Ryan,
The majority of the list members are not from US, so I do not really think that you would want an answer on this question. LOL Hakan At 00:19 17/05/2004, you wrote: >OK, enough already. I won't make the same mistake again and post MHOs on >this list. How any of you can sit there and say you have not directly >benefited from the colonization of the land that now makes up the USA is >beyond me, but OK. Now, shall we get back to biofuels? > >Thank you, > >Ryan > -----Original Message----- > From: Hakan Falk [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Saturday, May 15, 2004 6:41 PM > To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com > Subject: RE: [biofuel] RE: [biofuels] Re: US poll about Iraq war > > > > Dermot, > > The problem is that Ryan is a product of Hollywood history and that he > must have slept in school. It is an overwhelming task to answer his short > posting, that is so efficient in showing the total lack of knowledge in >facts > and history. I was about to respond, but discovered that it would take >well > over 20 pages, to correct only the few statements he did. At the moment, > I do not have the energy to respond to a caricature of Americans, it is so > many of them that have education and knowledge anyway, so why bother. . > > Maybe Noam Chomsky would help, but it should be complemented by > some basic reading of history books. > > Hakan > > > At 20:51 15/05/2004, you wrote: > >Hi Ryan, > > > >Where do you get your news/views from? Fox News! > >I don't know where to start in correcting the inaccuracies in your > >statements, nor do I have the time. > >I think the best thing you could do would be to read almost any book by >Noam > >Chomsky (What Uncle Sam Really Wants or Deterring Democracy)about the way > >America runs the world. > >Did you never hear of the American overthrow of democratically elected > >governments in Chile and Guatemala and Iran? > > > >Regards > >Dermot > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Ryan Morgan [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Sent: 14 May 2004 09:22 > >To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com > >Subject: [biofuel] RE: [biofuels] Re: US poll about Iraq war > > > >Hey Todd et al, let's not make this personal, did you perhaps not see my > >":)?". I was merely saying that we have all benefited in the long run >from > >the genocide that happened in North America in the past. One cannot >judge > >history by modern standards, that's History 101! America is >single-handedly > >the most innovative populace the world has ever known period. Look >around > >you, the technology our democracy and free markets have produced and > >continue to produce have saved countless more lives, and provided for >even > >more than were lost in the settling of this land. We are all benefiting > >from this, our life expectancy is much higher than even two generations >ago, > >and our quality of life is unimaginable to those in the past. Do you >like > >your medicine? Your efficient, convenient way of life? Your >entertainment, > >refrigerator, how about your computer, it's software and the Internet? >Have > >you ever used a phone, or turned on a light, or read a newspaper, or > >wondered about the mysteries of Space? This country has developed more > >technology than any other past or present, that we are all benefiting >from. > > > >Furthermore, who does the world look to for justice in the world? Were >it > >not the Americans who emerged victorious in WWI and WWII saving the world > >from tyranny and genocide? Did anyone else contribute more to the plight >of > >the South Koreans, the Vietnamese, the Kuwaitis and Saudis, or to the >people > >of Yugoslavia? Who stopped the communists from taking over the world? >Has > >anyone else offered to bail out countless corrupt government after >corrupt > >government, saving people from poverty, without even asking to be >re-paid? > >Do I condone genocide? Of course not. But we, in this day and age, have > >all benefited from it. That is all I am saying. > > > >As for my comments on the need to reduce incentive for stability in the > >Middle East, I apologize for painting anyone on this list (who did not >want > >to be painted) as working toward reducing dependency on foreign oil, > >specifically oil from the Middle East. What I meant to say, is that I am > >working to reduce our dependency on foreign oil so that we as a nation >have > >less of a reason (incentive) to meddle in the affairs of the Middle East. > >As far as I can tell (and I have never been there) the region is fraught > >with religious strife, brutality, ignorance, and hatred. In short, most >of > >the countries there seem almost laughably behind the times given their > >resources, corrupt, and no place to be if you were born with fallopian >tubes > >and a uterus. Islamic law fosters fear, slows progress, and is easily > >abused by those in power. We are fighting the evil, backward, minority >in > >Iraq for many reasons, oil, hope, and liberation among them. We have > >attempted to provide them with hope for a brighter future, teach them >about > >democracy and free trade, so that we may watch them prosper, and no one >can > >seem to get past centuries old grudges and hatred toward one another and >us. > >It got so bad, one man ordered the hijacking and crashing of our own >planes > >(once again our inventions) into our own skyscrapers (dido) because we >had > >established a base in "The Holy Land" to promote stability in the region, > >and he couldn't handle we "Infidels" on his turf. Where were the Muslims > >after 9/11? I sure didn't hear cries of outrage and condemnation from >their > >community, did you? In fact the silence, at least state-side, was > >deafening. We are "infidels," and every good Muslim must rid the world >of > >infidels according to the Koran, am I right? So I say, "Fine, you want >me > >dead? I'll fight you back by not buying your oil and watching you figure > >out the world doesn't work that way anymore and changing. > > > >I buy and promote biodiesel to give the people of the Middle East >incentive > >to find another line of work and move forward. As for the non-American > >majority on this list, stop and consider, for a moment where you would be > >without us. > > > >Ryan > > -----Original Message----- > > From: appalenergy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2004 8:50 AM > > To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [biofuel] Re: US poll about Iraq war > > > > > > Crikey Ryan! > > > > Did you read what you wrote? Do you even understand what it is that > > you communicated? > > > > How distored a perspective can you have when you say > > > > > that much more good has come from our use > > > of the land for the good of the world, than from the natives who > > inhabited > > > it previously. > > > > And to justify such a statement of arrogance by trying to lay guilt > > on the doorsteps of those who came after such slaughter? How > > disconnected and disjointed can a human being's thought processes be? > > > > Benefitted? Haven't you figured out that the mindless and "depraved > > philosophy" of Manifest Destiny is something that global society is > > suffering the consequences from to this very day? Not to mention > > that it's acceptance and implementation in one era smooths the path > > for its implementation in every generation thereafter. > > > > Get real for a moment. It's somehow okay to slaughter and > > displace "the poor, savage, barbaric, nomadic ... natives" who > > cannot withstand overwhelming numbers, unimaginable weaponry and > > devastating disease? > > > > Who the hell are you or anyone else to pass such judgement? > > > > Wake up for Christ's sake!!! And everyone elses. Standing up for > > a "depraved philosophy that states we are morally compelled by God > > Almighty to kill weaker people and steal their land" is every bit as > > immoral and depraved as those who swing the sword, obliterate food > > supplies or intentionally seed blankets with smallpox - or any > > similar actions. > > > > And then you move on and take issue with applications of similar > > policies of arrogance in the present day? Something sure isn't wound > > and tensioned properly in your upstairs orbit if you can on the one > > hand see the insanity of Bush's implementation of Jacksonian policy > > but still endorse or justify such aberrations in historical context. > > > > Somehow you need to get a mental, emotional and even spiritual grip > > and start understanding that all those dead, maimed and displaced > > persons from previous generations that you so easily dismiss were as > > human as you are at this very moment - and judging by your words, > > perhaps more so in many respects. > > > > One can only wonder how you would perceive history if you were a > > mother or child or infant or weathered elder on the receiving end of > > a saber or bullet sent from "god." > > > > What are now "ghosts" were once brothers and sisters. And neither > > you nor anyone else has ever possessed the right to wave your hand > > and state that their murder is or was justified. > > > > As for your dismally blind and sweepingly general perspective on how > > well off the indigenous peoples of the North American continent are > > today or what the traits of a broadened education are? > > > > Whatever it is that you're smoking you need to put it down and take > > a long walk back into the world of reality. > > > > Todd Swearingen > > > > > > --- In biofuel@yahoogroups.com, "Ryan Morgan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > All I can add in our defense, is that much more good has come from > > our use > > > of the land for the good of the world, than from the natives who > > inhabited > > > it previously. Yes, you too have benefited from Jackson' s quest, > > so find a > > > better argument about the poor, savage, barbaric, nomadic though > > culturally > > > rich natives who fell easily to manifest destiny. Their children > > are being > > > well taken care of, and now have the benefit of electricity, > > inexpensive > > > housing, internal combustion, oh, and beer. :) > > > > > > Also, we sure picked a loser for a President in 2000, good thing > > we can kick > > > him out of office in 2004. How many other countries refresh their > > > leadership on such a regular basis? I agree with some who think > > his entire > > > administration should be behind bars for the atrocities, > > corruption, and > > > fleecing of not only the American public, but the entire world. I > > am > > > ashamed to be associated with our false President and his cabinet > > these > > > days, but proud that I voted for Al Gore, and rightly so...as it > > turns out. > > > Is Kerry the answer? Maybe, but at least he will choose an > > entirely > > > different administration and get those crocked-good-for-nothin' > > Ashcrofts, > > > Rumsfelds, and Cheneys out of positions of power. When push comes > > to shove, > > > and believe me it has! The American public will do the right > > thing. > > > > > > In the mean time, we're all [here on this list] are just doing > > what we can > > > to reduce the need for foreign oil, to take the incentive away from > > > stability in the Middle East. Personally I look forward to the > > day when the > > > economics of the region make it impossible to inhabit the area, at > > least on > > > the same scale. Where will all of those people go? Well, they > > may just > > > have to assimilate elsewhere, obey the law, get a job, and act > > respectable. > > > Enough of this 2000 year code of Islamic law already, the world > > awards > > > progress...they'll figure it out. > > > > > > Please note I don't hate Native Americans or Muslim populations in > > general, > > > I believe all people are generally good, and have gone through the > > four > > > years of feminist based philosophy that is State-sponsored > > University here > > > in the US. With that said- > > > > > > > > > Flame away dear friends, > > > > > > Ryan :) > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Appal Energy [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 2004 1:57 PM > > > To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com > > > Subject: Re: [biofuel] US poll about Iraq war > > > > > > > > > Why not ask the Israelis Ted? > > > > > > No. Wait. They haven't figured out their little problem yet > > either. > > > > > > Many don't agree with the analogy of Iraq being another Viet Nam. > > > > > > Rather, the comparison to the Gaza Strip or the West Bank is more > > > appropriate - continual attrition, continual hate, continual > > oppression, > > > continual occupation. > > > > > > But heck. The US has been very good at oppression, occupation > > and even > > > genocide throughout its "illustrious" past. Just ask any > > American native. > > > And for that? Jackson got his picture on the $20. > > > > > > One very queer country that pays homage to those who are the > > architects of > > > such sweeping devastation. > > > > > > Todd Swearingen > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Ted Dinkelman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > To: <biofuel@yahoogroups.com> > > > Sent: Tuesday, May 11, 2004 2:02 PM > > > Subject: Re: [biofuel] US poll about Iraq war > > > > > > > > > > As the poll states, the majority think this is a bad idea. My > > question > > > is > > > how do we get out of it? Just quiting and going home would be a > > worse > > > situation and staying will cost many lives on all sides. > > > > > > > > Ted > > > > > > > > Hakan Falk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I just saw the latest gallup polls about the Iraq war and Bush > > handling > > > of > > > > it. As we said the whole time, "it were and is a bad idea to > > > unilaterally > > > > occupy Iraq". Now finally a majority of the American people > > seems to > > > agree > > > > with it and that Bush is not capable to handle it. Now we > > cannot find > > > any > > > > majority population of any country in the world, who think > > that the > > > Iraq > > > > occupation was or is a good idea. > > > > > > > > We also find some fine ways of which the OPEC countries show > > their > > > opinion > > > > of what is happening. They are signing up the major > > development of > > > Natural > > > > Gas with other countries, like Russia and China, and when US > > finally > > > have > > > > transport capacity for NG, they will have difficulties to buy > > enough. > > > The > > > > same is happening on new oil exploration. They also have > > difficulties in > > > > delivering more oil to US. This is not a surprise, if the > > proponents of > > > the > > > > opinion that we at the moment experience the Hubbert peak of > > oil > > > > production. The other possibility is that the oil producing > > countries > > > > prefer to sell to China, than to US. My personal opinion is > > that, even > > > if > > > > they wanted, they cannot meet the growing demand in US and the > > world. US > > > is > > > > not only buying to meet higher demands, but is also buying > > desperately > > > for > > > > filling up their strategic storage reserve, that way pushing > > prices > > > higher. > > > > > > > > Hakan > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ---------------------~--> Yahoo! Domains - Claim yours for only $14.70 http://us.click.yahoo.com/Z1wmxD/DREIAA/yQLSAA/FGYolB/TM ---------------------------------------------------------------------~-> Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! 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