Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Those are the type of people that ideas but need us to implement them to make them real. Those ideas and having them implemented means more work for us in the community and that means more bright people in the community. Just my experience. Like the idea of balance also. What I was thinking wasn't really aimed from a pure selling point of view more getting back to grass roots websites though. The home page should provide a clear message about what the site is all about. That means a clear message about what zope 3 is all about. The reason it should appeal to newcomers in particular is because they are less likely to go further if then do not understand what the benefits are. Anyone already in the community is likely to be able to bookmark their ideal landing page whether it be news, new products, mailing list archives or whatever they like to use to keep abreast. There is a balance to be struck of course as we are not about hype but a clear consistent, concise message goes a long way. Think of it as a backing up of the community, when we try to convince someone they should use zope we can point them at the site to find out why we are so evangelistic about it. Anyway sounds like you guys are all on the right track so don't take this as a disagreement :-) cheers, Pete Chris Withers wrote: Lennart Regebro wrote: Of course not, you are a total thinker, and not affected positively about people bragging. But most other people are. It's all about hype. I'll take that as a compliment ;-) Do we really want people that are attracted? How are they going to benefit our community? Chris ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Lennart Regebro wrote: Of course not, you are a total thinker, and not affected positively about people bragging. But most other people are. It's all about hype. I'll take that as a compliment ;-) Do we really want people that are attracted? How are they going to benefit our community? Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Lennart Regebro wrote: On 3/8/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I think Zope would be much more appealing for newcomers if they could see it was vibrant and focussed rather than trying to "sell" itself... Although if you see on all other wibsites, it seems to actually work the otehr way around. ;) Hmm, not sure I agree... But of course, there can be an overload. One or two nice testimonials, and then some news would be the right mix I think. Yep, I could live with that... cheers, Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
" But of course, there can be an overload. One or two nice testimonials, and then some news would be the right mix I think." I agree. On Mar 8, 2006, at 7:03 AM, Lennart Regebro wrote: On 3/8/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: I think Zope would be much more appealing for newcomers if they could see it was vibrant and focussed rather than trying to "sell" itself... Although if you see on all other wibsites, it seems to actually work the otehr way around. ;) But of course, there can be an overload. One or two nice testimonials, and then some news would be the right mix I think. No news is dead news. :) -- Lennart Regebro, Nuxeo http://www.nuxeo.com/ CPS Content Management http://www.cps-project.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
On 3/8/06, Chris Withers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I think Zope would be much more appealing for newcomers if they could > see it was vibrant and focussed rather than trying to "sell" itself... Although if you see on all other wibsites, it seems to actually work the otehr way around. ;) But of course, there can be an overload. One or two nice testimonials, and then some news would be the right mix I think. No news is dead news. :) -- Lennart Regebro, Nuxeo http://www.nuxeo.com/ CPS Content Management http://www.cps-project.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: "Is the idea that this is the stuff that changes the most and so will draw people back or is it just filler content at this stage?" Mostly filler. I agree with what you say. I'm thinking some of the testimonials would be good and I'm planning on mocking that up. I also think Andrew S. said he's looking into getting some good introductory text as well. Honestly, I'd prefer the front page to be less testimonials/marketing/etc and more content that the rest of us with find useful, which seemed to be what your v3 had, bar the testimonial at the top. I think Zope would be much more appealing for newcomers if they could see it was vibrant and focussed rather than trying to "sell" itself... Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Thanks Tom I figured as much but always good to be sure. Cheers, Pete Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: "Is the idea that this is the stuff that changes the most and so will draw people back or is it just filler content at this stage?" Mostly filler. I agree with what you say. I'm thinking some of the testimonials would be good and I'm planning on mocking that up. I also think Andrew S. said he's looking into getting some good introductory text as well. - [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.modscape.com - On Mar 7, 2006, at 3:29 PM, Peter Simmons wrote: Hi All, I had a look at the latest from Tom also and like it too. I am not sure about having the content that is in the content area as the very first thing newbies will see. Is the idea that this is the stuff that changes the most and so will draw people back or is it just filler content at this stage? I think if we just had a clear statement of intent, something punchy like Looking for an enterprise web framework? You've found the right place. Other statements which I think fit might be 'A web framework built by developers for developers so that they can deliver.' Or something like that. Cheers, Pete Andrew Sawyers wrote: He noted he's aware of that and working on it. Talking to him yesterday, he thought he could have something done that we can start using by Monday. Andrew Sawyers On Fri, 2006-03-03 at 11:10 +, Chris Withers wrote: Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy nav. Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go along. I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else anyone can think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will try to keep pace on this. http://modscape.com/zope Having finally remembered to look at this while I'm online, I really like it :-) (much more than v1, in fact!) The rollovers don't work right ofr me in firefox though: no content shows in them and funny formatting... cheers, Chris ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
"Is the idea that this is the stuff that changes the most and so will draw people back or is it just filler content at this stage?" Mostly filler. I agree with what you say. I'm thinking some of the testimonials would be good and I'm planning on mocking that up. I also think Andrew S. said he's looking into getting some good introductory text as well. - [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.modscape.com - On Mar 7, 2006, at 3:29 PM, Peter Simmons wrote: Hi All, I had a look at the latest from Tom also and like it too. I am not sure about having the content that is in the content area as the very first thing newbies will see. Is the idea that this is the stuff that changes the most and so will draw people back or is it just filler content at this stage? I think if we just had a clear statement of intent, something punchy like Looking for an enterprise web framework? You've found the right place. Other statements which I think fit might be 'A web framework built by developers for developers so that they can deliver.' Or something like that. Cheers, Pete Andrew Sawyers wrote: He noted he's aware of that and working on it. Talking to him yesterday, he thought he could have something done that we can start using by Monday. Andrew Sawyers On Fri, 2006-03-03 at 11:10 +, Chris Withers wrote: Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy nav. Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go along. I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else anyone can think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will try to keep pace on this. http://modscape.com/zope Having finally remembered to look at this while I'm online, I really like it :-) (much more than v1, in fact!) The rollovers don't work right ofr me in firefox though: no content shows in them and funny formatting... cheers, Chris ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Hi All, I had a look at the latest from Tom also and like it too. I am not sure about having the content that is in the content area as the very first thing newbies will see. Is the idea that this is the stuff that changes the most and so will draw people back or is it just filler content at this stage? I think if we just had a clear statement of intent, something punchy like Looking for an enterprise web framework? You've found the right place. Other statements which I think fit might be 'A web framework built by developers for developers so that they can deliver.' Or something like that. Cheers, Pete Andrew Sawyers wrote: He noted he's aware of that and working on it. Talking to him yesterday, he thought he could have something done that we can start using by Monday. Andrew Sawyers On Fri, 2006-03-03 at 11:10 +, Chris Withers wrote: Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy nav. Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go along. I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else anyone can think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will try to keep pace on this. http://modscape.com/zope Having finally remembered to look at this while I'm online, I really like it :-) (much more than v1, in fact!) The rollovers don't work right ofr me in firefox though: no content shows in them and funny formatting... cheers, Chris ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
He noted he's aware of that and working on it. Talking to him yesterday, he thought he could have something done that we can start using by Monday. Andrew Sawyers On Fri, 2006-03-03 at 11:10 +, Chris Withers wrote: > Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: > > > > Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy nav. > > Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go along. > > I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else anyone can > > think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will try to keep > > pace on this. > > http://modscape.com/zope > > Having finally remembered to look at this while I'm online, I really > like it :-) > (much more than v1, in fact!) > > The rollovers don't work right ofr me in firefox though: no content > shows in them and funny formatting... > > cheers, > > Chris > ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy nav. Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go along. I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else anyone can think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will try to keep pace on this. http://modscape.com/zope Having finally remembered to look at this while I'm online, I really like it :-) (much more than v1, in fact!) The rollovers don't work right ofr me in firefox though: no content shows in them and funny formatting... cheers, Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope & Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Great job Tom. I like the layout (minus what's in the content well) - but that's a nit. I think we have to expect more for 'marketing' then one might otherwise (note to Jens) :) Keep up the excellent work! Andrew On Thu, 2006-02-23 at 21:08 -0500, Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: > Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy > nav. Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go > along. I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else > anyone can think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will > try to keep pace on this. > http://modscape.com/zope > > On Feb 17, 2006, at 8:01 PM, Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: > > > > > Based on some of the comments, I'm actually working on a brand new > > layout. I'm trying to really simplify and organize things and give > > the site a more "marketable" look and feel... without losing > > functionality. I should have some new stuff posted this weekend. > > > > On Feb 17, 2006, at 9:14 AM, Andrew Sawyers wrote: > > > >>> I am really keen to spend the money on some nice design (for logo, > >>> colors, brand guidelines) and marketing efforts for Zope 3. > >> We have some of this expertise at our disposal. Tom V. (who's on > >> this > >> list IIRC) has done some nice initial design work. I think the last > >> thread with him was to reduce the front page navigation - which he > >> had > >> noted he was going to take a stab at. > > > > ___ > > Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org > > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web > > ___ > Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
On 2/24/06, Tom Von Lahndorff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy > nav. Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go > along. I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else > anyone can think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will > try to keep pace on this. > http://modscape.com/zope Very nice, big friendly icons! I like it. -- Lennart Regebro, Nuxeo http://www.nuxeo.com/ CPS Content Management http://www.cps-project.org/ ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Thanks for the feedback Jens. Good to hear from you! :) Actually, I may have made a mistake by posting the mockups early. I'm actually right in the middle of working on the navs, I'm aware of both issues and working on them offline. Just wanted to let everyone know, but please don't hesitate to send comments. Thanks. On Feb 25, 2006, at 5:32 PM, Jens Vagelpohl wrote: On 24 Feb 2006, at 03:08, Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy nav. Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go along. I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else anyone can think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will try to keep pace on this. http://modscape.com/zope Thanks Tom, this is wonderful work :) I'm conservative, I actually prefer version 1. I don't think it would be hard to whittle down that left navigation to something that fits above the fold in its entirety. I find the menu across the top problematic in version 2. The font (at least in Firefox on OS X) is not distinguished in size or looks over the standard text font, and the dropdown menus render really badly. jens ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
On 24 Feb 2006, at 03:08, Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy nav. Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go along. I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else anyone can think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will try to keep pace on this. http://modscape.com/zope Thanks Tom, this is wonderful work :) I'm conservative, I actually prefer version 1. I don't think it would be hard to whittle down that left navigation to something that fits above the fold in its entirety. I find the menu across the top problematic in version 2. The font (at least in Firefox on OS X) is not distinguished in size or looks over the standard text font, and the dropdown menus render really badly. jens ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Hi Tom, thanks for working on this. I took a quick look, looks great. Two issues: the fonts are too small (cf our competition's sites), and the download menu appears behind everything else in firefox 1.5 on gnu/linux. Thanks again! Very nice. ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Version 2 is linked below. Its a work in progress, namely the buggy nav. Any comments are appreciated. I'll be adding more pages as I go along. I'm also open to providing a Media Kit and whatever else anyone can think of. I'm a little slammed at work right now, but will try to keep pace on this. http://modscape.com/zope On Feb 17, 2006, at 8:01 PM, Tom Von Lahndorff wrote: Based on some of the comments, I'm actually working on a brand new layout. I'm trying to really simplify and organize things and give the site a more "marketable" look and feel... without losing functionality. I should have some new stuff posted this weekend. On Feb 17, 2006, at 9:14 AM, Andrew Sawyers wrote: I am really keen to spend the money on some nice design (for logo, colors, brand guidelines) and marketing efforts for Zope 3. We have some of this expertise at our disposal. Tom V. (who's on this list IIRC) has done some nice initial design work. I think the last thread with him was to reduce the front page navigation - which he had noted he was going to take a stab at. ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Based on some of the comments, I'm actually working on a brand new layout. I'm trying to really simplify and organize things and give the site a more "marketable" look and feel... without losing functionality. I should have some new stuff posted this weekend. On Feb 17, 2006, at 9:14 AM, Andrew Sawyers wrote: I am really keen to spend the money on some nice design (for logo, colors, brand guidelines) and marketing efforts for Zope 3. We have some of this expertise at our disposal. Tom V. (who's on this list IIRC) has done some nice initial design work. I think the last thread with him was to reduce the front page navigation - which he had noted he was going to take a stab at. ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
On Fri, 2006-02-17 at 11:04 +1300, Peter Simmons wrote: > Hi Andrew, > > Cheers. That does sound like a good idea I have been wondering about > creating more content for our site and might do that also :-) Thanks to > Christian T also for the idea in the first place. I just let him know. :) > > Do you help keep zope.org up to date? (forgive my ignorance in this area) I have done lots in the past - mostly hardware wise; and have been trying to get a redefined new site we can be proud of for some time now. A few others have stepped up and we're working together to get something done. So, I'm a participant, yes. > > I am really keen to spend the money on some nice design (for logo, > colors, brand guidelines) and marketing efforts for Zope 3. We have some of this expertise at our disposal. Tom V. (who's on this list IIRC) has done some nice initial design work. I think the last thread with him was to reduce the front page navigation - which he had noted he was going to take a stab at. > I truly do > believe that with a little effort we can make the entry point much > better. I know from experience that have the plone.org site (the front > page and demos are the main contribution really) it helps people > understand what they are getting into when they start using plone. I > think we could do the same for Zope 3. > > The items > > 1) What is Zope 3? > 2) Why use Zope 3? > 3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks? > 4) How do I get started? > > Cover it I think. I am pretty keen to keep the aim/goal fairly simple to > begin with to ensure we get something up and running. Then I believe we need > to keep reinvesting to keep current with what is going on just on these basic > items. We should really only expand if these are completely up to date and we > have spare resource. > I can't agree more. That's been my main thrust for some time. I just got access to Phillip's SVN repo yesterday, so I was going to add some to the documents I had reviewed on D2M's site. Thanks Again! Andrew Sawyers > Cheers, > Pete > > Andrew Sawyers wrote: > > >That's excellent Peter! I don't want any money, but would be cool to > >find the best use for it > >Talking to Christian T from the German Zope Users Group the other day, > >he pointed out something interesting they were doing with available > >funds: hiring 2 'writers' who would watch the Zope and python lists and > >bi-weekly (2 - ea. offsetting one another) write an in-depth article for > >their site. > > > >I think that would be interesting possibility to do with offered funds > >and maybe could be further used by the foundation when that gets > >established. > > > >Anyhow, really just wanted to say 'thanks'. > > > >Andrew Sawyers > > > > > >On Fri, 2006-02-17 at 09:58 +1300, Peter Simmons wrote: > > > > > >>Hi All, > >> > >>I just subscribed to both these lists (forgive the cross post) so you > >>may have gotten further down the road on this one than I have seen. I > >>have been following a conversation on Zope3-users list about setting up > >>a website and doing a little marketing push for Zope 3. > >> > >>I really liked the ideas in the email from Joel Moxley > >>([EMAIL PROTECTED]) as pasted at the end in particular as I think they > >>sum up where the discussion got to. Anyway I wanted to offer some > >>funding to help get a site like that going I could offer $1000 NZD > >>(about $700 USD at present) from my company to kick this thing off. > >> > >>I am not sure where to go next though, Gary Poster suggested I get over > >>to the zope-web list and that the foundation would also be able to help > >>with this when it gets up and running. > >> > >>I noticed recently that the Plone foundation had started using a site > >>http://fundable.org to help people organise funding for projects similar > >>to this. Have a look at the site it seems like a good place to do this > >>kinda thing. > >> > >>Anyone got a place to point me or ideas about how to get the funding > >>into place and get this thing going? > >> > >>Cheers, > >>Pete > >> > >>As I see it, Zope 3's central marketing issue is the lack of a > >>coherent online identity. There needs to be a single place that > >>answers the following questions: > >> > >>1) What is Zope 3? > >>2) Why use Zope 3? > >>3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks? > >>4) How do I get started? > >> > >>Largely, this is assembly of the Zope 3 FrontPage, philikon's first > >>two chapters, and the "appetizer" quick start guides on worldcookery. > >>However, I would also love to see a section on the lead developers > >>answering Q1-Q3. And this would be in conjunction with conveying... > >> > >>Zope3's shtick: Zope3 is not flashy. Zope3 does not put pastel > >>colors on its website. Zope3 is the no-nonsense, industrial strength > >>platform. It's where you come when you want to do it right. It was > >>coded with the most rigorous standards by a bunch of hard-nosed son
Re: [ZF] Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Hi Joel, I agree exactly. Basically I am just trying to work out how to do it without stepping on any toes and fit in with whatever plans there are. But so far I haven't found out anything. So if anyone can help in that area (even if to say there isn't anything) that would be really helpful. Cheers, Pete Joel Moxley wrote: Pete and all, Like you, I'm fairly new to the Zope3 marketing and website issues -- and relatively new to Zope/Zope3 as well. I was actually unaware of the zope-web list until that "Guido" thread. In any event, I agree with you -- the initial and central need is an intelligent, clear organization of existing content in a single place. I've followed the discussion on both lists, and my questions are these: I've seen the zope-web svn text (which is a great start). What's the plan forward, and when does the zope-web community expect to have working model? Is there a timeline? Where can a non-expert individual like myself make a contribution? I feel as though initially the mere existence of a central Zope3 brochure-type "jumping off" website would be hugely valuable even if not completely perfected. I'm unclear on whether this is too specific for zope-web's larger purpose. If it is something zope-web wants to do, is it something that we would expect in a few months or perhaps year? Anyways, I'm excited that so many of us share the enthusiasm for marketing Zope and Zope3. Joel On 2/16/06, Peter Simmons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Re-reading my email I kinda put the emphasis in the wrong area. If we need more design then I would like to get it right of couse the existing isn't too bad so maybe we don't need it so much just a little bit for differiantion purposes. The main thing is the content. I would be keen to do some demos/simulations as well as getting together the existing howtos and making sure they are up to date. The 4 items sum it up and the content behind those is the main thing. Cheers, Pete Peter Simmons wrote: Hi Andrew, Cheers. That does sound like a good idea I have been wondering about creating more content for our site and might do that also :-) Thanks to Christian T also for the idea in the first place. Do you help keep zope.org up to date? (forgive my ignorance in this area) I am really keen to spend the money on some nice design (for logo, colors, brand guidelines) and marketing efforts for Zope 3. I truly do believe that with a little effort we can make the entry point much better. I know from experience that have the plone.org site (the front page and demos are the main contribution really) it helps people understand what they are getting into when they start using plone. I think we could do the same for Zope 3. The items 1) What is Zope 3? 2) Why use Zope 3? 3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks? 4) How do I get started? Cover it I think. I am pretty keen to keep the aim/goal fairly simple to begin with to ensure we get something up and running. Then I believe we need to keep reinvesting to keep current with what is going on just on these basic items. We should really only expand if these are completely up to date and we have spare resource. Cheers, Pete Andrew Sawyers wrote: That's excellent Peter! I don't want any money, but would be cool to find the best use for it Talking to Christian T from the German Zope Users Group the other day, he pointed out something interesting they were doing with available funds: hiring 2 'writers' who would watch the Zope and python lists and bi-weekly (2 - ea. offsetting one another) write an in-depth article for their site. I think that would be interesting possibility to do with offered funds and maybe could be further used by the foundation when that gets established. Anyhow, really just wanted to say 'thanks'. Andrew Sawyers On Fri, 2006-02-17 at 09:58 +1300, Peter Simmons wrote: Hi All, I just subscribed to both these lists (forgive the cross post) so you may have gotten further down the road on this one than I have seen. I have been following a conversation on Zope3-users list about setting up a website and doing a little marketing push for Zope 3. I really liked the ideas in the email from Joel Moxley ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) as pasted at the end in particular as I think they sum up where the discussion got to. Anyway I wanted to offer some funding to help get a site like that going I could offer $1000 NZD (about $700 USD at present) from my company to kick this thing off. I am not sure where to go next though, Gary Poster suggested I get over to the zope-web list and that the foundation would also be able to help with this when it gets up and running. I noticed recently that the Plone foundation had started using a site http://fundable.org to help people organise funding for projects similar to this. Have a look at the site it seems like a good place to do this kinda thing. Anyone got a place to point me or ideas about how to get the funding
Re: [ZF] Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Pete and all, Like you, I'm fairly new to the Zope3 marketing and website issues -- and relatively new to Zope/Zope3 as well. I was actually unaware of the zope-web list until that "Guido" thread. In any event, I agree with you -- the initial and central need is an intelligent, clear organization of existing content in a single place. I've followed the discussion on both lists, and my questions are these: I've seen the zope-web svn text (which is a great start). What's the plan forward, and when does the zope-web community expect to have working model? Is there a timeline? Where can a non-expert individual like myself make a contribution? I feel as though initially the mere existence of a central Zope3 brochure-type "jumping off" website would be hugely valuable even if not completely perfected. I'm unclear on whether this is too specific for zope-web's larger purpose. If it is something zope-web wants to do, is it something that we would expect in a few months or perhaps year? Anyways, I'm excited that so many of us share the enthusiasm for marketing Zope and Zope3. Joel On 2/16/06, Peter Simmons <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Re-reading my email I kinda put the emphasis in the wrong area. If we > need more design then I would like to get it right of couse the existing > isn't too bad so maybe we don't need it so much just a little bit for > differiantion purposes. > > The main thing is the content. I would be keen to do some > demos/simulations as well as getting together the existing howtos and > making sure they are up to date. > > The 4 items sum it up and the content behind those is the main thing. > > Cheers, > Pete > > Peter Simmons wrote: > > > Hi Andrew, > > > > Cheers. That does sound like a good idea I have been wondering about > > creating more content for our site and might do that also :-) Thanks > > to Christian T also for the idea in the first place. > > > > Do you help keep zope.org up to date? (forgive my ignorance in this area) > > > > I am really keen to spend the money on some nice design (for logo, > > colors, brand guidelines) and marketing efforts for Zope 3. I truly do > > believe that with a little effort we can make the entry point much > > better. I know from experience that have the plone.org site (the front > > page and demos are the main contribution really) it helps people > > understand what they are getting into when they start using plone. I > > think we could do the same for Zope 3. > > > > The items > > > > 1) What is Zope 3? > > 2) Why use Zope 3? > > 3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks? > > 4) How do I get started? > > > > Cover it I think. I am pretty keen to keep the aim/goal fairly simple > > to begin with to ensure we get something up and running. Then I > > believe we need to keep reinvesting to keep current with what is going > > on just on these basic items. We should really only expand if these > > are completely up to date and we have spare resource. > > > > Cheers, > > Pete > > > > Andrew Sawyers wrote: > > > >> That's excellent Peter! I don't want any money, but would be cool to > >> find the best use for it > >> Talking to Christian T from the German Zope Users Group the other day, > >> he pointed out something interesting they were doing with available > >> funds: hiring 2 'writers' who would watch the Zope and python lists and > >> bi-weekly (2 - ea. offsetting one another) write an in-depth article for > >> their site. > >> I think that would be interesting possibility to do with offered funds > >> and maybe could be further used by the foundation when that gets > >> established. > >> Anyhow, really just wanted to say 'thanks'. > >> > >> Andrew Sawyers > >> > >> > >> On Fri, 2006-02-17 at 09:58 +1300, Peter Simmons wrote: > >> > >> > >>> Hi All, > >>> > >>> I just subscribed to both these lists (forgive the cross post) so > >>> you may have gotten further down the road on this one than I have > >>> seen. I have been following a conversation on Zope3-users list about > >>> setting up a website and doing a little marketing push for Zope 3. > >>> > >>> I really liked the ideas in the email from Joel Moxley > >>> ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) as pasted at the end in particular as I think > >>> they sum up where the discussion got to. Anyway I wanted to offer > >>> some funding to help get a site like that going I could offer $1000 > >>> NZD (about $700 USD at present) from my company to kick this thing off. > >>> > >>> I am not sure where to go next though, Gary Poster suggested I get > >>> over to the zope-web list and that the foundation would also be able > >>> to help with this when it gets up and running. > >>> > >>> I noticed recently that the Plone foundation had started using a > >>> site http://fundable.org to help people organise funding for > >>> projects similar to this. Have a look at the site it seems like a > >>> good place to do this kinda thing. > >>> > >>> Anyone got a place to point me or ideas about how to get the
Re: [ZF] Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Re-reading my email I kinda put the emphasis in the wrong area. If we need more design then I would like to get it right of couse the existing isn't too bad so maybe we don't need it so much just a little bit for differiantion purposes. The main thing is the content. I would be keen to do some demos/simulations as well as getting together the existing howtos and making sure they are up to date. The 4 items sum it up and the content behind those is the main thing. Cheers, Pete Peter Simmons wrote: Hi Andrew, Cheers. That does sound like a good idea I have been wondering about creating more content for our site and might do that also :-) Thanks to Christian T also for the idea in the first place. Do you help keep zope.org up to date? (forgive my ignorance in this area) I am really keen to spend the money on some nice design (for logo, colors, brand guidelines) and marketing efforts for Zope 3. I truly do believe that with a little effort we can make the entry point much better. I know from experience that have the plone.org site (the front page and demos are the main contribution really) it helps people understand what they are getting into when they start using plone. I think we could do the same for Zope 3. The items 1) What is Zope 3? 2) Why use Zope 3? 3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks? 4) How do I get started? Cover it I think. I am pretty keen to keep the aim/goal fairly simple to begin with to ensure we get something up and running. Then I believe we need to keep reinvesting to keep current with what is going on just on these basic items. We should really only expand if these are completely up to date and we have spare resource. Cheers, Pete Andrew Sawyers wrote: That's excellent Peter! I don't want any money, but would be cool to find the best use for it Talking to Christian T from the German Zope Users Group the other day, he pointed out something interesting they were doing with available funds: hiring 2 'writers' who would watch the Zope and python lists and bi-weekly (2 - ea. offsetting one another) write an in-depth article for their site. I think that would be interesting possibility to do with offered funds and maybe could be further used by the foundation when that gets established. Anyhow, really just wanted to say 'thanks'. Andrew Sawyers On Fri, 2006-02-17 at 09:58 +1300, Peter Simmons wrote: Hi All, I just subscribed to both these lists (forgive the cross post) so you may have gotten further down the road on this one than I have seen. I have been following a conversation on Zope3-users list about setting up a website and doing a little marketing push for Zope 3. I really liked the ideas in the email from Joel Moxley ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) as pasted at the end in particular as I think they sum up where the discussion got to. Anyway I wanted to offer some funding to help get a site like that going I could offer $1000 NZD (about $700 USD at present) from my company to kick this thing off. I am not sure where to go next though, Gary Poster suggested I get over to the zope-web list and that the foundation would also be able to help with this when it gets up and running. I noticed recently that the Plone foundation had started using a site http://fundable.org to help people organise funding for projects similar to this. Have a look at the site it seems like a good place to do this kinda thing. Anyone got a place to point me or ideas about how to get the funding into place and get this thing going? Cheers, Pete As I see it, Zope 3's central marketing issue is the lack of a coherent online identity. There needs to be a single place that answers the following questions: 1) What is Zope 3? 2) Why use Zope 3? 3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks? 4) How do I get started? Largely, this is assembly of the Zope 3 FrontPage, philikon's first two chapters, and the "appetizer" quick start guides on worldcookery. However, I would also love to see a section on the lead developers answering Q1-Q3. And this would be in conjunction with conveying... Zope3's shtick: Zope3 is not flashy. Zope3 does not put pastel colors on its website. Zope3 is the no-nonsense, industrial strength platform. It's where you come when you want to do it right. It was coded with the most rigorous standards by a bunch of hard-nosed sons of bitches who don't have time for froofy marketing :) . And so forth. This would come across in lead dev's answering Q1-Q3. And finally, the site should demonstrate the "industrial strength" quality with examples. Little snippets from developers of SchoolTool, corporate users, and so forth should demonstrate "hey, we're for real, and we don't mess around -- you give me an animated screenshots, I raise you a XYZ transaction per day uber site". In a sense, we'd want to portray ourselves as the Chuck Norris[1] of web platforms :) Bottom line, a coherent online identity would go
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
Hi Andrew, Cheers. That does sound like a good idea I have been wondering about creating more content for our site and might do that also :-) Thanks to Christian T also for the idea in the first place. Do you help keep zope.org up to date? (forgive my ignorance in this area) I am really keen to spend the money on some nice design (for logo, colors, brand guidelines) and marketing efforts for Zope 3. I truly do believe that with a little effort we can make the entry point much better. I know from experience that have the plone.org site (the front page and demos are the main contribution really) it helps people understand what they are getting into when they start using plone. I think we could do the same for Zope 3. The items 1) What is Zope 3? 2) Why use Zope 3? 3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks? 4) How do I get started? Cover it I think. I am pretty keen to keep the aim/goal fairly simple to begin with to ensure we get something up and running. Then I believe we need to keep reinvesting to keep current with what is going on just on these basic items. We should really only expand if these are completely up to date and we have spare resource. Cheers, Pete Andrew Sawyers wrote: That's excellent Peter! I don't want any money, but would be cool to find the best use for it Talking to Christian T from the German Zope Users Group the other day, he pointed out something interesting they were doing with available funds: hiring 2 'writers' who would watch the Zope and python lists and bi-weekly (2 - ea. offsetting one another) write an in-depth article for their site. I think that would be interesting possibility to do with offered funds and maybe could be further used by the foundation when that gets established. Anyhow, really just wanted to say 'thanks'. Andrew Sawyers On Fri, 2006-02-17 at 09:58 +1300, Peter Simmons wrote: Hi All, I just subscribed to both these lists (forgive the cross post) so you may have gotten further down the road on this one than I have seen. I have been following a conversation on Zope3-users list about setting up a website and doing a little marketing push for Zope 3. I really liked the ideas in the email from Joel Moxley ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) as pasted at the end in particular as I think they sum up where the discussion got to. Anyway I wanted to offer some funding to help get a site like that going I could offer $1000 NZD (about $700 USD at present) from my company to kick this thing off. I am not sure where to go next though, Gary Poster suggested I get over to the zope-web list and that the foundation would also be able to help with this when it gets up and running. I noticed recently that the Plone foundation had started using a site http://fundable.org to help people organise funding for projects similar to this. Have a look at the site it seems like a good place to do this kinda thing. Anyone got a place to point me or ideas about how to get the funding into place and get this thing going? Cheers, Pete As I see it, Zope 3's central marketing issue is the lack of a coherent online identity. There needs to be a single place that answers the following questions: 1) What is Zope 3? 2) Why use Zope 3? 3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks? 4) How do I get started? Largely, this is assembly of the Zope 3 FrontPage, philikon's first two chapters, and the "appetizer" quick start guides on worldcookery. However, I would also love to see a section on the lead developers answering Q1-Q3. And this would be in conjunction with conveying... Zope3's shtick: Zope3 is not flashy. Zope3 does not put pastel colors on its website. Zope3 is the no-nonsense, industrial strength platform. It's where you come when you want to do it right. It was coded with the most rigorous standards by a bunch of hard-nosed sons of bitches who don't have time for froofy marketing :) . And so forth. This would come across in lead dev's answering Q1-Q3. And finally, the site should demonstrate the "industrial strength" quality with examples. Little snippets from developers of SchoolTool, corporate users, and so forth should demonstrate "hey, we're for real, and we don't mess around -- you give me an animated screenshots, I raise you a XYZ transaction per day uber site". In a sense, we'd want to portray ourselves as the Chuck Norris[1] of web platforms :) Bottom line, a coherent online identity would go a long way. Instead of doing some snazzy marketings, let's communicate the character that Zope3 does have. It sounds like zope3.org under ZF might be the ideal way to do this, As for codenames, this is just one way we could help create a coherent online identity. I certainly think release names would be fun (and not distracting to the central "Zope 3" brand we'd want). Overall, I think the time has come for communication of Zope 3 identity to move hand in hand with development. Joel __
Re: [ZWeb] Zope 3 Website
That's excellent Peter! I don't want any money, but would be cool to find the best use for it Talking to Christian T from the German Zope Users Group the other day, he pointed out something interesting they were doing with available funds: hiring 2 'writers' who would watch the Zope and python lists and bi-weekly (2 - ea. offsetting one another) write an in-depth article for their site. I think that would be interesting possibility to do with offered funds and maybe could be further used by the foundation when that gets established. Anyhow, really just wanted to say 'thanks'. Andrew Sawyers On Fri, 2006-02-17 at 09:58 +1300, Peter Simmons wrote: > Hi All, > > I just subscribed to both these lists (forgive the cross post) so you > may have gotten further down the road on this one than I have seen. I > have been following a conversation on Zope3-users list about setting up > a website and doing a little marketing push for Zope 3. > > I really liked the ideas in the email from Joel Moxley > ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) as pasted at the end in particular as I think they > sum up where the discussion got to. Anyway I wanted to offer some > funding to help get a site like that going I could offer $1000 NZD > (about $700 USD at present) from my company to kick this thing off. > > I am not sure where to go next though, Gary Poster suggested I get over > to the zope-web list and that the foundation would also be able to help > with this when it gets up and running. > > I noticed recently that the Plone foundation had started using a site > http://fundable.org to help people organise funding for projects similar > to this. Have a look at the site it seems like a good place to do this > kinda thing. > > Anyone got a place to point me or ideas about how to get the funding > into place and get this thing going? > > Cheers, > Pete > > As I see it, Zope 3's central marketing issue is the lack of a > coherent online identity. There needs to be a single place that > answers the following questions: > > 1) What is Zope 3? > 2) Why use Zope 3? > 3) How does Zope 3 compare to competing frameworks? > 4) How do I get started? > > Largely, this is assembly of the Zope 3 FrontPage, philikon's first > two chapters, and the "appetizer" quick start guides on worldcookery. > However, I would also love to see a section on the lead developers > answering Q1-Q3. And this would be in conjunction with conveying... > > Zope3's shtick: Zope3 is not flashy. Zope3 does not put pastel > colors on its website. Zope3 is the no-nonsense, industrial strength > platform. It's where you come when you want to do it right. It was > coded with the most rigorous standards by a bunch of hard-nosed sons > of bitches who don't have time for froofy marketing :) . And so forth. > This would come across in lead dev's answering Q1-Q3. > > And finally, the site should demonstrate the "industrial strength" > quality with examples. Little snippets from developers of SchoolTool, > corporate users, and so forth should demonstrate "hey, we're for real, > and we don't mess around -- you give me an animated screenshots, I > raise you a XYZ transaction per day uber site". In a sense, we'd want > to portray ourselves as the Chuck Norris[1] of web platforms :) > > Bottom line, a coherent online identity would go a long way. Instead > of doing some snazzy marketings, let's communicate the character that > Zope3 does have. It sounds like zope3.org under ZF might be the ideal > way to do this, > > As for codenames, this is just one way we could help create a coherent > online identity. I certainly think release names would be fun (and > not distracting to the central "Zope 3" brand we'd want). Overall, I > think the time has come for communication of Zope 3 identity to move > hand in hand with development. > > Joel > > > ___ > Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web ___ Zope-web maillist - Zope-web@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-web
