[USMA:16418] RE: More metric items
At 22:37 11/26/2001 -0800, Bill Potts wrote: Jim Elwell wrote: The Digestive appears to be a type of cookie. Can one of our English members tell me what Digestive means to English citizens? Sounds like a medicine to me. Digestives are British crackers found in grocery stores in the cookies and crackers section, or at least they were when I was in the UK about ten years ago. They are often round, like Ritz crackers, and wrapped in stacks about 20 cm high, and often somewhat crumbly in texture and somewhat sweet. I liked them. I don't recall if they come in SI packages. No offense intended, but digestives were one of the culinary highlights of our stay in the UK! Plus Indian and Chinese food. HARRY WYETH
[USMA:16419] Fw: Re: When does SI/ISO calendar starts?
You just have to differentiate between the calendar week, and the work week. - Original Message - From: Adam Baranski [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: November 26, 2001 18:52 Subject: [USMA:16402] Re: When does SI/ISO calendar starts? It seems most cultures follow the 7 day week as prescribed in the old testament. God worked for 6 days and rested the 7th. There is no confusion here. At some point in western civilization history someone decided the resurrection of Jesus which happened on Sunday was a big enough event to make that day devoted to prayers. Naturally you couldn't do your normal work on that day so it had to become a day off. But in those times you couldn't have two days off in a week so that in turn caused Saturday to be a regular working day. At the same time some countries decided to call Sunday the last day of the week so it fit the old testament prescription of 6 days of work and 1 day of rest. The English speaking countries adapted the Sunday-as-a-day-of-prayer scheme but they decided to keep it as the first day of the week. Later on hard working people of industrial era decided to fight for a shorter work week and they made the Saturday a day off. Later on they coined the term weekend to describe the two days off as time for leisure and prayer. Now that doesn't fit with Sunday being the first day of the week. How can Sunday be the first day of the week and at the same time be part of the weekEND? Hmm. Something's amiss here. One of the ways to fix this problem is to go with most people's definition of the weekend and start the week on Monday and end it on Sunday. I'm really not sure who authorized the change from a Sunday to a Monday but my best guess would be the Pope or his advisors who btw were for quite a long time setting standards in many areas. Adam From: kilopascal [EMAIL PROTECTED] 2001-11-26 I don't have a clue as to when some countries changed the sabbath from Saturday to Sunday or why, but in both the old and new testaments, the day of rest has been the Sabbath and a Saturday. The Jewish calendar starts with Sunday because the Jews are following the 7 day week as prescribed in Genesis. Even at the time of the Ressurection, the two women who visited the tomb and found it empty went on a Sunday morning (now celebrated as Easter Morning) which the bible describes as the first day of the week. I never heard of Easter being on a Monday. A change of the first day from a Sunday to a Monday, done for whatever reason, was done without authorisation and thus is not valid. John _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp
[USMA:16420] Re: More metric items
Although I'm not British, I am of British ancestry. A digestive is simply a plain type of cookie (or biscuit as they would say in the UK), usually taken with a cup of tea. Sometimes they are plain and other times they are coated on one side with chocolate. Reminds me of visiting my granny. Stephen Gallagher P.S. There is no such thing as an English citizen. People from the UK are British citizens (not British Subjects, by the way), as are people from Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. - Original Message - From: Jim Elwell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: November 26, 2001 19:22 Subject: [USMA:16403] More metric items Picked up the following items at a Stop Shop in Middletown, New York. They had a large selection of foods imported from England, most with no colloquial units on them. I only bought a representative sample. (Categories per USMA consumer page.) beans Batchelors Curried Beans (UK) 400 g other sauces HP Curry Sauce 250 g ketchup Chef Tomato Ketchup 340 g (Nestle, Switzerland) onions Haywards Traditional Onions 270 g (bottled, UK) cookies McVitie's Shortcake (UK) 200 g Jacob's Chocolate Digestive 150 g (UK) candy Yorkie Chocolate Bar 70 g (Nestle, Ireland) The Digestive appears to be a type of cookie. Can one of our English members tell me what Digestive means to English citizens? Sounds like a medicine to me. Jim Elwell
[USMA:16421] Re: More metric items
Stephen Gallagher wrote: P.S. There is no such thing as an English citizen. People from the UK are British citizens (not British Subjects, by the way), as are people from Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. You're both right and wrong. Regarding legal status, it's British citizen. However, citizen isn't exclusively a legal term and has a total of 10 definitions (OED). in the more general sense (and, in fact, the primary one), one can be an English citizen, a citizen of London, a citizen of New York, and so on. I always look on myself as a citizen of the world, although legally I'm both a British and a Canadian citizen. Bill Potts, CMS Roseville, CA http://metric1.org [SI Navigator]
[USMA:16422] Re: 80-cents-a-gallon gas
- Original Message - From: brianr [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: rec.travel.usa-canada Sent: November 26, 2001 14:15 Subject: Re: 80-cents-a-gallon gas Scaleman wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rqf) I was listening to a sports radio station, this morning, in NYC. The host of the show reported he paid 94 cents for a gallon of gas in New Jersey. Just to cheer you up, it's £3.42p a gallon in the UK. approx $5 per gallon. Is that imperial gallon, or US gallon?
[USMA:16423] Re: 80-cents-a-gallon gas
Are you asking Scaleman or are you asking us? Scaleman's message wasn't to this list server. Bill Potts, CMS Roseville, CA http://metric1.org [SI Navigator] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Stephen C. Gallagher Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 05:13 To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:16422] Re: 80-cents-a-gallon gas - Original Message - From: brianr [EMAIL PROTECTED] Newsgroups: rec.travel.usa-canada Sent: November 26, 2001 14:15 Subject: Re: 80-cents-a-gallon gas Scaleman wrote: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Rqf) I was listening to a sports radio station, this morning, in NYC. The host of the show reported he paid 94 cents for a gallon of gas in New Jersey. Just to cheer you up, it's £3.42p a gallon in the UK. approx $5 per gallon. Is that imperial gallon, or US gallon?
[USMA:16424] Unix : When does SI/ISO calendar starts?
In unix OS, we schedule the jobs to be run on different days. Some jobs are run 7 days a week and some others only 5 days. The day starts with Sunday, but luckily the number given for it is '0' and Monday is 1 ,Tuesday is 2 ,Wednesday is 3 ,Thursday is 4 ,Friay is 5 ,Saturday is 6. So our thinking that Monday is the first day goes correctly with it. Similary the hours start with '00' and end with '23', minutes is 00 - 59 seconds is 00 - 59 If every software follows a week from Sun-Sat starting with 0, then it will be good and easy to follow. Madan __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1
[USMA:16425] What prompted decimalization
The decimal currency (1$ = 100 cents) was introduced in the US almost 220 years ago. But the stock exchange switched to decimal units only in the year 2001. What prompted this change, is it to 1. adjust with the global situation 2. competition from European exchanges 3. based on an individuals initiative. If anyone can find this, then we can pursue the same path to metrication also. Madan __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1
[USMA:16426] Re: When does SI/ISO calendar starts?
This is a 7-based issue, not 10-based. Therefore, off topic. D. -Original Message- From: kilopascal [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: November 26, 2001 14:14 Subject: [USMA:16388] Re: When does SI/ISO calendar starts? 2001-11-26 The reason the American week starts with Sunday is biblical in origin. The Sabbath, the seventh day, is the day of rest and is a Saturday. Monday can not be the first day since it does not follow Saturday. Sunday has always been the first day. John - Original Message - From: Wizard of OS [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, 2001-11-26 12:35 Subject: [USMA:16384] When does SI/ISO calendar starts? you know what I mean, normal calendars start with monday and how could it be american one starts with sunday. what's legal with SI/ISO? _ Downloaden Sie MSN Explorer kostenlos unter http://explorer.msn.de/intl.asp
[USMA:16427] Re: attitudes
Regarding Han's quote: Imperialists could claim: As Jesus did not use metric, the world should not use metric. I've heard this variation: If God had wanted us to use the metric system, there would have been 10 disciples (instead of 12). to which I reply: If God had wanted us to use Ye Olde English units there would have been 5280 commandments (instead of 10). Han also mentioned: ...the condemnations of false weight and measure in the Bible ... Here is the reference for that quote (or at least the one with which I am most familiar): Deuteronomy 25:14a You shall not have in your house two kinds of measures ... I use this to suggest that we should not have two different measuring systems in the US or in the world. Regards, Bill Hooper Keep It Simple! Make It Metric!
[USMA:16428] Re: More metric items
I mentioned English citizen only in an informal sense. I probably meant someone who has lived or lives in England, as I do not know if digestive is used in a similar fashion in all of the British empire (i.e., Scotland, Wales, ). (If I am using British empire improperly as a synonym for United Kingdom, no doubt list members will correct me.) BTW, the package that was labeled digestive has a description of wheaten biscuits, half covered with real milk chocolate. In the interest of science, I opened the package and tried them. Very much like animal crackers with chocolate frosting. Jim At 05:01 AM 11/27/2001 -0800, Bill Potts wrote: Stephen Gallagher wrote: P.S. There is no such thing as an English citizen. People from the UK are British citizens (not British Subjects, by the way), as are people from Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. You're both right and wrong. Regarding legal status, it's British citizen. However, citizen isn't exclusively a legal term and has a total of 10 definitions (OED). in the more general sense (and, in fact, the primary one), one can be an English citizen, a citizen of London, a citizen of New York, and so on. I always look on myself as a citizen of the world, although legally I'm both a British and a Canadian citizen. Bill Potts, CMS Roseville, CA http://metric1.org [SI Navigator]
[USMA:16429] Re: More metric items
When one becomes a Canadian citizen, the oath is: I swear (or affirm) that I will be faithful and bear true allegiance to Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth the Second, Queen of Canada, Her Heirs and Successors, and that I will faithfully observe the laws of Canada and fulfil my duties as a Canadian citizen. Sounds like subject could be implied in there somewhere ... Carleton In a message dated Tue, 27 Nov 2001 8:02:30 AM Eastern Standard Time, Bill Potts [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Stephen Gallagher wrote: P.S. There is no such thing as an English citizen. People from the UK are British citizens (not British Subjects, by the way), as are people from Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. You're both right and wrong. Regarding legal status, it's British citizen. However, citizen isn't exclusively a legal term and has a total of 10 definitions (OED). in the more general sense (and, in fact, the primary one), one can be an English citizen, a citizen of London, a citizen of New York, and so on. I always look on myself as a citizen of the world, although legally I'm both a British and a Canadian citizen. Bill Potts, CMS Roseville, CA http://metric1.org [SI Navigator]
[USMA:16430] RE: More metric items
On Tue, 27 Nov 2001 02:57:46 -0800, Harry Wyeth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Digestives are British crackers found in grocery stores in the cookies and crackers section, or at least they were when I was in the UK about ten years ago. They are often round, like Ritz crackers, and wrapped in stacks about 20 cm high, and often somewhat crumbly in texture and somewhat sweet. They are 'sweetmeal' biscuits, i.e. made from wholemeal four and lots of sugar. They are available now with chocolate coating but that's not a real digestive! I liked them. I don't recall if they come in SI packages. Biscuits have been in metric packs for years. Chris -- UK Metric Association: http://www.metric.org.uk/
[USMA:16431] RE: What prompted decimalization
Only a guess, but I bet it has a lot to do computerization of the stock markets. It's much easier to enter a decimal stock price than a fractional on a keyboard. It's also probably much easier to write database code for decimal numbers. Now there's an interesting thought. If someone buys a stock at, say, 20 and 1/3 dollars, and the stockbroker's computer stores the price in the database as 20.3..., who gets the $0.00333... when they cash out? Scott C -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of M R Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 6:26 AM To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:16425] What prompted decimalization The decimal currency (1$ = 100 cents) was introduced in the US almost 220 years ago. But the stock exchange switched to decimal units only in the year 2001. What prompted this change, is it to 1. adjust with the global situation 2. competition from European exchanges 3. based on an individuals initiative. If anyone can find this, then we can pursue the same path to metrication also. Madan __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1
[USMA:16432] Re: More metric items
All a 'digestive' is and ever has been to me is a tasty biccy that you dip in your tea!! Regards, Steve. [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Jim Elwell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 12:22 AM Subject: [USMA:16403] More metric items Picked up the following items at a Stop Shop in Middletown, New York. They had a large selection of foods imported from England, most with no colloquial units on them. I only bought a representative sample. (Categories per USMA consumer page.) beans Batchelors Curried Beans (UK) 400 g other sauces HP Curry Sauce 250 g ketchup Chef Tomato Ketchup 340 g (Nestle, Switzerland) onions Haywards Traditional Onions 270 g (bottled, UK) cookies McVitie's Shortcake (UK) 200 g Jacob's Chocolate Digestive 150 g (UK) candy Yorkie Chocolate Bar 70 g (Nestle, Ireland) The Digestive appears to be a type of cookie. Can one of our English members tell me what Digestive means to English citizens? Sounds like a medicine to me. Jim Elwell
[USMA:16433] Re: More metric items
There's been no such thing as the British Empire for over thirty years, Jim!! Regards, Steve. [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Jim Elwell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 4:59 PM Subject: [USMA:16428] Re: More metric items I mentioned English citizen only in an informal sense. I probably meant someone who has lived or lives in England, as I do not know if digestive is used in a similar fashion in all of the British empire (i.e., Scotland, Wales, ). (If I am using British empire improperly as a synonym for United Kingdom, no doubt list members will correct me.) BTW, the package that was labeled digestive has a description of wheaten biscuits, half covered with real milk chocolate. In the interest of science, I opened the package and tried them. Very much like animal crackers with chocolate frosting. Jim At 05:01 AM 11/27/2001 -0800, Bill Potts wrote: Stephen Gallagher wrote: P.S. There is no such thing as an English citizen. People from the UK are British citizens (not British Subjects, by the way), as are people from Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. You're both right and wrong. Regarding legal status, it's British citizen. However, citizen isn't exclusively a legal term and has a total of 10 definitions (OED). in the more general sense (and, in fact, the primary one), one can be an English citizen, a citizen of London, a citizen of New York, and so on. I always look on myself as a citizen of the world, although legally I'm both a British and a Canadian citizen. Bill Potts, CMS Roseville, CA http://metric1.org [SI Navigator]
[USMA:16435] Re: More metric items
2001-11-27 But, I'll bet some people still think it exists. I have a feeling that those who subscribe to the BWMA in some way, shape or form still feel a strong nostalgia for the empire. Metric and Europe are seen as forces that remind Britain that the empire is dead. To counter these forces, people who have this nostalgia do everything in their power to promote English and to resist metric and the European Union. To the empirists, it is grand when the British can rule and give orders, it is defeat if the British are ruled over and take orders from some other source, especially if those sources contains elements that were in competition with the old empire, namely France and Germany. The loyalists to the empire are mostly old has-beens and young wanna be has-beens! John - Original Message - From: Stephen Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 2001-11-27 13:42 Subject: [USMA:16433] Re: More metric items There's been no such thing as the British Empire for over thirty years, Jim!! Regards, Steve. [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Jim Elwell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 4:59 PM Subject: [USMA:16428] Re: More metric items I mentioned English citizen only in an informal sense. I probably meant someone who has lived or lives in England, as I do not know if digestive is used in a similar fashion in all of the British empire (i.e., Scotland, Wales, ). (If I am using British empire improperly as a synonym for United Kingdom, no doubt list members will correct me.) BTW, the package that was labeled digestive has a description of wheaten biscuits, half covered with real milk chocolate. In the interest of science, I opened the package and tried them. Very much like animal crackers with chocolate frosting. Jim At 05:01 AM 11/27/2001 -0800, Bill Potts wrote: Stephen Gallagher wrote: P.S. There is no such thing as an English citizen. People from the UK are British citizens (not British Subjects, by the way), as are people from Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. You're both right and wrong. Regarding legal status, it's British citizen. However, citizen isn't exclusively a legal term and has a total of 10 definitions (OED). in the more general sense (and, in fact, the primary one), one can be an English citizen, a citizen of London, a citizen of New York, and so on. I always look on myself as a citizen of the world, although legally I'm both a British and a Canadian citizen. Bill Potts, CMS Roseville, CA http://metric1.org [SI Navigator]
[USMA:16436] RE: Dictionaries -- OFF TOPIC (was: More metric items)
That's because the spelling should be bikky which is a variant of bicky. Baron -Original Message- From: Jim Elwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, 27 November, 2001 12:57 To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:16434] Dictionaries -- OFF TOPIC (was: More metric items) At 06:17 PM 11/27/2001 +, Stephen Davis wrote: All a 'digestive' is and ever has been to me is a tasty biccy that you dip in your tea!! Presumably biccy is slang for biscuit. It's not in my OED. Speaking of dictionaries, and since several list members have a version of the Oxford English Dictionary (OED), allow me to suggest a very interesting book: Chasing the Sun -- Dictionary Makers and the Dictionaries They Made, by Jonathan Green (2000). Traces the history of dictionaries and lexicography back to the Sumerians, around 3000 b.c. I found it to be quite dense reading, but well worth the effort. I also had to look up a word on every page or two, so it helped expand my vocabulary. Jim Elwell
[USMA:16437] RE: Dictionaries -- OFF TOPIC (was: More metric items)
Jim Elwell wrote: Presumably biccy is slang for biscuit. It's not in my OED. Is yours the SOED? From the OED Online: bicky, bikky A diminutive or affectedly childish form of BISCUIT. 1930 R. BLAKER Medal without Bar iv. 303 Sammy..said there was some breakfast. 'Only ''bikkies'' again, I'm afraid,' he apologised. 1947 Mod. Lang. Rev. July 356 Eng[lish] stands almost alone with bicky for 'biscuit'. 1954 C. P. SNOW New Men viii. 56 The Minister pulled out a bag... It contained grey oatmeal cakes. 'Bikkies,' explained the Minister. 1955 B. MOORE Judith Hearne i. 11 Have a bikky, Bernie? 1963 M. ALLINGHAM China Governess xiv. 171 He's going to be asked to share Eustace's boiled milk and bickies. Bill Potts, CMS Roseville, CA http://metric1.org [SI Navigator]
[USMA:16438] Re: attitudes
As a matter of fact it seems that God (which is the same for muslims, christians and jews) told us several thousand years ago to GO Metric by giving the 10 commandments. We still don't get it! Adrian PS: And if we put this information together with the Bill's quote from Deuteronomy we get: You shall not have in your house two kinds of measures and the one you have shall be decimal -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Barbara and/or Bill Hooper Sent: Tuesday, 27 November, 2001 10:51 To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:16427] Re: attitudes Regarding Han's quote: Imperialists could claim: As Jesus did not use metric, the world should not use metric. I've heard this variation: If God had wanted us to use the metric system, there would have been 10 disciples (instead of 12). to which I reply: If God had wanted us to use Ye Olde English units there would have been 5280 commandments (instead of 10). Han also mentioned: ...the condemnations of false weight and measure in the Bible ... Here is the reference for that quote (or at least the one with which I am most familiar): Deuteronomy 25:14a You shall not have in your house two kinds of measures ... I use this to suggest that we should not have two different measuring systems in the US or in the world. Regards, Bill Hooper Keep It Simple! Make It Metric! -- ___ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup 1 cent a minute calls anywhere in the U.S.! http://www.getpennytalk.com/cgi-bin/adforward.cgi?p_key=RG9853KJurl=http://www.getpennytalk.com
[USMA:16439] RE: Dictionaries -- OFF TOPIC (was: More metric items)
My OED is the second edition (OED2), published in 1989, on CD-ROM. It includes the full text of the A-Z database, but does not include some ancillary material. It does have bicky and bikky. Jim At 12:08 PM 11/27/2001 -0800, Bill Potts wrote: Jim Elwell wrote: Presumably biccy is slang for biscuit. It's not in my OED. Is yours the SOED? From the OED Online: bicky, bikky A diminutive or affectedly childish form of BISCUIT.
[USMA:16441] RE: Dictionaries -- OFF TOPIC (was: More metric items)
I wasn't aware you guy's were going to take this subject THIS seriously How about the phrase A' hm gannin' doon the road! as something to REALLY get your teeth into?? Regards, Steve. [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Jim Elwell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 9:14 PM Subject: [USMA:16439] RE: Dictionaries -- OFF TOPIC (was: More metric items) My OED is the second edition (OED2), published in 1989, on CD-ROM. It includes the full text of the A-Z database, but does not include some ancillary material. It does have bicky and bikky. Jim At 12:08 PM 11/27/2001 -0800, Bill Potts wrote: Jim Elwell wrote: Presumably biccy is slang for biscuit. It's not in my OED. Is yours the SOED? From the OED Online: bicky, bikky A diminutive or affectedly childish form of BISCUIT.
[USMA:16440] RE: Dictionaries -- OFF TOPIC (was: More metric items)
Mine is the Concise Oxford Dictionary 10th Edition ISBN 0-19-860259-6 and it does have both bicky and bikky. Baron Carter -Original Message- From: Jim Elwell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Tuesday, 27 November, 2001 15:14 To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:16439] RE: Dictionaries -- OFF TOPIC (was: More metric items) My OED is the second edition (OED2), published in 1989, on CD-ROM. It includes the full text of the A-Z database, but does not include some ancillary material. It does have bicky and bikky. Jim At 12:08 PM 11/27/2001 -0800, Bill Potts wrote: Jim Elwell wrote: Presumably biccy is slang for biscuit. It's not in my OED. Is yours the SOED? From the OED Online: bicky, bikky A diminutive or affectedly childish form of BISCUIT.
[USMA:16442] RE: CNN-fn
Yes, it looks like the int'l feed. However since I wrote the message I looked closer into it and the -fn channel has the int'l news most of the day and after prime time while the main one has a lot less international news and very late at night. I don't know exactly the hours when they switch but I will find them out. In any case it is a good break from the ifp brainwash. A. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Bill Potts Sent: Thursday, 22 November, 2001 14:33 To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:16312] RE: CNN-fn Adrian: That is not, in fact, CNN-fn. It's the CNN International feed being carried on the CNN-fn channel. Both the CNN channel and the CNN-fn channel carry the CNN International feed for an hour or two, late at night. I think CNN-fn carries it somewhat earlier than CNN. So, all those people you see with English (and, incidentally, Australian) accents are employees of CNN International. I believe they're based in London. Like you, I enjoy the SI usage. Bill Potts, CMS Roseville, CA http://metric1.org [SI Navigator] -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Adrian Jadic Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2001 08:02 To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:16254] CNN-fn In our (cable) area CNN-fn has a high rate of metric usage. I have to confess I have not heard yet a report using ifp. The temperatures are listed as °C/°F All anchors have a british accent but when talking about their location they refer to it as here at the CNN center. I don't know if they are in Atlanta or there is another center in UK. In any case, the only digestible network on the air. Has anybody in the US noticed the same for their CNN-fn channel? If so maybe we should start writing thank you letters. Adrian -- -- ___ Sign-up for your own FREE Personalized E-mail at Mail.com http://www.mail.com/?sr=signup 1 cent a minute calls anywhere in the U.S.! http://www.getpennytalk.com/cgi-bin/adforward.cgi?p_key=RG9853KJurl=http://www.getpennytalk.com
[USMA:16443] Re: More metric items
This is a pretty astute observations of the attitude of a significant minority in Britain, John!! Especially those of a right wing persuasion who tend to read papers like 'The Telegraph' and the Daily Mail' which are not exactly paragons of balanced reporting!! They like to imagine the British Empire as a benign friendly thing that brought progress and civilisation to countries like India when in fact, they were bleeding these countries dry much like any other Empire before it!! They like to consider themselves the best in the World and sneer at others when in fact, our public services and infrastructure are now almost at third world levels and fail to realise these things are vastly superior in most other countries of Europe!! These are the people who have held this great country back for years and would rather see us slide into the gutter than admit we need the European Union!! Regards, Steve. [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: kilopascal [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 7:50 PM Subject: [USMA:16435] Re: More metric items 2001-11-27 But, I'll bet some people still think it exists. I have a feeling that those who subscribe to the BWMA in some way, shape or form still feel a strong nostalgia for the empire. Metric and Europe are seen as forces that remind Britain that the empire is dead. To counter these forces, people who have this nostalgia do everything in their power to promote English and to resist metric and the European Union. To the empirists, it is grand when the British can rule and give orders, it is defeat if the British are ruled over and take orders from some other source, especially if those sources contains elements that were in competition with the old empire, namely France and Germany. The loyalists to the empire are mostly old has-beens and young wanna be has-beens! John - Original Message - From: Stephen Davis [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 2001-11-27 13:42 Subject: [USMA:16433] Re: More metric items There's been no such thing as the British Empire for over thirty years, Jim!! Regards, Steve. [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Jim Elwell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 4:59 PM Subject: [USMA:16428] Re: More metric items I mentioned English citizen only in an informal sense. I probably meant someone who has lived or lives in England, as I do not know if digestive is used in a similar fashion in all of the British empire (i.e., Scotland, Wales, ). (If I am using British empire improperly as a synonym for United Kingdom, no doubt list members will correct me.) BTW, the package that was labeled digestive has a description of wheaten biscuits, half covered with real milk chocolate. In the interest of science, I opened the package and tried them. Very much like animal crackers with chocolate frosting. Jim At 05:01 AM 11/27/2001 -0800, Bill Potts wrote: Stephen Gallagher wrote: P.S. There is no such thing as an English citizen. People from the UK are British citizens (not British Subjects, by the way), as are people from Scotland, Wales, and Northern Ireland. You're both right and wrong. Regarding legal status, it's British citizen. However, citizen isn't exclusively a legal term and has a total of 10 definitions (OED). in the more general sense (and, in fact, the primary one), one can be an English citizen, a citizen of London, a citizen of New York, and so on. I always look on myself as a citizen of the world, although legally I'm both a British and a Canadian citizen. Bill Potts, CMS Roseville, CA http://metric1.org [SI Navigator]
[USMA:16444] Re: Depressing...
to be exact: marathon is 42.195 km How did they ever come up with such a number? It's not a conversion of 26.2 miles (and why should it be) because that would be 42.1648128 kilometeres not 42.195. But 42.195 km does give 26.2 miles when converted and properly rounded (unrounded value is 26.218757456). That suggests that the official definition of the marathon is metric and that the mile version is simply an approximate conversion from the metric version (and not the other way around). Regards, Bill Hooper Keep It Simple! Make It Metric! ).
[USMA:16445] Re: Depressing...
2001-11-27 I worked it backwards and it does come out close. 42.195/1.609344 = 26.218 757 5 miles. The miles were truncated after 1 decimal place. So, I guess in order to get it closer to the 42.195 figure, you need to round it to 26.219, which is 42.195 3 km, or 300 mm too far. But, I'm sure that error is tolerable. Since the number of digits to the right of the decimal point is 3 when stated in kilometres, it must also be 3 in miles to have the same degree of accuracy. You know, significant digits. Or you can just forget the miles all together. I'm sure no matter what the distance may be stated in miles in the press and other English writings, the IOC and other International Organisations only know it as 42.195 km and that is what they go by. John - Original Message - From: Barbara and/or Bill Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 2001-11-27 17:41 Subject: [USMA:16444] Re: Depressing... to be exact: marathon is 42.195 km How did they ever come up with such a number? It's not a conversion of 26.2 miles (and why should it be) because that would be 42.1648128 kilometeres not 42.195. But 42.195 km does give 26.2 miles when converted and properly rounded (unrounded value is 26.218757456). That suggests that the official definition of the marathon is metric and that the mile version is simply an approximate conversion from the metric version (and not the other way around). Regards, Bill Hooper Keep It Simple! Make It Metric! ).
[USMA:16446] Re: Depressing...
After some poking around I think I might have this figured out. The International Olympic Committee recognizes international sport federations (SF). These SFs set the rules. The SF governing marathons, and other track, field, and road races is the International Association of Athletics Federations (IAAF). You can log onto their website at http://www.iaaf.org/index.asp This organization sets the marathon distance as 42.195 km. The 26.2, or more correctly 26 miles 385 yards, is a historical distance and only misses the official by some 3 meters, as pointed out below. I know there are a lot of physicists on this litserver. You may find the track specs interesting; 100% SI. Go to http://www.iaaf.org/TheSport/index.asp click Techmatters and click Performance Specifications for Tracks Here is the marathon distance straight from the rule book located on the IAAF website as a PDF file: SECTION VIII - ROAD RACES RULE 240 Road Races 1. The standard distances for men and women shall be 15km, 20km, Half-Marathon, 25km, 30km, Marathon (42.195km), 100km . -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of kilopascal Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2001 3:53 PM To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:16445] Re: Depressing... 2001-11-27 I worked it backwards and it does come out close. 42.195/1.609344 = 26.218 757 5 miles. The miles were truncated after 1 decimal place. So, I guess in order to get it closer to the 42.195 figure, you need to round it to 26.219, which is 42.195 3 km, or 300 mm too far. But, I'm sure that error is tolerable. Since the number of digits to the right of the decimal point is 3 when stated in kilometres, it must also be 3 in miles to have the same degree of accuracy. You know, significant digits. Or you can just forget the miles all together. I'm sure no matter what the distance may be stated in miles in the press and other English writings, the IOC and other International Organisations only know it as 42.195 km and that is what they go by. John - Original Message - From: Barbara and/or Bill Hooper [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: U.S. Metric Association [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, 2001-11-27 17:41 Subject: [USMA:16444] Re: Depressing... to be exact: marathon is 42.195 km How did they ever come up with such a number? It's not a conversion of 26.2 miles (and why should it be) because that would be 42.1648128 kilometeres not 42.195. But 42.195 km does give 26.2 miles when converted and properly rounded (unrounded value is 26.218757456). That suggests that the official definition of the marathon is metric and that the mile version is simply an approximate conversion from the metric version (and not the other way around). Regards, Bill Hooper Keep It Simple! Make It Metric! ).
[USMA:16447] BRITISH PRIME MINISTER REGRETS ENGLAND'S ABSENCE IN EUROZONE
2001-11-28 BRITISH PRIME MINISTER REGRETS ENGLAND'S ABSENCE IN EUROZONEPrime Minister Tony Blair of Great Britain stated that England's current absence in the 12-member nation Euro zone is a "tragedy for which we all will pay the price." The tenant of Downing Street said he regretted that British citizens were missing this important "date with history" and expressed the hope that in the future opportunities would not be missed. Referring to the European Union's future expansion, Mr. Blair added that "the European Union has demonstrated and will continue to demonstrate its value. What we need are reforms."
[USMA:16448] Eurofraud
Today our Consumers Association has made public the fact that our hospitality industry is rounding up euro-prices to such an extent that they rise by 10%. For instance a hotel raised its room charges from 63.xx euro (converted from a round amount in guilders) to 70 euro! The Association has called on the public to boycott any company that abuses the coming of the euro by indulging in excessive price hikes. Han PS: Americans beware if you come to The Netherlands: our hospitality industry is hospitable for smokers only. It is in cahoots with the tobacco industry. Most pubs, cafe's etc. are smoking dens and non-smokers are simply expected to inhale ETS or stay away. That is supposed to be 'tolerance'. Many non-smokers boycott this industry.
[USMA:16449] Change to euro in Ireland
Irish Times Wednesday, 2001 November 28 Consumers will have to be vigilant In the first part of a weekly series on the euro, Mary Minihan examines fears that the imminent change will mean higher prices for shoppers With just 34 days to go until the euro notes and coins are introduced, the January sales will mark the first time many shoppers will have given serious thought to the currency. Consumer affairs organisations have spent the last year promoting the worthy message that early preparation would ensure a smooth transition from punt to euro. For most of us, it's too late for that now. The appearance of dual pricing on receipts and menus - an amusing novelty at first - was soon largely ignored by many consumers. But with E-day fast approaching, it's time to pay attention. As one inspector from the Office of the Director of Consumer Affairs tells the people he meets while promoting the euro around the country: It'll be a bit like going on holiday but not coming back. The Consumers' Association of Ireland's chief executive, Mr Dermott Jewell, said retailers and service providers should be careful of scaremongering about the euro. Customers are well capable of dealing with the changeover. This should be a very, very simple process but in a number of areas it's simply not happening that way, he said. In some cases, the changeover was being used as a sad excuse to raise prices. Mr Jewell said one patron of a Dublin city-centre pub contacted the Consumers' Association when he noticed that an average of 6p had been added to the price of most drinks. This would make things handier for the changeover to the euro, he was told. Service providers and retailers can be investigated and named and shamed but ultimately the power to stop unfair practices lies with the customer, said Mr Jewell. It's the consumer who is going to decide whether or not they want to give their business to that type of trading. Ms Pauline Mulligan, euro information officer with the Office of the Director of Consumer Affairs, said there was plenty of anecdotal evidence that prices were being raised in advance of the euro becoming legal tender in the State. People were particularly concerned that typical supermarket prices such as £1.99, £2.99, and so on would be rounded up. She said large retailers such as Dunnes Stores had told her such price tags had been phased out in recent years. She said the Office of Consumer Affairs approved of the rounding up or down of converted prices to two decimal places but not of smoothing prices to an unequal amount. The New Year was a popular time for retailers and service providers to up their prices and the introduction of the euro was not necessarily to blame, she said. People are ringing saying the price of x, y and z is going up. What we're saying is that prices will go up and that won't change with the euro coming in. Ms Mulligan said she welcomed a by-product of the changeover - the fact that consumers had become increasingly aware of prices. The Office of the Director of Consumer Affairs will investigate any situation where a consumer spots a discrepancy in price conversion. This will be the case whether or not the business in question is signed up to the voluntary national code. However, Ms Mulligan advised consumers to point out any discrepancies when and where they spot them. She mentioned the recently published survey which found that 96 per cent of dual pricing in the State was correct. Incorrect pricing was often a result of a genuine mistake, she said. One retailer had multiplied his prices by 1.27 rather than dividing by 0.787564. Others had divided by 0.79. They're reasonable mistakes to make. It's not completely off the wall. We didn't find any cases where there was a blatant attempt to rip people off. Ms Mulligan said the survey had found that the majority of staff had a working knowledge of the euro and would be well equipped to handle queries and complaints. On a seasonal note, if you're planning to take the family to a performance of the Christmas pantomime, Sleeping Beauty, in Cork Opera House next month, you will be asked to part with some rather unwieldy amounts of money for your tickets. Prices are £9.06, £10.24, £11.81 and £13.39. After the New Year, of course, these prices will convert into the more manageable 11.50, 13, 15 and 17. Last year's prices for performances of Cinderella cost £8 - £10. Next Tuesday: How will shops - and their customers - cope with the changeover? And on Friday, Business This Week 2 will examine the efforts of continental Europeans to spend undeclared currency. EURO CONTACT: Readers with queries can email [EMAIL PROTECTED] or write to Euro Queries, Irish Times, 10-16 D'Olier Street, Dublin 2. The Office of the Director of Consumer Affairs can be contacted at Lo-call 1890 220229.
