date:20081209

I am using 5830 products - is this not the latest point to multipoint
product Trango has to offer (in the 5.8 band)?

>>The only possible reasons you could get that spread was if you were not
comparing equivellent
anntennas or doing something wrong, or had a bad batch of radios, or
something, but it was not inline with the capabilty of the product.

*Using 5830AP and 5830S SU (non-ext), to my knowledge you're stuck with the
panel for the AP but the SU you can use an external antenna but for a mere
7mi that didn't seem worth it.  I believe there were 2 radios on that
customer's grain bin before the MT AP was up, but I could be wrong.  It was
installed years before my time.*

>>You can;t jsut ignore that Trango offers a 24dbi antenna (Fox) stock for
its
under $350 price tag. Thats part of it's value proposition. You could argue
that you don;t like Dishes, but that is not what you said.  If you test
Trango 5830 that is a 18db antenna, and you must also use a 18db antenna
with the MT, for a fair comparison, which the 5830 ext can accommodate.

*I can see the arguement of the stock 18db antenna versus 23db MT antenna,
however I've yet to see where I can get a 5830S-EXT for anything less then
$500 (I'm only seeing the Trango website's price).  Keep in mind the MT
setup I am using is $220.  Can you tell me where to find these Fox units for
$350?  I am also interested in knowing if anyone has had good success with
the Fox product line as I certainly have not.  I have only seen three or
four of them on a tower way north of where our network lives, unsure of
their purpose.*

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 2:00 AM, Tom DeReggi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote:

> Josh,
>
> I did not mean to be disrespectful in my comments, but some of the
> information that you posted was not factual, and was misleading.
>
> You compared the older and most expesnive trango (because itwas old
> technology) with the Newest less expensive Mikrotik.
> That is not apples to apples. t minimum you should be comparingthe latest
> generation of each product line.
> It was sorta like me saying, all Alvarions are expensive because they have
> $1500 CPEs (which they do), without disclosing the fact that Alvarion also
> has a $350 CPE (which they do)designed to compete for WISP's business.
>
> Second, the RSSI levels that you represented were impossible if you were
> doing apples to apples comparison. Trango and MT have mPCI cards that
> transmit at just about the same TX power. (Trango 22db).  The only possible
> reasons you could get that spread was if you were not comparing equivellent
> anntennas or doing something wrong, or had a bad batch of radios, or
> something, but it was not inline with the capabilty of the product.  You
> can;t jsut ignore that Trango offers a 24dbi antenna (Fox) stock for its
> under $350 price tag. Thats part of it's value proposition. You could argue
> that you don;t like Dishes, but that is not what you said.  If you test
> Trango 5830 that is a 18db antenna, and you must also use a 18db antenna
> with the MT, for a fair comparison, which the 5830 ext can accommodate.
>
> To be clear, there was never an attempt to discredit MT or Butch's fine
> engineering. Simply that your math wasn't adding up, when you were
> reporting
> results you got with Trango.
>
> Tom DeReggi
> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Josh Luthman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 10:42 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Where is JAB when we need them
>
>
> >>>I have a problem with your FUD misrepresenting facts.
> >
> > *What facts am I misrepresenting?*
> >
> >>>They are not even close to accurate. You can't fairly compare apples to
> > oranges either.
> >
> > *Did you not just state my information was factual?  How can facts not be
> > accurate?  How could you possibly argue this?  What in the world could
> > possibly give you the right or capability to call me a liar?  I also have
> > to
> > ask what are apples and oranges as I believe I am comparing two 5.8 point
> > to
> > multipoint products.*
> >
> >>>Trango CPEs are $250-$300 per CPE
> >
> > *Where are you getting this price?  Here is what I am looking at:
> >
> http://www.trangobroadband.com/store/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=M5830S-SU
> >
> http://www.google.com/products?q=trango+m5830s&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&sa=X&oi=product_result_group&resnum=4&ct=title
> > *
> >
> >>>Trango is 22db consistent, and Mikrotik is LUCKY to get their
> > stated full 23db of a Atheros HP card in LOW modulations (not capable of
> > 26mbps), and I've rarely seen it actually deliver it consistently, after
> > all
> > the various potential places for loss (UFl, pigtail, out of spec car

Re: [WISPA] Where is JAB when we need them

2008-12-09 Thread Tom DeReggi

Josh,

I did not mean to be disrespectful in my comments, but some of the 
information that you posted was not factual, and was misleading.

You compared the older and most expesnive trango (because itwas old 
technology) with the Newest less expensive Mikrotik.
That is not apples to apples. t minimum you should be comparingthe latest 
generation of each product line.
It was sorta like me saying, all Alvarions are expensive because they have 
$1500 CPEs (which they do), without disclosing the fact that Alvarion also 
has a $350 CPE (which they do)designed to compete for WISP's business.

Second, the RSSI levels that you represented were impossible if you were 
doing apples to apples comparison. Trango and MT have mPCI cards that 
transmit at just about the same TX power. (Trango 22db).  The only possible 
reasons you could get that spread was if you were not comparing equivellent 
anntennas or doing something wrong, or had a bad batch of radios, or 
something, but it was not inline with the capabilty of the product.  You 
can;t jsut ignore that Trango offers a 24dbi antenna (Fox) stock for its 
under $350 price tag. Thats part of it's value proposition. You could argue 
that you don;t like Dishes, but that is not what you said.  If you test 
Trango 5830 that is a 18db antenna, and you must also use a 18db antenna 
with the MT, for a fair comparison, which the 5830 ext can accommodate.

To be clear, there was never an attempt to discredit MT or Butch's fine 
engineering. Simply that your math wasn't adding up, when you were reporting 
results you got with Trango.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband

- Original Message - 
From: "Josh Luthman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 10:42 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Where is JAB when we need them

>>>I have a problem with your FUD misrepresenting facts.
>
> *What facts am I misrepresenting?*
>
>>>They are not even close to accurate. You can't fairly compare apples to
> oranges either.
>
> *Did you not just state my information was factual?  How can facts not be
> accurate?  How could you possibly argue this?  What in the world could
> possibly give you the right or capability to call me a liar?  I also have 
> to
> ask what are apples and oranges as I believe I am comparing two 5.8 point 
> to
> multipoint products.*
>
>>>Trango CPEs are $250-$300 per CPE
>
> *Where are you getting this price?  Here is what I am looking at:
> http://www.trangobroadband.com/store/ProductInfo.aspx?productid=M5830S-SU
> http://www.google.com/products?q=trango+m5830s&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&sa=X&oi=product_result_group&resnum=4&ct=title
> *
>
>>>Trango is 22db consistent, and Mikrotik is LUCKY to get their
> stated full 23db of a Atheros HP card in LOW modulations (not capable of
> 26mbps), and I've rarely seen it actually deliver it consistently, after 
> all
> the various potential places for loss (UFl, pigtail, out of spec cards,
> lower grade filtering, etc).   If your Mikrotiks are getting higher RSSI,
> then you are illegallly over powering your Mikrotiks.
>
> *I didn't do much of the wireless configuration - Butch made a template 
> for
> me.  I have a really hard time believing that the cause of the 
> disagreement
> here is "illegally over powering [my] Mikrotiks".*
>
>>> You can't compare Trango's oldest product line to MIkrotik's newest.  If
> you
> are concerned about price you shouldn't be buying 5830s. There is a reason
> that they made the FOX.
>
> *I deployed around a dozen FOX units.  The last set were used to replace 
> the
> first set that had gone bad.  **In the last year only one remains not
> defective. **This one loses association at least once throughout the month
> and will be replaced if the customer complains about it.*
>
>>>I'd agree with this.  But from looking at his post, it looked more like
> he was telling his own experience.  Certainly he knows more about his
> own experience than you.  Perhaps he is misreading the data, but that's
> not the assumption it looks like you are making.
>
> * Everything I have stated is based on facts.  Key word being 
> "experience".
> My purpose of my post was to report my success story and my past
> experiences.*
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
> --- Henry Spencer
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 8, 2008 at 10:21 PM, Butch Evans <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 2008-12-08 at 21:35 -0500, Tom DeReggi wrote:
>>
>> > I don't have a problem with you finding a reason or jsutification to 
>> > use
>> > Mikrotik. Mikrotik has a powerful unique product to save WISPs money.
>> > However, I have a problem with your FUD misrepresenting facts. They are
>> not
>> > even close to accurate. You can't fairly compare apples to oranges
>> either.
>>
>> Which is t

Re: [WISPA] Where is JAB when we need them

2008-12-09 Thread Tom DeReggi

Butch,

First, my point is TX power + antenna gain = EIRP.  5.8G ofdm loss 
across 1 mile of Air = the same thing, no matter what gear you use. (with 
some exceptions such as mimo dual antenna multipath combining type 
technologies).  This is math, it has nothing to do with the manufacturer of 
the gear.  He used an example where he alledged MT had 20db more gain, which 
was impossible, considering that both radios had specs of about the same TX 
power.  Either there was not an apples to apples compairson, or clearly 
there where some flaws in installation, not in the gear.

Second, all the comments that you made regarding MT's features, ALL TRUE. 
Excellent post, to remind us of some of the unique value MT offers. Its 
really exciting to see this product evolve as it has.

Third, Looks like MT has some nice surprises regarding its new hardware 
options. Just saw in their newsletter they have a mPCI card now with three 
band selectable filters. (or something like that). Pretty cool.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


- Original Message - 
From: "Butch Evans" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 10:21 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Where is JAB when we need them


> On Mon, 2008-12-08 at 21:35 -0500, Tom DeReggi wrote:
>
>> I don't have a problem with you finding a reason or jsutification to use
>> Mikrotik. Mikrotik has a powerful unique product to save WISPs money.
>> However, I have a problem with your FUD misrepresenting facts. They are 
>> not
>> even close to accurate. You can't fairly compare apples to oranges 
>> either.
>
> Which is the apple and which the orange.
>
>> Trango CPEs are $250-$300 per CPE and go for 12 miles, and never once in 
>> my
>> life had a Trango with a RSSI as low as -87. Under no shape or form will 
>> a
>> Mikrotik ever get a higher RSSI than a DSSS Trango radio of equivellent
>
> This is not necessarily true, either.  The truth is that it depends on
> MANY factors.  The radio itself is one of them.  Mikrotik is not a
> "CPE", but an operating system (hence the name "RouterOS").  Just
> because you have not seen the lower RSSI values doesn't mean that it
> doesn't happen.
>
>> Mikrotik is LUCKY to get their stated full 23db of a Atheros HP card in
>> LOW modulations (not capable of 26mbps), and I've rarely seen it actually
>> deliver it consistently, after all the various potential places for loss
>> (UFl, pigtail, out of spec cards, lower grade filtering, etc).
>
> Hmm.  Looks like you NAILED it!  Using a superior operating system with
> quality components (good radio card and quality antennas/pigtails) CAN
> work as well as Trango or any other product on the market.
>
>> If your Mikrotiks are getting higher RSSI, then you are illegallly
>> over powering your Mikrotiks.
>
> This is a really broad statement and unfair accusation.  You have no
> real idea if he is doing that or not.  I don't know if he is or isn't,
> but the point is that neither do you.
>
>> You can't compare Trango's oldest product line to MIkrotik's newest.  If 
>> you
>> are concerned about price you shouldn't be buying 5830s. There is a 
>> reason
>> that they made the FOX.  You need to select the right product and buy 
>> savy
>> for Trango, just like you do for Mikrotik.  You will also find that
>> Mikrotik doesn't do anywhere near 26mbps consistent throughput in a
>> scaled PtMP environment, expecially with the slightest amount of noise,
>> after combating all the congestion issues of a Wifi protocol (no
>> Nstreme polling does not perform as well as Trango polling).
>
> First, you are missing several realities of how MT works.  Mikrotik's
> Nstreme is MUCH more than just polling.  Nstreme offers 3 specific
> benefits, one of which is configurable for specific types of network
> traffic while the other 2 are simply a "switch".  With Nstreme you now
> have the option to turn off CSMA.  This fixes a LOT of the problem that
> outdoor wifi had in the first place.  Then, you have polling.  The
> polling mechanism has gotten a LOT of work recently.  Versions after
> 3.15 (currently only in the test package) have a MUCH better polling
> mechanism and can scale very well.  Perhaps not the the hundreds that a
> Canopy system can do, but then you don't need it to do that since you
> can build out more APs for the same $$.  Finally, you have the other
> MAIN benefit of Nstreme, which is the packet aggregation feature.  This
> feature is where the real benefit to Nstreme resides.  You and I both
> know that typical IP traffic for most users is not even CLOSE to the
> 1500 byte MTU of Ethernet.  The average packet size is MUCH smaller.
> Let's just say it's 200 bytes (this will vary a LOT, depending on the
> network).  What the packet aggregation does is put multiple IP packets
> inside a single protocol frame.  The policy that is used to determine if
> an IP packet goes into a frame that is being sent is configurable with 4
>

Re: [WISPA] Do you provide backup services?

As far as client software I really like Cobian Backup v8.  I havn't touched
v7 or 9.  It does a great job automating things (email, runs as a service,
keeps directory structure, etc) and is open source.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 12:33 AM, John Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Based on the reviews, it looks like these may have some firmware
> problems...
>
> Marlon, what kind of space are you talking about?
>
> Here's a Buffalo box that does 4 TB ( 3TB in RAID 5) for $1000
>
> http://shop4.frys.com/product/5782802?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG
>
> John
>
>
> Mike Hammett wrote:
> > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148337
> >
> >
> > -
> > Mike Hammett
> > Intelligent Computing Solutions
> > http://www.ics-il.com
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > From: "Marlon K. Schafer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 8:22 PM
> > To: "WISPA General List" 
> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Do you provide backup services?
> >
> >
> >> We do it.  Handybackup has been a nice little program.
> >>
> >> What I'm stuck on is how to get ahold of a cheap enough solution for
> >> massive
> >> amounts of storage.  Anyone got any ideas for inexpensive storage space?
> >>
> >> Because handy backup encrypts everything before sending it to my servers
> >> security doesn't have to be super good.
> >> marlon
> >>
> >> - Original Message -
> >> From: "Mike Hammett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >> Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 7:10 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Do you provide backup services?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> I do, but I'm not happy with the provider I chose.  He just uses
> someone
> >>> else's software, but it has so many files that it errors on, it's
> >>> ridiculous
> >>> I have to manually remove that file from the backup set and try again.
> >>> With
> >>> over a half million files...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> -
> >>> Mike Hammett
> >>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> >>> http://www.ics-il.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >>> Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 3:19 AM
> >>> To: "WISPA General List" 
> >>> Subject: [WISPA] Do you provide backup services?
> >>>
> >>>
>  Do any of you provide backup data services to your broadband clients
> as
>  a
>  value added or revenue improving service?
> 
>  Was it a success or failure?
> 
> 
> 
>  
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>  http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
> 
>  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
>  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
>  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
> 
> >>>
> 
> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>>
> 
> >>>
> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>>
> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>>
> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> 
> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> >> http://signup.wispa.org/
> >>
> 
> >>
> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >>
> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >>
> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> 
> > WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> > http://signup.wispa.org/
> >
> 
> >
> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> >
> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> >
> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>


---

Re: [WISPA] Do you provide backup services?

2008-12-09 Thread John Thomas

Based on the reviews, it looks like these may have some firmware problems...

Marlon, what kind of space are you talking about?

Here's a Buffalo box that does 4 TB ( 3TB in RAID 5) for $1000

http://shop4.frys.com/product/5782802?site=sr:SEARCH:MAIN_RSLT_PG

John


Mike Hammett wrote:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822148337
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Marlon K. Schafer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Sunday, December 07, 2008 8:22 PM
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Do you provide backup services?
>
>   
>> We do it.  Handybackup has been a nice little program.
>>
>> What I'm stuck on is how to get ahold of a cheap enough solution for 
>> massive
>> amounts of storage.  Anyone got any ideas for inexpensive storage space?
>>
>> Because handy backup encrypts everything before sending it to my servers
>> security doesn't have to be super good.
>> marlon
>>
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "Mike Hammett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>> Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 7:10 AM
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Do you provide backup services?
>>
>>
>> 
>>> I do, but I'm not happy with the provider I chose.  He just uses someone
>>> else's software, but it has so many files that it errors on, it's
>>> ridiculous
>>> I have to manually remove that file from the backup set and try again.
>>> With
>>> over a half million files...
>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>> Mike Hammett
>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>>> http://www.ics-il.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 3:19 AM
>>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>>> Subject: [WISPA] Do you provide backup services?
>>>
>>>   
 Do any of you provide backup data services to your broadband clients as 
 a
 value added or revenue improving service?

 Was it a success or failure?



 
 



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

 
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>   
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>> 
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
>
>   




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Re: [WISPA] MikroTik Multi-GigE and greater throughput... (was Cisco VLAN help)

One question I really would love to hear the answer to..

What version of 3.x are you using (if any) on those multi core/processor
Mikrotiks?

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 11:40 PM, Brad Belton <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I didn't want to hijack Travis's Cisco thread, but wanted to throw in my
> .02
> regarding MikroTik as a core router.
>
>
> We began running MikroTik as a core router sometime back in 2004 when our
> Cisco VXR DS3 router started to struggle.  We purchased a couple LMC DS3
> NICs from Eje at Wisp-Router and haven't looked back since.
>
> It was better than three years ago when we bench tested more than 800Mbps
> between MikroTik routers using older Intel Pro fiber NICs and standard
> 32bit
> PCI slots.  Over the years we have deployed numerous MikroTik routers with
> 24 or more 10/100 Interfaces, and several MikroTik routers with multiple
> Intel GigE Copper and Fiber Interfaces.
>
> Today our MikroTik routers have evolved to include motherboards with
> multiple PCIe x8 & x16 lane expansion slots, Quad core CPUs, 2Gig RAM,
> redundant hot-swap power supplies and multiple six port SFP NICs.  This
> latest generation of MikroTik router we are deploying are extremely fast,
> flexible, cost effective and most importantly reliable.
>
> The SFP NICs allow us to easily swap Interfaces from Copper GigE to SX
> fiber, LX fiber, ZX Fiber...all hot-swap without requiring the router to be
> powered down or rebooted.  The power supplies are diverse and redundant.
>  We
> can lose either power feed or power module or any combination of the two
> and
> still keep the router powered up.
>
> We are currently peering with three GigE upstream providers with a fourth
> GigE provider being turned up this week for unprecedented capacity and
> diversity for an ISP our size.  We are already exploring and evaluating
> 10GigE Interfaces as our requirements continue to increase.  We have no
> reason to believe the MikroTik platform will not continue to deliver the
> exceptional performance we have become accustomed to.
>
> Every client gets a MikroTik CPE router that we own and manage regardless
> of
> the medium used (microwave, copper, fiber etc.) to deliver their data
> circuit.  A MikroTik as a client CPE router gives us terrific flexibility
> and diagnostic abilities.  MikroTik allows us to provide the detailed
> information required to identify and resolve problems at the client side
> quickly and efficiently.  We have made countless "IT Guys" heroes in the
> eyes of their employers more times than I care to remember.  
>
> I firmly believe we would not be where we are today, offering the level of
> service we are able to provide without MikroTik at the core of our network.
>
> Best,
>
>
> Brad
>
>
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Gino Villarini
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 8:42 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>
> We are using HP Carrier Servers on our Core, Dual Xenon 2.8 Ghz, Dual
> PS, 2 GB Intel Nics with 3 PCIX 3 Port GB Cards for a total of 14 ports
> per Router
>
>
> Gino A. Villarini
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
> tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:38 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>
> I answer with a question.  What makes you think they couldn't do 100
> megs?
> I believe the original PowerRouter series does 5.9 gigabits and the
> latest series does 8 gigabits.
>
> I don't know how strong Mikrotik's VPLS offering is, but from what I've
> heard, VPLS is the way to go.
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions
> http://www.ics-il.com
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Josh Luthman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 8:13 P
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>
> > How can you possibly get 100 megs with Mikrotik?
> >
> > On 12/9/08, Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> >> I like the "THEY ARE PAYING FOR IT"!  :)  Nothing wrong with that.
> You
> >> should be able to do that with some high end MTs and EoIP Tunnels
> though
> >> :)
> >>
> >> --
> >> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
> >> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
> >> 314-735-0270
> >> http://www.linktechs.net 
> >>
> >> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
> >> /*
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Travis Johnson wrote:
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> Normally that is what we d

Re: [WISPA] Tricky infrastructure question

2008-12-09 Thread John Thomas

If you use managed switches on both ends that properly support 
EtherChannel and/or LACP, then your down time should be about 30 seconds 
or less as the trunks setup. The main thing is that you will want  the 
links as balanced as you can get them.

John Thomas


Ugo Bellavance wrote:
> Hi everyone
>
> We are using a pfsense firewall to protect some kind of WiFi campus.
>
> Here is the current setup:
>
>
> Building 1 [PfSense -> Netgear switch -> WiFi Antenna (1)] -> RF -> 
> Building 2 [WiFi Antenna -> Netgear switch -> Client computers].  We 
> have a few buildings that are all connected to the central antenna in 
> Building 1.
>
> We are currently using vlans because we have VoIP services going through 
> this and different kind of users.  Everything is working OK as of now. 
> However, the max bandwidth of one WiFi link like that is about 10 mbps. 
>   To increase the total bandwidth, we want to add another antenna in 
> Building 1.  We though of 2 ways to achieve what we want... Trunking 
> (EtherChannel) of another vlan.  We also tought of just trying to just 
> connect the extra antenna and see how it goes, but we were worried of 
> forming a loop.
>
> We found out that there are pros and cons to each approach:
>
> Trunking (EtherChannel):
>
> Pros:
> -> Probably the best fit for that purpose
> -> No other change to the architecture
> -> "Intelligent" load balancing between the two WiFi links
>
> Cons:
> -> We are not sure if the switch will be able to manage that correctly, 
> since it goes through the air.
> -> Must cause downtime for all end-users
>
> Extra Vlan
>
> Pros:
> -> We can prepare our setup in parallel, minimizing downtime, 0 downtime 
> even possible
>
> Cons:
> -> Many changes to the current setup
> -> Duplication of config
> -> Since our DHCP server is not on PFsense, we would have to put it on 
> PFsense or on the other vlan.
>
> Anyone has been in a similar situation?  All input would be appreciated.
>
> Regards,
>
> Ugo
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
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>
>
>
>   




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[WISPA] MikroTik Multi-GigE and greater throughput... (was Cisco VLAN help)

2008-12-09 Thread Brad Belton

I didn't want to hijack Travis's Cisco thread, but wanted to throw in my .02
regarding MikroTik as a core router.

We began running MikroTik as a core router sometime back in 2004 when our
Cisco VXR DS3 router started to struggle.  We purchased a couple LMC DS3
NICs from Eje at Wisp-Router and haven't looked back since.

It was better than three years ago when we bench tested more than 800Mbps
between MikroTik routers using older Intel Pro fiber NICs and standard 32bit
PCI slots.  Over the years we have deployed numerous MikroTik routers with
24 or more 10/100 Interfaces, and several MikroTik routers with multiple
Intel GigE Copper and Fiber Interfaces.

Today our MikroTik routers have evolved to include motherboards with
multiple PCIe x8 & x16 lane expansion slots, Quad core CPUs, 2Gig RAM,
redundant hot-swap power supplies and multiple six port SFP NICs.  This
latest generation of MikroTik router we are deploying are extremely fast,
flexible, cost effective and most importantly reliable.

The SFP NICs allow us to easily swap Interfaces from Copper GigE to SX
fiber, LX fiber, ZX Fiber...all hot-swap without requiring the router to be
powered down or rebooted.  The power supplies are diverse and redundant.  We
can lose either power feed or power module or any combination of the two and
still keep the router powered up.

We are currently peering with three GigE upstream providers with a fourth
GigE provider being turned up this week for unprecedented capacity and
diversity for an ISP our size.  We are already exploring and evaluating
10GigE Interfaces as our requirements continue to increase.  We have no
reason to believe the MikroTik platform will not continue to deliver the
exceptional performance we have become accustomed to.

Every client gets a MikroTik CPE router that we own and manage regardless of
the medium used (microwave, copper, fiber etc.) to deliver their data
circuit.  A MikroTik as a client CPE router gives us terrific flexibility
and diagnostic abilities.  MikroTik allows us to provide the detailed
information required to identify and resolve problems at the client side
quickly and efficiently.  We have made countless "IT Guys" heroes in the
eyes of their employers more times than I care to remember.  

I firmly believe we would not be where we are today, offering the level of
service we are able to provide without MikroTik at the core of our network.

Best,

Brad

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Gino Villarini
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 8:42 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

We are using HP Carrier Servers on our Core, Dual Xenon 2.8 Ghz, Dual
PS, 2 GB Intel Nics with 3 PCIX 3 Port GB Cards for a total of 14 ports
per Router 

Gino A. Villarini
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:38 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

I answer with a question.  What makes you think they couldn't do 100
megs? 
I believe the original PowerRouter series does 5.9 gigabits and the
latest series does 8 gigabits.

I don't know how strong Mikrotik's VPLS offering is, but from what I've
heard, VPLS is the way to go.

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

--
From: "Josh Luthman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 8:13 P
To: "WISPA General List" 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

> How can you possibly get 100 megs with Mikrotik?
>
> On 12/9/08, Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>> I like the "THEY ARE PAYING FOR IT"!  :)  Nothing wrong with that.
You
>> should be able to do that with some high end MTs and EoIP Tunnels
though
>> :)
>>
>> --
>> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
>> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
>> 314-735-0270
>> http://www.linktechs.net 
>>
>> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
>> /*
>>
>>
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> Normally that is what we do... using Cisco ASA firewalls and setting
>>> up VPN tunnels for the customers... however, this particular
customer
>>> needs the full 100Mbps between the ports and "transparent"
>>> transport... and they are paying for it... :)
>>>
>>> Travis
>>> Microserv
>>>
>>> Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs wrote:
 Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No
 configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are
the
 same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop" 
 issues.

 --
 * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Tra

Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help





Ok. When I bring the ring back up, the switch we have running spanning
tree changes VLAN1 to "blocking" on one port, but the VLAN150 still
shows "forwarding"... and creates a loop on VLAN150. Where do I start?
I'm not sure what to even look for or how to troubleshoot this?

Travis
Microserv

Matt Liotta wrote:

  Check and see if you are running PVST, which runs spanning tree on  
each VLAN.

-Matt

On Dec 9, 2008, at 7:30 PM, Travis Johnson wrote:

  
  
Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the  
vlan
setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... but  
the
problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep from
having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the
spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does block
the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN  
never
gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.

Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find
anything that I missed to make it work...

Travis
Microserv

Eric Rogers wrote:


  Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is  
the
status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
VLANs active.



Eric



From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help



Hi,

By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are  
allowed
(I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
did not display on the sho conf afterward).

Travis
Microserv

Patrick Shoemaker wrote:

Travis Johnson wrote:


	Hi,
	
	I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
	
	I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
via the
	GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
trying
	to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
ports so
	they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
setup in
	VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
trunking ports.
	There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
	
	I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
directly
	connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
	
	What am I missing?
	
	Travis
	Microserv
	
	
	


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Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:

switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx

A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.





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[WISPA] OT: FCC investigation.

2008-12-09 Thread Scottie Arnett

For immediate release: Tuesday, December 9, 2008 Contact: Jodi Seth/Dingell,
202-225-5735 // Nick Choate/Stupak, 202-225-4735

Committee Releases Staff Report on Findings of FCC Investigation

Washington, DC Reps. John D. Dingell (D-MI), Chairman of the
Committee on Energy and Commerce, and Bart Stupak (D-MI), Chairman of
the Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations, today released a Committee on
Energy and Commerce Majority Staff report detailing the findings of the
Committees bipartisan investigation relating to the Federal Communications
Commission (FCC).

Our investigation confirmed a number of troubling allegations raised
by individuals in and outside the FCC, Stupak said. The Committee
staff report details some of the most egregious abuses of power,
suppression of information and manipulation of data under Chairman
Martins leadership. It is my hope that this report will serve as a
roadmap for a fair, open and efficient FCC under new leadership in the
next administration.

Any of these findings, individually, are
cause for concern, said Dingell. Together, the findings suggest that,
in recent years, the FCC has operated in a dysfunctional manner and
Commission business has suffered as a result. It is my hope that the
new FCC Chairman will find this report instructive and that it will
prove useful in helping the Commission avoid making the same mistakes.

The report, titled Deception and Distrust:
The Federal Communications Commission Under Chairman Kevin J. Martin,
is the culmination of a bipartisan investigation into the FCCs
regulatory processes and management practices that was formally
launched on January 8, 2008.

Read the Report (pdf)

http://energycommerce.house.gov/images/stories/Documents/PDF/Newsroom/fcc%20majority%20staff%20report%20081209.pdf

http://energycommerce.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1455&Itemid=1

Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth.
Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information.

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Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

We are using HP Carrier Servers on our Core, Dual Xenon 2.8 Ghz, Dual
PS, 2 GB Intel Nics with 3 PCIX 3 Port GB Cards for a total of 14 ports
per Router 


Gino A. Villarini
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:38 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

I answer with a question.  What makes you think they couldn't do 100
megs? 
I believe the original PowerRouter series does 5.9 gigabits and the
latest series does 8 gigabits.

I don't know how strong Mikrotik's VPLS offering is, but from what I've
heard, VPLS is the way to go.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com



--
From: "Josh Luthman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 8:13 PM
To: "WISPA General List" 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

> How can you possibly get 100 megs with Mikrotik?
>
> On 12/9/08, Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>> I like the "THEY ARE PAYING FOR IT"!  :)  Nothing wrong with that.
You
>> should be able to do that with some high end MTs and EoIP Tunnels
though
>> :)
>>
>> --
>> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
>> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
>> 314-735-0270
>> http://www.linktechs.net 
>>
>> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
>> /*
>>
>>
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> Normally that is what we do... using Cisco ASA firewalls and setting
>>> up VPN tunnels for the customers... however, this particular
customer
>>> needs the full 100Mbps between the ports and "transparent"
>>> transport... and they are paying for it... :)
>>>
>>> Travis
>>> Microserv
>>>
>>> Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs wrote:
 Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No
 configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are
the
 same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop" 
 issues.

 --
 * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
 Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
 314-735-0270
 http://www.linktechs.net 

 */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line
Training
 /*



 Travis Johnson wrote:

> Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have
the 
> vlan
>
> setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now...
but 
> the
>
> problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep
from
> having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the
> spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does
block
> the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN 
> never
> gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.
>
> Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find
> anything that I missed to make it work...
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Eric Rogers wrote:
>
>
>> Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what
is 
>> the
>> status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also
trunking
>> VLANs active.
>>
>>
>>
>> Eric
>>
>>
>>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
>> On
>> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are
>> allowed
>> (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all"
and it
>> did not display on the sho conf afterward).
>>
>> Travis
>> Microserv
>>
>> Patrick Shoemaker wrote:
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>>
>> I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
>> via the
>> GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
>> trying
>> to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
>> ports so
>> they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
>> setup in
>> VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
>> trunking ports.
>> There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>>
>> I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
>> directly
>> connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>>

Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

I answer with a question.  What makes you think they couldn't do 100 megs? 
I believe the original PowerRouter series does 5.9 gigabits and the latest 
series does 8 gigabits.

I don't know how strong Mikrotik's VPLS offering is, but from what I've 
heard, VPLS is the way to go.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com



--
From: "Josh Luthman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 8:13 PM
To: "WISPA General List" 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

> How can you possibly get 100 megs with Mikrotik?
>
> On 12/9/08, Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> I like the "THEY ARE PAYING FOR IT"!  :)  Nothing wrong with that.  You
>> should be able to do that with some high end MTs and EoIP Tunnels though
>> :)
>>
>> --
>> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
>> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
>> 314-735-0270
>> http://www.linktechs.net 
>>
>> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
>> /*
>>
>>
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> Normally that is what we do... using Cisco ASA firewalls and setting
>>> up VPN tunnels for the customers... however, this particular customer
>>> needs the full 100Mbps between the ports and "transparent"
>>> transport... and they are paying for it... :)
>>>
>>> Travis
>>> Microserv
>>>
>>> Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs wrote:
 Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No
 configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are the
 same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop" 
 issues.

 --
 * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
 Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
 314-735-0270
 http://www.linktechs.net 

 */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
 /*



 Travis Johnson wrote:

> Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the 
> vlan
>
> setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... but 
> the
>
> problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep from
> having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the
> spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does block
> the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN 
> never
> gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.
>
> Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find
> anything that I missed to make it work...
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Eric Rogers wrote:
>
>
>> Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is 
>> the
>> status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
>> VLANs active.
>>
>>
>>
>> Eric
>>
>>
>>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
>> On
>> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are
>> allowed
>> (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
>> did not display on the sho conf afterward).
>>
>> Travis
>> Microserv
>>
>> Patrick Shoemaker wrote:
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>>
>> I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
>> via the
>> GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
>> trying
>> to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
>> ports so
>> they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
>> setup in
>> VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
>> trunking ports.
>> There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>>
>> I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
>> directly
>> connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>>
>> What am I missing?
>>
>> Travis
>> Microserv
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>
>> 
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wisp

Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

Well, we can... But we only use them as POP routers  We have a
couple with Metro Ethernet Fiber Backhauls running 100 mbps to our Core
facility, doing MPLS / VPLS ... No wireless stuff, we are a Moto shop


Those are RB1000 btw ... 


Gino A. Villarini
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:14 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

How can you possibly get 100 megs with Mikrotik?

On 12/9/08, Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I like the "THEY ARE PAYING FOR IT"!  :)  Nothing wrong with that.  
> You should be able to do that with some high end MTs and EoIP Tunnels 
> though
> :)
>
> --
> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer Link 
> Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services* 314-735-0270 
> http://www.linktechs.net 
>
> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
> /*
>
>
>
> Travis Johnson wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Normally that is what we do... using Cisco ASA firewalls and setting 
>> up VPN tunnels for the customers... however, this particular customer

>> needs the full 100Mbps between the ports and "transparent"
>> transport... and they are paying for it... :)
>>
>> Travis
>> Microserv
>>
>> Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs wrote:
>>> Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No 
>>> configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are 
>>> the same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop"
issues.
>>>
>>> --
>>> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer Link 
>>> Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services* 314-735-0270 
>>> http://www.linktechs.net 
>>>
>>> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
>>> /*
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>>
 Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the

 vlan

 setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... 
 but the

 problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep 
 from having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, 
 the spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does

 block the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new 
 VLAN never gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.

 Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find 
 anything that I missed to make it work...

 Travis
 Microserv

 Eric Rogers wrote:


> Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is

> the status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also 
> trunking VLANs active.
>
>
>
> Eric
>
>
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>
>
>
> Hi,
>
> By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are 
> allowed (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan 
> all" and it did not display on the sho conf afterward).
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Patrick Shoemaker wrote:
>
> Travis Johnson wrote:
>
>
>   Hi,
>   
>   I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>   
>   I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected 
> via the
>   GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am 
> trying
>   to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet 
> ports so
>   they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch 
> setup in
>   VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
trunking 
> ports.
>   There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>   
>   I have this setup between two other offices, but they are 
> directly
>   connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>   
>   What am I missing?
>   
>   Travis
>   Microserv
>   
>   
>   
> --
> --
> 
>   WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>   http://signup.wispa.org/
>   
> --
> --
> 
>   
>   WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>   
>   Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>   http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>   
>   Archives: http://lists.w

Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

How can you possibly get 100 megs with Mikrotik?

On 12/9/08, Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I like the "THEY ARE PAYING FOR IT"!  :)  Nothing wrong with that.  You
> should be able to do that with some high end MTs and EoIP Tunnels though
> :)
>
> --
> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
> 314-735-0270
> http://www.linktechs.net 
>
> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
> /*
>
>
>
> Travis Johnson wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Normally that is what we do... using Cisco ASA firewalls and setting
>> up VPN tunnels for the customers... however, this particular customer
>> needs the full 100Mbps between the ports and "transparent"
>> transport... and they are paying for it... :)
>>
>> Travis
>> Microserv
>>
>> Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs wrote:
>>> Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No
>>> configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are the
>>> same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop" issues.
>>>
>>> --
>>> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
>>> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
>>> 314-735-0270
>>> http://www.linktechs.net 
>>>
>>> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
>>> /*
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>>
 Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the vlan

 setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... but the

 problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep from
 having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the
 spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does block
 the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN never
 gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.

 Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find
 anything that I missed to make it work...

 Travis
 Microserv

 Eric Rogers wrote:


> Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is the
> status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
> VLANs active.
>
>
>
> Eric
>
>
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>
>
>
> Hi,
>
> By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are
> allowed
> (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
> did not display on the sho conf afterward).
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Patrick Shoemaker wrote:
>
> Travis Johnson wrote:
>
>
>   Hi,
>   
>   I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>   
>   I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
> via the
>   GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
> trying
>   to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
> ports so
>   they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
> setup in
>   VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
> trunking ports.
>   There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>   
>   I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
> directly
>   connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>   
>   What am I missing?
>   
>   Travis
>   Microserv
>   
>   
>   
> 
> 
>   WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>   http://signup.wispa.org/
>   
> 
> 
>   
>   WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>   
>   Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>   http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>   
>   Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>   
>   
>
> Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:
>
> switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx
>
> A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscrib

Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

Matt, 

This is for the 3550 right ... Cant be done on the 2950's? 

Gino A. Villarini
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Matt Liotta
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 9:26 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

Just be careful if they want to do there own VLANs. If they do you will
need to dot1q tunnel them. Cisco has made it easy in that all you have
to do in addition to what you do now with a single VLAN is add the
switchport dot1q tunnel command to their interface on either side.  
The VLAN stack takes another 4 bytes so you will need to raise your
backbone's MTU to at least 1504 to support your customer running a 1500
MTU.

-Matt

On Dec 9, 2008, at 7:47 PM, Travis Johnson wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Normally that is what we do... using Cisco ASA firewalls and setting 
> up VPN tunnels for the customers... however, this particular customer 
> needs the full 100Mbps between the ports and "transparent"
> transport... and they are paying for it... :)
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs wrote:
>>
>> Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No 
>> configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are the

>> same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop"
>> issues.
>>
>> --
>> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer Link 
>> Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services* 314-735-0270 
>> http://www.linktechs.net 
>>
>> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
>> /*
>>
>>
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>
>>> Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the 
>>> vlan setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working 
>>> now...
>>> but the
>>> problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep 
>>> from having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, 
>>> the spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does 
>>> block the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new 
>>> VLAN never gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.
>>>
>>> Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find 
>>> anything that I missed to make it work...
>>>
>>> Travis
>>> Microserv
>>>
>>> Eric Rogers wrote:
>>>
>>>
 Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is 
 the status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also 
 trunking VLANs active.

 Eric

 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Travis Johnson
 Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

 Hi,

 By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are  
 allowed
 (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all"  
 and it
 did not display on the sho conf afterward).

 Travis
 Microserv

 Patrick Shoemaker wrote:

 Travis Johnson wrote:

Hi,

I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.

I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
 via the
GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
 trying
to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
 ports so
they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
 setup in
VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
 trunking ports.
There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.

I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
 directly
connected to each other, with no other switches in between.

What am I missing?

Travis
Microserv

WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

 Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with  
 command:

 switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx

 A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.

 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/

Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

2008-12-09 Thread Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs

I like the "THEY ARE PAYING FOR IT"!  :)  Nothing wrong with that.  You 
should be able to do that with some high end MTs and EoIP Tunnels though 
:) 

--
* Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
314-735-0270
http://www.linktechs.net 

*/ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training 
/*



Travis Johnson wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Normally that is what we do... using Cisco ASA firewalls and setting 
> up VPN tunnels for the customers... however, this particular customer 
> needs the full 100Mbps between the ports and "transparent" 
> transport... and they are paying for it... :)
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs wrote:
>> Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No 
>> configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are the 
>> same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop" issues.
>>
>> --
>> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
>> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
>> 314-735-0270
>> http://www.linktechs.net 
>>
>> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training 
>> /*
>>
>>
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>   
>>> Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the vlan 
>>> setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... but the 
>>> problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep from 
>>> having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the 
>>> spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does block 
>>> the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN never 
>>> gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.
>>>
>>> Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find 
>>> anything that I missed to make it work...
>>>
>>> Travis
>>> Microserv
>>>
>>> Eric Rogers wrote:
>>>   
>>> 
 Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is the
 status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
 VLANs active.

  

 Eric

  

 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
 Behalf Of Travis Johnson
 Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

  

 Hi,

 By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are allowed
 (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
 did not display on the sho conf afterward).

 Travis
 Microserv

 Patrick Shoemaker wrote: 

 Travis Johnson wrote:
   

Hi,
 
I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
 
I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
 via the 
GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
 trying 
to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
 ports so 
they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
 setup in 
VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
 trunking ports. 
There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
 
I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
 directly 
connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
 
What am I missing?
 
Travis
Microserv
 
 

 
 
WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

 
 
 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
 
Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
  


 Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:
  
 switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx
  
 A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.
  
   


 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 
  
 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/


   
 
   
>>> -

Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

2008-12-09 Thread Matt Liotta

Just be careful if they want to do there own VLANs. If they do you  
will need to dot1q tunnel them. Cisco has made it easy in that all you  
have to do in addition to what you do now with a single VLAN is add  
the switchport dot1q tunnel command to their interface on either side.  
The VLAN stack takes another 4 bytes so you will need to raise your  
backbone's MTU to at least 1504 to support your customer running a  
1500 MTU.

-Matt

On Dec 9, 2008, at 7:47 PM, Travis Johnson wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Normally that is what we do... using Cisco ASA firewalls and setting  
> up VPN tunnels for the customers... however, this particular  
> customer needs the full 100Mbps between the ports and "transparent"  
> transport... and they are paying for it... :)
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs wrote:
>>
>> Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No
>> configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are the
>> same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop"  
>> issues.
>>
>> --
>> * Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
>> Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
>> 314-735-0270
>> http://www.linktechs.net 
>>
>> */ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
>> /*
>>
>>
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>
>>> Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have  
>>> the vlan
>>> setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now...  
>>> but the
>>> problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep  
>>> from
>>> having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the
>>> spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does  
>>> block
>>> the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN  
>>> never
>>> gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.
>>>
>>> Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find
>>> anything that I missed to make it work...
>>>
>>> Travis
>>> Microserv
>>>
>>> Eric Rogers wrote:
>>>
>>>
 Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what  
 is the
 status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also  
 trunking
 VLANs active.

 Eric

 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] On
 Behalf Of Travis Johnson
 Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

 Hi,

 By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are  
 allowed
 (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all"  
 and it
 did not display on the sho conf afterward).

 Travis
 Microserv

 Patrick Shoemaker wrote:

 Travis Johnson wrote:

Hi,

I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.

I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
 via the
GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
 trying
to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
 ports so
they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
 setup in
VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
 trunking ports.
There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.

I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
 directly
connected to each other, with no other switches in between.

What am I missing?

Travis
Microserv

WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/

WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

 Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with  
 command:

 switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx

 A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.

 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

>>> ---

Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

2008-12-09 Thread Matt Liotta

Check and see if you are running PVST, which runs spanning tree on  
each VLAN.

-Matt

On Dec 9, 2008, at 7:30 PM, Travis Johnson wrote:

> Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the  
> vlan
> setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... but  
> the
> problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep from
> having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the
> spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does block
> the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN  
> never
> gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.
>
> Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find
> anything that I missed to make it work...
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Eric Rogers wrote:
>> Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is  
>> the
>> status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
>> VLANs active.
>>
>>
>>
>> Eric
>>
>>
>>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:wireless- 
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are  
>> allowed
>> (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
>> did not display on the sho conf afterward).
>>
>> Travis
>> Microserv
>>
>> Patrick Shoemaker wrote:
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>
>>
>>  Hi,
>>  
>>  I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>>  
>>  I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
>> via the
>>  GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
>> trying
>>  to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
>> ports so
>>  they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
>> setup in
>>  VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
>> trunking ports.
>>  There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>>  
>>  I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
>> directly
>>  connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>>  
>>  What am I missing?
>>  
>>  Travis
>>  Microserv
>>  
>>  
>>  
>> 
>> 
>>  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>  http://signup.wispa.org/
>>  
>> 
>> 
>>  
>>  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>  
>>  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>  
>>  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>  
>>  
>>
>> Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:
>>
>> switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx
>>
>> A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/




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Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

VPLS all the way!

WE used to do it on L2 with Cisco, just like you... After more than 80
circuits like this, most of them multi site... We area migrating to
Mikrotik MPLS/VPLS and loving it!

BTW on Cisco switches you have to define STP per Vlan, don't ask for the
command line... We use the Cisco GUI 


Gino A. Villarini
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 8:44 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No
configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are the
same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop" issues.

--
* Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer Link
Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services* 314-735-0270
http://www.linktechs.net 

*/ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training
/*



Travis Johnson wrote:
> Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the
vlan 
> setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... but
the 
> problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep from

> having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the 
> spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does block 
> the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN
never 
> gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.
>
> Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find 
> anything that I missed to make it work...
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Eric Rogers wrote:
>   
>> Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is
the
>> status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
>> VLANs active.
>>
>>  
>>
>> Eric
>>
>>  
>>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
>> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>>
>>  
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are
allowed
>> (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
>> did not display on the sho conf afterward).
>>
>> Travis
>> Microserv
>>
>> Patrick Shoemaker wrote: 
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>   
>>
>>  Hi,
>>   
>>  I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>>   
>>  I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
>> via the 
>>  GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
>> trying 
>>  to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
>> ports so 
>>  they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
>> setup in 
>>  VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
>> trunking ports. 
>>  There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>>   
>>  I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
>> directly 
>>  connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>>   
>>  What am I missing?
>>   
>>  Travis
>>  Microserv
>>   
>>   
>>  
>>

>> 
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>>  http://signup.wispa.org/
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>>  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
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>>
>>  
>>
>> Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:
>>  
>> switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx
>>  
>> A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.
>>  
>>   
>>
>>
>>


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--

Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help





Hi,

Normally that is what we do... using Cisco ASA firewalls and setting up
VPN tunnels for the customers... however, this particular customer
needs the full 100Mbps between the ports and "transparent" transport...
and they are paying for it... :)

Travis
Microserv

Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs wrote:

  Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No 
configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are the 
same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop" issues.

--
* Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
314-735-0270
http://www.linktechs.net 

*/ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training 
/*



Travis Johnson wrote:
  
  
Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the vlan 
setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... but the 
problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep from 
having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the 
spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does block 
the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN never 
gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.

Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find 
anything that I missed to make it work...

Travis
Microserv

Eric Rogers wrote:
  


  Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is the
status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
VLANs active.

 

Eric

 

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

 

Hi,

By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are allowed
(I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
did not display on the sho conf afterward).

Travis
Microserv

Patrick Shoemaker wrote: 

Travis Johnson wrote:
  

	Hi,
	 
	I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
	 
	I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
via the 
	GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
trying 
	to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
ports so 
	they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
setup in 
	VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
trunking ports. 
	There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
	 
	I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
directly 
	connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
	 
	What am I missing?
	 
	Travis
	Microserv
	 
	 
	


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Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:
 
switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx
 
A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.
 
  



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Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

2008-12-09 Thread Dennis Burgess - LinkTechs

Just a FYI, I would just create a tunnel between the two sites.  No 
configuration on your backend network, bandwidth restrictions are the 
same as internet traffic typically, etc.  Simpler, and no "loop" issues.

--
* Dennis Burgess, CCNA, A+, Mikrotik Certified Trainer
Link Technologies, Inc -- Mikrotik & WISP Support Services*
314-735-0270
http://www.linktechs.net 

*/ Link Technologies, Inc is offering LIVE Mikrotik On-Line Training 
/*



Travis Johnson wrote:
> Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the vlan 
> setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... but the 
> problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep from 
> having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the 
> spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does block 
> the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN never 
> gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.
>
> Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find 
> anything that I missed to make it work...
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Eric Rogers wrote:
>   
>> Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is the
>> status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
>> VLANs active.
>>
>>  
>>
>> Eric
>>
>>  
>>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>>
>>  
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are allowed
>> (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
>> did not display on the sho conf afterward).
>>
>> Travis
>> Microserv
>>
>> Patrick Shoemaker wrote: 
>>
>> Travis Johnson wrote:
>>   
>>
>>  Hi,
>>   
>>  I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>>   
>>  I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
>> via the 
>>  GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
>> trying 
>>  to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
>> ports so 
>>  they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
>> setup in 
>>  VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
>> trunking ports. 
>>  There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>>   
>>  I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
>> directly 
>>  connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>>   
>>  What am I missing?
>>   
>>  Travis
>>  Microserv
>>   
>>   
>>  
>> 
>> 
>>  WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>  http://signup.wispa.org/
>>  
>> 
>> 
>>   
>>  WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>   
>>  Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>  http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>   
>>  Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>  
>>
>> Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:
>>  
>> switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx
>>  
>> A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.
>>  
>>   
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>  
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>
>>
>>   
>> 
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

Ok... found the original problem... a few switches did not have the vlan 
setup in the vlan database. So the VLAN is up and working now... but the 
problem is because we have a "ring", we use Spanning Tree to keep from 
having a loop in the network. But when we bring up the VLAN, the 
spanning-tree does not start blocking the VLAN traffic. It does block 
the "normal" VLAN1 traffic (like it always has), but the new VLAN never 
gets "blocked", so it creates a loop around the ring.

Am I missing something? I've checked the settings and can't find 
anything that I missed to make it work...

Travis
Microserv

Eric Rogers wrote:
> Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is the
> status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
> VLANs active.
>
>  
>
> Eric
>
>  
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Travis Johnson
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help
>
>  
>
> Hi,
>
> By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are allowed
> (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
> did not display on the sho conf afterward).
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
> Patrick Shoemaker wrote: 
>
> Travis Johnson wrote:
>   
>
>   Hi,
>
>   I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>
>   I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
> via the 
>   GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
> trying 
>   to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
> ports so 
>   they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
> setup in 
>   VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
> trunking ports. 
>   There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>
>   I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
> directly 
>   connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>
>   What am I missing?
>
>   Travis
>   Microserv
>
>
>   
> 
> 
>   WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>   http://signup.wispa.org/
>   
> 
> 
>
>   WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
>   Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>   http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>   Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
> 
>   
>
> Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:
>  
> switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx
>  
> A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.
>  
>   
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
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>   



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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

2008-12-09 Thread Matt

> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/12/05/richard_bennett_bittorrent_udp/

Would it not make sense for bittorrrent clients to have a preference
to share with users under the same AS number?  Would not help much on
last mile but might on Internet backbone.

Matt



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Re: [WISPA] cabinets

2008-12-09 Thread Blake Bowers

Gino,

I can't get through Barracuda.  If you want to give me a call
I will give you pricing.

417-257-


Don't take your organs to heaven,
heaven knows we need them down here!
Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.

- Original Message - 
From: "Gino Villarini" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 3:48 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets


> How much?
>
>
> Gino A. Villarini
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
> tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Blake Bowers
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:43 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets
>
> Yep, dana has some nice deals.
>
> I am however selling these, not buying.
>
>
> Don't take your organs to heaven,
> heaven knows we need them down here!
> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Randy Cosby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 3:11 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets
>
>
>> http://www.telepp.com/bargains.html
>>
>> Some pretty good looking deals there
>>
>>
>> Blake Bowers wrote:
>>> yes.
>>>
>>> http://tinyurl.com/6r4ptk
>>>
>>> Infinity outdoor cabinets by Tyco.
>>>
>>>
>>> Don't take your organs to heaven,
>>> heaven knows we need them down here!
>>> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>>>
>>> - Original Message - 
>>> From: "Matt Jenkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:52 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets
>>>
>>>
>>>
 Are you talking outdoor full rack cabinets?

 Blake Bowers wrote:

> There has been a lot of talk about cabinets.
>
> If someone had a really good deal on them, and was
> willing to give a discount to the people on the list,
> would it be acceptable to post it here?
>
> Don't take your organs to heaven,
> heaven knows we need them down here!
> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>
>
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
> 
>
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>
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>
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> 
> 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/

> 
> 

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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
> 
> 
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>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>>
> 
> 
>>>
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>>>
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>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> Randy Cosby
>> Vice President
>> InfoWest, Inc
>>
>> office: 435-773-6071
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 
> 
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>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

2008-12-09 Thread Eric Rogers

Try a "show interface fastethernet x/y switchport" and see what is the
status of the port and that trunking VLANs enabled are also trunking
VLANs active.

 

Eric

 

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:17 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

 

Hi,

By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are allowed
(I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all" and it
did not display on the sho conf afterward).

Travis
Microserv

Patrick Shoemaker wrote: 

Travis Johnson wrote:
  

Hi,
 
I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
 
I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected
via the 
GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am
trying 
to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet
ports so 
they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch
setup in 
VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as
trunking ports. 
There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
 
I have this setup between two other offices, but they are
directly 
connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
 
What am I missing?
 
Travis
Microserv
 
 



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Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:
 
switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx
 
A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.
 
  



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Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help





Hi,

By default, when doing the switchport mode trunk, all VLAN's are
allowed (I even issued the command "switchport trunk allowed vlan all"
and it did not display on the sho conf afterward).

Travis
Microserv

Patrick Shoemaker wrote:

  Travis Johnson wrote:
  
  
Hi,

I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.

I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected via the 
GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am trying 
to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet ports so 
they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch setup in 
VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as trunking ports. 
There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.

I have this setup between two other offices, but they are directly 
connected to each other, with no other switches in between.

What am I missing?

Travis
Microserv



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  Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:

switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx

A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.

  






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Re: [WISPA] cabinets

How much? 


Gino A. Villarini
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
tel  787.273.4143   fax   787.273.4145

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Blake Bowers
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 5:43 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets

Yep, dana has some nice deals.

I am however selling these, not buying.


Don't take your organs to heaven,
heaven knows we need them down here!
Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.

- Original Message -
From: "Randy Cosby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 3:11 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets


> http://www.telepp.com/bargains.html
>
> Some pretty good looking deals there
>
>
> Blake Bowers wrote:
>> yes.
>>
>> http://tinyurl.com/6r4ptk
>>
>> Infinity outdoor cabinets by Tyco.
>>
>>
>> Don't take your organs to heaven,
>> heaven knows we need them down here!
>> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>>
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "Matt Jenkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:52 PM
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets
>>
>>
>>
>>> Are you talking outdoor full rack cabinets?
>>>
>>> Blake Bowers wrote:
>>>
 There has been a lot of talk about cabinets.

 If someone had a really good deal on them, and was
 willing to give a discount to the people on the list,
 would it be acceptable to post it here?

 Don't take your organs to heaven,
 heaven knows we need them down here!
 Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.






 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/




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>>>


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>>>
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>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>


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>
> -- 
> Randy Cosby
> Vice President
> InfoWest, Inc
>
> office: 435-773-6071
>
>
>
>
>


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Re: [WISPA] cabinets

2008-12-09 Thread Blake Bowers

Yep, dana has some nice deals.

I am however selling these, not buying.


Don't take your organs to heaven,
heaven knows we need them down here!
Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.

- Original Message - 
From: "Randy Cosby" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 3:11 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets


> http://www.telepp.com/bargains.html
>
> Some pretty good looking deals there
>
>
> Blake Bowers wrote:
>> yes.
>>
>> http://tinyurl.com/6r4ptk
>>
>> Infinity outdoor cabinets by Tyco.
>>
>>
>> Don't take your organs to heaven,
>> heaven knows we need them down here!
>> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>>
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "Matt Jenkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "WISPA General List" 
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:52 PM
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets
>>
>>
>>
>>> Are you talking outdoor full rack cabinets?
>>>
>>> Blake Bowers wrote:
>>>
 There has been a lot of talk about cabinets.

 If someone had a really good deal on them, and was
 willing to give a discount to the people on the list,
 would it be acceptable to post it here?

 Don't take your organs to heaven,
 heaven knows we need them down here!
 Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.



 
 WISPA Wants You! Join today!
 http://signup.wispa.org/
 

 WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

 Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

 Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

>>> 
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>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> 
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>
> -- 
> Randy Cosby
> Vice President
> InfoWest, Inc
>
> office: 435-773-6071
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

2008-12-09 Thread Jon Auer

Have you added the VLAN to the VLAN database on all the switches
between them? (Assuming you are not usinh VTP) That's what I usually
forget.

(On 2900/3500)
# vlan database
# vlan NNN name blah
# apply
# exit

On 12/9/08, Travis Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>
> I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected via the
> GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am trying
> to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet ports so
> they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch setup in
> VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as trunking ports.
> There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>
> I have this setup between two other offices, but they are directly
> connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

2008-12-09 Thread Patrick Shoemaker

Travis Johnson wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.
>
> I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected via the 
> GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am trying 
> to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet ports so 
> they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch setup in 
> VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as trunking ports. 
> There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.
>
> I have this setup between two other offices, but they are directly 
> connected to each other, with no other switches in between.
>
> What am I missing?
>
> Travis
> Microserv
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
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>   
Is each trunk port in the path set to forward the VLAN with command:

switchport trunk allowed vlan xxx

A sh int for an example trunk and access port would be handy.

-- 
Patrick Shoemaker
Vector Data Systems LLC
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
office: (301) 358-1690 x36
http://www.vectordatasystems.com 





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[WISPA] Cisco VLAN help

Hi,

I need some Cisco switch VLAN help.

I currently have about 60 Cisco 3500 series switches connected via the 
GBIC ports all in a ring configuration with spanning tree. I am trying 
to setup a VLAN for a customer between two of the FastEthernet ports so 
they can connect their offices. I have port 5 on each switch setup in 
VLAN105 and every GBIC port on all the switches setup as trunking ports. 
There are 17 other cisco switches between these two.

I have this setup between two other offices, but they are directly 
connected to each other, with no other switches in between.

What am I missing?

Travis
Microserv



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Re: [WISPA] cabinets

http://www.telepp.com/bargains.html

Some pretty good looking deals there


Blake Bowers wrote:
> yes.
>
> http://tinyurl.com/6r4ptk
>
> Infinity outdoor cabinets by Tyco.
>
>
> Don't take your organs to heaven,
> heaven knows we need them down here!
> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Matt Jenkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "WISPA General List" 
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:52 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets
>
>
>   
>> Are you talking outdoor full rack cabinets?
>>
>> Blake Bowers wrote:
>> 
>>> There has been a lot of talk about cabinets.
>>>
>>> If someone had a really good deal on them, and was
>>> willing to give a discount to the people on the list,
>>> would it be acceptable to post it here?
>>>
>>> Don't take your organs to heaven,
>>> heaven knows we need them down here!
>>> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>>> 
>>>
>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>>
>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>>
>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>>>   
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 
>> 
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
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> 
>  
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>
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>   

-- 
Randy Cosby
Vice President
InfoWest, Inc

office: 435-773-6071





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Re: [WISPA] cabinets

2008-12-09 Thread Blake Bowers

yes.

http://tinyurl.com/6r4ptk

Infinity outdoor cabinets by Tyco.


Don't take your organs to heaven,
heaven knows we need them down here!
Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.

- Original Message - 
From: "Matt Jenkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:52 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] cabinets


> Are you talking outdoor full rack cabinets?
>
> Blake Bowers wrote:
>> There has been a lot of talk about cabinets.
>>
>> If someone had a really good deal on them, and was
>> willing to give a discount to the people on the list,
>> would it be acceptable to post it here?
>>
>> Don't take your organs to heaven,
>> heaven knows we need them down here!
>> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
>> 
>>
>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>>
>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
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Re: [WISPA] cabinets

2008-12-09 Thread Matt Jenkins

Are you talking outdoor full rack cabinets?

Blake Bowers wrote:
> There has been a lot of talk about cabinets.
> 
> If someone had a really good deal on them, and was
> willing to give a discount to the people on the list, 
> would it be acceptable to post it here?
> 
> Don't take your organs to heaven, 
> heaven knows we need them down here!
> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
>  
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
> 
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> 
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

Probably a better source here:

http://www.networkworld.com/news/2008/071708-comcast-fcc.html

 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jeff Broadwick
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 3:38 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

Here is an article that outlines what happened.  I don't agree with the
slant of the writer, but the info you are looking for is there.

http://www.naturalnews.com/024391.html

Jeff
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:33 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

Can you go into detail on to what happened or some information to it?  All I
saw was the nice and clean "500gigs/mo is enough for everyone, we're
limiting torrent traffic" announcements.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 2:30 PM, Jeff Broadwick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Actually they got in trouble for both lying and what they were 
> actually doing.
>
> Jeff
>
>  _
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On Behalf Of Blair Davis
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:09 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>
>
> If you put it in your AUP, and make sure your users know about it, 
> then you are fine.
>
> It is the hiding of it and lying about it that got comcast in trouble.
>
> Jeff Broadwick wrote:
>
> That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
>
> hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If 
> a
>
> customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not 
> blocking
>
> ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
>
> internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
>
> theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!
>
>
>
> You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of 
> congestion.
>
>
>
> "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"
>
>
>
> Jeff
>
> ImageStream
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> On
>
> Behalf Of Butch Evans
>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
>
> To: WISPA General List
>
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>
>
>
> On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
>
>
>
> Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.
>
>
>
>
>
> Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  
> It
>
> will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as 
> network
>
> utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.
>
>
>
> --
>
> 
>
> * Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
>
> * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
>
> * http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
>
> * http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> --
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
>
> --
> --
>
> 
>
>
>
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>
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> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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> --
> --
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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

Here is an article that outlines what happened.  I don't agree with the
slant of the writer, but the info you are looking for is there.

http://www.naturalnews.com/024391.html

Jeff
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:33 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

Can you go into detail on to what happened or some information to it?  All I
saw was the nice and clean "500gigs/mo is enough for everyone, we're
limiting torrent traffic" announcements.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 2:30 PM, Jeff Broadwick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Actually they got in trouble for both lying and what they were 
> actually doing.
>
> Jeff
>
>  _
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> On Behalf Of Blair Davis
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:09 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>
>
> If you put it in your AUP, and make sure your users know about it, 
> then you are fine.
>
> It is the hiding of it and lying about it that got comcast in trouble.
>
> Jeff Broadwick wrote:
>
> That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
>
> hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If 
> a
>
> customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not 
> blocking
>
> ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
>
> internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
>
> theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!
>
>
>
> You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of 
> congestion.
>
>
>
> "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"
>
>
>
> Jeff
>
> ImageStream
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
> On
>
> Behalf Of Butch Evans
>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
>
> To: WISPA General List
>
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>
>
>
> On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
>
>
>
> Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.
>
>
>
>
>
> Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  
> It
>
> will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as 
> network
>
> utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.
>
>
>
> --
>
> 
>
> * Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
>
> * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
>
> * http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
>
> * http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *
>
> 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> --
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
>
> --
> --
>
> 
>
>
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
>
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
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---

Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

Initially they didn't say what they were, just that you as a customer broke 
their imaginary limit, and therefore are without service.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com



--
From: "Josh Luthman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 1:32 PM
To: "WISPA General List" 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

> Can you go into detail on to what happened or some information to it?  All 
> I
> saw was the nice and clean "500gigs/mo is enough for everyone, we're
> limiting torrent traffic" announcements.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
> --- Henry Spencer
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 2:30 PM, Jeff Broadwick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
> wrote:
>
>> Actually they got in trouble for both lying and what they were actually
>> doing.
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>>  _
>>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>> Behalf Of Blair Davis
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:09 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>>
>>
>> If you put it in your AUP, and make sure your users know about it, then 
>> you
>> are fine.
>>
>> It is the hiding of it and lying about it that got comcast in trouble.
>>
>> Jeff Broadwick wrote:
>>
>> That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
>>
>> hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a
>>
>> customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not blocking
>>
>> ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
>>
>> internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
>>
>> theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!
>>
>>
>>
>> You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of
>> congestion.
>>
>>
>>
>> "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"
>>
>>
>>
>> Jeff
>>
>> ImageStream
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>>
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>>
>> Behalf Of Butch Evans
>>
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
>>
>> To: WISPA General List
>>
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
>>
>> will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as 
>> network
>>
>> utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> 
>>
>> * Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
>>
>> * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
>>
>> * http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
>>
>> * http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>> 
>>
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>>
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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

I think that depends a lot on the AP...  I have multiple BitTorrent users 
(although not crazy heavy) and my APs just keep charging along!


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com



--
From: "David E. Smith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 1:27 PM
To: "WISPA General List" 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

> Jerry Richardson wrote:
>
>> Isn't this the best argument for transfer caps?
>>
>> You can spend A LOT of money and time dancing with P2P and shaping, or
>> you can just charge $X for Xbytes of data and $Y per Ybytes over that.
>
> A single BitTorrent peer, rate-limited to 64kbps, is still enough to
> bring a wi-fi access point to its knees, because that 64kbps is spread
> out over 50pps or 100pps.
>
> I really don't care how much traffic he uses, as long as he uses it in a
> way that doesn't make the other users on that AP cranky.
>
> David Smith
> MVN.net
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

I see - didn't hear that they denied traffic shaping.  I must be behind on
the information as I only heard they announced their network was doing so.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 2:36 PM, David E. Smith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Josh Luthman wrote:
> > I don't believe
> > Comcast lied nor lied about it.  I read in the news that they announced
> > their monthly bandwidth limits and Bittorent throttling practices became
> > well known.  Is this not the case?  I do believe that limiting the type
> of
> > traffic is wrong, however the amount is fair game based.
>
> A lie of omission is still a lie. Comcast first claimed they weren't
> doing any traffic shaping, even when confronted with packet logs and
> other hard evidence that something really squirrely was going on. Only
> later did they finally fess up to using the Sandvine appliance in some
> markets.
>
> And they didn't tell their customers about the P2P shaping until they
> basically had no choice.
>
> (The bit-caps were well publicized, but that's an entirely different
> issue.)
>
> Last I checked, they were doing what they did for different reasons than
> what most WISPs would probably do. My understanding is that P2P within
> Comcast's network, between different Comcast users, was generally
> unthrottled; it was only traffic leaving their network that ran into
> weird problems.
>
> They were doing it to save money on upstreams and interconnect; I know I
> do it to keep my wi-fi towers from falling over.
>
> David Smith
> MVN.net
>
>
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

2008-12-09 Thread David E. Smith

Josh Luthman wrote:
> I don't believe
> Comcast lied nor lied about it.  I read in the news that they announced
> their monthly bandwidth limits and Bittorent throttling practices became
> well known.  Is this not the case?  I do believe that limiting the type of
> traffic is wrong, however the amount is fair game based.

A lie of omission is still a lie. Comcast first claimed they weren't 
doing any traffic shaping, even when confronted with packet logs and 
other hard evidence that something really squirrely was going on. Only 
later did they finally fess up to using the Sandvine appliance in some 
markets.

And they didn't tell their customers about the P2P shaping until they 
basically had no choice.

(The bit-caps were well publicized, but that's an entirely different issue.)

Last I checked, they were doing what they did for different reasons than 
what most WISPs would probably do. My understanding is that P2P within 
Comcast's network, between different Comcast users, was generally 
unthrottled; it was only traffic leaving their network that ran into 
weird problems.

They were doing it to save money on upstreams and interconnect; I know I 
do it to keep my wi-fi towers from falling over.

David Smith
MVN.net

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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

I absolutely agree that it is good customer relations, but how can anyone
expect to get to 1000 customers from 200 when you're busy being best friends
with everyone and making sure they understand bandwidth limits (especially
when there are some people that just do not understand).

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 2:31 PM, Blair Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>  Comcast admitted lying about it.
>
> Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> I don't believe it is the provider's responsibility to ensure its customers
> have read the AUP or abide by it.  The customer put their signatures down
> signing that they agree to the terms.
>
>  It may not be the providers responsibility, but it IS good customer
> relations.  All my users know I reserve the right to limit their traffic if
> they become a problem.  And out of 200+, I have 4 that have been limited.
> All have teens that use bittorrent and won't use the timer that is built in.
>
>  At this point it is only reasonable
> to act as one would like to be treated (the golden rule!)  I don't believe
> Comcast lied nor lied about it.  I read in the news that they announced
> their monthly bandwidth limits and Bittorent throttling practices became
> well known.  Is this not the case?  I do believe that limiting the type of
> traffic is wrong, however the amount is fair game based.
>
> There are many policies in place in nearly every terms and conditions
> written that are simply outrageous - but the company can not and should not
> act upon these unless forced by the customer.  Off the top of my head the
> one that most people practice is the recording of shows or movies - this
> does go against the terms of most providers.  Still, there are VCRs and DVRs
> to break this rule.  How the terms are written now with DVRs so popular I
> can't say, though.
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
> --- Henry Spencer
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Blair Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL 
> PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>
>
>   If you put it in your AUP, and make sure your users know about it, then
> you are fine.
>
> It is the hiding of it and lying about it that got comcast in trouble.
>
>
> Jeff Broadwick wrote:
>
> That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
> hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a
> customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not blocking
> ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
> internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
> theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!
>
> You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of congestion.
>
> "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"
>
> Jeff
> ImageStream
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL 
> PROTECTED]> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>] On
> Behalf Of Butch Evans
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>
> On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
>
>
>  Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.
>
>
>  Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
> will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as network
> utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.
>
> --
> 
> * Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
> * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
> * http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
> * http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *
> 
>
>
>
>
> 
> 
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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

Can you go into detail on to what happened or some information to it?  All I
saw was the nice and clean "500gigs/mo is enough for everyone, we're
limiting torrent traffic" announcements.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 2:30 PM, Jeff Broadwick <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> Actually they got in trouble for both lying and what they were actually
> doing.
>
> Jeff
>
>  _
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Blair Davis
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:09 PM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>
>
> If you put it in your AUP, and make sure your users know about it, then you
> are fine.
>
> It is the hiding of it and lying about it that got comcast in trouble.
>
> Jeff Broadwick wrote:
>
> That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
>
> hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a
>
> customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not blocking
>
> ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
>
> internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
>
> theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!
>
>
>
> You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of
> congestion.
>
>
>
> "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"
>
>
>
> Jeff
>
> ImageStream
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
>
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>
> Behalf Of Butch Evans
>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
>
> To: WISPA General List
>
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>
>
>
> On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
>
>
>
> Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.
>
>
>
>
>
> Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
>
> will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as network
>
> utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.
>
>
>
> --
>
> 
>
> * Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
>
> * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
>
> * http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
>
> * http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *
>
> 
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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

2008-12-09 Thread Blair Davis





Comcast admitted lying about it.

Josh Luthman wrote:

  I don't believe it is the provider's responsibility to ensure its customers
have read the AUP or abide by it.  The customer put their signatures down
signing that they agree to the terms. 

It may not be the providers responsibility, but it IS good customer
relations.  All my users know I reserve the right to limit their
traffic if they become a problem.  And out of 200+, I have 4 that have
been limited.  All have teens that use bittorrent and won't use the
timer that is built in.

   At this point it is only reasonable
to act as one would like to be treated (the golden rule!)  I don't believe
Comcast lied nor lied about it.  I read in the news that they announced
their monthly bandwidth limits and Bittorent throttling practices became
well known.  Is this not the case?  I do believe that limiting the type of
traffic is wrong, however the amount is fair game based.

There are many policies in place in nearly every terms and conditions
written that are simply outrageous - but the company can not and should not
act upon these unless forced by the customer.  Off the top of my head the
one that most people practice is the recording of shows or movies - this
does go against the terms of most providers.  Still, there are VCRs and DVRs
to break this rule.  How the terms are written now with DVRs so popular I
can't say, though.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Blair Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

  
  
 If you put it in your AUP, and make sure your users know about it, then
you are fine.

It is the hiding of it and lying about it that got comcast in trouble.


Jeff Broadwick wrote:

That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a
customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not blocking
ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!

You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of congestion.

"I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"

Jeff
ImageStream

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>] On
Behalf Of Butch Evans
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:


 Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.


 Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as network
utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.

--

* Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
* http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
* http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
* http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *







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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

Actually they got in trouble for both lying and what they were actually
doing.
 
Jeff

  _  

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Blair Davis
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 2:09 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release


If you put it in your AUP, and make sure your users know about it, then you
are fine.

It is the hiding of it and lying about it that got comcast in trouble.

Jeff Broadwick wrote: 

That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that

hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a

customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not blocking

ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any

internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since

theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!



You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of congestion.



"I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"



Jeff

ImageStream



-Original Message-

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On

Behalf Of Butch Evans

Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM

To: WISPA General List

Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release



On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:

  

Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.





Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It

will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as network

utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.



--



* Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*

* http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *

* http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *

* http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *















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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

2008-12-09 Thread David E. Smith

Jerry Richardson wrote:

> Isn't this the best argument for transfer caps?
> 
> You can spend A LOT of money and time dancing with P2P and shaping, or
> you can just charge $X for Xbytes of data and $Y per Ybytes over that. 

A single BitTorrent peer, rate-limited to 64kbps, is still enough to 
bring a wi-fi access point to its knees, because that 64kbps is spread 
out over 50pps or 100pps.

I really don't care how much traffic he uses, as long as he uses it in a 
way that doesn't make the other users on that AP cranky.

David Smith
MVN.net

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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

I don't believe it is the provider's responsibility to ensure its customers
have read the AUP or abide by it.  The customer put their signatures down
signing that they agree to the terms.  At this point it is only reasonable
to act as one would like to be treated (the golden rule!)  I don't believe
Comcast lied nor lied about it.  I read in the news that they announced
their monthly bandwidth limits and Bittorent throttling practices became
well known.  Is this not the case?  I do believe that limiting the type of
traffic is wrong, however the amount is fair game based.

There are many policies in place in nearly every terms and conditions
written that are simply outrageous - but the company can not and should not
act upon these unless forced by the customer.  Off the top of my head the
one that most people practice is the recording of shows or movies - this
does go against the terms of most providers.  Still, there are VCRs and DVRs
to break this rule.  How the terms are written now with DVRs so popular I
can't say, though.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 2:09 PM, Blair Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

>  If you put it in your AUP, and make sure your users know about it, then
> you are fine.
>
> It is the hiding of it and lying about it that got comcast in trouble.
>
>
> Jeff Broadwick wrote:
>
> That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
> hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a
> customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not blocking
> ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
> internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
> theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!
>
> You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of congestion.
>
> "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"
>
> Jeff
> ImageStream
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>] On
> Behalf Of Butch Evans
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
> To: WISPA General List
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release
>
> On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
>
>
>  Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.
>
>
>  Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
> will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as network
> utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.
>
> --
> 
> * Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
> * http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
> * http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
> * http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *
> 
>
>
>
>
> 
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!http://signup.wispa.org/
> 
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
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>
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> 
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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

2008-12-09 Thread Blair Davis





If you put it in your AUP, and make sure your users know about it, then
you are fine.

It is the hiding of it and lying about it that got comcast in trouble.

Jeff Broadwick wrote:

  That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a
customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not blocking
ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!

You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of congestion.

"I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"

Jeff
ImageStream

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Butch Evans
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
  
  
Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.

  
  
Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as network
utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.

--

* Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
* http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
* http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
* http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *







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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

I think it is the best argument for bit caps...question is, is the market
ready for them at a level that you can live with.

Jeff
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jerry Richardson
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 1:51 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

Isn't this the best argument for transfer caps?

You can spend A LOT of money and time dancing with P2P and shaping, or you
can just charge $X for Xbytes of data and $Y per Ybytes over that. 

If a user wants to use P2P, Netflix, etc and pay me 300/mo for his overage,
who am I to stop him? If 300/mo is too much, then they can re-evaluate their
surfing habits or upgrade to an "all you can eat"
plan.
 


 
 
__
Jerry Richardson
airCloud Communications

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jeff Broadwick
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:28 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a
customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not blocking
ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!

You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of congestion.

"I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"

Jeff
ImageStream

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Butch Evans
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
> Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.

Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as network
utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.

--

* Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
* http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
* http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
* http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *








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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

2008-12-09 Thread Jerry Richardson

Isn't this the best argument for transfer caps?

You can spend A LOT of money and time dancing with P2P and shaping, or
you can just charge $X for Xbytes of data and $Y per Ybytes over that. 

If a user wants to use P2P, Netflix, etc and pay me 300/mo for his
overage, who am I to stop him? If 300/mo is too much, then they can
re-evaluate their surfing habits or upgrade to an "all you can eat"
plan.
 


 
 
__ 
Jerry Richardson 
airCloud Communications

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jeff Broadwick
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:28 AM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a
customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not
blocking ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your
customer.  Any internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your
service since theoretically they could receive content from someone on
your network!

You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of
congestion.

"I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"

Jeff
ImageStream

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Butch Evans
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
> Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.

Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as
network utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage
it.

--

* Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
* http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
* http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
* http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *








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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

That, and if you block it you risk running afoul of the same FCC that
hammered Comcast.  Just because you aren't huge you aren't immune.  If a
customer complains you have the burden of proof that you are not blocking
ptp or any other service.  Doesn't even have to be your customer.  Any
internet customer who uses ptp can complain about your service since
theoretically they could receive content from someone on your network!

You CAN manage traffic on your network, but only during times of congestion.

"I'm from the government and I'm here to help you"

Jeff
ImageStream

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Butch Evans
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 10:37 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
> Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.

Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as network
utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage it.

--

* Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
* http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
* http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
* http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *







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Re: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?

2008-12-09 Thread Brian Webster

There are serial to Ethernet devices out there that have mini web servers
built in to them as well. I think they call them rabbits. Some programs will
allow you to map a com port  to an IP address as well. Maybe that would be
of use.



Thank You,
Brian Webster

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Randy Cosby
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 1:22 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?


http://www.serial-port-redirector.com/ - another windows-side client
that looks promising.

I'd rather have native serial connectivity though, but this may be the
best we can do.


Randy Cosby wrote:
> Hm... looks like that may not be necessary:
>
> In Routeros 3.0rc2:
>
> *) RFC 2217 serial server TCP to serial
>Now you can set the serial port to RFC 2217 server mode and
>you can use a remote application to communicate/control the serial
device.
>Find out more about this protocol at
http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc2217.html
>
> I see one program out there so far that will redirect the serial port on a
windows device to point to one of these serial servers...
>
>
http://dir.filewatcher.com/d/FreeBSD/4.3-release/i386/sredird-1.1.8.tgz.2006
3.html
>
>
> Anyone tried this?  May make a nice UPS control application as well!
>
>
>
> Eric Rogers wrote:
>
>> Have you considered serial extenders?  Then you can centrally monitor
>> them all?
>>
>> Lantronix.com
>>
>> Eric Rogers
>> Precision Data Solutions, LLC
>> (317) 831-3000 x200
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>> Behalf Of Randy Cosby
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 11:20 AM
>> To: wireless@wispa.org
>> Subject: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?
>>
>> I'm planning to upgrade from a 30 to 60 amp solar controller soon on one
>>
>> of our sites when we add more panels / batteries.  This time I'd like to
>>
>> make sure I get a good, remotely-monitorable (is that a word?) unit.
>> Any recommendations?
>>
>> Morningstar Tristar 60 looks good, but I'm not sure yet if the serial
>> console will actually work with anything other than their windows
>> software.  I'd like to be able to hook this up to a mikrotik or cisco
>> serial port to remotely monitor amps in / out, etc.
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>>
>>
>
>

--
Randy Cosby
Vice President
InfoWest, Inc

office: 435-773-6071






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Re: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?

Randy - that is really cool!  Thank you for sharing that.  I'm certain that
will be very useful =)

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer


On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 1:22 PM, Randy Cosby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> http://www.serial-port-redirector.com/ - another windows-side client
> that looks promising.
>
> I'd rather have native serial connectivity though, but this may be the
> best we can do.
>
>
> Randy Cosby wrote:
> > Hm... looks like that may not be necessary:
> >
> > In Routeros 3.0rc2:
> >
> > *) RFC 2217 serial server TCP to serial
> >Now you can set the serial port to RFC 2217 server mode and
> >you can use a remote application to communicate/control the serial
> device.
> >Find out more about this protocol at
> http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc2217.html
> >
> > I see one program out there so far that will redirect the serial port on
> a windows device to point to one of these serial servers...
> >
> >
> http://dir.filewatcher.com/d/FreeBSD/4.3-release/i386/sredird-1.1.8.tgz.20063.html
> >
> >
> > Anyone tried this?  May make a nice UPS control application as well!
> >
> >
> >
> > Eric Rogers wrote:
> >
> >> Have you considered serial extenders?  Then you can centrally monitor
> >> them all?
> >>
> >> Lantronix.com
> >>
> >> Eric Rogers
> >> Precision Data Solutions, LLC
> >> (317) 831-3000 x200
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> >> Behalf Of Randy Cosby
> >> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 11:20 AM
> >> To: wireless@wispa.org
> >> Subject: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?
> >>
> >> I'm planning to upgrade from a 30 to 60 amp solar controller soon on one
> >>
> >> of our sites when we add more panels / batteries.  This time I'd like to
> >>
> >> make sure I get a good, remotely-monitorable (is that a word?) unit.
> >> Any recommendations?
> >>
> >> Morningstar Tristar 60 looks good, but I'm not sure yet if the serial
> >> console will actually work with anything other than their windows
> >> software.  I'd like to be able to hook this up to a mikrotik or cisco
> >> serial port to remotely monitor amps in / out, etc.
> >>
> >> Thanks!
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
> --
> Randy Cosby
> Vice President
> InfoWest, Inc
>
> office: 435-773-6071
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>



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Re: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?

http://www.serial-port-redirector.com/ - another windows-side client 
that looks promising.

I'd rather have native serial connectivity though, but this may be the 
best we can do.


Randy Cosby wrote:
> Hm... looks like that may not be necessary:
>
> In Routeros 3.0rc2:
>
> *) RFC 2217 serial server TCP to serial
>Now you can set the serial port to RFC 2217 server mode and 
>you can use a remote application to communicate/control the serial device.
>Find out more about this protocol at http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc2217.html
>
> I see one program out there so far that will redirect the serial port on a 
> windows device to point to one of these serial servers... 
>
> http://dir.filewatcher.com/d/FreeBSD/4.3-release/i386/sredird-1.1.8.tgz.20063.html
>
>
> Anyone tried this?  May make a nice UPS control application as well!
>
>
>
> Eric Rogers wrote:
>   
>> Have you considered serial extenders?  Then you can centrally monitor
>> them all?
>>
>> Lantronix.com
>>
>> Eric Rogers
>> Precision Data Solutions, LLC
>> (317) 831-3000 x200
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>> Behalf Of Randy Cosby
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 11:20 AM
>> To: wireless@wispa.org
>> Subject: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?
>>
>> I'm planning to upgrade from a 30 to 60 amp solar controller soon on one
>>
>> of our sites when we add more panels / batteries.  This time I'd like to
>>
>> make sure I get a good, remotely-monitorable (is that a word?) unit.  
>> Any recommendations? 
>>
>> Morningstar Tristar 60 looks good, but I'm not sure yet if the serial 
>> console will actually work with anything other than their windows 
>> software.  I'd like to be able to hook this up to a mikrotik or cisco 
>> serial port to remotely monitor amps in / out, etc. 
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>>   
>> 
>
>   

-- 
Randy Cosby
Vice President
InfoWest, Inc

office: 435-773-6071





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Re: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?

Hm... looks like that may not be necessary:

In Routeros 3.0rc2:

*) RFC 2217 serial server TCP to serial
   Now you can set the serial port to RFC 2217 server mode and 
   you can use a remote application to communicate/control the serial device.
   Find out more about this protocol at http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc2217.html

I see one program out there so far that will redirect the serial port on a 
windows device to point to one of these serial servers... 

http://dir.filewatcher.com/d/FreeBSD/4.3-release/i386/sredird-1.1.8.tgz.20063.html


Anyone tried this?  May make a nice UPS control application as well!



Eric Rogers wrote:
> Have you considered serial extenders?  Then you can centrally monitor
> them all?
>
> Lantronix.com
>
> Eric Rogers
> Precision Data Solutions, LLC
> (317) 831-3000 x200
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Randy Cosby
> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 11:20 AM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?
>
> I'm planning to upgrade from a 30 to 60 amp solar controller soon on one
>
> of our sites when we add more panels / batteries.  This time I'd like to
>
> make sure I get a good, remotely-monitorable (is that a word?) unit.  
> Any recommendations? 
>
> Morningstar Tristar 60 looks good, but I'm not sure yet if the serial 
> console will actually work with anything other than their windows 
> software.  I'd like to be able to hook this up to a mikrotik or cisco 
> serial port to remotely monitor amps in / out, etc. 
>
> Thanks!
>
>   

-- 
Randy Cosby
Vice President
InfoWest, Inc

office: 435-773-6071





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Re: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?

2008-12-09 Thread Eric Rogers

Have you considered serial extenders?  Then you can centrally monitor
them all?

Lantronix.com

Eric Rogers
Precision Data Solutions, LLC
(317) 831-3000 x200



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Randy Cosby
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 11:20 AM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?

I'm planning to upgrade from a 30 to 60 amp solar controller soon on one

of our sites when we add more panels / batteries.  This time I'd like to

make sure I get a good, remotely-monitorable (is that a word?) unit.  
Any recommendations? 

Morningstar Tristar 60 looks good, but I'm not sure yet if the serial 
console will actually work with anything other than their windows 
software.  I'd like to be able to hook this up to a mikrotik or cisco 
serial port to remotely monitor amps in / out, etc. 

Thanks!

-- 
Randy Cosby
Vice President
InfoWest, Inc

office: 435-773-6071






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Re: [WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?

A complicated ridiculous way of doing it may be to take a Mikrotik
motherboard (or any small board, but MT is probably the least cost) and use
Linux+wine or virtualization/Xen to get a copy of windows running.

Yay for products and their Windows only software...

Hopefully someday Morningstar and other companies will see our
complication.  PLEASE listen to the community, not all of us use Windows in
every installation.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer

On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 11:19 AM, Randy Cosby <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> I'm planning to upgrade from a 30 to 60 amp solar controller soon on one
> of our sites when we add more panels / batteries.  This time I'd like to
> make sure I get a good, remotely-monitorable (is that a word?) unit.
> Any recommendations?
>
> Morningstar Tristar 60 looks good, but I'm not sure yet if the serial
> console will actually work with anything other than their windows
> software.  I'd like to be able to hook this up to a mikrotik or cisco
> serial port to remotely monitor amps in / out, etc.
>
> Thanks!
>
> --
> Randy Cosby
> Vice President
> InfoWest, Inc
>
> office: 435-773-6071
>
>
>
>
>
> 
> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
> http://signup.wispa.org/
>
> 
>
> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
>
> Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
>

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[WISPA] Solar controller - snmp or serial?

I'm planning to upgrade from a 30 to 60 amp solar controller soon on one 
of our sites when we add more panels / batteries.  This time I'd like to 
make sure I get a good, remotely-monitorable (is that a word?) unit.  
Any recommendations? 

Morningstar Tristar 60 looks good, but I'm not sure yet if the serial 
console will actually work with anything other than their windows 
software.  I'd like to be able to hook this up to a mikrotik or cisco 
serial port to remotely monitor amps in / out, etc. 

Thanks!

-- 
Randy Cosby
Vice President
InfoWest, Inc

office: 435-773-6071





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Re: [WISPA] Where is StarOS?

2008-12-09 Thread reader

I have to disagree with the below.

There's a short, very steep curve at the bottom, but it's not as bad as one 
might think from his description.

Compared to Mikrotik, it is the model of simplicity.

I have used it for the vast majority of everything, from backhauls to ap's 
to clients, and I have it deployed on 2.4, 5ghz, and 900 mhz.







- Original Message - 
From: "Steve Barnes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 6:36 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Where is StarOS?


>
> StarOS is a solid environment, but you have to commit yourself to making
> it work.  Very hard for a startup company to just pick it up and install
> it.  You have a huge learning curve.  The other thing I saw was that
> version changes are huge.  When going from a V2 OS setup to a V3,  There
> were huge changes in the OS that took lots of testing and many
> adjustments to our system.




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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

2008-12-09 Thread Butch Evans

On Tue, 2008-12-09 at 10:32 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
> Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.

Well, it will be MUCH more difficult to manage, that is a certainty.  It
will be MUCH more expensive in terms of CPU requirements as well as
network utilization that will happen in spite of your efforts to manage
it.

-- 

* Butch Evans   * Professional Network Consultation*
* http://www.butchevans.com/* Network Engineering  *
* http://www.wispa.org/ * WISPA Board Member   *
* http://blog.butchevans.com/   * Wired or Wireless Networks   *






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Re: [WISPA] BitTorrent to go UDP in next release

2008-12-09 Thread Brian Rohrbacher





Darn, so there isn't a good way to block it anymore.

Butch Evans wrote:

  On Mon, 2008-12-08 at 21:11 -0500, Brian Rohrbacher wrote:
  
  
It's a good thing I didn't get into being a voip provider.  Shouldn't
I be able to block it all now?

  
  
All UDP?  Nope.  You have streaming audio, DNS and other useful UDP.  

  






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[WISPA] Illinois GUV running this survey

2008-12-09 Thread Chuck McCown - 3

  Redline 286 0.29% 
  Alvarion 4030 4.15% 
  Ubiquity 1778 1.83% 
  Canopy 43767 45.09% 
  Other 8326 8.58% 
  Trango 11352 11.70% 
  Tranzeo 12779 13.17% 
  MT 14746 15.19% 
 97064 100.00% 
   
  Responses 96  




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Re: [WISPA] CDN peering

2008-12-09 Thread Matt Liotta

Any location within or very close to our market coverage we will build  
and install 100Mbps for $3600 MRC. Fiber lit locations and carrier  
hotels are way cheaper, but it depends on the address. There are WISPs  
who currently pay us $1000 MRC for a 100 meg commit on a GigE port at  
carrier hotels. The best part is that we don't get depeered once a  
year like Cogent. I think more interesting is the fact that we don't  
require signing up for large commits. We just had an ISP buy 20Mbps  
from us for $200 MRC. I think they were trying to ruin our ARPU. ;)

-Matt

On Dec 9, 2008, at 6:36 AM, George Rogato wrote:

> Matt, how much is your bandwidth, say 100megs, in the Pittock?
>
> George
>
> Matt Liotta wrote:
>> On Dec 8, 2008, at 11:16 AM, Mike Hammett wrote:
>>
>>> *nods*  I've looked at the Any2 Exchange here in Chicago.
>>> Unfortunately
>>> they only have like 3 participants.
>>>
>>> Despite their lower participant numbers, I'm looking to join non-
>>> Equinix
>>> exchanges here in Chicago (Any2 and ChicagoIX).
>>>
>> We are members of Any2 in DC, which has very few members and we only
>> see about 100Kbps of traffic. I wouldn't waste your time.
>>
>>> The place I get colo, etc. from in 350 E. Cermak offers a free 100  
>>> meg
>>> connection to ChicagoIX if you're a colo customer and most of the
>>> members
>>> are on their route server.
>>>
>>> Just for general knowledge, how do some of the others relate on  
>>> price
>>> compared to Equinix (assuming cheaper) and Any2 (assuming around the
>>> same)?
>>>
>> Any2 is the best deal around, but only on the west coast is there any
>> traffic. Big Apple, Nap of the Americas, and Seattle are cheap and
>> useful. Not that we are members of any of them.
>>
>> We will be probably join some additional exchanges in other markets
>> when we have customers there. We have other ISPs buying transit and
>> voice from us that put us in markets without a wireless footprint.
>> Chicago is on our radar, but thus far none of the ISPs we have talked
>> to have pulled the trigger.
>>
>> -Matt
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> WISPA Wants You! Join today!
>> http://signup.wispa.org/
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Re: [WISPA] Where is StarOS?

2008-12-09 Thread Steve Barnes

I want to answer some of this from my perspective. 
Why is StarOS not used as much and not as widely available? SUPPORT!!!

Valemont networks are hard people to deal with.  You have to be
immensely patient to get support and ignore some of what is stated by
the support staff about how you are using their equipment.  They have
their way and that is what they support.

StarOS is a solid environment, but you have to commit yourself to making
it work.  Very hard for a startup company to just pick it up and install
it.  You have a huge learning curve.  The other thing I saw was that
version changes are huge.  When going from a V2 OS setup to a V3,  There
were huge changes in the OS that took lots of testing and many
adjustments to our system.

IMHO if the StarOS environment wants to ever have the impact that it has
the ability to have, they need to train people and setup user groups
like MT has.  They need to quit having programmers with no people skills
answer support questions and they need to decide what their business
model and plan for the future is.  Without this in place why would a
vendor want to carry their inventory and have to answer questions about
something so poorly supported?

As Matt stated once installed and setup it is ROCK SOLID stuff and very
flexible (if you can figure out how.) 

Steve Barnes
RCWiFi Wireless Internet Service
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Josh Luthman
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 1:21 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Where is StarOS?

As I have said I have no experience with StarOS.

I wish I had learned of this when I was first starting as I may have
much of
it in use now but I still may start using it if I ever dive into it.

With the list of very impressive things you have seen and accomplished
with
it I can't help but ask the questions - why are there only two major
vendors?  Why aren't more WISPs using this product?  What is the fault
that
makes it such a small part of the market - is it the marketing the
company
failed to do?  Is there some major flaw everyone avoids?

Thank you very much for sharing that information, Matt.  I for one
really
enjoy reading these "soapbox articles" =)

The bullet points of the epic above:

*many customers in the 15-25 mile range running on StarOS APs
*one sub at 33 miles that runs 15-20gig of traffic a month - no
complaints
(we all love that last part)
*802.11b APs with 85-90 subs on them, and 802.11a APs with 100+
*One pulled out all of their $5000-$9000 Motorola backhauls and replaced
them with $900 StarOS FDD BH and saw huge improvements in performance.
*Several more but these are the real good ones with numbers =)

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly.
--- Henry Spencer

On Tue, Dec 9, 2008 at 1:06 AM, Matt Larsen - Lists
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote:

> I put myself in as being Tranzeo based, as that is the heavy majority
of
> my CPE radios, although I have a fair amount of Ubiquiti, Telex,
> HighGain and a smattering of Mikrotik CPE as well.   Chuck started the
> survey, and as a Canopy user he is more used to the idea of everything
> coming from the same vendor.   With StarOS and Mikrotik, you can use
one
> thing for your APs and backhauls, and another brand or multiple
> different brands for your CPE radios.
>
> All of my APs and backhauls are on StarOS.I find that there are a
> lot of StarOS operators out there, but you don't hear from them
because
> they tend to gather on the StarOS forums and don't get involved in
list
> politics.   Unfortunately, many of the discussions on this and other
> lists ends up focusing on Mikrotik and Canopy because there are more
> vendors pushing them, and users "evangelizing" them.
>
> I have plenty of experience with StarOS, Mikrotik and Tranzeo - and I
> have deployed Trango and Canopy as well.   For the majority of the
> wireless applications I have been involved in, it was the most
> ubiquitous and best value of the platforms I have used.
>
> It is not a "brain-dead" deployment - if you want to run a bridged
> network, StarOS is definitely not for you.   There is a little bit of
a
> learning curve, and almost no available training resources for it
beyond
> the StarOS forums.There are few vendors that sell it - FreeSpace
and
> Streakwave are about the only two major ones that do much with Star.
> The developers are not exactly accessible and will become openly
hostile
> if your choice of network topology doesn't fit their recommended way
of
> doing things.   These are all factors that limit the overall adoption
of
> StarOS.
>
> However, at the core of StarOS is a set of world-class wireless
> drivers.   StarOS was the first platform to have 20/10/5mhz channels
> with the Atheros chipsets.   Their distance settings were a first,
going
> back to their Orinoco drivers, and enabling WISP

Re: [WISPA] AT&T Cell Band

2008-12-09 Thread Chuck McCown - 3

Wilson Electronics makes some of the best systems I know of.

- Original Message - 
From: "Mike Brownson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" 
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 12:08 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] AT&T Cell Band


> Both of the guys below are ok for your home or small business but can't
> handle 100,000 sq ft warehouse.  That calls for manufacturers like 
> Dekolink,
> CSI, Andrew, Mobile Access and such.  With the higher gain systems to fill
> such a large space you can't just amp the whole spectrum or you create a 
> lot
> of noise.  So usually the systems need to be band specific for just the
> carrier you are looking to use.  Since this applications is just for AT&T
> that's simple.  Even if they are using both 800 and 1950 in the area these
> systems can amplify both separately and combine them into a single
> distribution system.  Very cool technology.  There's even some systems 
> that
> use optical fiber to distribute the RF signal to remote amplifiers.  But
> that's generally for spaces larger or more complex that a 100,000 sq ft 
> box.
>
> Mike B
>
>
> On 12/8/08 4:42 PM, "CHUCK  PROFITO" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>>
>>  http://www.primecellular.comfor cell repeaters or
>> http://www.alternativewireless.com/cellular-antennas/cell_phone_power_booste
>> rs.html
>>
>> Chuck Profito
>> 209-988-7388
>> CV-ACCESS, INC
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> Providing High Speed Broadband
>> to Rural Central California
>> -Original Message-
>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
>> Behalf Of Patrick Nix Jr.
>> Sent: Monday, December 08, 2008 1:55 PM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: [WISPA] AT&T Cell Band
>>
>> Anyone know what band AT&T uses for cell service? I have a client that
>> needs cell amplifiers put in a 100,000 sqft warehouse they just changed
>> from Nextel to AT&T.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks
>>
>>
>>
>> __
>>
>>
>>
>> Patrick Nix, Jr.,
>>
>> csweb.net
>>
>> (918) 235-0414
>>
>> http://www.csweb.net 
>>
>> E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>> ATTENTION: This e-mail may contain information that is confidential in
>> nature. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete this e-mail
>> and notify the sender immediately. Thank you.
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>> 
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>> 
>>
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>>
>>
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>> --
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>> --
>>
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>
> -- 
> Mike Brownson
> Hutton Communications
> 5015 Paris St
> Denver, CO 80239
> 303-373-3170
>
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Re: [WISPA] Where is StarOS?

If Matt says it can be done, it can be done...  even if he uses that... 
other...  OS.  :-p


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com



--
From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 12:06 AM
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "WISPA General List" 
Subject: [WISPA] Where is StarOS?

> I put myself in as being Tranzeo based, as that is the heavy majority of
> my CPE radios, although I have a fair amount of Ubiquiti, Telex,
> HighGain and a smattering of Mikrotik CPE as well.   Chuck started the
> survey, and as a Canopy user he is more used to the idea of everything
> coming from the same vendor.   With StarOS and Mikrotik, you can use one
> thing for your APs and backhauls, and another brand or multiple
> different brands for your CPE radios.
>
> All of my APs and backhauls are on StarOS.I find that there are a
> lot of StarOS operators out there, but you don't hear from them because
> they tend to gather on the StarOS forums and don't get involved in list
> politics.   Unfortunately, many of the discussions on this and other
> lists ends up focusing on Mikrotik and Canopy because there are more
> vendors pushing them, and users "evangelizing" them.
>
> I have plenty of experience with StarOS, Mikrotik and Tranzeo - and I
> have deployed Trango and Canopy as well.   For the majority of the
> wireless applications I have been involved in, it was the most
> ubiquitous and best value of the platforms I have used.
>
> It is not a "brain-dead" deployment - if you want to run a bridged
> network, StarOS is definitely not for you.   There is a little bit of a
> learning curve, and almost no available training resources for it beyond
> the StarOS forums.There are few vendors that sell it - FreeSpace and
> Streakwave are about the only two major ones that do much with Star.
> The developers are not exactly accessible and will become openly hostile
> if your choice of network topology doesn't fit their recommended way of
> doing things.   These are all factors that limit the overall adoption of
> StarOS.
>
> However, at the core of StarOS is a set of world-class wireless
> drivers.   StarOS was the first platform to have 20/10/5mhz channels
> with the Atheros chipsets.   Their distance settings were a first, going
> back to their Orinoco drivers, and enabling WISPs to pick up customers
> beyond the 12mile wifi limit.   I have many customers in the 15-25 mile
> range running on StarOS APs.   I actually have one sub at 33 miles that
> runs 15-20gig of traffic a month - no complaints.   With good bandwidth
> management profiles, you can get a lot of people on an AP.   I have had
> 802.11b APs with 85-90 subs on them, and 802.11a APs with 100+.   It is
> doable, and I have done it.
>
> StarOS is also great for backhauls, both half and full-duplex.  I have a
> pair of WAR boards running in turbo mode that have been in the air for
> 2.5 years, and run 15-35 meg constantly.   Haven't so much as changed
> the channel in that 2 year period.  I have FDD links on $400 X4000
> radios that will do 50meg throughput (10/40, 25/25, 40/10, whatever)
> over 20+ miles.   I've watched StarOS backhauls kill Canopy backhauls on
> the same channels, and the signal squelch features allow backhauls to
> work in places where other stuff flat out will not work.   I have 550+
> miles of StarOS backhaul up, including a 65 mile shot and several more
> 35+ mile shots, and several of my consulting clients have just as many
> miles in the air.  One pulled out all of their $5000-$9000 Motorola
> backhauls and replaced them with $900 StarOS FDD BH and saw huge
> improvements in performance.   I've even mixed Star and Mikrotik
> backhauls with decent results.
>
> StarOS has also been a great platform to work with when it comes to
> building an integrated wireless platform.   Radius auth of MAC addresses
> has been there from the start, and doesn't require any special servers
> beyond a radius server.   Loading DHCP scripts, cbq rules and firewall
> settings is easily automated with shell scripts (much easier than
> Mikrotik).  OSPF works great and does exactly what it is supposed to.
> SNMP is comprehensive and it's easy to track signal strength, link
> quality, # of associations, interface traffic and cpu load with commonly
> available tools.  The "F1" associations list is by far the best
> troubleshooting tool I have used on any platform.  There is good stuff
> in there.
>
> Best of all is not being beholden to any specific vendor for CPE
> radios.   Over the years I've used radios from Tranzeo, Teletronics,
> Orinoco, SmartBridges, Senao, Linksys, D-link, Ubiquiti, Telex,
> HighGain, Mikrotik, eZY.net, Cisco, Ampwave and probably a few other
> brands that I don't recall.  All different kinds of chipsets work with
> it, and without the dropped association issues that Mikrotik and other
> APs have had.   One many of my 2.4ghz APs, ther

Re: [WISPA] Fwd: WISP Broadband