For the time being just name the names of 'the signers of the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence' IYO who both believed and lived the gospel.I do not mean to suggest that there were none only, that I do not know who they were.
----- Original Message ----- From: "David Miller" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: December 03, 2004 23:30 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Trapped in the Flag > Lance wrote: > > When many, if not all, on TT speak the name JESUS > > we understand IMMANUEL/GOD WITH US. How > > often did the 'founding fathers' actually speak His name? > > When they spoke of Him will you illustrate, with citations > > from their own writings, just what they meant? > > When we talk about the revolutionary war and the role of religion and > religious beliefs, I don't think we can only consider "founding fathers." > Sure, we can find quotes by some of the signers of the Constitution and > Declaration of Independence that indicate a faith in Jesus. Some of them > actually founded Bible societies, and I understand that Congress in 1777 > used funds to appropriate 20,000 Bibles. But the real role of believers is > not unlike today. They were not so much in the spotlight, and those who > were ranged from being like George Bush and Jimmy Carter to Richard Nixon > and Bill Clinton. Not exactly shining stars of evangelical Christianity. > > I studied this years ago and so I don't have references ready for you right > now, but I came away with an understanding that about a third of the people > of this country favored the revolutionary war. About another third were > against it. The final third were swayed one way or the other, and it was > the activity of the pulpits that played a big role in getting many in that > final third to support independence. For the most part these are not > 'founding fathers' per se, but important influences in society. > > There are a some elements in our society that try to make even Thomas > Jefferson and Ben Franklin evangelical Christians with quotes. This is > ludicrous. Such quotes are selective and often isolated and not considering > the whole man and everything he wrote. In the same vein, there are some > elements in our society that try to make it look like none of the founding > fathers were Christian. These quotes also are very selective and taken out > of context and not accurately evaluating the whole person. The truth is > that we had primarily secular men framing the Constitution who also > recognized the value of Christianity. For example, while Thomas Jefferson > was a Deist, he compiled his own diary of the teachings of Jesus Christ and > followed it closely much of his life. He considered himself a disciple of > Jesus Christ even though he rejected the miracles of the Bible and he > rejected the concept of the Deity of Jesus Christ. > > Now please don't misunderstand me. I'm not saying that we can't come up > with quotes for you from 'founding fathers' showing what they believed about > Jesus, but I think looking for quotes like this is a lot of work, and > providing them does not give the whole picture. I'm going to be busy this > weekend ministering at a men's prayer breakfast tomorrow morning, preaching > a parade route tomorrow evening, teaching Sunday School Sunday morning, and > ministering in a nursing home Sunday afternoon. Please don't expect me to > do much homework for you in looking for these quotes. I'm not trying to > snub you or be mean. I just have priorities in my life that make this list > a little low on the list. Please do not take it personal. > > I have to say that I have been disappointed in how some have taken my posts > way too personal. Such causes me to retreat if it appears to be chronic. I > apparently do not experience the frustration that some of you do in > attempting to communicate and so I am a little slow in recognizing when some > have taken serious offense. I am considering a new rule for TruthTalk and > will be talking with Slade about it because we certainly do not seem to be > able to moderate ourselves. > > Peace be with you. > David Miller. > > > ---------- > "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org > > If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed. ---------- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
