Ciao Jeremy I have a suggestion. A thought. It is based on the idea *this group is pretty good at self-policing*.
Allow people to do near anything BUT with a clear message up-top asking readers to indicate when something is not right. I myself has asked "why is this thread pinned?" and the author took it down. That seemed adequate. AND also make clear there are moderators who have absolute rights to remove tags, posts, pins or whatever. Without question. So the rule is "be modest" or you will be cut back by consensus OR moderator. That combination might work? A complication is tagging. I don't actually know what tags have actually been used. I have added myself quite a lot. There are more than a new post indicates are available. Its an area where being clear matters to make the most of search filtering. That is partly about documenting them though (note: I can't find a simple way to find them all on GG). Just thoughts Josiah On Monday, 9 December 2019 18:10:43 UTC+1, Jeremy Ruston wrote: > > Hi Josiah > > Ciao Jeremy > > The issue on this is that it was a pretty routine issue closing threads on > request previously. > It helps in that readers then know you don't need to bother reading that > thread. > Unless a moderator is reading everything it won't happen now. > > I hope we can get to some kind of consensus on a way forward because right > now it is less than optimal. > I appreciate there are issues on closing threads, pinning & tagging (most > issues are on the latter I think, as its not fully clear what has gone on) > but none of it was exactly a huge problem. > > > As far as I can tell we have two options: > > * Leave moderation functions open to everyone, which we know causes > problems for users who don’t expect their actions to affect other users > * Restrict moderation functions to a group of moderators, which we know > causes frustration for people who want to be able to do moderator-like > things without being a moderator > > Obviously, the latter approach is taken universally by online communities. > We’re not trying to re-invent how online communities work (or at least not > yet!), and so I don’t see a need to depart from what has worked for other > communities. > > Best wishes > > Jeremy. > > > > Best wishes > Josiah > > On Monday, 9 December 2019 16:40:47 UTC+1, Jeremy Ruston wrote: >> >> Hi Josiah >> >> I just noticed that it appears a reader can no longer "close" a thread. >> >> I assume that is a side effect of the recent changes in the admin system? >> >> Quite often authors of threads request that (as it is not possible for >> the author of the thread to close it) it be closed when they got an answer >> that solves it. >> >> Are moderators now going to look for that? It seemed to work fine before. >> >> >> As discussed above, the Google Groups permissions are not very granular. >> We’ve changed a single setting called “Moderation” and it appears to affect >> pinning, tagging, closing — pretty much everything except post. >> >> Best wishes >> >> Jeremy >> >> >> >> Best wishes >> Josiah >> >> On Saturday, 7 December 2019 12:37:34 UTC+1, Jeremy Ruston wrote: >>> >>> >>> I could be wrong, but it looks like the feature has already been turned >>> off. I did feel that the original list of tags was too broad. >>> >>> >>> It sounds like tagging is classified under the same “moderation” >>> permission that governs the ability to pin posts. >>> >>> We could revert the change, but perhaps the solution here is to appoint >>> some more group managers. The top 10 posters according to Google Groups are >>> below. Eric is already a group manager, but it might be good if maybe 3 or >>> 4 of these people volunteered for the role. >>> >>> - TonyM >>> - Mohammad >>> - TiddlyTweeter >>> - Mark S >>> - Arlen >>> - Eric >>> - A Gloom >>> - PMario >>> - (me) >>> - Jed (inmysocks) >>> >>> See https://groups.google.com/forum/#!aboutgroup/tiddlywiki >>> >>> The group managers would: >>> >>> - Help Eric with moderating posts flagged by Google as spam >>> - Pin and unpin threads >>> - Compile pinned anthology posts summarising important announcements >>> and discussions >>> - And perhaps use whatever other useful moderation features may be >>> lurking under the surface of Google Groups >>> >>> It also seems like we need to be more transparent about the rules and >>> conventions we’re following to manage the group. I’d suggest adding a >>> tiddler to tiddlywiki.com in which we describe our approach (for >>> example, guidelines about when to pin a thread, or a thread from last year >>> where I posted about the need to criticise ideas rather than people). >>> Perhaps we actually need two: one called “Moderation Policies” focusing on >>> the role of group managers and one called “Code of Conduct” focusing on the >>> standards of behaviour we expect from everyone in the group. >>> >>> I’d welcome any advice/thoughts from people who have experience of other >>> online communities. I’m sure we can do a better job overall, and I suspect >>> more formal roles in the community will be a part of it. >>> >>> Best wishes >>> >>> Jeremy. >>> >>> >>> >>> On Friday, December 6, 2019 at 4:55:32 AM UTC-8, TiddlyTweeter wrote: >>>> >>>> In another thread ... >>>> >>>> Jeremy Ruston wrote: >>>>> >>>>> * Pinning should never have been globally available. I appreciate the >>>>> argument that no great harm was done, but it evidently created confusion >>>>> as >>>>> to who could see that a thread had been pinned >>>>> * We should agree on general rules for what threads might qualify for >>>>> being pinned. To me, pinning would start with urgent announcements (e.g. >>>>> if >>>>> discovered a serious bug in a release and wanted to warn people to >>>>> upgrade), important on-going informational threads like “Newbies start >>>>> here” >>>>> >>>> >>>> Ciao Jeremy >>>> >>>> In another thread >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/tiddlywiki/gWtX7uGi2QQ/xg6sv0PICQAJ> we >>>> discussing user v. admin privileges re PINS. >>>> >>>> Here I want to ask about TAGS. >>>> >>>> *First I just want to check IF you are aware that at the moment any >>>> user can both add or delete TAGS on any post?* >>>> >>>> * +* In a way its v. good in that missing tags get added. >>>> *+ *Its good that an original author who has not added them may >>>> have them added by an enthusiastic user >>>> >>>> *-* in another way its not ideal as these don't get documented and >>>> the numbers could get vast... >>>> * - * I see no place user added tags get listed. >>>> >>>> For example, this post I gave tags: "question GoogleGroup tags" >>>> >>>> Tags have proved very useful for finding things here. But I'm not sure, >>>> without moderated addition, they are optimal. >>>> >>>> Best wishes >>>> TT >>>> >>>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "TiddlyWiki" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/7b416c3c-809f-4753-b52f-ad06ab6ff790%40googlegroups.com >>> >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/7b416c3c-809f-4753-b52f-ad06ab6ff790%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> >>> >>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "TiddlyWiki" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/adaf4afa-b901-4af1-a88b-d23357287439%40googlegroups.com >> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/adaf4afa-b901-4af1-a88b-d23357287439%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> >> >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "TiddlyWiki" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] <javascript:>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/d11fbac8-153c-4767-8403-f17f80d0fb66%40googlegroups.com > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/d11fbac8-153c-4767-8403-f17f80d0fb66%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TiddlyWiki" group. 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