I was wrong about Support_desk being permenantly semi-protected. It was temporarily semi-protected for 3 days, but that's been lifted now.
Regardless of spam concerns, point still stands that it seems bad form to semi-protect the venue where newbies are supposed to ask for help. Not that i have any better solution to the spam issue. -- bawolff On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 3:33 AM, Brian Wolff <[email protected]> wrote: > Neither project:support_desk nor project:current_issues is really meant for > that purpose - support desk is mainly for user and (external) sysadmin > support. And current_issues is the village pump of mediawiki.org (the > website not the software) > > Honestly, I kind of think that lqt was better than flow for support desk. As > much as lqt sucked at least search sort of worked. > > Although the bigger problem probably is that project:support desk is > protected so new users arent allowed to ask questions(!) > > On the subject of search, i do think that > https://lists.wikimedia.org/robots.txt is rediculous. At least for technical > lists we should let google in, and the privacy concern is silly as there are > mirrors that are indexed. > > -- > bawolff > > > On Saturday, November 18, 2017, Sam Wilson <[email protected]> wrote: >> Hear hear to being able to properly search past conversations. >> >> I know it's not the fashionably geek thing to say, but I must admit that >> I always find mailing lists to be incredibly annoying, compared to >> forums. Not only is searching completely separate from reading, even >> browsing old topics is another interface again (assuming one hasn't been >> subscribed forever and kept every old message). Then, when you do manage >> to find an old message, there's no way to reply to it (short of copying >> and pasting and losing context). >> >> Maybe https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Project:Support_desk (and its >> sibling https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Project:Current_issues ?) is the >> best place to ask questions about the software, its development, and >> other things. If so, let's make that fact much more well advertised! >> (Although, I think Flow is brilliant, when it's for discussing a wiki >> page — because the topic is already set (effectively by the title of the >> page its attached to). When it's trying to be a host to multiple >> unrelated topics, it becomes pretty annoying to use.) >> >> On Sun, 19 Nov 2017, at 05:57 AM, Niharika Kohli wrote: >>> I'd like to add that having Discourse will provide the one thing IRC >>> channels and mailing lists fail to - search capabilities. If you hangout >>> on >>> the #mediawiki IRC channel, you have probably noticed that we get a lot >>> of >>> repeat questions all the time. This would save everyone time and effort. >>> >>> Not to mention ease of use. Discourse is way more usable than IRC or >>> mailing lists. Usability is the main reason there are so many questions >>> about MediaWiki asked on Stackoverflow instead: >>> https://stackoverflow.com/unanswered/tagged/mediawiki >>> <https://stackoverflow.com/unanswered/tagged/mediawiki>, >>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/mediawiki-api?sort=newest >>> <https://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/mediawiki-api?sort=newest>, >>> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/tagged/mediawiki-extensions... >>> >>> I'd personally hope we can stop asking developers to go to IRC or mailing >>> lists eventually and use Discourse/something else as a discussion forum >>> for >>> support. >>> >>> On Sat, Nov 18, 2017 at 1:31 PM, Quim Gil <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> > Hi, I have expanded >>> > https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Discourse#One_place_to_ >>> > seek_developer_support >>> > >>> > https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Project:Support_desk is the only channel >>> > whose main purpose is to provide support. The volunteers maintaining >>> > are >>> > the ones to decide about its future. There is no rush for any decisions >>> > there. First we need to run a successful pilot. >>> > >>> > The rest of channels (like this mailing list) were created for >>> > something >>> > else. If these channels stop receiving questions from new developers, >>> > they >>> > will continue doing whatever they do now. >>> > >>> > > I'd like to understand how adding a venue will improve matters. >>> > >>> > For new developers arriving to our shores, being able to ask a first >>> > question about any topic in one place with a familiar UI is a big >>> > improvement over having to figure out a disseminated landscape of wiki >>> > Talk >>> > pages, mailing lists and IRC channels (especially if they are not used >>> > to >>> > any of these environments). The reason to propose this new space is >>> > them, >>> > not us. >>> > >>> > On Sat, Nov 18, 2017 at 5:01 PM, MZMcBride <[email protected]> wrote: >>> > >>> > > Brian Wolff wrote: >>> > > >On Friday, November 17, 2017, Quim Gil <[email protected]> wrote: >>> > > >> The Technical Collaboration team proposes the creation of a >>> > > >> developer >>> > > >> support channel focusing on newcomers, as part of our Onboarding >>> > > >> New >>> > > >> Developer program. We are proposing to create a site based on >>> > Discourse >>> > > >> (starting with a pilot in discourse-mediawiki.wmflabs.org) and to >>> > point >>> > > >>the many existing scattered channels there. >>> > > > >>> > > >What does point existing channels to discouse mean exactly? Are you >>> > > >planning to shutdown any existing channels? If so, which ones? >>> > > >>> > > Excellent questions. I'd like to know the answers as well. >>> > > >>> > > I raised a similar point at >>> > > <https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Talk:Discourse>. I skimmed >>> > > <https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T155678>, looking for some >>> > > answers, >>> > and >>> > > I didn't find any. >>> > > >>> > > Quim, are you involved in MediaWiki support in places such as the >>> > > #mediawiki IRC channel or the mediawiki-l mailing list? Are you >>> > > involved >>> > > in MediaWiki support elsewhere? I'm trying to better understand how >>> > > it >>> > > would be appropriate for you to seemingly suggest disrupting or >>> > > shutting >>> > > down these established and functioning venues. If this is not your >>> > > suggestion, I'd like to understand how adding a venue will improve >>> > matters. >>> > > >>> > > MZMcBride >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > _______________________________________________ >>> > > Wikitech-l mailing list >>> > > [email protected] >>> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l >>> > > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Quim Gil >>> > Engineering Community Manager @ Wikimedia Foundation >>> > http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/User:Qgil >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Wikitech-l mailing list >>> > [email protected] >>> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l >>> > >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Niharika >>> Software Engineer >>> Community Tech >>> Wikimedia Foundation >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikitech-l mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikitech-l mailing list >> [email protected] >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l _______________________________________________ Wikitech-l mailing list [email protected] https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
