I suppose I'm not very open minded about these things. Jd
On Thu, Jan 14, 2010 at 9:53 PM, klaus gauger <klaus_gau...@yahoo.com>wrote: > > > Dear Joel, > > nihilism must not be something weak and worthless. It can also be a sign of > strenght and vitality. Jünger says that in "Der Waldgang". Hedonism musn´t > also be bad, if it is combined with any sort of commitment to a cause. Ozzy > Osbourne is, like many musicians, a hedonist, but he (and the other members > of Black Sabbath, especially Tony Iommi) invented a new art-form, Heavy > Metal, and Ozzy is commited to this art until today and has made great > efforts to create songs that belong now to the history of Heavy Metal and > are appreciated by many fans, like me for example. Seen from a marxist or > christian morality Ozzy Osbourne surely is a ugly hedonist and nihilist, but > seen from a more open-minded point of view he also is a person of high value > for our society. > > Yours, > > Klaus > > --- Joel Dietz <jdi...@gmail.com <jdietz%40gmail.com>> schrieb am Do, > 14.1.2010: > > > > Von: Joel Dietz <jdi...@gmail.com <jdietz%40gmail.com>> > > Betreff: Re: AW: [juenger_org] Niekisch's Critique of Juenger > > An: juenger_org@yahoogroups.de <juenger_org%40yahoogroups.de> > > Datum: Donnerstag, 14. Januar 2010, 20:23 > > I'm not convinced. The article after > > Niekisch's reviews Juenger's > > "Nihilism" in greater depth. A phrase from "The Peace" > > indicates a > > complete rejection of this impulse, but what replaces > > it? Aesthetics? > > Ozzy Osbourne-like hedonistic abandonment? > > > > I believe the proper point of comparison would be > > Hoelderlin, but I am > > without conclusions, only questions. > > > > Jd > > > > On 1/14/10, Thomas Friese <thomasfri...@ymail.com<thomasfriese%40ymail.com> > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bravo, Klaus! I would have replied exactly the same > > way to "who finances > > > it". > > > > > > I would add that an anarch is aware that there is no > > free lunch in life. In > > > one way or another, everyone pays for their choices. > > But he is more aware of > > > this reality and therefore attempts to choose > > consciously what he is > > > prepared to pay for. Most people get given their > > choices already made by > > > society and must still pay for what they don't > > fundamentally want. > > > > > > The anarch also "knows the rules" and realizes that > > living in society has > > > its price, which he must pay if he wants to remain > > there and not flee to the > > > forest. > > > > > > Thomas > > > > > > --- On Mon, 1/4/10, klaus gauger > > > <klaus_gau...@yahoo.com<klaus_gauger%40yahoo.com> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > From: klaus gauger <klaus_gau...@yahoo.com <klaus_gauger%40yahoo.com>> > > > Subject: AW: [juenger_org] Niekisch's Critique of > > Juenger > > > To: juenger_org@yahoogroups.de > > > Date: Monday, January 4, 2010, 4:32 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Joel, > > > > > > > > > it is right that Jünger always fled from society, as > > a 18 year old schoolboy > > > to the foreign legion, and as a old man as an anarch > > into the forest. Who > > > finances this freedom? That is a typical question of a > > marxist. Today we > > > have in modern society millions of anarchs: Young > > people who don´t want to > > > make a career and don´t want to participate in the > > "rat race" and subsist > > > with temporary jobs, or doing their own business, or > > even with social > > > welfare or who live from the money of their parents, > > young people who > > > experiment with drugs, travel, read, write (all the > > things that Jünger did), > > > sometimes temporarily, sometimes as a choosen > > lifestile. They survive in the > > > economical and geographical niches that modern, rich > > and developed societies > > > always offer. The question is not "who finances this > > freedom?" the question > > > is: "Do you dare to live an individualistic, > > anti-conformistic life, even if > > > means to have less money than average people, even if > > it means that you > > > don´t get the recognition that average people get as > > so called hard-working > > > citizens?". Besides: Also an anarch can work very > > hard. Jünger wrote a lot > > > of books and earned some money with it. But an > > Anarch will always do a work > > > that is also rewarding for himself. He won´t work > > only for money or because > > > he has fear to be evaluated as an unworthy, lazy > > outsider in society. > > > > > > > > > Yours, > > > > > > Klaus > > > > > > > > > > > > --- Joel Dietz <jdi...@gmail. com> schrieb am > > Mo, 4.1.2010: > > > > > > > > > Von: Joel Dietz <jdi...@gmail. com> > > > Betreff: [juenger_org] Niekisch's Critique of Juenger > > > An: "juenger_org" <juenger_org@ yahoogroups. > > de> > > > Datum: Montag, 4. Januar 2010, 14:26 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Was reviewing my notes on Eliot Neaman's Dubious > > Past (P. 188-189), and > > > came across this: > > > > > > In a two-page critique of the Waldgang, a copy of > > which Niekisch sent to > > > Juenger, the former editor of the national Bolshevist > > Widerstand compared > > > Juenger ot Max Stirner, whose individualism was nearly > > solipsistic. Acording > > > to Niekisch, Juenger doesn’t realize how indebted > > every individual is to the > > > collective: indeed, he remarks, “glorious > > isolation” is a version of > > > societal exploitation. Niekisch wonders why the figure > > of the Waldgaenger > > > has achieved such popularity among conservatives, > > positing that postwar > > > individualism is the last refuge o the European > > intellectual, threatened by > > > the mass culture of America nad the Stalinist > > Leviathan of Russia. > > > > > > > > > > > > Niekisch detects in all of Juenger’s poses the > > flight from society, ”whether > > > in Africa, as a heroic soldier, a gourmet of > > aesthetics, as a runaway from > > > Hitle’rs army in the dreamy reflection of Gardens > > and Streets, as a mountain > > > dweller in the cosmic sphere of Heliopolis. .. . > > wherever one looks, one > > > uncovers the figure of the fleeing nihilist.” > > Finally, Niekisch asks, “where > > > is the forest?” He considers the trees a natural > > metaphor for solitude and > > > refuge, comparable to Rousseau’s idea of nature. AS > > such the forest “is the > > > somber feeling, the intuitive sense of the inner self, > > emancipated from the > > > exterior world.” Niekisch concludes with the > > material question, “who > > > finances this freedom” > > > > > > Curious how list members would respond to Niekisch's > > critiques. > > > > > > Best, > > > > > > > > > Joel > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ > > __ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Sie sind Spam leid? Yahoo! Mail verfügt über einen > > herausragenden Schutz > > > gegen Massenmails. > > > http://mail. > > yahoo.com > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > joeldietz.com | twitter.com/jdietz | > > twitter.com/fractastical (tech) > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > (Yahoo!-ID erforderlich) > > > > > > juenger_org-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.de<juenger_org-fullfeatured%40yahoogroups.de> > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Sie sind Spam leid? Yahoo! Mail verfügt über einen herausragenden Schutz > gegen Massenmails. > http://mail.yahoo.com > >
