On Dec 18, 2008, at 7:22 PM, Henry E Schaffer wrote:

Alan D. Cabrera writes:
On Dec 18, 2008, at 1:10 PM, Josh Thompson wrote:
I do have some questions as to why we can't keep the name.

Something I don't understand is that if NCSU were to completely stop doing anything with VCL other than developing it at ASF, and then were to set up an install of it in a year, wouldn't we call it whatever it is called at ASF? In which case we'd be back to the state of using the same name. That goes for anyone that wants to run it. Does another entity have to change the name of it if they install it? If not, they'd be using using the name for the
exact same product.

Let's use Apache Geronimo as an example.  If I were a company that
took the product, maybe added some stuff, maybe not, and then sold it
as the "Acme Geronimo Application Server", the ASF would be after me
with a baseball bat.  I could, however, sell it as "Acme Application
Server based on Apache Geronimo".  Think of it as a trademark thing.

 NC State isn't selling and doesn't intend to sell the VCL.

 NC State wants to run the VCL code from ASF - contributed to the ASF
by NC State - and call the code by the same name as it has at the ASF.

 We could easily have a notice at the bottom of our web page saying
"This VCL code is not only based on the Apache/ASF VCL code, it is the
same code."

Using the code is not a problem.  I am referring tho this site:


Please don't get caught up in the fact that there is no software being sold here.

We're not planning on developing anything here at NCSU in parallel to what's being developed at ASF. We're planning on doing all development based at

Yeah, it doesn't matter where the development is. Think of it as like
a trademark thing.

 Since we're not selling it, or even distributing it - just using
locally what's at Apache/ASF, it's hard for me to see how we're
violating any trademark.   (IANAL - but I'm wondering if everyone who
runs the Apache web server has to proclaim that it's not the Apache web
server, although the code is identical, that it's actually the Acme
Applications Server based on the Apache web server.  My experience is
that people simply say they are running the Apache web server, and don't
engage in renaming it.)

 As far as the possibility that this refers to Apache/ASF violating NC
State's trademark (we have been using "VCL" for years), which seems to
be indicated at: http://www.apache.org/dev/project-names.html
I believe that NC State would permit Apache/ASF to use the "VCL"
name/mark (apparently to be used as "Apache VCL") and so remove the
possibilty of such being a violation.

If VCL is a trademark owned by NCSU then they would have to assign the trademark to the ASF or we would have to change our project's name.


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