On Thursday, January 13, 2011, Mel <gunnar19632...@yahoo.com.au> wrote:

Again snipping the Parts I have no comment on, but I am grateful for
your taking the time to answer my questions.

> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> I wonder if you Mel agree with Ed that my original line about the peach And 
> the painting was in fact evangelistic?
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> MEL: I've been looking up the above in the archives and I found the 
> 'peach' posting but not the 'painting' bit.

On Saturday, January 8, 2011, Chris Austin-Lane <ch...@austin-lane.net> wrote:
> To eat the peach or make do with the picture of a lovely peach. It is a daily 
> choice we face.

Back to Mel:

> This is just the thing about Zen...we all eventually become our own counselors

We are all already our own conselors.  Zen adds nothing to this basic
fact of reality.


< my comment about how I sometimes recommend 'sit' as a answer
understanding that people are free >

> MEL: Absolutely Chris, I couldn't agree more. That is what separates us from 
> the Semites. Now, I'm being dualistic here
> but I only say that because some of their flock try so hard to bring me back 
> from being that...well...that 'lost and
> wandering sheep'...*more laughter*....and back into Yahweh's fold...

I am currently also a practicing Christian, and the above deleted
phrase is identical to my approach in sharing Christianity, except for
'sit' the thing is 'attend my church'. There is more cultural baggage
attached with the church, so the times when recommending it seem
useful are rarer is the main difference.

For what it is worth, my experience with the church is that most
people who practise Christianity for a long time have a lot of
non-dualistic elements in their understanding of it.  I think that
dualistic perspectives wrap around any thing in our lives, because
that is what our brains do.  and that life keeps on beating us until
we notice the non-dual nature of it. If one is a Christian, but cannot
love neighbors without judging them, I recommend they try zazen :) But
if some one grew up worshipping in a Christian church, but life has
changed their perspectives, but they seem to miss worship as a
community, I will tell them there is no inherent-to-Christianity
reason why they cannot worship in a Christian church as is, and
receive and offer non-judgmental love in that church.  There might be
some church shopping involved, of course. I think God cares less about
our thoughts than a good Zen teacher, and that is very little.

> The sheep's fold....and all Semites are sheep, and some in this world 
> obviously think I need another sheep's bath in the fold after having been 
> 'lost' for so long

Whoops, my last few sentences are not aimed at you, just an
elucidation of the thinking that might lie behind my offering
attendance at my church during a conversation. Please carry on your
pesonal life as is best.

> A politician visits the wise zen master and asks the secret. The master 
> replies, "do what is good and do not do what is not good." the politician 
> rolls his eyes and says, "my kid can tell me that!" the master says, "we all 
> know this, but even this wise zen master has trouble doing it."
> ----------------------------------------------------------------
> MEL:....(*BIG LAUGHTER*)...I loved it, thank you!

Despite the reference to good and not good?


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