At 12:47 AM 4/5/02 -0500, you wrote:
I've spent more time making the Python docs work in NS4 than making them look good in more modern browsers

This is sad but true.  I still have Netscape 4 here for testing as well.  (I run into the same problem with other web technologies, like Macromedia Flash.  Yes, probably 97% of browsers do have a Flash player installed, but what version?  Many are still at Version 3.)  Those "Download FREE upgrade" buttons may as well be invisible.

I don't think we should let Zope3 look ugly on old browsers, but isn't it acceptable for it to look more modest?  With careful use of CSS, it is possible to let the older browsers "fail gracefully".

And it is amazing what can be done with very little CSS and lots of images.  The page at,, has 2 styles, no Javascript, and looks very respectable.  But look at all the GIF's.

If the web-centric, software-tools development community feels strongly about perpetuating old browsers (and old web standards) then isn't it about time for that community to provide tools to hide the details?  When will Python, and for sure Zope, have built-in browser detection and formatting support driven by some sort of meta format that let's us application developers get on with developing applications?


"The commandments of the LORD are right, bringing joy to the heart. The commands of the LORD are clear, giving insight to life . . . For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome." (Psalm 19:8, 1John 5:3)

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