Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Todd Allen
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 10:13 PM, Philippe Beaudette pbeaude...@wikimedia.org wrote: On Aug 11, 2014, at 7:13 PM, Todd Allen toddmal...@gmail.com wrote: like suppression, it should be used only by stewards and community approved functionaries. I'm confused. Are you suggesting that

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Pine W
FWIW, Lila's comments were made before the start of this email thread about superprotect. Pine On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 11:53 PM, Pine W wiki.p...@gmail.com wrote: Forwarding comments from Lila from https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=User_talk%3ALilaTretikovdiff=9454366oldid=9339030

[Wikimedia-l] VisualEditor Office Hours for August and September

2014-08-12 Thread Erica Litrenta
Hi all, this is just a reminder that the next VE office hour is on Thursday 14 August at 900 UTC, in case you want to add it to your calendar. Hope to see you there, Elitre (WMF) ___ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Options for the German Wikipedia

2014-08-12 Thread Dan Garry
On 12 August 2014 02:39, svetlana svetl...@fastmail.com.au wrote: There needs to be a central place, like the Wikimedia blog, but dedicated to tech things - actively announcing everything WM ENGINEERING are doing, both in products and in core. There is. It's called the monthly report. See

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Craig Franklin
Erik, I'll be writing a longer post on the Meta RFC later, but can you confirm whether the idea is to superprotect key interface pages like [[Mediawiki:common.js]] on a permanent basis, or will this feature only be used to lock pages temporarily in the case of wheel warring or other circumstances

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Pine W
Straniu, Jimbo's comments in his keynote about forking concerned encouraging competent editors who can't work cooperatively with other people to fork in a way that would be better for everyone in the long run. I don't believe this disappointing confrontation between the WMF and volunteers were

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Options for the German Wikipedia

2014-08-12 Thread Guillaume Paumier
Hi, On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 8:44 AM, Dan Garry dga...@wikimedia.org wrote: On 12 August 2014 02:39, svetlana svetl...@fastmail.com.au wrote: There needs to be a central place, like the Wikimedia blog, but dedicated to tech things - actively announcing everything WM ENGINEERING are doing,

[Wikimedia-l] Odder on moderation?!

2014-08-12 Thread John Mark Vandenberg
Hi, Has Odder / Tomasz Kozłowski been put on moderation? I'm informed his emails sent to this list havent come through to the list for nearly 24 hrs, and he has not been notified of having been put on any moderation, and the moderators havent responded to queries sent directly, and havent

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Odder on moderation?!

2014-08-12 Thread Tim Starling
On 12/08/14 11:23, John Mark Vandenberg wrote: Hi, Has Odder / Tomasz Kozłowski been put on moderation? I'm informed his emails sent to this list havent come through to the list for nearly 24 hrs, and he has not been notified of having been put on any moderation, and the moderators havent

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Odder on moderation?!

2014-08-12 Thread Austin Hair
Yes, I temporarily placed Tomasz on moderation after his personal attacks on the list. I apologize for apparently not making this clear enough with my on-list warning. I spent most of yesterday afternoon traveling home from Wikimania, and have not seen any messages from him since. As the admin

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Odder on moderation?!

2014-08-12 Thread Austin Hair
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 12:48 PM, Fæ fae...@gmail.com wrote: Current working practices on lists include never being informed that it happened and never getting a reply to a polite request of why the moderation is in place, along with there being no possibility of appeal or timely review. More

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Options for the German Wikipedia

2014-08-12 Thread Chris Keating
Does either of you or anyone else see a valid reason to deny this seemingly reasonable and considered request? It's quite obvious that hacks to achieve the same ends are far from ideal. Why not simply disable MediaViewer by default on the German Wikipedia, as requested? In my view, the

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Odder on moderation?!

2014-08-12 Thread John Lewis
I'm an administrator for a few lists and personally I feel you are being far far too generic in saying lists are not managed correctly. A process is not broken here just a users understanding. Document don't argue regarding processes. ___ Wikimedia-l

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Yaroslav M. Blanter
On 12.08.2014 02:26, svetlana wrote: If we accept the policy in principle, I don't care who enforces such policy, that be community or WMF. Such policy does not go against community entirely, unless WMF shows a will to reject community patches related to issues which community finds important.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Odder on moderation?!

2014-08-12 Thread Richard Ames
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 12/08/14 20:23, John Mark Vandenberg wrote: Hi, Has Odder / Tomasz Kozłowski been put on moderation? Yes. I'm informed his emails sent to this list havent come through to the list for nearly 24 hrs, and he has not been notified of having

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Peter Southwood
As one has been there, done that, I would like to point out that there is an order of magnitude difference between Internet Brands and WMF. Cheers, Peter -Original Message- From: wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org [mailto:wikimedia-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org] On Behalf Of

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Magnus Manske
Also, 118 people (190 vs. 72 votes in the poll [1] on German Wikipedia) are not the community. They are a small part of the community. The people who would profit [2] from the Media Viewer as a default feature were not consulted. Cheers, Magnus [1]

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Erik Moeller
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 10:19 AM, Craig Franklin cfrank...@halonetwork.net wrote: I'll be writing a longer post on the Meta RFC later, but can you confirm whether the idea is to superprotect key interface pages like [[Mediawiki:common.js]] on a permanent basis, or will this feature only be

[Wikimedia-l] Thank you for Wikimania!

2014-08-12 Thread phoebe ayers
Thank you so much to the London Wikimania organizers for putting a wonderful Wikimania 2014. I want to recognize everyone who helped out: the core team who proposed the bid and worked for over a year organizing a vision and a team to carry it out; the staff at Wikimedia UK and WMF who worked on

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Romaine Wiki
Has it ever come to the mind that something is going wrong on how the community is approached? Has it ever come to the mind that some software implementations have gone to hastily with negative effects? That the community reacts the way it does now, is because they care very much about the site

[Wikimedia-l] Tech News the communication gap (was Re: Options for the German Wikipedia)

2014-08-12 Thread Quim Gil
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 8:44 AM, Dan Garry dga...@wikimedia.org wrote: On 12 August 2014 02:39, svetlana svetl...@fastmail.com.au wrote: There needs to be a central place, like the Wikimedia blog, but dedicated to tech things - actively announcing everything WM ENGINEERING are doing,

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread rupert THURNER
magnus, a vote always has 3 options. * i am for it * i am against it * i can live with the outcome of the vote so i did not vote. because i can live with both. but i do respect the vote. i do respect admin decisions, i even voted for some admins. at the end it is very simple. the one who

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Katie Chan
On 12/08/2014 15:19, rupert THURNER wrote: magnus, a vote always has 3 options. * i am for it * i am against it * i can live with the outcome of the vote No, there are other options. * I didn't know the poll was happening * I just want to get on with editing / reading Wikipedia (or sister

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Magnus Manske
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 3:19 PM, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.com wrote: magnus, a vote always has 3 options. * i am for it * i am against it * i can live with the outcome of the vote nitpick You mean do not particularly care about it, surely? That you can live with the outcome of a

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Romaine Wiki
2014-08-12 16:57 GMT+02:00 Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com: On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 3:19 PM, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.com wrote: so i did not vote. because i can live with both. but i do respect the vote. i do respect admin decisions, i even voted for some admins.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Magnus Manske
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 4:21 PM, Romaine Wiki romaine.w...@gmail.com wrote: 2014-08-12 16:57 GMT+02:00 Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com: On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 3:19 PM, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.com wrote: so i did not vote. because i can live with both. but i do

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Brad Jorsch (Anomie)
On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 6:54 PM, John Mark Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 3:49 AM, Brad Jorsch (Anomie) bjor...@wikimedia.org wrote: On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 2:01 PM, John Mark Vandenberg jay...@gmail.com wrote: Before this, there was no expectation that a

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Erik Moeller
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 4:57 PM, Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com wrote: It's probably fine for modern viewing, although it's hard to guess that you get to the file page via the little Commons icon for people who (in all likelihood) have never seen that icon, or visited Commons. Dear

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Henning Schlottmann
On 12.08.2014 16:57, Magnus Manske wrote: German Wikipedia had 1.1 billion page views in June [1]. ~300 votes (~2/3 against MediaViewer) do not represent the readers, IMHO. Claiming to speak for a perceived silent majority will not help you much in this discussion. There is a common pattern in

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Magnus Manske
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 5:26 PM, Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org wrote: These changes will need to be carefully tested/validated. If you want to take a look at an early early (!) prototype (!!), see http://multimedia-alpha.wmflabs.org/wiki/Lightbox_demo , but please note that anything but

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Abd ulRahman Lomax
Whoever believes that an administration of a crowdsourcing website can do whatever they want just because they are running the website should recollect what recently happened to Internet Brands and Wikitravel. Popcorn, anyone? Wikipedia is not an organization, and the WMF does not administer

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Options for the German Wikipedia

2014-08-12 Thread Balázs Viczián
It seems that poor (and insufficient) communication is a pretty widespread problem at WMF. Balazs 2014-08-12 13:25 GMT+02:00 Chris Keating chriskeatingw...@gmail.com: Does either of you or anyone else see a valid reason to deny this seemingly reasonable and considered request? It's quite

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Pete Forsyth
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 11:12 AM, Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com wrote: On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 5:26 PM, Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org wrote: These changes will need to be carefully tested/validated. If you want to take a look at an early early (!) prototype (!!), see

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Richard Farmbrough
It is very disheartening to see that active members of the community have been Borged by the Foundation, and all tell the same story, albeit with different levels of enthusiasm. Quite possibly there are issues over configuration pages, but to implement a super-protection feature *in the middle of

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Magnus Manske
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 5:33 PM, Henning Schlottmann h.schlottm...@gmx.net wrote: On 12.08.2014 16:57, Magnus Manske wrote: German Wikipedia had 1.1 billion page views in June [1]. ~300 votes (~2/3 against MediaViewer) do not represent the readers, IMHO. Claiming to speak for a perceived

[Wikimedia-l] is it possible to accept bitcoins without receiving stolen property?

2014-08-12 Thread James Salsman
Given this news about BGP hijacking used to mine hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of dollars worth of bitcoins per year, as a practical matter concerning donations, is there any way to accept bitcoin payments without risking accepting stolen property?

Re: [Wikimedia-l] is it possible to accept bitcoins without receiving stolen property?

2014-08-12 Thread Andre Engels
No, that doesn't seem possible. But that's not really different for any other payment method either. And even if we could get payments without risking accepting stolen property, I don't think we should. When choosing between unwittingly accepting tainted money and forcing people to give up their

Re: [Wikimedia-l] is it possible to accept bitcoins without receiving stolen property?

2014-08-12 Thread Todd Allen
You do, of course, realize that any currency anyone accepts could at some point have been stolen? On Aug 12, 2014 3:49 PM, James Salsman jsals...@gmail.com wrote: Given this news about BGP hijacking used to mine hundreds of thousands (if not millions) of dollars worth of bitcoins per year, as a

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Philippe Beaudette
All, I just want to call your attention to Lila's statement at https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User_talk:LilaTretikov#On_a_Scale_of_Billions . pb *Philippe Beaudette * \\ Director, Community Advocacy \\ Wikimedia Foundation, Inc. T: 1-415-839-6885 x6643 | phili...@wikimedia.org | :

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Pete Forsyth
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com wrote: On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 5:33 PM, Henning Schlottmann h.schlottm...@gmx.net wrote: This is serious. WMF really needs to appreciate the expertise of the author community and accept their experience a

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread svetlana
On Tue, 12 Aug 2014, at 23:42, Romaine Wiki wrote: That the community reacts the way it does now, is because they care very much about the site and they notice something is terrible going wrong on WMF side and too less is done to fix those problems/issues! if the community was not so willing

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread svetlana
On Wed, 13 Aug 2014, at 10:46, svetlana wrote: On Tue, 12 Aug 2014, at 23:42, Romaine Wiki wrote: That the community reacts the way it does now, is because they care very much about the site and they notice something is terrible going wrong on WMF side and too less is done to fix those

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread John Mark Vandenberg
On Wed, Aug 13, 2014 at 10:48 AM, svetlana svetl...@fastmail.com.au wrote: On Wed, 13 Aug 2014, at 10:46, svetlana wrote: On Tue, 12 Aug 2014, at 23:42, Romaine Wiki wrote: That the community reacts the way it does now, is because they care very much about the site and they notice something

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Pete Forsyth
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 5:46 PM, svetlana svetl...@fastmail.com.au wrote: On Tue, 12 Aug 2014, at 23:42, Romaine Wiki wrote: That the community reacts the way it does now, is because they care very much about the site and they notice something is terrible going wrong on WMF side and too

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Todd Allen
If the WF wasn't so willing to use force (i.e. pushing unwanted changes) against the other party instead of talking properly then the superprotect wouldn't exist at all you seeing the problem there? whose problem is it? desire to act out of the blue instead of collaborating they didn't

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Romaine Wiki
2014-08-12 21:41 GMT+02:00 Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com: On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 5:33 PM, Henning Schlottmann h.schlottm...@gmx.net wrote: There is a common pattern in the conflicts between WMF and several communities over software developments during the last few years.

Re: [Wikimedia-l] [Wikitech-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread Romaine Wiki
2014-08-13 2:46 GMT+02:00 svetlana svetl...@fastmail.com.au: On Tue, 12 Aug 2014, at 23:42, Romaine Wiki wrote: That the community reacts the way it does now, is because they care very much about the site and they notice something is terrible going wrong on WMF side and too less is done to

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Board Meeting Update

2014-08-12 Thread Bishakha Datta
Dear all, Since many have asked why I'm stepping off the board when my term ends Dec 2014: there's no dramatic reason - it's the compulsions of time. Being on the WMF board is immensely satisfying but also a big time commitment that I find increasingly hard to sustain. I intend to be around in

Re: [Wikimedia-l] Superprotect user right, Comming to a wiki near you

2014-08-12 Thread rupert THURNER
On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 6:26 PM, Erik Moeller e...@wikimedia.org wrote: On Tue, Aug 12, 2014 at 4:57 PM, Magnus Manske magnusman...@googlemail.com wrote: Like many other old hands, it seems to get in the way of my workflow. Not an issue for me, as long as I can turn it off. hehe, i suppose