Joe,

I suppose faith might help in practice but definitely something you have to 
DROP to attain realization...

And the problem with faith is that it is IRRATIONAL TRUST and can very easily 
lead the believer off the path...

Edgar



On Apr 17, 2013, at 1:53 PM, Joe wrote:

> Edgar,
> 
> You ignore the primary position of Faith.
> 
> My teacher would not give me certain methods unless I met the Requirements:
> 
> Faith in the Method; Faith in myself; Faith in Shih-fu.
> 
> I didn't work it out via Reason. Did I have the faith? Yes. How did I know? I 
> had to feel it. Why did the old man give me the methods? Because I wasn't 
> faking it.
> 
> --Joe
> 
> > Edgar Owen <edgarowen@...> wrote:
> >
> > Bill,
> > 
> > You ignore the obvious. When you were instructed in Zazen you listened to 
> > your teacher explain how to sit, what to do etc. etc. and you understood 
> > that and that's the only reason you were able to do it.
> > 
> > That my friend was a RATIONAL exchange of ideas of teacher to student that 
> > was necessary step on the path to your realization.....
> > 
> > Edgar
> 
> 

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