Bill, I don't use the term and don't really get into all the interminable Buddhist and HIndu levels and counts of everything anyone could think of...
Edgar On Jun 28, 2013, at 10:13 AM, Bill! wrote: > Edgar, > > As a follow-on to this, what do you consider the difference/distinction > between samadhi and nirvana? ...Bill! > > --- In [email protected], "Bill!" <BillSmart@...> wrote: > > > > Edgar, > > > > I liked your description of the difference between enlightenment and > > nirvana: "...enlightenment in which one does not leave the world of forms > > but just sees them for what they truly are..." and "In nirvana all forms > > cease permanently." > > > > I agree with that and use the term 'delusions' as a term for your "...see > > them for what they truly are...". > > > > ...Bill! > > > > --- In [email protected], Edgar Owen <edgarowen@> wrote: > > > > > > Mike, > > > > > > First, the law of karma is nonsense. I'm not defending it, just > > > explaining it. > > > > > > Also as you can see your reply as received was garbled so don't have time > > > to wade through it all.. > > > > > > Yes, karma plays itself out eventually. As to karma suddenly ceasing > > > that's only when all forms cease in what is called nirvana which Buddhism > > > in general (there are some variant beliefs) takes as cessation of all > > > form. Nirvana is a state far beyond enlightenment in which one does not > > > leave the world of forms but just sees them for what they truly are, > > > empty forms of Buddha Nature. In nirvana all forms cease permanently. > > > > > > Standard Buddhist doctrine believes that one may eventually work through > > > all one's karma through successive reincarnations and eventual escape > > > form altogether. > > > > > > But since there is NO reincarnation the true understanding is that dying > > > is equivalent to nirvana, because it is only in death that all forms > > > cease (to the dead person) and only in death does one escape the world of > > > forms and reach nirvana. At death one's karma automatically ceases > > > whether one is good or bad, or enlightened or not. > > > > > > Sort of crazy that Buddhists take death as the ultimate salvation when > > > seen in the proper light..... > > > > > > That's the proper understanding of karma which properly understood is > > > just cause and effect in the world of forms that ceases when one leaves > > > the world of forms in death. And also believing that good always beget > > > good and evil evil is total nonsense. Maybe slightly above 50% at best > > > depending on who is doing the judging.... > > > > > > Edgar > > > > > > > > > > > > On Jun 28, 2013, at 3:07 AM, uerusuboyo@ wrote: > > > > > > > Edgar,<br/><br/>There is no confusion in what I said at all and it also > > > > depends on from which tradition you're talking about karma. As I've > > > > been taught, karma will indeed play itself out, but only as long as a > > > > person still identifies themselves with a self. Upon awakening to our > > > > Original Nature (which can happen at any time) karma is extinguished > > > > because where is the self for karma to attach to? Unless of course > > > > you're getting karma confused with the crazy notion that karma is > > > > fatalistic and/or deterministic which would make emancipation from > > > > karma impossible.<br/><br/>Here are a few snippets on the subject. > > > > There are many, many more out there if you care to do the > > > > research..<br/><br/>>He who believes in Karma does not condemn even the > > > > most corrupt, for they, too, have their chance to reform themselves > > > > ***at any moment*** (buddhanet.net)<<br/><br/>>Since basic nature > > > > transcends all duality and is ultimate, there is no one to receive the > > > > effect, whether > > > > it is good or bad, and no one to whom any effect can apply. Cause and > > > > effect, just like birth and death, lose their significance at the > > > > Enlightened level because at the level of basic nature there is no one > > > > to receive the effect of the Karma, whether it is good or bad. > > > > Therefore, at the extreme, when one is Enlightened, the law of Karma is > > > > not applicable (angel-fire.com)<<br/><br/>>In the Vajrayana tradition, > > > > it is believed that the effects of negative past karma can be > > > > "purified" through such practices as meditation on Vajrasattva.[91] The > > > > performer of the action, after having purified the karma, does not > > > > experience the negative results he or she otherwise would > > > > have.[92]<br/>(Wiki)<br/><br/>>The Japanese Tendai/Pure Land teacher > > > > Genshin taught that Amida Buddha has the power to destroy the karma > > > > that would otherwise bind one in > > > > saṃsāra.[89][90]<br/><br/><br/>Mike<br/><br/>Sent from Yahoo! Mail for > > > > iPad > > > > > > >
