Chris Shenton wrote:
"Martijn Faassen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

On the rest of your rant, I agree that the beginner experience for
Zope 3 is suboptimal. Work is slowly progressing towards a new website
for Zope. As an alternative you might like to look at Grok
(, which is based on Zope 3 as well but may be somewhat
easier to get started with. That said, our documentation is far from
complete yet, and we don't have a forum either. :)

I've been poking around the edges of Plone for a while and Plone3 makes
the learning wall even steeper than Plone 2.  So last weekend I got
Grok, followed the tutorial, and had an application up in a day that
took me a week in Plone3.  Grok seems a great way for me to get into
Zope without worrying about all the details yet.
Kudos to the Grok team for such a pleasant product, and for some REALLY
good tutorials.  Thanks!

Grok and Plone are not exactly competitors. You're not comparing apples and apples at all. :)

I think Plone can learn a lot from Grok's philosophy and that the two projects can share a lot more infrastructure, though.


Author of `Professional Plone Development`, a book for developers who
want to work with Plone. See

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