[Biofuel] solar tracker circuit - part 1
Solar Panel Tracker http://www.alternate-energy.net/sol_track05.html Get your daily alternative energy news http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid news resources forums http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tomorrow-energy Alternative Energy Politics http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Alternative_Energy_Politics/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel
Greetings, All - The loss of the PNGV links at NREL is no surprise. The Feds are deleting online files by the gross. Anything that makes them out for what they are is going, going... Gone. Keith - If you still have the old links, I suppose I could play with the 'wayback machine' and see if I can get partial pages. Images are very unlikely, but text should be there. What goes on here (on this list) is critical - There are a painful few 'real' researchers out there working this problem (U.S. anyway). It is up to us... -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.8.5/32 - Release Date: 6/27/2005 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] maximum MPG
Recovering exhaust and coolant heat tends to be complicated and expensive. It's best not to lose it in the first place, but there are practical limits. I was curious about using vegetable oil as the engine lubricant as well. Apparently it has been looked at and the lubricity is great but the oil breaks down quickly at high temperatures. There are good vegetable oil engine lubricants, especially in Europe. Try these: http://www.sterlinggrade.com http://www.renewablelube.com http://www.gemtek.com/ http://www.terresolve.com/ http://www.soypower.net/ http://www.lubegard.com/ http://www.renewableoil.com/ The idea occured to me that an engine could be designed that passes veggie oil through the engine as a lubricant and even a coolant on its way to the combustion chamber. That way it is always fresh oil and engine heat is put to good use heating the oil before injecting it. No more changing oil filters and draining dirty oil. Of course the final fuel filter would need changing more often though. This doesn't technically improve the efficiency of the engine but it recovers useful energy which would otherwise be wasted and improves the overall system efficiency in a sense. Running out of fuel would not be recommended with an engine of this type...hmmm I think I've seen that idea discussed before, and I don't think it got ruled out. It sounds like an elegant solution to me. Why not? Best wishes Keith Joe ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] BD process question
Hello Joe Hi Keith See my answers below; Keith Addison wrote: Hello Joe Hello, I have a question about biodiesel processing I hope someone can help me with; I read the excellent info on the journey to forever site and checked the archives about washing etc. I am interested in using mechanical agitation to speed up the process of washing but I wonder if I am being too impatient or something. Did you see this post? http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg37937.html Re: [biofuel] Circulation with pump washing. I just read it. Thanks. I don't think hot biodiesel fumes are very good for you. The smell is certainly more aromatic. This is the first I have heard of this. I thought I read on JtoF that BD is completely non toxic. It is, but does that also mean the fumes from heating it to a high temperature are harmless? I don't know. I've seen some people claiming it's harmful but without any details and I've never been able to find any real info on it. I'm afraid I'm a dumbo when it comes to vacuum, I don't know what that means. Did you let the glycerin by-product settle and separate it before distilling off the excess methanol? If you did it straight after the reaction you probably sent the reaction into reverse, converting soaps back into FFAs, which dissolve in the biodiesel and can't be washed out (and are not good for your motor). Either way, I doubt you'd succeed in removing all the excess methanol by distillation, most perhaps but not all. If you distilled it off with the by-product still in the reactor there'd still be quite a lot left in the by-product - without using vacuum you'd need to finish at a temperature of about 150 deg C to get it all, or nearly all. Anyway if you washed it thoroughly there won't be any methanol left. I let the glycerine settle overnight and then I turned the rercirc pump back on and mixed it all up while heating to 55 deg C. Then I used vacuum until the distillate stopped and then vented and allowed it to separate again. I doubt you got 100% of the methanol out that way, and you do risk reversing the reaction. I drained off the glycerin and added hot tap water ( I used deionized water in my test batches that is one difference) and recirculated for about an hour. After washing I would let it separate for two hours and then drain the water and repeat. I used 3 wash cycles. The last wash water came out almost clear. Try another wash cycle. Washing it in the processor runs the risk of contamination with residual by-product. See how it goes, you might have this problem later and need a separate wash-tank. Does the cloudiness indicate that the reaction was not correct (excess caustic?) If it's really persistent it might do. But you haven't told us very much about what you did, titration etc. - how did you measure the pH? Did you measure the pH of the final batch of wash water? It should be the same as your tap water. There are quite a lot of variables in transferring a process from a one-litre test batch to a bigger processor. You might need to experiment with agitation times. What's the volume of your reactor, only five gallons? I used phenolthalien (a few drops) in 4 ml oil mixed with 40 ml IPA. I stopeed when the color lasted 10 seconds. I don't have my lab book with me at work here but I think it came out around 3.5 ml of 0.1 % KOH soln per ml. Following the recommendations regarding the assay of my KOH I ended up deciding on 10.6 g KOH per liter of oil for my process. I did get a good clean split this way. Sounds good. I haven't tried reducing the concentration of caustic yet. I haven't measured the was water ph. I will do this. Yes my batch reactor is pitifully small. It is a 36 liter hot water tank. Since I walk to work year round my fuel needs are relatively low and my Golf TDI sips fuel rather than being a big gulper so I opted to build a small system that fits in my basement. I don't think that's pitiful, Joe, I think it's admirable, especially in view of your previous message about the footprints we make on the face of this fair planet. We fuelled our Toyota TownAce for nearly a year with a 20-litre processor, this one: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_processor5.html Simple 5-gallon processor The TownAce isn't nearly as economical as your Golf, and we also fuelled a few tractors and provided biodiesel for demos and for people coming to our seminars and so on. Now we make 60-litre batches but we still use the 5-gallon processor. Lots of people have copied it. I do wonder about people, especially in the US, who just seem to be ordinary folks, not farmers or businesses with fleets or whatever, but they say a 200-litre processor isn't enough for them. I use forced exhaust to take any fumes away from the methoxide mixing and the vacuum pump exhaust when it is running. So far it works ok except I guess I am pushing the process just a
Re: [Biofuel] Re: Environmentalism is dead. What's next?
Hello Chris sorry, i forgot who originally wrote this in reply response to my earlier statement, but i have to echo k's comment. what you refer to is the 'social contract', as many historians like to call it, which formed the basis of feudalism. serfs were bound to their lords, as you say. they had to provide the rents (or skilled labor if they were a blacksmith or mason, etc.) which supported their lords' lifestyle and privileges. in exchange, they essentially were allowed to live. There's confusion about it still though. For instance, people have said how kind their lordships were because they invariably allowed the serfs to graze their cattle and sheep on the lord's land. Actually they weren't allowed to, they were forced to - there was plenty of grass about the place, but there wasn't plenty of manure. Their lordships were purloining the serfs' only source of soil fertility, how kind indeed. I think Fernand Braudel's The Structures of Everyday Life: Civilization Capitalism might be a good read about all this. I've only read bits of it, I've wanted to read the whole thing for years. but they were not--at least not usually--bound in chains. they could leave if they were so resolved. not in broad daylight, of course, and as i said there were many factors which complicated matters. but there was nothing like today's institutionalized controls on a person's movements. Just think, a hundred years ago: no passports, no IDs. LOL! I suppose people will say we're being nostalgic. Nostalgia's not what it used to be either. :-) Best wishes Keith -chris Before the Black Death serfs were bound to their lords, not allowed to leave, move house or marry with his permission. Serfdom was just another name for slavery. Chris. Only before the Black Death? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel
Hello Tony Greetings, All - The loss of the PNGV links at NREL is no surprise. Not really, no. The Feds are deleting online files by the gross. Anything that makes them out for what they are is going, going... Gone. Keith - If you still have the old links, I suppose I could play with the 'wayback machine' and see if I can get partial pages. Images are very unlikely, but text should be there. That's a good idea - I'll dig up some backups and see what I can find. Thanks! What goes on here (on this list) is critical - There are a painful few 'real' researchers out there working this problem (U.S. anyway). It is up to us... Yes... and many others like us. Painfully few as a proportion of the whole, it's true, but many in number, and it's growing fast. Look at the growth of the blogosphere, for one instance - sure, there's a lot of woolly nonsense there, but there's a lot of good solid stuff too, that you don't find anywhere else, more and more of it, and it has its effect. Maybe the number's more important than the proportion. Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel
I do agree, though, that that was a heck of an expensive program for the U.S. taxpayer. I'm sorry, but I have to comment on what's being said here. Basically, the American tax dollar is begrudgingly given to help with cleaning up our environment to the tune of 210 million (ever deflating) US dollars yet a blind eye is being cast on the HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS of those same dollars being wasted on the beloved American Defence Budget. I heard somewhere that the INCREASE in the American defence budget this year exceeds the total defence budgets of the next five largest defence budgets of other superpowers put together. And George won't even consider cancelling third nation debt (I suppose it doesn't hold any immediate return for him so he doesn't care). So putting the whole thing into perspective, the payment of 0.175% of the American defence budget (which will be spent on developing new and improved ways of wiping out the planet in the shortest time possible) on helping some other Americans develop ways of reducing our dependence on the Earth's natural resources is a waste of money while creating weapons of mass destruction isn't. Hmmm, methinks there's a slight imbalance in priorities here. The term Heck of an expensive program(me) should be reserved for George Dubya's retirement fund (aka defence budget). As expensive as today's oil consumption is proving to be, in so many different ways? And not just for the US taxpayer either. IIRC, under PNGV the US gave $70 million to each of the big 3 automakers to come up with these 'possible vehicles'. I've cut out as much as is reasonable from this email trail to preserve bandwidth. Hope it still makes sense. By the way, I'm using English spelling in this mail not the American mutated version. The information contained in this e-mail and in any attachments is confidential and is designated solely for the attention of the intended recipient(s). If you are not an intended recipient, you must not use, disclose, copy, distribute or retain this e-mail or any part thereof. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by return e-mail and delete all copies of this e-mail from your computer system(s). Please direct any additional queries to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You.begin:vcard fn:Paddy O'Reilly n:O'Reilly;Paddy org:Silicon Software Systems;Digital Consumer Business Unit adr:Model Farm Road;;Cork Business Technology Park;Cork;;;Ireland email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] title:Senior IC Design Engineer tel;work:+353 21 230 2400 url:http://www.s3group.com version:2.1 end:vcard ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Chemical use with organic farming.
Had a discusion this morning with a fellow gardener about the use of chemicals in organic gardening. I said i don't use chemicals asi garden using organic principles. He said Organic farmers use loads of chemicals otherwise they would never get a good crop and would lose most to slugs and fungus infections. I know they use chemicals but not the synthetic nastys that non organic farmers use. Can enyone give me discription on chemicals organic farmers use and why they are different to non organic farmingpesticides and fungcides? Cheers myke. How much free photo storage do you get? Store your holiday snaps for FREE with Yahoo! Photos. Get Yahoo! Photos___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Freedom from oil?
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Happy day List! I just received that link www.freedomfromoil.com/ http://www.freedomfromoil.com/ and I support their effort. Pass it on! Declare your independance from oil! Felix I've looked around their site, and don't see a proposal on how this is to be implemented. And I can't sign something that I've not implemented in my own life and habits... I still eat food from the grocers, (brought there by oil dependent trucks.) And on occasion purchase items that were brought to the stores by oil dependent trucks. Heck, even the keyboard I'm typing on is plastic, which at one time was crude oil. Independence from oil sounds fantastic, but making it a reality means taking a close look at how oil has really infiltrated our lives to such a degree that to declare an independence from it would mean a change in lifestyle that no one I know of could carry through and not wind up in a cave. I'm much less dependent than I once was before I woke up and started looking at everything from a more alert perspective, but I'm still a considerable distance from independent! I wish their effort much success, and perhaps one day I'll be able to sign their declaration. (Click wood carved mouse here... :) doug swanson ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] maximum MPG
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Doug, there are about 20,000 BTUs in a pound of gasoline, about 6 pounds to the U.S. gallon. A high school physics text and Marks' Handbook for Engineers (in the reference section of most larger libraries) will contain a lot of the information you might need. A text on internal combustion engines that is about as clearly and simply written as any such text can be is The High-Speed Internal Combustion Engine by Ricardo and Hempson, 5th edition 1956or 1957, publisher Blackie of Edinburgh. There are earlier editions by Ricardo alone. Recovering exhaust and coolant heat tends to be complicated and expensive. It's best not to lose it in the first place, but there are practical limits. Diesels have a definite advantage over conventional spark ignition gasoline engines in maximum efficiency, because they can operate at higher compression and therefore expansion ratios. However, where Diesels really shine is part load efficiency; gasoline engines suffer badly at part load. Designing the transmission and suspension (including tires) for comfort, handling and performance involves major losses. Opportunities for reducing aerodynamic losses involve belly pans (maintenance problems?) and attention to the flow from the belly to the sides. It seems that the flow separation at the rear can be reduced, but the vehicle may look odd. If you are near a university which has a mechanical engineering department, browsing the archive of the Journal of the Society pf Automotive Engineers might interest you. There is a British equivalent; if memory serves thirty years ago it was the Journal of the Society of Chartered Mechanical Engineers. Doug Woodard St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada Thanks to you and all the others who gave me more to think about. What triggered the question in my mind was a claim of a 500 MPG car that appeared in a newsgroup I follow, and after having seen the VW 1l/100km car, and what design implementation went into that, I had wondered if a 500 MPG car could possibly be any larger than a roller skate. And then, with a passenger of average weight, the numbers just don't look as good any more. LOL thanks again, all! doug swanson ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] magnetic stir bars.
Dear Skapegoat, You're probably going to have difficulty scaling up to 5 gallons using magnetic stir bars. The largest bars I have used are only 6.3 cm(2.5 inches). They can stir a liter or 2 reasonable well but 10 times that volume I have my doubts if it will mix well enough. You would have to extend your stirring times at the very least. You could also baffle your reactor for more turbulent mixing. Bigger bars and more powerful magnets may help but I have not found a source for these as yet. In thick fluids mag stirrers have a tendency to disengage and sort of whirl around the outside of the beakers I've used. Pumping may be the best alternative. Tom Irwin Has anyone created a home made magnetic stir plate? I am scaling up from lab scale 100 mL batches to a 5 gallon reactor, and have some ideas for a homemade magnetic stir plate in lieu of the more typical agitation methods, and I wanted to see if others have gone down this path with any success (or failure). ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Chemical use with organic farming.
Hallo Myke, In this area some of the organic farmers use dilute biodegradeable soap. One fellow who farms using horses uses the same tanks that carry the *-cides chemicals but uses the dilute soap. He does this so he won't have to listen to the chemical farmers. He is tired of arguing with them. A study released last year which was of ten years showed that organic farmers have the same or better yields without the *-cides and it costs them less to farm because they don't have to pay for the *-cides. In my own hayfield I haven't used chemicals of any sort for 25 years and have had no problems with insects whether they be alfalfa leaf hoppers or whatever. The spiders take care of them. The *-cides are poisons and the chemicals used by organic farmers are not. The *-cides pollute the environment and groundwater and the organic farmer chemicals do not. A world of difference. Happy Happy, Gustl Wednesday, 29 June, 2005, 05:56:28, you wrote: mh Had a discusion this morning with a fellow gardener about the use mh of chemicals in organic gardening. I said i don't use chemicals as mh i garden using organic principles. mh He said Organic farmers use loads of chemicals otherwise they mh would never get a good crop and would lose most to slugs and mh fungus infections. I know they use chemicals but not the synthetic mh nastys that non organic farmers use. mh Can enyone give me discription on chemicals organic farmers use mh and why they are different to non organic farming pesticides and mh fungcides? mh Cheers myke. -- Je mehr wir haben, desto mehr fordert Gott von uns. We can't change the winds but we can adjust our sails. The safest road to Hell is the gradual one - the gentle slope, soft underfoot, without sudden turnings, without milestones, without signposts. C. S. Lewis, The Screwtape Letters Es gibt Wahrheiten, die so sehr auf der Straße liegen, daß sie gerade deshalb von der gewöhnlichen Welt nicht gesehen oder wenigstens nicht erkannt werden. Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music. George Carlin The best portion of a good man's life - His little, nameless, unremembered acts of kindness and of love. William Wordsworth ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] maximum MPG
Doug, If you look at VW 1 L and make a one person car with top speed 55 mph in line with that concept, you could probably make 0.6 L experiment car , near 500 mpg. This if you still could claim that it is a car and not a covered moped. After all, WV 1 L with one person, did in road tests 100 km on .89 l. Hoagy (MH) gave you some links on consumption records. Practically, I think that VW 1 L, sets the limit for a vehicle that could still be called a car and that this experiment will result in new and valuable energy saving design practices for cars. Hakan At 09:02 AM 6/29/2005, you wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Doug, there are about 20,000 BTUs in a pound of gasoline, about 6 pounds to the U.S. gallon. A high school physics text and Marks' Handbook for Engineers (in the reference section of most larger libraries) will contain a lot of the information you might need. A text on internal combustion engines that is about as clearly and simply written as any such text can be is The High-Speed Internal Combustion Engine by Ricardo and Hempson, 5th edition 1956or 1957, publisher Blackie of Edinburgh. There are earlier editions by Ricardo alone. Recovering exhaust and coolant heat tends to be complicated and expensive. It's best not to lose it in the first place, but there are practical limits. Diesels have a definite advantage over conventional spark ignition gasoline engines in maximum efficiency, because they can operate at higher compression and therefore expansion ratios. However, where Diesels really shine is part load efficiency; gasoline engines suffer badly at part load. Designing the transmission and suspension (including tires) for comfort, handling and performance involves major losses. Opportunities for reducing aerodynamic losses involve belly pans (maintenance problems?) and attention to the flow from the belly to the sides. It seems that the flow separation at the rear can be reduced, but the vehicle may look odd. If you are near a university which has a mechanical engineering department, browsing the archive of the Journal of the Society pf Automotive Engineers might interest you. There is a British equivalent; if memory serves thirty years ago it was the Journal of the Society of Chartered Mechanical Engineers. Doug Woodard St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada Thanks to you and all the others who gave me more to think about. What triggered the question in my mind was a claim of a 500 MPG car that appeared in a newsgroup I follow, and after having seen the VW 1l/100km car, and what design implementation went into that, I had wondered if a 500 MPG car could possibly be any larger than a roller skate. And then, with a passenger of average weight, the numbers just don't look as good any more. LOL thanks again, all! doug swanson ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Mystery logo
It means more information is available in the manual. r wrote: I saw a few logos stamped on the inside of the gas tank fuel door of my vehicle, a 2003 Dodge Caravan SE. One of them, I found out is E85, the symbol for ethanol 85. Another symbol, which is a mystery to me, represents the letter i stamped on the right page of a book. Any ideas as to the meaning of the i inside a book symbol? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] magnetic stir bars.
I have been working along the same exact line of thinking. Tom is probably right about stiring 5 gal of oil with a bar magnet. However where a magnetic stirrer really shines is in mixing methoxide. Stirring bars work great so long as they are confined to the area of the rotating magnetic field. The easiest way to do this is to have a small motor beneath the pot with a permanent magnet coupling to the stir bar through the stainless. I decided to get fancy and made a motorless stirrer using two home made electromagnets and some circuitry to create a rotating magnetic field. Yes there is a reason those motorless stirrers are so expensive to buy. You can make one for a lot less money if you want to do all this work, BUT now consider that when the thing is off there is nothing to hold the stir bar in place in the bottom of the big mixing vessel where it needs to be to work properly. In a small beaker the bar can not escape the field. A motor with a permanent magnet will hold the bar in position all the time, but with the motorless type the bar can end up anywhere in the pot when you pour in the ingredients. The little 1/2 inch bars are great for doing titrations. In fact the motorless stirrer I made is really only useful for this job. As an added benefit the home made electromagnets get warm after a little while and this is just great for warming the oil and isopropyl alcohol for the titration. Knowing what I know now though I wouldn't have spent all the time building the motorless stirrer. It works just as well to put the little titration beaker into a small jar of warm water to heat it and stir with a bar and a motor driven permanent magnet underneath. Bottom linedon't be like me, remember the KISS principle of engineering ( Keep It Simple Stupid) yeah, I find it necessary to teach myself that one from time to time Joe Tom Irwin wrote: Dear Skapegoat, You're probably going to have difficulty scaling up to 5 gallons using magnetic stir bars. The largest bars I have used are only 6.3 cm(2.5 inches). They can stir a liter or 2 reasonable well but 10 times that volume I have my doubts if it will mix well enough. You would have to extend your stirring times at the very least. You could also baffle your reactor for more turbulent mixing. Bigger bars and more powerful magnets may help but I have not found a source for these as yet. In thick fluids mag stirrers have a tendency to disengage and sort of whirl around the outside of the beakers I've used. Pumping may be the best alternative. Tom Irwin Has anyone created a home made magnetic stir plate? I am scaling up from lab scale 100 mL batches to a 5 gallon reactor, and have some ideas for a homemade magnetic stir plate in lieu of the more typical agitation methods, and I wanted to see if others have gone down this path with any success (or failure). ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] magnetic stir bars.
Hello. Once I did have this same idea but I did not find the materials and the electric engine and the electronic control but other people have done the commercial way for special purposes for laboratory equipment, you could try a Lab equipment supplier like: www.coleparmer.com Cole-Parmer's 2003/2004 Cathalog, pag. 1735 a so called Super Magnetic Stirrer for heavy-walled container with the article code A-84160-00 Magnetic Stirrer with an stir bar article code A-08552-00 Mono-Mold measuring 2 L x 3/8 diam. maximun stirring volume is 19 Liters. Price tag is: Stirrer $1770.00 + Stir bar $ 6.80 In the same Cole-Parmer Cathalog for economical stirrers for common containers up to 10 gallons you will find in page 1736, for 120 Volts at $656.00 or 230 Volts at $756.00. Stirring bars for most applications are in page 1738-1739 These might be what you are looking for but at a price here I could buy a small motorcycle, uff... Regards. Juan -- From: the skapegoat [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 6/28/2005 1:22 PM For:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject:[Biofuel] magnetic stir bars. Has anyone created a home made magnetic stir plate? I am scaling up from lab scale 100 mL batches to a 5 gallon reactor, and have some ideas for a homemade magnetic stir plate in lieu of the more typical agitation methods, and I wanted to see if others have gone down this path with any success (or failure). ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] fuel efficient cars
This might be interesting if the effects of gravity could be reduced or other technological developments implemented -- The VW 1L fuel economy is one litre per 100 kilometres or about 235 miles per US gallon in 2002 and I don't know what the average speed was. 290 kilogram (639 lb.) vehicle. The California Commuter 104 kilogram (230 lb.) vehicle. Gasoline Record The 157.192 MPG at 55 MPH gasoline record was set on November 20, 1980. Diesel Record The 156.53 MPG at 56.3 MPH diesel record was set on November 30, 1981. http://www.canosoarus.com/03CalifCommuter/CalCom01.htm The Mini Micro Missile A bicyclist on a typical road bike has to develop 1.0 Horsepower continuously to hold a speed of 30 Miles Per Hour. A first class athlete can sustain this level of effort for some 30 seconds whereas a healthy human can only sustain this level of effort for about 12 seconds. At 30 MPH, 12 seconds is just enough time to travel 200 meters! . . . . . . 8 year old with maybe 1/8th of an adult's total Horsepower capacity officially average 29.62 MPH over the 200 meter traps to become the World's Fastest Self Propelled Kid . . . http://www.canosoarus.com/12MMMissile/MMM01.htm Producing just 0.1 Horsepower, which a healthy human can do for 8 hours continuously, a bicyclist on the moon would be cruising at 237 MPH! That is just 1/10th of the horsepower an earthbound cyclist needs to produce in order to be moving along at a crummy 30 MPH! . . . http://www.canosoarus.com/12MMMissile/MMM05.htm ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] fuel efficient cars
I can tell you now you will have a lot of trouble from the ASPG if you propose this idea. See here: http://www.pugbus.net/News/05032005_joliegravity.htm Apparently Angelina Jolie has taken up the torch as spokesperson for the movement to conserve gravity. Like Jolie many of us here on the list are concerned with conserving things. This is NOT a throw away world. And here we have someone right under our noses who wants the just throw away a significant portion of our most basic natural resource gravity itself. Sheesh! MH wrote: This might be interesting if the effects of gravity could be reduced or other technological developments implemented -- The VW 1L fuel economy is one litre per 100 kilometres or about 235 miles per US gallon in 2002 and I don't know what the average speed was. 290 kilogram (639 lb.) vehicle. The California Commuter 104 kilogram (230 lb.) vehicle. Gasoline Record The 157.192 MPG at 55 MPH gasoline record was set on November 20, 1980. Diesel Record The 156.53 MPG at 56.3 MPH diesel record was set on November 30, 1981. http://www.canosoarus.com/03CalifCommuter/CalCom01.htm The Mini Micro Missile A bicyclist on a typical road bike has to develop 1.0 Horsepower continuously to hold a speed of 30 Miles Per Hour. A first class athlete can sustain this level of effort for some 30 seconds whereas a healthy human can only sustain this level of effort for about 12 seconds. At 30 MPH, 12 seconds is just enough time to travel 200 meters! . . . . . . 8 year old with maybe 1/8th of an adult's total Horsepower capacity officially average 29.62 MPH over the 200 meter traps to become the World's Fastest Self Propelled Kid . . . http://www.canosoarus.com/12MMMissile/MMM01.htm Producing just 0.1 Horsepower, which a healthy human can do for 8 hours continuously, a bicyclist on the moon would be cruising at 237 MPH! That is just 1/10th of the horsepower an earthbound cyclist needs to produce in order to be moving along at a crummy 30 MPH! . . . http://www.canosoarus.com/12MMMissile/MMM05.htm ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] fuel efficient cars
I read at one of the links that you gave earlier, that they went on highway to a show. At average speed around 70 kmph and one person, the consumption was 0.89 l per 100 km, 1.35 l per 100 miles or 281 mpg. If you trim the weight and with a lower average speed, it should be possible to make a vehicle (covered moped) that make 500 mpg. I doubt that such a vehicle would be of general interest. A Lupo 2L or Smart 2L is however feasible and I suspect that we could see that quite soon. I think that Detroit have a lot to do, before they get fuel efficient production cars. Hakan At 04:38 PM 6/29/2005, you wrote: This might be interesting if the effects of gravity could be reduced or other technological developments implemented -- The VW 1L fuel economy is one litre per 100 kilometres or about 235 miles per US gallon in 2002 and I don't know what the average speed was. 290 kilogram (639 lb.) vehicle. The California Commuter 104 kilogram (230 lb.) vehicle. Gasoline Record The 157.192 MPG at 55 MPH gasoline record was set on November 20, 1980. Diesel Record The 156.53 MPG at 56.3 MPH diesel record was set on November 30, 1981. http://www.canosoarus.com/03CalifCommuter/CalCom01.htm The Mini Micro Missile A bicyclist on a typical road bike has to develop 1.0 Horsepower continuously to hold a speed of 30 Miles Per Hour. A first class athlete can sustain this level of effort for some 30 seconds whereas a healthy human can only sustain this level of effort for about 12 seconds. At 30 MPH, 12 seconds is just enough time to travel 200 meters! . . . . . . 8 year old with maybe 1/8th of an adult's total Horsepower capacity officially average 29.62 MPH over the 200 meter traps to become the World's Fastest Self Propelled Kid . . . http://www.canosoarus.com/12MMMissile/MMM01.htm Producing just 0.1 Horsepower, which a healthy human can do for 8 hours continuously, a bicyclist on the moon would be cruising at 237 MPH! That is just 1/10th of the horsepower an earthbound cyclist needs to produce in order to be moving along at a crummy 30 MPH! . . . http://www.canosoarus.com/12MMMissile/MMM05.htm ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Gravity -was: fuel efficient cars
With these vehicles conservation will be increased while reclining. 8^D Joe Street wrote: I can tell you now you will have a lot of trouble from the ASPG if you propose this idea. See here: http://www.pugbus.net/News/05032005_joliegravity.htm Apparently Angelina Jolie has taken up the torch as spokesperson for the movement to conserve gravity. Like Jolie many of us here on the list are concerned with conserving things. This is NOT a throw away world. And here we have someone right under our noses who wants the just throw away a significant portion of our most basic natural resource gravity itself. Sheesh! ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel
Title: RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel you can always try the wayback internet time machine. I'm always AMAZED at what it remembers. if it was publicly available, and in a search engine, chances are it is in the time machine http://www.archive.org/web/web.php -Original Message- From: Keith Addison [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wed 6/29/2005 3:51 AM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Cc: Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel Hello TonyGreetings, All -The loss of the PNGV links at NREL is no surprise.Not really, no.The Feds are deleting online files by the gross. Anything that makesthem out for what they are is going, going... Gone.Keith - If you still have the old links, I suppose I could play withthe 'wayback machine' and see if I can get partial pages. Images arevery unlikely, but text should be there.That's a good idea - I'll dig up some backups and see what I can find. Thanks!What goes on here (on this list) is critical - There are a painfulfew 'real' researchers out there working this problem (U.S. anyway).It is up to us...Yes... and many others like us. Painfully few as a proportion of thewhole, it's true, but many in number, and it's growing fast. Look atthe growth of the blogosphere, for one instance - sure, there's a lotof woolly nonsense there, but there's a lot of good solid stuff too,that you don't find anywhere else, more and more of it, and it hasits effect. Maybe the number's more important than the proportion.Best wishesKeith___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] heating the wash
I noticed on my last batch, that if I heat the was prosess up a bit, that it seems to work better(no white deposits). Is this a good way to do it? My wash water comes staight out of the well and is very cold. Brent 6.2 diesel ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel
Mean while the Japanese figured out how to make hybrids at a prices to sell to the American public. Seems there is a line waiting for the hybrids now because of the souring gas prices. Again the big three are slow to answer to the American public and their sinking sales prove once again they don't have a clue. Bill From: RobT [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:47:50 -0400 I worked on the Ford P2000 DIATA diesel hybrid for a few years in the late 90's, as a engine control systems engineer. It was a research vehicle, part of the PNGV initiative. A pretty cool and functional hybrid -- a large 4-door car (larger inside than a Taurus) with reasonable power. I got around 60-70 mpg in real-world driving, a bit higher on the EPA test cycles. The engine and hybrid system were all pretty close to currently in-production stuff, with the exception of batteries and exhaust aftertreatment. The cost of the vehicle, though, was way high, much to high for a marketable car. To get the weight down to 2000 lbs curb weight, we had expensive aluminum, magnesium, and titanium components everywhere. Titanium lugnuts? $200 each. Magnesium wheels? I doubt it could have been produced for less than $50,000 US, even given economies of scale. Fun stuff to play with, though. So, I don't think there is a magic vehicle being hidden from us. I do agree, though, that that was a heck of an expensive program for the U.S. taxpayer. IIRC, under PNGV the US gave $70 million to each of the big 3 automakers to come up with these 'possible vehicles'. -- RobT ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Vegetable Motor Oil (was: maximum MPG)
I was curious about using vegetable oil as the engine lubricant as well. Apparently it has been looked at and the lubricity is great but the oil breaks down quickly at high temperatures. There are good vegetable oil engine lubricants, especially in Europe. Try these: http://www.sterlinggrade.com http://www.renewablelube.com http://www.gemtek.com/ http://www.terresolve.com/ http://www.soypower.net/ http://www.lubegard.com/ http://www.renewableoil.com/ Thanks for the links, Keith. I've also been thinking about replacements for petroleum-based motor oil lately. I maintain the cars for a small intentional community (13 people, 4 families). We currently put about 70,000 miles on our three cars each year. Two years ago, I switched one of them to synthetic oil with a drain interval of 25,000 miles or 1 year. (I'm actually doing 20,000.) The main advantage this has for me is that I save time changing the oil: once instead of four times in 20,000 miles. I spend slightly more on the oil, but the time savings easily makes that up. I've been very happy with the results and have recently made the switch with our second car and plan to switch the last car in the next few weeks. As I understand it, the base stock for synthetic oil could come from rotting vegetation. However, I have not found anything that indicates that it actually does. My impression is that they use the lightest gases from the petroleum refining process and work from there. Thus, while I have cut my use of petroleum motor oil to a quarter of what it was (and gained the performance advantages), I have not stopped using it entirely. Just the other day, I spent some time looking for a plant-based motor oil. The only one I came up with was Agro Management Group (http://www.agromgt.com/). They seem to have a 4-cycle motor oil, but they don't sell it on their web site. I have not gotten a response to my query. However, they recommend a 3,000-mile drain interval. From a time and materials point of view, they could be giving it away for free and it would still cost me twice as much to use that product as it costs me to use the synthetic oil because I would be taking the time to change the oil six to eight times as often. Additionally, while they emphasize the biodegradability of the product, I don't think I would be pouring it on my garden when I'm done with it. No matter what is in it when I put it in my engine, there will be toxic contaminants in it when I take it out because the engine will add small amounts of heavy metals from wear, leftover petroleum oil, blow by, other lubricants, etc. This means I still have to dispose of it responsibly, Also, I'd be getting rid of six to eight times as much of the stuff with all of the associated environmental costs of producing and delivering the product to my door. That does not seem like the environmentally sound choice. It seems to me that the vegetable-based products would have to come close to rivaling the change interval I'm getting now before I would want to switch for environmental or lifecycle cost reasons. I looked at the web sites mentioned above, but none seem to have a motor oil ready for 4-cycle engines. One (http://www.soypower.net/) seems to have a hydraulic oil (for my backhoe) available, but not through the web site. John ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel
I'm not sure what the average price of gas (aka petrol) is in the US, in Ireland it has just passed the Euro mark per litre - that's USD5.44 a gallon and in England its about 90p per litre - that's USD8.17 a gallon. Perhaps this kind of price in the US will be enough to get people's attention (George Bush and his cohorts would be delighted at this price). Unfortunately nothing significant is still being done in Europe about changing to biofuels. Bill Vaughn wrote: Mean while the Japanese figured out how to make hybrids at a prices to sell to the American public. Seems there is a line waiting for the hybrids now because of the souring gas prices. Again the big three are slow to answer to the American public and their sinking sales prove once again they don't have a clue. Bill The information contained in this e-mail and in any attachments is confidential and is designated solely for the attention of the intended recipient(s). If you are not an intended recipient, you must not use, disclose, copy, distribute or retain this e-mail or any part thereof. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender by return e-mail and delete all copies of this e-mail from your computer system(s). Please direct any additional queries to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thank You.begin:vcard fn:Paddy O'Reilly n:O'Reilly;Paddy org:Silicon Software Systems;Digital Consumer Business Unit adr:Model Farm Road;;Cork Business Technology Park;Cork;;;Ireland email;internet:[EMAIL PROTECTED] title:Senior IC Design Engineer tel;work:+353 21 230 2400 url:http://www.s3group.com version:2.1 end:vcard ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Chemical use with organic farming.
Hello Myke Had a discusion this morning with a fellow gardener about the use of chemicals in organic gardening. I said i don't use chemicals as i garden using organic principles. He said Organic farmers use loads of chemicals otherwise they would never get a good crop and would lose most to slugs and fungus infections. I know they use chemicals but not the synthetic nastys that non organic farmers use. Can enyone give me discription on chemicals organic farmers use and why they are different to non organic farming pesticides and fungcides? Ump... Mainly they this one: good compost and good soil humus management, and good everything management. I don't think we are unique among experienced organic growers in using very little intervention in pest management. (Organic grower, US) I, too, use no biocides. People who think you have to use biocides to farm assume incorrectly that organic farmers use botanical biocides. This is not the case. Very few organic farmers merely switch from synthetic to organic biocides. For some this may be a first step in the transition to organic growing, but it is not the rule. Organic farmers have shown that food crops can be grown with the same or more production per acre, with the same or less lost to pests, without using biocides or NPK (chemical) fertilizers. (Organic grower, US) -- Pesticides are the badge of the amateur -- organic grower You're not really talking about organic farming, you're talking about input substitution - chemical farming with different chemicals. Organics is not just using a different set of inputs to achieve the same old reactive aims -- kill the pests, kill the weeds. Most organic farmers don't use any pesticides, whether approved organic ones or not, they don't need them. Less than 5% of the organic farmers in the US use any pesticides of whatever origin, according to the USDA. They don't use fertilisers either, to feed the crop, and they're not too interested in nutrients. They're interested in soil humus-maintenance, in building very high levels of soil fertility -- feed the soil, then the crop will look after itself. Organics by substitution doesn't work too well anyway - high inputs, average to low outputs. Organics by neglect doesn't work very well either - low-input, and low output too. And an outside job to keep the farm going. Real organic farming is organic by design. Organic growers look upstream to determine why the problem exists in the first place, then they figure out how the system has to be managed to avoid having the problem at all. These are mixed, integrated farms, balanced ecosystems where pest attack or weed infestations tell you something is wrong - you fix it, restore the balance, the pests and weeds depart. Low-input, high-output, high quality, and you're laughing all the way to the bank. You can do this at any scale, including garden-scale - no livestock, but your compost pile makes up for that. Start here: http://journeytoforever.org/garden_organic.html Why organic? Journey to Forever organic garden Keep going, there are links there to everything you need to know, including the basic texts and much more at the online Small Farms Library, plus website sections on small farms, city gardens, composting, seeds, weeds and pests, and more, with a lot more to be uploaded, particularly on projects we're doing here in Japan, so visit often. Have a look at this (I don't agree about the livestock, but to each his own): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg12485.html RE: Organics - was Re: [biofuel] $7.5 Million Feedstock Subsidy for SSPC Best wishes Keith Cheers myke. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Vegetable Motor Oil (was: maximum MPG)
Hello John I was curious about using vegetable oil as the engine lubricant as well. Apparently it has been looked at and the lubricity is great but the oil breaks down quickly at high temperatures. There are good vegetable oil engine lubricants, especially in Europe. Try these: http://www.sterlinggrade.com http://www.renewablelube.com http://www.gemtek.com/ http://www.terresolve.com/ http://www.soypower.net/ http://www.lubegard.com/ http://www.renewableoil.com/ Thanks for the links, Keith. You're welcome, but to me they're just links, I haven't yet investigated them. Please let us know how you get on with them. I've also been thinking about replacements for petroleum-based motor oil lately. I maintain the cars for a small intentional community (13 people, 4 families). We currently put about 70,000 miles on our three cars each year. Two years ago, I switched one of them to synthetic oil with a drain interval of 25,000 miles or 1 year. (I'm actually doing 20,000.) The main advantage this has for me is that I save time changing the oil: once instead of four times in 20,000 miles. I spend slightly more on the oil, but the time savings easily makes that up. I've been very happy with the results and have recently made the switch with our second car and plan to switch the last car in the next few weeks. As I understand it, the base stock for synthetic oil could come from rotting vegetation. However, I have not found anything that indicates that it actually does. My impression is that they use the lightest gases from the petroleum refining process and work from there. These should help: http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg28320.html RE: [biofuel] What Is Synthetic Oil Made Of? http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg28331.html RE: [biofuel] What Is Synthetic Oil Made Of? http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg28323.html Re: [biofuel] What Is Synthetic Oil Made Of? http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg28335.html Re: [biofuel] What Is Synthetic Oil Made Of? Thus, while I have cut my use of petroleum motor oil to a quarter of what it was (and gained the performance advantages), I have not stopped using it entirely. Just the other day, I spent some time looking for a plant-based motor oil. The only one I came up with was Agro Management Group (http://www.agromgt.com/). They seem to have a 4-cycle motor oil, but they don't sell it on their web site. I have not gotten a response to my query. Nothing seems to have happened there for five years. People have tried to get some response or news out of them before and failed. However, they recommend a 3,000-mile drain interval. From a time and materials point of view, they could be giving it away for free and it would still cost me twice as much to use that product as it costs me to use the synthetic oil because I would be taking the time to change the oil six to eight times as often. Additionally, while they emphasize the biodegradability of the product, I don't think I would be pouring it on my garden when I'm done with it. No matter what is in it when I put it in my engine, there will be toxic contaminants in it when I take it out because the engine will add small amounts of heavy metals from wear, leftover petroleum oil, blow by, other lubricants, etc. This means I still have to dispose of it responsibly, Also, I'd be getting rid of six to eight times as much of the stuff with all of the associated environmental costs of producing and delivering the product to my door. That does not seem like the environmentally sound choice. It seems to me that the vegetable-based products would have to come close to rivaling the change interval I'm getting now before I would want to switch for environmental or lifecycle cost reasons. I looked at the web sites mentioned above, but none seem to have a motor oil ready for 4-cycle engines. One (http://www.soypower.net/) seems to have a hydraulic oil (for my backhoe) available, but not through the web site. Oh. You should try European sources then, it's definitely marketed there. We use a pure castor-oil based lube oil, in everything except the auto transmission actually, jolly nice stuff, but it's not generally available and we haven't managed to budge them on that. http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg33707.html Re: [biofuel] The Myth of the 3,000 Mile Oil Change ... With approximately 200,000 miles on the odometer, I installed a Frantz Bypass Filter System. There are others available, but this one suited my needs, and I remembered the name from my teenage years. I have had numerous professional lab analysis performed on the oil at many different bypass filter change intervals since. All results have come back near identical. The results have shown soot levels at BELOW .01%. The same result I would expect with new, unused oil. I now have not
[Biofuel] Re: max mpg of vehicle
this car currently hold the record for max fuel efficiency http://www.physorg.com/news4788.html ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel
Yes but there is the issue of Battery life and cost. The batteries are warranted for 8-10 year or 80K/100K miles. Prorated - Who knows. There cost is in the $7000 bracket. So lets see, My Toyota Camry 1985 has 321K miles no rebuilds. I will admit it is near death. It get 27 odd MPG. 31 on the freeway. I will make the assumption that maintained cost are about equal for both cars. Assume the same time period and fuel prices. So my cost of ownership is (Toyota Camry) Fuel consumed = 321,000/27 = 11888 gallons. Fuel cost avg $1.50 Total fuel cost = $17,833 Cost per/year = $17,833/20years = $891 fuel costs. Battery cost $0 total = $891/year So my cost of ownership is (VW Jetta) Fuel consumed = 321,000/47 = 6829 gallons. Fuel cost avg $1.50 Total fuel cost = $10,244 Cost per/year = $10,244/20years = $512 fuel costs. Battery cost $0 total = $512/year As a Honda with a 80K/$7000 battery 2005 Honda Accord mileage 30/37 = avg around 35 mpg Fuel consumed = 321,000/35 = 9171 gallons. Fuel cost avg $1.50 Total fuel cost = $13,757 Total batteries used @ 80k mile/bat = 321/80 = 4.012 = 4 4 x 7000 = $28,000 Cost per/year = $13,757/20years = $687 fuel costs. Cost per/year = $28,000/20years = $1400 Battery costs. total = $2100/year @ 80K battery Assume a 150K battery = 2 changes = $14,000 Cost per/year = $13,757/20years = $687 fuel costs. Cost per/year = $14,000/20years = $700 Battery costs. total = $1387/year @ 80K battery As a Honda with a 100K/$7000 battery Insight mileage 60/66 = avg around 63 mpg Fuel consumed = 321,000/35 = 5095 gallons. Fuel cost avg $1.50 Total fuel cost = $7,642 Total batteries used @ 100k mile/bat = 321/100 = 3.21 = 3 3 x 7000 = $21,000 Cost per/year = $7,642/20years = $328 fuel costs. Cost per/year = $21,000/20years = $1050 Battery costs. total = $1378/year @ 100K battery Assume a 150K battery = 2 changes = $14,000 Cost per/year = $13,757/20years = $328 fuel costs. Cost per/year = $14,000/20years = $700 Battery costs. total = $1028/year @ 150K battery Conclusion: Toyota Camry 27mph $891/year Honda Accord$2100/year @ 80K battery 135% higher Honda Accord$1387/year @ 150K battery 56% higher Honda Insight $1387/year @ 100K battery 56% higher Honda Insight $1024/year @ 150K battery 14% higher VW Jetta$512/Year Honda Accord$2100/year @ 80K battery 310% higher Honda Accord$1387/year @ 150K battery 170% higher Honda Insight $1387/year @ 100K battery 170% higher Honda Insight $1024/year @ 150K battery 100% higher So I see not cost benefit to Hybrids, my poor Camry is less expensive. And what about life expectancy. My last Diesel Rabbit was retired at 450,000 miles. No rebuilds. When gas get to $4+ a gallon then there could be a net advantage to the hybrids, if the engine systems can last 20+ years. But still will not compeate with the diesels. Sorry the calculations do not include CO2 carbon credits. Just random thoughts. M -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bill Vaughn Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 8:25 AM To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel Mean while the Japanese figured out how to make hybrids at a prices to sell to the American public. Seems there is a line waiting for the hybrids now because of the souring gas prices. Again the big three are slow to answer to the American public and their sinking sales prove once again they don't have a clue. Bill From: RobT [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: RE: [Biofuel] Hybrid Diesel Date: Tue, 28 Jun 2005 09:47:50 -0400 I worked on the Ford P2000 DIATA diesel hybrid for a few years in the late 90's, as a engine control systems engineer. It was a research vehicle, part of the PNGV initiative. A pretty cool and functional hybrid -- a large 4-door car (larger inside than a Taurus) with reasonable power. I got around 60-70 mpg in real-world driving, a bit higher on the EPA test cycles. The engine and hybrid system were all pretty close to currently in-production stuff, with the exception of batteries and exhaust aftertreatment. The cost of the vehicle, though, was way high, much to high for a
[Biofuel] strange observation re mileage
I was driving my daughters new 1 ton Ford on a trip and was averaging 18.2 mpg. Then I encountered rain and mileage fell to about 12.5. Apparently something must be changed by the computer. Kirk Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] heating the wash
Hello Brent I noticed on my last batch, that if I heat the was prosess up a bit, that it seems to work better(no white deposits). Is this a good way to do it? My wash water comes staight out of the well and is very cold. It's a good way to do it, heat the process or use hot water, it definitely washes better. Try to get the temperature of the water-biodiesel up to at least 30 deg C (86 deg F) or more. We use hot water all winter. It's cheap for us, but it still uses energy, and energy isn't cheap no matter how little you pay for it. We have a Kyocera solar water heater, we just have to plumb it in, then we'll use that. Regards Keith Brent 6.2 diesel ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] magnetic stir bars.
Thanks. I was going to attempt to make my own. Regular stir plates cost more than I am willing to spend. I'm thinking now it will just be easier to make a stirrer from a drill and perhaps if I scale up later I'll try to make a stir plate for mixing up methoxide.Juan Boveda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello.Once I did have this same idea but I did not find the materials and the electric engine and the electronic control but other people have done "the commercial way" for special purposes for laboratory equipment, you could try a Lab equipment supplier like:www.coleparmer.comCole-Parmer's 2003/2004 Cathalog, pag. 1735 a so called Super Magnetic Stirrer for heavy-walled container with the article code A-84160-00 Magnetic Stirrer with an stir bar article code A-08552-00 Mono-Mold measuring 2" L x 3/8 diam. maximun stirring volume is 19 Liters.Price tag is: Stirrer $1770.00 + Stir bar $ 6.80In the same Cole-Parmer Cathalog for economical stirrers for common containers up to 10 gallons you will find in page 1736, for 120 Volts at $656.00 or 230 Volts at $756.00. Stirring bars for most applications are in page 1738-1739These might be what you are looking for but at a price here I could buy a small motorcycle, uff...Regards.Juan--From: the skapegoat [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: 6/28/2005 1:22 PMFor: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: [Biofuel] magnetic stir bars.Has anyone created a home made magnetic stir plate? I am scaling up from lab scale 100 mL batches to a 5 gallon reactor, and have some ideas for a homemade magnetic stir plate in lieu of the more typical agitation methods, and I wanted to see if others have gone down this path with any success (or failure).___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] strange observation re mileage
Water is heavy and sticks to the car and fills divets in the bed of the truck (adding weight), plus the rain hitting the car makes it have to work harder to maintain speed, and on top of all that the water on the ground means your tires have you be turned with more force to get through it. Moisture in the air, if the air isn't cold, will negatively affect combustion as well. Did you slow down for the rain? That might have been a problem as well. Chris N - Original Message - From: Kirk McLoren To: biofuel Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 2:51 PM Subject: [Biofuel] strange observation re mileage I was driving my daughters new 1 ton Ford on a trip and was averaging 18.2 mpg. Then I encountered rain and mileage fell to about 12.5. Apparently something must be changed by the computer. Kirk Yahoo! SportsRekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] magnetic stir bars.
I was thinking of attaching a permanent magnet to an the rotating part of an old juicer. I still want to try it just to see if I can make it work, but I think I will try something a bit more straightforward first...Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have been working along the same exact line of thinking. Tom is probably right about stiring 5 gal of oil with a bar magnet. However where a magnetic stirrer really shines is in mixing methoxide. Stirring bars work great so long as they are confined to the area of the rotating magnetic field. The easiest way to do this is to have a small motor beneath the pot with a permanent magnet coupling to the stir bar through the stainless. I decided to get fancy and made a motorless stirrer using two home made electromagnets and some circuitry to create a rotating magnetic field. Yes there is a reason those motorless stirrers are so expensive to buy. You can make one for a lot less money if you want to do all this work, BUT now consider that when the thing is off there is nothing to hold the stir bar in place in the bottom of the big mixing vessel where it needs to be to work properly. In a small beaker the bar can not escape the field. A motor with a permanent magnet will hold the bar in position all the time, but with the motorless type the bar can end up anywhere in the pot when you pour in the ingredients. The little 1/2 inch bars are great for doing titrations. In fact the motorless stirrer I made is really only useful for this job. As an added benefit the home made electromagnets get warm after a little while and this is just great for warming the oil and isopropyl alcohol for the titration. Knowing what I know now though I wouldn't have spent all the time building the motorless stirrer. It works just as well to put the little titration beaker into a small jar of warm water to heat it and stir with a bar and a motor driven permanent magnet underneath.Bottom linedon't be like me, remember the KISS principle of engineering ( Keep It Simple Stupid) yeah, I find it necessary to teach myself that one from time to timeJoeTom Irwin wrote:Dear Skapegoat,You're probably going to have difficulty scaling up to 5 gallons using magnetic stir bars. The largest bars I have used are only 6.3 cm(2.5 inches). They can stir a liter or 2 reasonable well but 10 times that volume I have my doubts if it will mix well enough. You would have to extend your stirring times at the very least. You could also baffle your reactor for more turbulent mixing. Bigger bars and more powerful magnets may help but I have not found a source for these as yet. In thick fluids mag stirrers have a tendency to disengage and sort of whirl around the outside of the beakers I've used. Pumping may be the best alternative.Tom Irwin Has anyone created a home made magnetic stir plate? I am scaling upfrom lab scale 100 mL batches to a 5 gallon reactor, and have some ideasfor a homemade magnetic stir plate in lieu of the more typical agitationmethods, and I wanted to see if others have gone down this path with anysuccess (or failure).___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] strange observation re mileage
Lots of standing water on the road? It's hard for the computer to change things _that_ much. Or was that 12.5 indicated by the trip computer over a short time? -- Rob -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kirk McLoren Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 2:52 PM To: biofuel Subject: [Biofuel] strange observation re mileage I was driving my daughters new 1 ton Ford on a trip and was averaging 18.2 mpg. Then I encountered rain and mileage fell to about 12.5. Apparently something must be changed by the computer. Kirk Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Making the World Sustainable
True costs of industrial food production system 1 000 tonnes of water are consumed to produce one tonne of grain [13] 10 energy units are spent for every energy unit of food on our dinner table [14, 15] Up to 1 000 energy units are used for every energy unit of processed food [16] 17% of the total energy use in the United States goes into food production distribution, accounting for more than 20% of all transport within the country; this excludes energy used in import and export [17] 12.5 energy units are wasted for every energy unit of food transported per thousand air-miles [18, 19] Current EU and WTO agricultural policies maximise food miles resulting in scandalous food swaps [20, 21] Up to 25% of CO2, 60% of CH4 and 60% of N2O in the world come from current agriculture [22] US$318 billion of taxpayers money was spent to subsidize agriculture in OECD countries in 2002, while more than 2 billion subsistence farmers in developing countries tried to survive on $2 a day [11, 23] Nearly 90% of the agricultural subsidies benefit corporations and big farmers growing food for export; while 500 family farms close down every week in the US [11] Subsidized surplus food dumped on developing countries creates poverty, hunger and homelessness on massive scales [11] - The Institute of Science in Society Science Society Sustainability http://www.i-sis.org.uk ISIS Press Release 29/06/05 Making the World Sustainable mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Mae-Wan Ho Biophysics Group, Dept. of Pharmacy, Kings College, Franklin-Wilkins Bldg. London SE1 9NN, UK. Institute of Science in Society, PO Box 32097, London NW1 0XR, UK E-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED][EMAIL PROTECTED] sis.org.uk Plenary lecture at Food Security in An Energy-Scarce World international conference, 23- 25 June 2005, University College, Dublin, Ireland. A fuller version with http://www.i- sis.org.uk/full/MTWSFull.phpreferences and figures are posted on ISIS Members website. http://www.i-sis.org.uk/membership.phpDetails here Abstract Decades of an environmental bubble economy built on the over-exploitation of natural resources has accelerated global warming, environmental degradation, depletion of water and oil, and brought falling crop yields, precipitating a crisis in world food security with no prospects for improvement under the business as usual scenario. There is, nevertheless, a wealth of knowledge for making our food system sustainable that not only can provide food security and health for all, but can also go a long way towards mitigating global warming by preventing greenhouse gas emissions and creating new carbon stocks and sinks. One of the most important obstacles to implementing the existing knowledge is the dominant economic model of unrestrained, unbalanced growth that has already failed the reality test. I describe a highly productive integrated farming system based on maximising internal input to illustrate a theory of sustainable organic growth as alternative to the dominant model. Current food production system due for collapse World grain yield fell for four successive years from 2000 to 2003 as temperatures soar, bringing reserves to the lowest in thirty years [1]. The situation did not improve despite a bumper harvest in 2004, which was just enough to satisfy world consumption. Experts are predicting [2] that global warming is set to do far worse damage to food production than even the gloomiest of previous forecasts. An international team of crop scientists from China, India, the Philippines and the United States had already reported that crop yields fall by 10 percent for each deg. C rise in night-time temperature during the growing season [3]. The Intergovernment Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) predicted in 2001 that the earths average temperature would rise by 1.4 to 5.8 deg. C within this century [4]. In 2003, a Royal Society conference in London told us that the IPCC model fails to capture the abrupt nature of climate change, that it could be happening over a matter of decades or years [5]. In January 2005, a group based in Oxford University in the UK predicts a greater temperature rise of 1.9 to 11.5 deg. C when carbon dioxide level in the atmosphere, currently standing at 379 parts per million, doubles its pre-industrial level of 280 parts per million sometime within the present century [6]. The environmental bubble economy built on the unsustainable exploitation of our natural resources is due for collapse [7] said Lester Brown of Earth Policy Institute. The task of turning our food production system sustainable must be addressed at war-time speed. He summarised the fallout of the environmental bubble economy succinctly [8]: ..collapsing fisheries, shrinking forests, expanding deserts, rising CO2 levels, eroding soils, rising temperatures, falling water tables, melting glaciers, deteriorating grasslands, rising seas, rivers that are
Re: [Biofuel] strange observation re mileage
Didn't slow, used cruise control. The truck gets 12.5 mpg towing a 24 foot steel Titan with 6 horses on board so I don't think the water matched that. I perceive it as mixture must change. Some sensor and computer thing. KirkChris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Water is heavy and sticks to the car and fills divets in the bed of the truck (adding weight), plus the rain hitting the car makes it have to work harder to maintain speed, and on top of all that the water on the ground means your tires have you be turned with more force to get through it. Moisture in the air, if the air isn't cold, will negatively affect combustion as well. Did you slow down for the rain? That might have been a problem as well. Chris N - Original Message - From: Kirk McLoren To: biofuel Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 2:51 PM Subject: [Biofuel] strange observation re mileage I was driving my daughters new 1 ton Ford on a trip and was averaging 18.2 mpg. Then I encountered rain and mileage fell to about 12.5. Apparently something must be changed by the computer. Kirk Yahoo! SportsRekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
RE: [Biofuel] strange observation re mileage
When I saw my average mpg falling I reset the trip computer.The 12.5 was where it averaged.Next day I got 18+ on the same road. Road is crowned well, no standing water. Wasn't a trip computer error either as verified at fillup. Took the gallonage computer said it would. Very strange Kirk RobT [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Lots of standing water on the road? It's hard for the computer to changethings _that_ much. Or was that 12.5 indicated by the trip computer over ashort time?-- Rob-Original Message-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED][mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kirk McLorenSent: Wednesday, June 29, 2005 2:52 PMTo: biofuelSubject: [Biofuel] strange observation re mileageI was driving my daughters new 1 ton Ford on a trip and was averaging 18.2mpg. Then I encountered rain and mileage fell to about 12.5. Apparentlysomething must be changed by the computer. KirkYahoo! SportsRekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ Yahoo! Sports Rekindle the Rivalries. Sign up for Fantasy Football ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Truth in Journalism and the Washington Post
June 29, 2005Manufacturing SupportHow the Washington Post Lied about Its Own War PollBy MIKE SCHAEFERIn a deceitful boost to Bush on the morning of hisIraq address, the Washington Post and ABC Newsreleased a poll of U.S. public opinion on Iraq. Butthe Post's numbers in their print version (in the bodyof the article) underestimates the "Out Now" positionby more than 3 times. One has to look at their actualnumbers (Poll Data) to see that support for "stayingthe course" is much smaller than the article suggests.The Washington Post has published the results of theirjoint survey with ABC News on the front page todayunder the heading "Survey Finds Most Support Stayingin Iraq - Public Skeptical About Gains AgainstInsurgents" by Richard Morin and Dan Balz.The first two paragraphs read:"a new Washington Post-ABC News poll finds thatmost Americans do not believe the administration'sclaims that impressive gains are being made againstthe insurgency, but a clear majority is willing tokeep U.S. forces there for an extended time tostabilize the country.The survey found that only one in eight Americanscurrently favors an immediate pullout of U.S. forces,while a solid majority continues to agree with Bushthat the United States must remain in Iraq until civilorder is restored -- a goal that most of thosesurveyed acknowledge is, at best, several years away."The article misrepresents the actual numbers aspublished under "Poll Data" which can be accessedthrough the article's webpageQuestion #7 under "Poll Data" reads: "Do you think theUnited States should keep its military forces in Iraquntil civil order is restored there, even if thatmeans continued U.S. military casualties; OR, do youthink the United States should withdraw its militaryforces from Iraq in order to avoid further U.S.military casualties, even if it means civil order isnot restored there?Keep forces = 58%Withdraw forces = 41%No opinion = 2%41% is just over two out of five, not "one in eight"(12.5%) as the second paragraph suggests. And 8% overhalf is not a "solid majority" for "staying thecourse." It would be more accurately described as a"slim majority!I have studied the Poll Data, and I don't know wherethe Post gets "one in eight" for immediate pullout.The graph on the website that reads "Just your bestguess, about how much longer do you think the UnitedStates will need to keep U.S. military forces inIraq?" (Question #15) shows just 6% support "pull outnow," which is not "one in eight;" it's less than halfthat: one in sixteen. But Question #15 can beunderstood as a strategic and not a politicalquestion, and so it is not as reliable question ofU.S. support for continued occupation vs withdrawal asquestion #7.If this was an accident, it was a pretty sloppy one.Mike Schaefer can be reached at: [EMAIL PROTECTED]___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biofuel as a rural community development project in Mozambique
hello, alexis. you may have received numerous replies already, but just want to point out that the optimum temperature range for fermentation is roughly between 50 and 70 degrees fahrenheit. efficiency drops off as you get further out of that range. something to be taken into account when calculating costs/feasibility. -chris -Original Message-From: Alexis Rawlinson [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Mon, 27 Jun 2005 20:43:07 +0200Subject: [Biofuel] Biofuel as a rural community development project in Mozambique I am toying with the idea of trying to set up a pilot rural community development project involving biofuel (bioethanol or biodiesel or SVO, whichever is most appropriate) in Mozambique. I am hoping that you can give me your opinion and advice on the technical feasibility, commercial viability and ultimately, long-term sustainability, in a poor isolated African rural setting, of small-scale, community-based, locally-run biofuel production. If anyone has had experience of a similar project, I would be extremely interested to have information about that. Am I right in thinking that the technical feasibility is beyond question? Bear in mind that we are talking about very isolated and poor communities where everything has to be low-tech and low-maintenance. On the basis of this criterion, biodiesel appears to be the most appropriate fuel as it can be used in diesel vehicles/machines/generators (even very old and rickety ones?) with no engine modifications. We can discount the issue of having to change filters initially because of accumulated petrodiesel deposits falling off (we could include the cost of new filters in start-up subsidies). We also don't need to worry about problems with cold starts, since Mozambique is a tropical country. I am more concerned about the question of commercial viability. The project will only be replicable on a larger scale and sustainable in the long term if, after initial start-up costs, every link in the value chain has an incentive to participate and it is profitable for all concerned (i.e. the anticipated gains should outweigh the expected costs, including the opportunity cost of doing something else). a) Inputs: Local farmers will have an incentive to supply the biofuel production facility with feedstock only if prices paid and quantities required by the production facility are stable and remunerative compared to undertaking other activities, such as growing other crops for other purposes. b) Production: Local entrepreneurs will have an incentive to make investments in biofuel production facilities and operate and maintain those facilities only if they can sell their fuel at a remunerative price, i.e. if they can compete against fossil fuels (whether locally, nationally, regionally or globally, depending on the scale of production). c) Demand: We know that the world market for biofuels is growing rapidly and that the policy environment is becoming extremely favourable. However, supposing, as is most likely to be the case, that local biofuel is most competitive on the local market (and least competitive on the global market, where it has to compete with industrial-scale production), there must be a critical mass of buyers on that market, i.e. local communities must have the desire / ability to invest in machines, vehicles or generators, and the ability to pay for biofuel on a regular basis to run those machines. I guess the root question is the following: is the current situation in rural southern Africa - no biofuel production - a market failure that could be resolved by kickstarting a virtuous cycle in the sector with start-up outreach and support activities and subsidies, or is it simply not an economically viable sector except with permanent subsidy and support? It seems to me that, to answer this question, there are three crucial cost assessments which need to be made: a) Start-up costs: the required investments by farmers, by local biofuel entrepreneurs, by future biofuel consumers, and to what extent can/should "outreach and support activities" subsidize these fixed costs? b) Price and availability of feedstock: How will local feedstock production compare to growing other crops or not growing crops at all? Might it potentially actually be cheaper to import the feedstock from elsewhere (which would defeat much of the local development aspect of the project)? P.S. A lot of sugarcane is grown in Mozambique and the country has big potential to become a major low-cost producer of sugar (and therefore ethanol?) (although again, we are more likely talking about large estates than small-holders). c) Value of market demand for biofuel: How cheaply will local biofuel producers be able to sell their production, and how large will be their market? To what extent can they compete with fossil fuels, and imported industrial-scale biofuel producers on the local/national/regional/global market? Do you agree with this general
Re: [Biofuel] maximum MPG
For a perfect vehicle with no friction or air resistance losses at 100% efficiency it would probably run forever. LOL! a vehicle like that, who would need an engine? you could drive it flintsones-style! -chris ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Re: Environmentalism is dead. What's next?
I think that the commercial interest behind the government keep trying to prevent people, consumers from getting together to compare notes, form consumer spending strategies, etc. As they say, "in union is strength ". I think that if major corporations could have their way, the Internet would not exist today, or even it did, it would exist for the sole purpose to enhance their marketing capabilities. Sorry, big corporations, but you are too late, the cat is out of the bag now. I remember the time when Microsoft(TM) said that the Internet was a fad. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: From: Rousseau, Jean-Jacques: The Social Contract (1762) http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~wldciv/world_civ_reader/world_civ_reader_2/rousseau.html "Man is born free; and everywhere he is in chains. One thinks himself the master of others, and still remains a greater slave than they." Perhaps more importantly... "But, as men cannot engender new forces, but only unite and direct existing ones, they have no other means of preserving themselves than the formation, by aggregation, of a sum of forces great enough to overcome the resistance. These they have to bring into play by means of a single motive power, and cause to act in concert. (2)" Isn't it ironic that Franklin once said "We must all hang together or assuredly we will all hang separately" since it's our government who (IMO) would prefer to see us divided. Times have changed, haven't they. ...Mike [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: sorry, i forgot who originally wrote this in reply response to my earlier statement, but i have to echo k's comment. what you refer to is the 'social contract', as many historians like to call it, which formed the basis of feudalism. serfs were bound to their lords, as you say. they had to provide the rents (or skilled labor if they were ablacksmith or mason, etc.)which supported their lords' lifestyle and privileges. in exchange, they essentially were allowed to live. but they were not--at least not usually--bound in chains. they could leave if they were so resolved. not in broad daylight, of course, and as i said there were many factors which complicated matters. but there was nothing like today's institutionalized controls on a person's movements. -chris Before the Black Death serfs were bound to their lords, not allowed to leave, move house or marry with his permission. Serfdom was just another name for slavery. Chris. Only before the Black Death? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] fuel efficient cars
Hi Hakan, I was thinking of all the motorcycles I see and with some imagination and checking in with the department of motor vehicles one could build a two seater something like the VW 1L but with 3 wheels and possibly register it as a motorcycle though I haven't thought about this in decades. My Honda 500 cc use to get around 45 mpg and the Harley 61 ci 32 mpg and here in the US converted motorcycle three-wheeler trikes are popular so why not a 155 mpg California Commuter doing 55 mph. I'd love to watch the tv program building that one! My past autos such as the Fiat 850, Honda Civic, Chevy Sprint and Ford Festiva averaged 40 mpg but kept me out of the rain, warm in the winter and brought home a store load of goodies if needed. So I've given up motorcycling and now find pedaling my bicycle or tricycle more enjoyable along with the exercise and when needed using the 48 mpg Geo Metro with E10. Maybe the US gov't and Detroit will come up with something in the distant future as the price of crude oil climbs but its difficult for me to imagine them doing that nowadays. I read at one of the links that you gave earlier, that they went on highway to a show. At average speed around 70 kmph and one person, the consumption was 0.89 l per 100 km, 1.35 l per 100 miles or 281 mpg. If you trim the weight and with a lower average speed, it should be possible to make a vehicle (covered moped) that make 500 mpg. I doubt that such a vehicle would be of general interest. A Lupo 2L or Smart 2L is however feasible and I suspect that we could see that quite soon. I think that Detroit have a lot to do, before they get fuel efficient production cars. Hakan ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] US oil war game
Outcome Grim at Oil War Game Former Officials Fail to Prevent Recession in Mock Energy Crisis By John Mintz Washington Post Staff WriterFriday, June 24, 2005; Page A19 http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/06/23/AR2005062301896.html The United States would be all but powerless to protect the American economy in the face of a catastrophic disruption of oil markets, high-level participants in a war game concluded yesterday. The exercise, called Oil Shockwave and played out in a Washington hotel ballroom, had real-life former top U.S. officials taking on the role of members of the president's Cabinet convening to respond to escalating energy crises, culminating in $5.32-a-gallon gasoline and a world wobbling into recession. The American people are going to pay a terrible price for not having had an energy strategy, said former CIA director Robert M. Gates, who took on the role of national security adviser. Stepping out of character, he added that the scenarios portrayed were absolutely not alarmist; they're realistic. The exercise began with ethnic unrest in Nigeria, leading to the collapse of the oil industry in that west African nation. Then al Qaeda launched crippling attacks on key energy facilities in Valdez, Alaska, and Saudi Arabia. But the war game's participants -- including former CIA director R. James Woolsey, former Marine Corps commandant Gen. P.X. Kelley and former EPA administrator Carol Browner, soon realized the U.S. government had few options in the short term to prevent an economic crash in this country and worldwide. When the exercise's planners first met last year, oil was in the $40-a-barrel range. As they fantasized where oil prices would be for the war game's start in an imagined late 2005, they said, they set them at $58 but worried they were being absurdly pessimistic. Yesterday, the closing price for a barrel of oil was $59.42. The war game players also referred several times to other real-life events of today. A major feature of the exercise was how China's voracious appetite for oil is driving up world prices, and only yesterday it was announced the Beijing government, in a bold and unprecedented act, is bidding to buy the U.S. oil company Unocal. The exercise was organized by two nonprofit groups that focus on the national security implications of U.S. dependence on foreign oil: the National Commission on Energy Policy and Securing America's Future Energy (SAFE). The scenarios were dreamed up by a team of former oil industry executives and government officials, including Rand Beers, a White House counterterrorism official who quit in 2003 to protest the Iraq war. The underlying situation dramatized in the exercise -- and accepted by most energy analysts -- is that tolerances are so tight between supply and demand, that even small disruptions in the delivery of oil and natural gas can cause cascades of unpleasant developments. The war game contemplated that when oil prices spiked and the Cabinet met to consider its options, it realized it had almost no clout to influence events. The standard response, drawing on the Strategic Petroleum Reserve, was symbolic at best. The president should not give in to Saudi offers that the kingdom would lower prices if he stopped pressing for Saudi democracy, the participants agreed. Within weeks conditions were worsening -- the Valdez oil terminal was on fire, as was a major Saudi oil port, and Western technicians were being killed there. Foreign oil firms soon pulled tens of thousands of workers out of Saudi Arabia. Suddenly lacking technical expertise, Saudi facilities could no longer play their decades-long role of guaranteed swing provider of oil in response to disruptions elsewhere. As the global recession deepened, there was no central banker of oil to smooth out temporary dislocations. The participants concluded almost unanimously that they must press the president to invest quickly in promising technologies to reduce dependence on overseas oil, such as hybrid cars powered by gasoline and plug-in electricity; and cars that run on fuels derived from prairie grasses, animal waste and other products. They all agreed these projects would take years to yield any benefit but should not wait for the kind of crisis they were dramatizing. If you want to put a frown on the face of [Saudi] Wahhabis, talk about 100-mile-per-gallon vehicles, Woolsey said. We don't need a Manhattan Project to do it. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
