you for noting the distinction that bicycle infrastructure tagging is ONE thing
(and important) and bicycle route tagging (inclusion of usually the latter
elements in a route relation) is ANOTHER (important) thing.
On Mar 2, 2022, at 1:18 AM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> Have they simply forgotten that they posted them, so a reminder would og
> their memory; or as suggested, do they want somebody else to do the actual
> mapping work for them?
Let's not forget that a Note is often added by a "lesser
On Feb 19, 2022, at 4:11 PM, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Someone is mapping a 'train tour' into OSM.
> Should such things be mapped?
Yes. As someone who extensively maps rail infrastructure relations
(route=railway) as well as both passenger routes (route=train,
route=light_rail,
Yup, Lisa, what Thorsten said: it may be that somebody else has made an edit
"in the meantime" and you are really seeing the nodes in the map as they are
"right now."
It may be that you are witnessing that many people can edit the same data.
When this gets messy," it is called an "Edit
Lisa, also, please know that it can take different times for the various "zoom
levels" of the map to show the same data. For example, zoomed way up close,
all might look correct, then you zoom out (and it's OK), but you zoom out "one
more level" and it's like it was yesterday, or two days ago.
On Feb 17, 2022, at 8:16 PM, Lisa wrote:
> Thank you for such a quick response :)
OSM: We aim to please!
> When I go into Edit mode the old node that needs to be removed isn't
> displaying, but when I am not in edit mode I can see it?
> Am I using the wrong method of editing it?
> Or do I
On Feb 17, 2022, at 7:51 PM, Lisa wrote:
(a question)
Hi Lisa: I'm assuming you are using the iD editor. It seems you know the
difference between the new node being correct and the old node "needing to go,"
you can click on a node and delete it like this:
Select the node with a single
On Feb 20, 2022, at 2:41 PM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> On Sun, 20 Feb 2022 at 18:24, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Some of ours, such as the India Pacific, are tourist only,
>
> I thought the IP also delivered some freight / supplies to the "towns"
> (alright - flyspecks!) across
Not boring at all; mighty impressive knock-down, actually. Go Team Oz!
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Nice.
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In the spirit of the OSM tenet of "be bold," and because you (all) have been so
open about the real vandalism / destruction this one person (account) is doing
to our map, I say "go ahead and revert his changesets yourself."
I've done this before when "the clear and present danger" of vandalism
On Feb 2, 2022, at 12:41 AM, Bob Cameron wrote:
> MR358 or Coulsons Creek Road between Willow Tree and Merriwa NSW is closed
> for repair of major slippage as it crosses the Liverpool Ranges.
> "Livetraffic" (Traffic for NSW govt site) says not reopening until late 2023.
> A reference on that
On Feb 2, 2022, at 1:50 AM, Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The 'facts cannot be copyright' may be a USA thing that does not work
> elsewhere. Don't know but I would not rely on it alone.
While I am reasonably certain this is true in the USA, I don't believe that
makes it necessarily
On Feb 2, 2022, at 2:23 PM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> So you're standing in the pub having a cold beer & the two blokes beside you
> are talking.
> ...
> Does that count as Local Knowledge?
Graeme, I'm not an attorney / solicitor, but what you describe is called
"hearsay" and is not usually
Dang auto-correct, of course that's addr:housename.
And when there is "both," as it appears here, "that's a good question!" (Maybe
enter both?)
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On Feb 4, 2022, at 12:48 AM, Dian Ågesson wrote:
> Genuine question:
>
> If I go to Officeworks and get a sign printed with the name "Bob" and put it
> on my letterbox, does that become the name of my house?
I would think this is an EXCEEDINGLY "locally variable" question (and answer).
To
On Feb 3, 2022, at 10:12 PM, Mat Attlee wrote:
> Whilst I was out surveying today I stumbled upon a building that had a street
> number but also a house name, as just above the entrance and door number it
> said Rivenhall. Now the question is should this be tagged as the name or
>
> On Jan 30, 2022, at 8:16 PM, Phil Wyatt wrote:
> I think Class 1 specifically mentions disability access so I would hate to
> see that combined in any way with other classes.
+1: I agree that "disability access explicit" and "how much experience you
have as a bush-trail walker" are
an be
an exception. Again, it must be understood that it is a "rating," rather than
explicit values that mean specific things unto themselves.
> On Jan 30, 2022, at 9:15 PM, Andrew Harvey wrote:
> On Mon, 31 Jan 2022 at 15:27, stevea wrote:
> But to conflate two wholly different seman
On Feb 8, 2022, at 8:08 PM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> Do routers "read" such things as flood-prone, intermittent & seasonal?
My "quick, off-the-cuff" answer would be: "better routers SHOULD." The real
answer is very much "check your particular router."
Not to mention, burgers come with “Betty’s secret lube” (sauce) and can be
“dressed any way you like.”
OK, I’ll stop there.
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On Feb 9, 2022, at 4:12 AM, Peter Hardy wrote:
> Betty's Burgers & Concrete Co? I've eaten at the one on Clarence St and the
> one in Darling Harbour in Sydney (admittedly before *waves arms around* all
> of this, so a couple years ago). They're fast food with dine-in tables -
> order at the
On Apr 10, 2022, at 5:53 PM, Dian Ågesson wrote:
> Thanks Andrew,
>
> I'll make the adjustments to level 7 and 9 in the update guidelines as I
> prepare them.
>
> I can also add the Districts of the ACT in at Level 5 as well, although
> should it be documented for all states' counties?
>
See, what I'm getting at is saying ACT District is 5, yet 7 means District,
well, that ambiguity trips me up.
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I'm mighty obliged to you for that excellent synopsis; thank you.
Yes, at a certain point such "proposals" have to "be discussed amongst
yourselves," of course, I've seen this and you are in a "certain stage" of such
things. Then there is your primer on "Aussie 2, 4, 6," excellent. Yeh, the
On Apr 7, 2022, at 10:31 PM, Andrew Harvey wrote:
> Well your router would need to look up the specific default whether that's
> something in the routing engine configuration, pulled from the OSM wiki, or
> pulled from the Victoria state relation def:* tags.
Right, I agree: that's part of the
On Apr 7, 2022, at 9:53 PM, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> I think this is getting too much into mapping regulations, we could just have
> no bicycle tag and leave it to data consumers to apply the regional defaults.
>
> What would that do to bike routing?
There is bicycle infrastructure tagging
On Apr 7, 2022, at 10:36 PM, Andrew Harvey wrote:
> It means JOSM hasn't downloaded all the member ways, in one of the panels on
> the right showing the relation, right clicking download incomplete members
> will fetch them all.
Yes, Graeme, if you see in the bottom left pane of JOSM's
Speaking from personal experience as only one participant over many years
(between say, 2012 with some agreement in 2015 and some refinement 2020) in a
big country with a lot of states and dozens of their idiosyncrasies, getting
admin_level values "right" can be a true, multi-year-long wrangle
To be sure everyone reading knows, JOSM's buffer has amazing undo capacity, I
believe "all the way back to the beginning of the session." And there's the
fact you can edit, edit, play with things all day and night long, then you
simply do not upload to the OSM servers (and into the fabric of
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