Re: [Zen] Realization

Wed, 02 Mar 2011 17:15:54 -0800 

Mayka!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

--- In [email protected], Maria Lopez <flordeloto@...> wrote:
>
> Mike:  Even being 'mindful' is not 'it' as it has it's duality in 
> forgetfullness
> Mayka:  I can't see the duality of being mindful.  When there is pure 
> mindfulness there is automatically "just this".  Mindfulness is full 
> attention and awareness in the present moment.
>  
>  
>  
> --- On Wed, 2/3/11, mike brown <uerusuboyo@...> wrote:
> 
> 
> From: mike brown <uerusuboyo@...>
> Subject: Re: [Zen] Realization
> To: [email protected]
> Date: Wednesday, 2 March, 2011, 11:18
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi JM,
>  
> Thanks for the question. Meditation is the best practice that I know of, but 
> is not essential. Even being 'mindful' is not 'it' as it has it's duality in 
> forgetfullness. If there is a way, then it has to be simple and everywhen (a 
> nod to Steve). What do we know outside of concepts, thoughts, visualisations, 
> tools, witnessing etc.? We are always beyond doubt existentially aware of 'I 
> am' (a further nod to Ramana Maharishi and Nisargadatta Maharal),  so this 
> is a good place to start. But ultimately, even awareness of 'I am' is a 
> product of the mind and so we need to go further beyond that to Pure 
> Awareness ; ) where we all share the same (Buddha) Nature and nothing really 
> needs to be done.
>  
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.jmjm@...>
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Wed, 2 March, 2011 0:38:16
> Subject: [Zen] Realization
> 
>   
> 
> Hi Mike,
> 
> According to your witness, is there a practice/way/how to "realize"?
> 
> Thanks,
> JM
> Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> http://www.heartchan.org
> 
> On 3/1/2011 2:16 AM, mike brown wrote: 
>   
> 
> 
> ED,
>  
> Maybe, maybe not. It still stands tho that meditation is not essential 
> for enlightenment as it leads us away from Realisation. Therein lies the 
> paradox - for most of us meditation was the way to Realisation.
>  
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: ED <seacrofter001@...>
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Tue, 1 March, 2011 18:20:57
> Subject: Re: [Zen] Change
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
>  
> I believe that there are relatively few cases of individuals who have 
> claimed to have become spontaneously enlightened or were born enlightened.
> --ED
>  
> --- In [email protected], mike brown <uerusuboyo@> wrote:
> >
> > Steve,
> > 
> > ... I empathise with the Dzogchen claim that meditation is not essential 
> > for enlightenmentm but is useful for developing mindfullness, moral 
> > development, 
> > concentration etc. Only after Realisation is meditation essential for 
> > deepening 
> > the initial breakthrough.
> > 
> > Mike
>




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