Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
In message 4bc5e280.5070...@advantos.net, Bill Haskett wphask...@advantos.net writes Wol: What do you consider properly normalized and what example would you give for designing a new mv FILE as a set of nested tables? Basically, use relational theory. Okay, mv design isn't as clear as for a RDBMS (they force everything into two dimensions - imho a very stupid idea), but the underlying maths provides a solid foundation. The way I'd do it is to do an EAR (Entity/Attribute/Relationship). Each entity I would aim to put into an individual FILE. All the associated attributes and relationships, I'd analyse using relational theory, then recombine them in NFNF using values and sub-values as required. This is where the fact that MV is not fully multidimensional can be an advantage, or can be a pain if you need more levels than provided by sub-values. But my rule-of-thumb is that if your FILE primary keys are equivalent to real-world keys, then your design is about right. If you need what looks like a SQL complex key, chances are you're falling into Einstein's too simple trap. That said, I have had some exposure to accounts systems, and doing an EAR on them is likely to be interesting, let's say ... most of my experience has been in other stuff like bill-of-materials, and statistical analysis of prices. Thanks, Bill Cheers, Wol -- Anthony W. Youngman pi...@thewolery.demon.co.uk 'Yings, yow graley yin! Suz ae rikt dheu,' said the blue man, taking the thimble. 'What *is* he?' said Magrat. 'They're gnomes,' said Nanny. The man lowered the thimble. 'Pictsies!' Carpe Jugulum, Terry Pratchett 1998 Visit the MaVerick web-site - http://www.maverick-dbms.org Open Source Pick ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
On Thu, Apr 8, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Baker Hughes baker.hug...@mouser.comwrote: Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? Yes. b. How many use IBM Websphere? No. c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. We have the Cache' Server Pages gateway between Apache web server and our Cache' database backend. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? No, but that is supported. There is no reason -- we can use mvbasic and javascript as the two languages. e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. Cache' AJAX framework (named Zen). For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) I realize this doesn't help you much on the U2 side, but you asked for any MV-friendly options, so I thought I would add it it. We can even do Model-View-Controller with a controller that can pass lists to and from the client-side. --dawn Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users -- Dawn M. Wolthuis Take and give some delight today ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
In message 012d01cad820$f3492290$d9db67...@com, Symeon Breen syme...@gmail.com writes Absolutely Brian, i agree wholeheartedly - However try having that conversation with a computer science guro... but then again they don't live in the real world. As soon as they mention the word proof (quite important in software and relational database design, I believe :-) that places them *firmly* in the realms of maths. And, to quote Einstein, As far as the laws of mathematics refer to reality, they are not certain; and as far as they are certain, they do not refer to reality. :-) Indeed, as I've often said, it's pretty easy to prove that relational databases, in order to qualify for the moniker relational, *must* be inefficient energy hogs. Cheers, Wol -- Anthony W. Youngman pi...@thewolery.demon.co.uk 'Yings, yow graley yin! Suz ae rikt dheu,' said the blue man, taking the thimble. 'What *is* he?' said Magrat. 'They're gnomes,' said Nanny. The man lowered the thimble. 'Pictsies!' Carpe Jugulum, Terry Pratchett 1998 Visit the MaVerick web-site - http://www.maverick-dbms.org Open Source Pick ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
In message 0f0fc5f04b472746b01fa2c4897cf972014314ee6...@excl01.mouser.lan, Baker Hughes baker.hug...@mouser.com writes For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Why don't you want to normalise? Legacy code? ALL new databases should be properly normalised (but no, I do *not* consider first normal form as properly normalised :-) Retrofitting normalisation on an old database isn't easy, but failing to design a new FILE as a set of nested tables is imho very bad practice. Cheers, Wol -- Anthony W. Youngman pi...@thewolery.demon.co.uk 'Yings, yow graley yin! Suz ae rikt dheu,' said the blue man, taking the thimble. 'What *is* he?' said Magrat. 'They're gnomes,' said Nanny. The man lowered the thimble. 'Pictsies!' Carpe Jugulum, Terry Pratchett 1998 Visit the MaVerick web-site - http://www.maverick-dbms.org Open Source Pick ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Wol: What do you consider properly normalized and what example would you give for designing a new mv FILE as a set of nested tables? Thanks, Bill Anthony W. Youngman said the following on 4/14/2010 8:31 AM: In message 0f0fc5f04b472746b01fa2c4897cf972014314ee6...@excl01.mouser.lan, Baker Hughes baker.hug...@mouser.com writes For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Why don't you want to normalise? Legacy code? ALL new databases should be properly normalised (but no, I do *not* consider first normal form as properly normalised :-) Retrofitting normalisation on an old database isn't easy, but failing to design a new FILE as a set of nested tables is imho very bad practice. Cheers, Wol ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
a. yes b. yes (judging by other responses, we may be the only ones) c. n/a d. If you mean a java GUI running on the client, then no. Everything we've done so far has used a browser as the UI. e. n/a f. n/a -John -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Baker Hughes Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 10:16 AM To: 'U2 Users List' Subject: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
On Apr 12, 2010, at 12:48 PM, John Hester wrote: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? Yes b. How many use IBM Websphere? No c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. We use Tomcat http://tomcat.apache.org It's free as in choice and as in beer d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? No, our front end is HTML/Javascript/CSS e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? No f. How many have other UI? Please give name. We're exploring using Adobe Flex. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Just saw this... A. It'll be in the next release (3rd 1/4 of the year) B. No C. No D. Currently a custom written Delphi app (thin client sorta thing) Moving to .NET client (again 3rd 1/4 of the year) that is slightly 'thicker' E. See 'D' above - mostly C# for .NET with some VB for .NET purchased components. F. All of this started life as a product called WinFAST from Visual Legacy Systems who gave us a huge 'leg up' in moving from a legacy character oriented systme to a real client server system - less than 1 year from inception to roll out with a 3 month beta period in there somewhere. -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Ben Souther Sent: Monday, April 12, 2010 3:59 PM To: U2 Users List Subject: Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture On Apr 12, 2010, at 12:48 PM, John Hester wrote: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? Yes b. How many use IBM Websphere? No c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. We use Tomcat http://tomcat.apache.org It's free as in choice and as in beer d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? No, our front end is HTML/Javascript/CSS e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? No f. How many have other UI? Please give name. We're exploring using Adobe Flex. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
a. Yes, we have a handheld applications that use WebDE as the middleware. b. No c. Our ecommerce product uses soap calls and we push/pull from UniVerse. No middle ware required. d. No e. No f. We use AVEXXIS' AVRAD product for our primary product. Currently this has a thin Delphi client but they are moving to .Net. preferred communication is via a secure pipe (ssh or ssl) but it also supports telnet. -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Baker Hughes Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 1:16 PM To: 'U2 Users List' Subject: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Yes Ud on the backend Asp.net webservices layer on top using uniobjects.net Asp.net front end that utilises the web services layer Ontop of that there may also be a javascript and ajax layer that utilises services which are part of the asp.net front end layer and then render html dynamically within the browser. We use vb.net rather than c# squiggly brackets are just a bit 1990' ;) -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Baker Hughes Sent: 08 April 2010 18:16 To: 'U2 Users List' Subject: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Hi Unidata -- mv.Net -- c# / vb6 front ends Works nicely. Sometimes there's web services between the top two tiers as well. Ed -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Baker Hughes Sent: 08 April 2010 18:16 To: 'U2 Users List' Subject: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users --- This e-mail and any attachment(s), is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. If you are not the addressee, dissemination, copying or use of this e-mail or any of its content is prohibited and may be unlawful. If you are not the intended recipient please inform the sender immediately and destroy the e-mail, any attachment(s) and any copies. All liability for viruses is excluded to the fullest extent permitted by law. It is your responsibility to scan or otherwise check this email and any attachment(s). Unless otherwise stated (i) views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender (ii) no contract may be construed by this e-mail. Emails may be monitored and you are taken to consent to this monitoring. Civica Services Limited, Company No. 02374268; Civica UK Limited, Company No. 01628868 Both companies are registered in England and Wales and each has its registered office at 2 Burston Road, Putney, London, SW15 6AR. --- ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Hmm, I'm guessing what's behind the question is the need to respond to the usual 'this is a legacy text based system' nonsense. If I'm wrong in that, please forgive the following soapbox! I haven't written text based stuff in years (unless I have no choice), so practically every system I've worked on in the last 10 - 15 years has been client/server or web - whether that's been VB, Delphi, ASP or .Net, using UniObjects, UO.Net, RedBack or equivalents. Point is - these things have been around a long time. For those who bang on about the perceived lack of front end development tools for U2 (and you know who you are!) it's worth pointing out that U2 has an excellent IDE - it's called Visual Studio. No different in that respect to SQL Server.. except the combination of UO.net and UniVerse Basic is often much neater - and for complex operations, quicker - than the equivalent SQL Client/TSQL/SQL CLR combinations grin. If UniVerse Basic looks old-fashioned, just look at the average TSQL procedure: sexy it ain't. And the great advantage of U2 is that you *don't need* traditional n-tier - your Business Logic (BL) tier belongs in the database. In fact, I prefer not to think about U2 as a database. It's much more appropriate to legitimately present U2 as a business engine - one in which BL, DAL and data storage layers are all resident in the same space. Which is a huge saving in efficiency. Brian ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
a. Two tiers: frontend GUI and backend U2 basic. b. We don't use Websphere. c. We use u2pipe to connect ColdFusion/PHP/C# applications to the U2 backend business logic. d. No java. e. Yes, we use C#. f. We also use ColdFusion and PHP to frontend our applications. Under normal circumstances, UniObjects with webservices would have been would have been my first choice; however, we use u2pipe due to some pre-existing constraints in our hosting environments. rex ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Any new development here is done with web client front-end. Applications are served from LAMP web servers. Backend servers include Unidata, MS Sql Server and some MySql. Still support applications with VB6 and VB.NET front-ends using Unidata and MS Sql Server backends. Also still supporting Lotus Domino applications that use Unidata back end in addition to the Lotus Domino databases. HTH On 04/08/2010 12:16 PM, Baker Hughes wrote: Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker Charles Shaffer Senior Analyst NTN-Bower Corporation ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Absolutely Brian, i agree wholeheartedly - However try having that conversation with a computer science guro... but then again they don't live in the real world. -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Brian Leach Sent: 09 April 2010 11:10 To: 'U2 Users List' Subject: Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Hmm, I'm guessing what's behind the question is the need to respond to the usual 'this is a legacy text based system' nonsense. If I'm wrong in that, please forgive the following soapbox! I haven't written text based stuff in years (unless I have no choice), so practically every system I've worked on in the last 10 - 15 years has been client/server or web - whether that's been VB, Delphi, ASP or .Net, using UniObjects, UO.Net, RedBack or equivalents. Point is - these things have been around a long time. For those who bang on about the perceived lack of front end development tools for U2 (and you know who you are!) it's worth pointing out that U2 has an excellent IDE - it's called Visual Studio. No different in that respect to SQL Server.. except the combination of UO.net and UniVerse Basic is often much neater - and for complex operations, quicker - than the equivalent SQL Client/TSQL/SQL CLR combinations grin. If UniVerse Basic looks old-fashioned, just look at the average TSQL procedure: sexy it ain't. And the great advantage of U2 is that you *don't need* traditional n-tier - your Business Logic (BL) tier belongs in the database. In fact, I prefer not to think about U2 as a database. It's much more appropriate to legitimately present U2 as a business engine - one in which BL, DAL and data storage layers are all resident in the same space. Which is a huge saving in efficiency. Brian ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Baker, You probably already know this, but we're using both an ERP system developed in UniBasic as well as multiple applications built in C#/UniObjects. Most of the new development is done in C#/UniObjects. Jake (a converted SQL Server Homer) -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Baker Hughes Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 12:16 PM To: 'U2 Users List' Subject: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
There is a new weapon that you can throw at this argument, that is cost and deliverables. Boards and CEOs and professional CIOs are frustrated at the cost and delays, where deliverables are not being met. Forget the technical arguments and focus on the financial ones. CEOs and boards do not know if Oracle or SAP is any good, they are taking the approach of there is security in numbers. The old I cannot get sacked for buying IBM. However risk mitigation is a growing issue in every organisation. Reducing the cost and shortening deliverable time tables mitigate risk. This is where U2 shines. I talk to management about the KISS principal, I play on their fears of technology by promoting robust technology instead of flashy technology. Focus on the business arguments and risk mitigation, then U2 has the legs on Oracle and SAP. Regards David Jordan -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Symeon Breen Sent: Saturday, 10 April 2010 6:12 AM To: 'U2 Users List' Subject: Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Absolutely Brian, i agree wholeheartedly - However try having that conversation with a computer science guro... but then again they don't live in the real world. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
[U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture [AD]
Hi Baker, There's no way to respond to this that doesn't sound like an ad, so I marked the response as an ad... We have multiple product lines and numerous customers who do various types of GUI interfaces to MV, with some great successes in the list. Most of our larger customers that do these things have built out a Data Access Layer (in accordance with industry best practices) and usually have a web service layer that abstracts this out. Some smaller customers have munged the data access and GUI together, which given their size, and the relative simplicity of their required solution, is quite appropriate. FusionWare's Direct product line allows you to map your MV database once, and access that mapped layer (or any PICK/BASIC stored procedures) from either Java, C#, C++, PHP or any number of other environments. We have had customers that have moved between different database offerings, and the client access layer (apart from connection strings) has not had to change. We have customers accessing their MultiValue databases from Java, .NET 3.5, various app servers and dev environments. We have customers on: - Universe (back as far as Universe 5) - Unidata - PI/Open - D3 - mvEnterprise - mvBase - Reality And many other platforms. We basically run on any MV platform. Our MV products, services and customers go back to the early 1990s when we participated in the original ODBC specifications (we were involved when it was still just the SQL Access Group's Call Level Interface.) We have numerous customers that we have been involved with for integration projects, through various companies, going back 15 years or more. We have at least one that goes back to the mid 1980s. More information on our products and services is available at http://www.fwic.net. -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Baker Hughes Sent: Thursday, April 08, 2010 10:16 AM To: 'U2 Users List' Subject: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Hi Baker, We are heavily into layers, using UniVerse Microsoft VB.Net. User level: VB.Net using menus, data entry, queries, Pick reports, Forms, prompts, processing. VB/UV interface level: between UniVerse and user, in VB.Net, using UniVerse Objects. Tools level: UniVerse parameters (including UniVerse dictionaries) for menus, data entry, queries, pick reports, forms, prompts, processes. Basic level: UniVerse Basic programs: utility and application subroutines (including dictionary subroutines), processes. HTH, Kate Kate Stanton Walstan Systems Ltd 4 Kelmarna Ave, Herne Bay, Auckland 1011, New Zealand Ph: +64 9 360 5310 Fax: +64 9 376 0750 Mobile: +64 21 400 486 Email: k...@walstan.com - Original Message - From: Baker Hughes baker.hug...@mouser.com To: 'U2 Users List' u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Sent: Friday, April 09, 2010 5:16 AM Subject: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Hi Baker, We're doing a lot of java through web services and servlets. Mostly with Tomcat and Glassfish. Several servlets for reports and inquiries. Several java user interfaces that utilize web services that connect to UD for wireless picking, tag and label printing. HTH Jeff On 04/08/2010 12:16 PM, Baker Hughes wrote: Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Hi Baker We have 2 tier with the business rules in the database and a VB.Net frontend. We are also installing 3 tier with webservise based on IINet. The backend is UniVerse We use VB.Net as it has better interaction with office, that C# cannot easily do and it is easier for people who have not had C++ or java experience. C# developers can write VB, but VB developers don't easily handle C#, so I double the available developers with VB. We use subroutines in UniVerse as the business rules, and pass the data to datasets in .Net. Due to complexity, we find it quicker and better to keep the business rules in UniVerse Basic. As the business rules are integrated with the database, we believe there is a performance advantage over a middle tier business rule engine, but we have not tested that theory. Regards David Jordan ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
We're also using Apache Tomcat 6 w/ a Java Servlet. The front end has Java 1.6, hibernate (writing to PICK), ajax, and html. The back end is done in UniVerse BASIC which we use for our reports and database. It's basically one medium size web application. -Chris Date: Thu, 8 Apr 2010 17:47:20 -0500 From: j...@powellclan.com To: u2-users@listserver.u2ug.org Subject: Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Hi Baker, We're doing a lot of java through web services and servlets. Mostly with Tomcat and Glassfish. Several servlets for reports and inquiries. Several java user interfaces that utilize web services that connect to UD for wireless picking, tag and label printing. HTH Jeff On 04/08/2010 12:16 PM, Baker Hughes wrote: Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users _ The New Busy think 9 to 5 is a cute idea. Combine multiple calendars with Hotmail. http://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?tile=multicalendarocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:WM_HMP:042010_5 ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
Re: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture
Hi Baker, a) We, and our VARS/clients, utilize a middle tier, and you could also introduce an intermediate MV application server in the chain for execution of business rules intermediate staging if necessary (conducted Proof on Concept for one prospect). b) Not us c) We use Microsoft IIS and windows services on middle tier. Could rework middleware to operate via Websphere, but simply hasn't been the demand d) Nope e) Nope f) Visage - essentially just AJAX/HTML As you know, the Visage toolset eats native MV data structure (and indeed allows nesting well beyond just 3 levels) - can throw MV data to the outside world as well formed XML that can be consumed by most things these days (and Baker, don't forget we have a nice GUI ERP product if necessary :-) Ross Ferris Stamina Software Visage Better by Design! -Original Message- From: u2-users-boun...@listserver.u2ug.org [mailto:u2-users- boun...@listserver.u2ug.org] On Behalf Of Baker Hughes Sent: Friday, 9 April 2010 3:16 AM To: 'U2 Users List' Subject: [U2] Quick poll - how many use 3-tier or N-tier Architecture Would those of you mind responding that use 3-Tier or N-Tier architecture - I'm trying to gather some quick numbers for some decision makers (somewhat urgent). Please respond if your site, or sites who you service have UniData, UniVerse, or any other MV db on the backend, and any fully graphical user interface: a. How many have a middle-tier application server? b. How many use IBM Websphere? c. How many use some other? Please give product name if you can. d. How many have a Java front end User Interface? e. How many have a C# front end User Interface? f. How many have other UI? Please give name. For anyone - what Multi-Value aware / friendly middleware products are there? (That don't require data normalization before sending to the middleware.) Thank you so much, -Baker This communication, its contents and any file attachments transmitted with it are intended solely for the addressee(s) and may contain confidential proprietary information. Access by any other party without the express written permission of the sender is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this communication in error you may not copy, distribute or use the contents, attachments or information in any way. Please destroy it and contact the sender. ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users ___ U2-Users mailing list U2-Users@listserver.u2ug.org http://listserver.u2ug.org/mailman/listinfo/u2-users
