JMJM, You bring up a very good question.
According to Merriam-Webster Online the definitions of these words and my opinion as how they could be applied to zen are: MYSTICAL 1:a : having a spiritual meaning or reality that is neither apparent to the senses nor obvious to the intelligence [Bill!] Zen is not 'spiritual' and is definitely apparent to the senses, so this definition doesn't seem to fit. Zen is however not obvious, nor even accessible as far as I'm concerned, to the intelligence. b : involving or having the nature of an individual's direct subjective communion with God or ultimate reality [Bill!] This is pretty close, although I would take out the words 'subjective' and 'God or ultimate' which leaves 'direct communion with reality'. MYSTICISM 1: the experience of MYSTICAL union or direct communion with ultimate reality reported by MYSTICS [Bill!] I could live with this definition. 2: the belief that direct knowledge of God, spiritual truth, or ultimate reality can be attained through subjective experience (as intuition or insight) [Bill!] Again, this is close, but I don't associate Buddha Nature with intuition or insight - although I know in the West these could be used as a poor substitute. 3:a : vague speculation : a belief without sound basis [Bill!] I don't like this one at all. b : a theory postulating the possibility of direct and intuitive acquisition of ineffable knowledge or power [Bill!] This is pretty close. I like the word 'ineffable'. That definitely fits. I don't like the words 'intuitive, acquisition, knowledge and power'. In English, 'mysticism' is generally associated with God or 'hidden' knowledge or insight. I associate zen with just everyday stuff. It's no big deal. ...Bill! From: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com [mailto:zen_fo...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jue Miao Jing Ming - ???? Sent: Wednesday, September 08, 2010 2:14 AM To: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Zen] Practical Mysticism - Evelyn Underhill Dear all, I have a question. In Chinese, the Tibetan practice is literally translated as the "Mystic Order", the Chan practice is literally translated as the "Grand Mystic Order". Chan is the grand one, because Rong-Shu Patriarch brought the Chan to Tibet and affected their practice. In Chan 『秘密內證法』 "Mystic Inner Witness Dharma" means an inward practice enabling heart to heart witness of Buddha. That's all. There is really nothing mystic about it. Is the term "mystic or mysticism" means the same as the I described above or not? Much obliged, _/\_ JMJM On 9/7/2010 8:13 AM, DP wrote: That's kind of the point of the book. She is trying to bring mysticism down to Earth, as it were. She wants to show that not only monks can do it. --- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, <billsm...@...> wrote: > > DP, > > I haven't heard of this book, but it does sound interesting. > > I don't, however, associate mysticism with zen, or with `seeing the world as > it is' (which I do associate with zen). How could anyone call that > mysticism? Or with spiritualism as so many are wont to do? > > …Bill! > > From: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com [mailto:zen_fo...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf > Of DP > Sent: Monday, September 06, 2010 9:22 PM > To: Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [Zen] Practical Mysticism - Evelyn Underhill > > > I recently downloaded this ebook from a public domain site (the book is > nearly 100 year old) and I have to say I'm very impressed with it. Underhill > was an ANglo-Catholic, but her main focus is on how anyone can appreciate > the mysticism of everyday life by seeing the world as it is, without > categorization. I think this sounds very Zen, and I wonder if anyone else > had read it. > > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 5429 (20100906) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > > > __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature > database 5429 (20100906) __________ > > The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. > > http://www.eset.com > -- Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com http://www.heartchan.org __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5432 (20100907) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5432 (20100907) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: zen_forum-dig...@yahoogroups.com zen_forum-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: zen_forum-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/