You could make the javascript trigger on the image onload events. Though, I
think some older version of Opera, v8 or 7.54, doesn't support the onLoad
event for images.
- Original Message -
From: Christian Snodgrass [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Saturday,
Most mobile phones won't use Javascript or CSS either. And the usage of
handheld devices is rapidly increasing. So is other gadgets. Nintendo DS for
instance. We can't assume that only browser applications is used to access
our webpages.
- Original Message -
From: Christian Snodgrass
But the crappy intranet sites etc that are coded specifically to IE6 or
IE7's quirks *won't* go away (as that's the whole reason why MS are doing
this), so no, the meta tag (and the associated rendering engine) will
stay. If they're freezing rendering unless you opt-in because corporates
won't
You don't have to modify every single HTML you publish. You can set the HTTP
header for HTML files on your server and off you go. Btw, you have to author
every single document, so is it really that bad to add a meta tag?
They don't want to default to IE8 rendering because of what happend with
- Original Message -
From: Katrina [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 9:17 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] This IE8 controversy
Thomas Thomassen wrote:
You don't have to modify every single HTML you publish. You can set the
HTTP header for HTML
: Chris Knowles [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 9:27 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] This IE8 controversy
Thomas Thomassen wrote:
You don't have to modify every single HTML you publish. You can set the
HTTP header for HTML files on your server and off you go
@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 9:03 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] This IE8 controversy
On Jan 30, 2008 1:31 AM, Thomas Thomassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
They don't want to default to IE8 rendering because of what happend with
IE7. It broke website. Not only that but IE is used so much outside
Why sniff out browsers that accept XML? If the document is marked as XHTML
1.1 it should allways be sent as XML.
Though, I have seen people sniffing out browsers and using server side
scripting to change the doctype. XHTML 1.1 to browsers than supports it, and
XHTML 1.0 with the html mime to
]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Thursday, January 31, 2008 12:10 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Conflict between Mime Type and Document Type
Thomas Thomassen wrote:
Why sniff out browsers that accept XML? If the document is marked as
XHTML 1.1 it should allways be sent as XML.
Though, I have seen
Subject: Re: [WSG] Conflict between Mime Type and Document Type
Thomas Thomassen skrev:
There's no difference between XHTML 1.1 and XHTML 1.0 Strict. XHTML 1.1
only advantage is that it's modulized
Not entirely true. XHTML 1.1 includes ruby.
and can only be sent as XML so it can be extended
Have a look at this article on A List Apart:
http://www.alistapart.com/articles/prettyaccessibleforms
If you haven't been too that site before then have a snoop around. They got
lots of really good articles.
- Original Message -
From: Christian Snodgrass [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To:
When the LABEL element wraps around INPUT you do not need the FOR
attribute.The hierarchy provides the connection between them. However, when
the LABEL does not wrap around the INPUT, the FOR attribute is required for
useragent to know the elements are related.
- Original Message -
On having Layout is a good article that gives good insight to most of IE's
quirks: http://www.satzansatz.de/cssd/onhavinglayout.html
- Original Message -
From: Joe Ortenzi
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 8:14 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] display
Fieldsets and Labels is present in HTML4 as well. Don't see anything new about
that. Still need some extra elements to organise them. Such as lists.
- Original Message -
From: Joe Ortenzi
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2008 8:36 AM
Subject: Re:
, or advantageous and, if not careful,
can actually take away from the form.
Just like a p doesn't need a td, a label + input combo doesn't need
an li.
Old conversation, I know, but I just had to chime in.
Cheers.
Mike Cherim
http://green-beast.com/
- Original Message -
From: Thomas
hm... this thread has given me a thinker.
How does screenreaders treat using just labelinput//label?
form
fieldset
labelFoo: input id=foo//label
labelBar: input id=bar//label
/fieldset
/form
How will it present the form? If it's all inline, will it be read continuous,
or will there
be
accommodating :)
Cheers.
Mike
- Original Message -
From: Thomas Thomassen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Friday, February 08, 2008 11:32 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Styling forms
Very interesting article. I'm reevaluating my options about lists on
forms.
But I'm not sure I
Very interesting article. I'm reevaluating my options about lists on forms.
But I'm not sure I feel comfortable with a br between the label and
input. Semantically it looks like it separates them, even though the FOR
attributes connects them.
If the br came after the input then both the
I had a look at your article. Got some questions:
One of your examples:
p
iWhy does this semantic markup stuff have to be so unclear at times/i,
he thought.
/p
Wouldn't it be more appropriate to use:
p
qWhy does this semantic markup stuff have to be so unclear at times/q,
he thought.
/p
Add left padding to the paragraph intead?
- Original Message -
From: Jens-Uwe Korff [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Sunday, February 10, 2008 10:33 PM
Subject: [WSG] IE6 3-pixel jog victim
Hi,
I have restyled a timeline but have come stuck with IE6's 3-pixel
The branding might change. I'm in favour of span with a class, like: span
class=logo.
- Original Message -
From: Mike at Green-Beast.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 4:42 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] Decorative bolding
Do I:
a. Use the
The definition lists aren't soly for defining a term. The W3C specs gives an
example usage of DL to marking up dialouges. I see the defintion lists as
a good option when the list consists of two parts, a headline and a
description.
- Original Message -
From: John Faulds [EMAIL
Nothing. Web 2.0 is a buzzword. There's nothing truely new.
It's often accociated with social networking. Sites where the users provide the
content.
- Original Message -
From: Gitanjali
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2008 2:21 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG]
Yes, IE doesn't handle attribute selectors.
However, I'd still be tempted to use it. The only thing that happens is that
IE6 doesn't display the icons. Graceful degradation. Users with newer
browsers will get a better experience, but it'll still work with the older
browsers.
- Original
On Sun, February 17, 2008 10:02 pm, Thomas Thomassen wrote:
Yes, IE doesn't handle attribute selectors.
There are always javascript workarounds for attribute selectors in IE.
However, I'd still be tempted to use it. The only thing that happens is
that
IE6 doesn't display
Don't make the think -- A Common Sence Approach to Web Usability by Steve Krug
- Original Message -
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, February 19, 2008 7:31 AM
Subject: [WSG] books
Anybody can suggest me some good books or other
As far as I know, control of how text wrap was introduced in CSS3:
http://www.w3.org/TR/css3-text/#text-wrap
All though, IE has it's own property for this
http://msdn2.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ms531186(VS.85).aspx
I think you'll have to pick a different word for your localization.
Out of
Screenshots sent.
Not sure how gracefully degrade. I think once when I used a translucent
image it was an even colour and IE6 should simply degrade to display the
colour solid. That worked fine for my use. Your case might be different
though.
- Original Message -
From: kevin
it...
;-)
On Feb 19 2008, at 07:29, Thomas Thomassen wrote:
Don't make the think -- A Common Sence Approach to Web Usability by Steve
Krug
Joe Ortenzi
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.joiz.com
***
List Guidelines: http
It might be worth testing on different platforms. Firefox 2.0 on Windows, OSX
and Linux. I belive there some times are some quirks that creeps up. All though
rare.
- Original Message -
From: Andrew WC Brown
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2008 3:28
You specify different stylesheets for different medias. The most common ones
are to target handhelds, print and screenreaders. The user-agent will use
the MEDIA attribute to pick the correct stylesheet.
It is also possible to provide multiple stylesheets which the user can
select from. Though
True. IE is more than just a browser. It's a development platform. Intranet
systems, HTA applications etc. Some of them might be used in mission critial
systems where it's less than ideal to update the HTML and CSS every time IE
updates it rendering engine so locking them self to a spesific
I got a spare computer to test this on. Thanks for the heads up about the
availiblity of the beta.
- Original Message -
From: aleagi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2008 8:32 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] IE8 news
Yeah, I'm afraid to install it
IE8 does provide a mode switch to IE7. There's a new button next to the home
button. Though I'm not surpriced it nuked your IE6 installation.
I gave it a go and tried some of my testcases where I make heavy use of
selectors and other cutting edge CSS features. Can't say I was impressed. I
had
p.s. the testcase I'm working on is here:
http://thomthom.net/storage/markup/html/sitenav/ (NOTE: very rough draft!)
but if you use it to compare IE8 with Firefox2/3, Opera 9 and Safari 3 you
see that IE8 still got a long way to go. :(
- Original Message -
From: Thomas Thomassen
Some of the oddness can use experienced here:
http://thomthom.net/storage/markup/html/sitenav/
In IE8 the drop down menu of the red nav bar will hide when the cursor moves
over the menu where the headers are below.
Also, the table of content will not drop down.
In my CSS code for the TOC I
Yup, I'm seeing odd :hover behaviour as well in some of my own testcases.
Launch them bug reports at them. https://connect.microsoft.com/IE
Let make sure MS is told about the problems now early. If not we'll be stuck
with this for sure afterwards.
- Original Message -
From: Gunlaug
Google cache:
http://216.239.59.104/search?q=cache:hJvRsZGb7kUJ:www.geocities.com/hollywood/makeup/4303/t2script.txt+http://www.geocities.com/hollywood/makeup/4303/t2script.txthl=enct=clnkcd=1gl=noclient=firefox-a
- Original Message -
From: Andrew Freedman [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To:
Because they are defined by w3c what they should map to.
http://www.w3.org/TR/CSS21/syndata.html#color-units
- Original Message -
From: Adam Martin
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Monday, March 17, 2008 11:43 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] IE 8 and grey
Are you talking from a
In addition to using the dictionary, it's worth looking up how W3C uses the
terms in relationship with the specs. http://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc2119.txt
While MUST and MUST NOT would be more handy, reality is grey sometimes and
does depend on the interpretation of the author. The biggest problem
I was working on some examples for the use of del and ins.
http://www.thomthom.net/blog/2008/03/document-history-viewer-making-use-of-del-and-ins/
As I was working on this I wanted to mark up a list where items had been added
and removed. That's when I realised that you can't wrap up li dt or
You can only apply the alt attribute to img elements. If you need to provide
an alt attribute to a CSS background image then the background image should
instead be an img element.
Use the img element for images related to the content and keep all images
related to layout in your CSS.
-
the content supposed to be the job of the browser/user agent - rather than
you using CSS.
On Sun, March 23, 2008 12:43 pm, Thomas Thomassen wrote:
I was working on some examples for the use of del and ins.
http://www.thomthom.net/blog/2008/03/document-history-viewer-making-use-of-d
el-and-ins
] On Behalf Of Thomas
Thomassen
Sent: Sunday, March 23, 2008 5:44 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: [WSG] INS and DEL in lists
I was working on some examples for the use of del and ins.
http://www.thomthom.net/blog/2008/03/document-history-viewer-making-use-of-del-and-ins
, March 25, 2008 5:50 PM
Subject: RE: [WSG] INS and DEL in lists
Regardless,
Tags are there to markup content, whereas classes are used to group together
tags or markup.
Kyle
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Thomas Thomassen
Sent: 25 March
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 7:57 PM
Subject: RE: [WSG] INS and DEL in lists
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Thomas Thomassen
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 10:58 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG
.
-Thom
- Original Message -
From: Keryx Web [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Tuesday, March 25, 2008 8:24 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] INS and DEL in lists
Thomas Thomassen skrev:
I posted a comment about it in the W3C public HTML discussion group,
hoping it'd
Semantic markup for a person's name or business nameThe ADDRESS element is
intended to provide contact information for the author of the HTML document,
not any address.
http://www.w3.org/TR/html401/struct/global.html#h-7.5.6
-Thom
- Original Message -
From: Cole Kuryakin
To:
Poping up windows makes assumtion of the user's behaviour. I for one find it
very annoying when sites force open a new window. If I want to navigate a
link I open the link up in a new tab. Forcing the link to open up in a new
window doesn't make me stay on the site, it just makes me click extra
myself.
But as I said, it's a different fish from websites.
-Thom
- Original Message -
From: Hassan Schroeder [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2008 6:59 PM
Subject: Re: [WSG] a target=” blank” not part of xhtml
Thomas Thomassen wrote:
Poping up
.. although I wonder how many people would know how to do that.
Not everyone who uses the internet is all that websavvy.
Nancy
- Original Message -
From: Thomas Thomassen [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2008 10:01 AM
Subject: Re: [WSG] a target
If there isn't any doctype you won't have to worry. IE8 will use the old
render engines for that.
--
From: Jens-Uwe Korff [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 10:07 AM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: RE: [WSG] IE8 beta's a
Could be technical if you want to allow your pages to be parsed with XML
parsers. I've done that in the past because I made some software to fetch data
from my site.
-Thom
From: Andrew Maben
Sent: Wednesday, April 30, 2008 4:14 PM
To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org
Subject: Re: [WSG]
I've not done any full Flash websites. For reasons of accessibility and the
loss of browser navigational tools. But I have been playing with an idea;
use XHTML as data source for the site instead of plain XML. That way you
build a site with all the accessibility and features of HTML with Flash
Or, instead of using a class to reset the layout to original, why not set a
class for the elements you actually are styling?
When I use use INPUT elements I allways add a class related to what kind of
input element it is and only refer to the class in the CSS. Recently I've
started to use
If you do content negotiation to send html/text and XHTML 1.0 to IE and
application/xhtml+xml XHTML to anyone else then you're effectivly using
XHTML 1.0 html/text as you'd never be able to make use of the modular XML
nature of XHTML 1.1.
- Original Message -
From: Nikita The Spider
You can still do that with XHTML 1.0 sent as html/text. I've done that
several times when I've made desktop gadgets to extract data from my site.
The parsers doesn't care if the page is sent as html/text instead of
xml/text.
I don't see any point of using XHTML 1.1 unless you use it's modular
Add some padding at the bottom of the content with the same size as the
absolutely positioned element. That should prevent the preseeding content to
not overlap. You might have to do some position and size adjustments to make
it all fit again after you add the padding.
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