involved, anyway.
I think we violently agree on the effects and motivations for the exception, and
are getting way off-topic. ;)
cheers,
dalibor topic
, and watch Geir and the team
make Harmony rock.
till then,
dalibor topic
Absolutely. I think we've all won. Not in the way we expected, I guess, but
nevertheless, we've managed to change several important things substantially for
the better.
keep up the good work,
dalibor topic
a licensing choice that allows me
to use it (i.e. GPL-compatible in my GPL advocate case), I'd see no reason to
complain about it, or to refuse to contribute to it.
cheers,
dalibor topic
about their license choices on the internet. ;)
cheers,
dalibor topic
an exception to the GPL, that permits software under a set of open source
licenses to create derivative works. I believe that's what you meant, right?
cheers,
dalibor topic
[1] http://www.mysql.com/company/legal/licensing/foss-exception.html ... it has
the familiar As a special exception
the better one ?
we like to say more free software is not a problem :)
+1 :)
The more, the merrier.
cheers,
dalibor topic
-in.
cheers,
dalibor topic
-
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, as our experience in
Apache Harmony
with code using unspecified sun.* classes shows.
'Never again' should be the motto for IBM BEA, imho. They should let
deeds follow the open letters, and open up their
proprietary implementations.
cheers,
dalibor topic
On Tue, Aug 22, 2006 at 04:18:48PM -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
Maybe - or just declaring a patent peace or patent commons. I think
that there's nothing wrong with proprietary software, so if they want
to keep competing using it, great
Debian of maliciously
forking httpd ... I assume he was whistled back by whoever holds the
reigns on that project, as Apache didn't take legal action for all
those alleged license violations, afaik, and Debian continues to
distribute patched httpd packages, of course.
cheers,
dalibor topic
On Sun, Aug 13, 2006 at 06:34:47PM -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
First part of the problem was the JavaScript bridge, which allowed
access to sun.* code, and the second part was sun.misc.Unsafe, which
allows kicking the legs under the Java security mechanism
On Sun, Aug 13, 2006 at 06:38:13PM -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Sat, Aug 12, 2006 at 02:27:29PM -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
'Harmony - runs 100% of apps Sun does (sure it's obviously a rubbish
claim,
but you should trust us
-jre%2Ckaffe%2Cjava-gcj-compatshow_installed=onshow_vote=onwant_percent=onwant_legend=onbeenhere=1
cheers,
dalibor topic
Harmony will be great, regardless of whether the sun.* packages are
there. There will be at least one program that doesn't work because of
this (but that's been fixed
On Fri, Aug 11, 2006 at 03:11:48PM +0100, Tim Ellison wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Thu, Aug 10, 2006 at 01:35:34PM +0100, Tim Ellison wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Thu, Aug 10, 2006 at 10:27:42AM +0100, Tim Ellison wrote:
Mikhail Loenko wrote:
The problem is Base64 functionality
On Sat, Aug 12, 2006 at 08:50:42PM +0200, Jeroen Frijters wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
So if I can't run the sun.misc.Unsafe remote exploit on
Harmony it is a failure? ;)
You keep referring to this, but IMO this is a mischaracterization of the
exploit. The exploit used a bug in JavaScript
On Sat, Aug 12, 2006 at 02:27:29PM -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
'Harmony - runs 100% of apps Sun does (sure it's obviously a rubbish claim,
but you should trust us anyway on our other claims)' is not a very
compelling tag line either.
But this isn't what
on the usage of Kaffe in Venezuela, please send it
my way. Thanks for bringing this up!
cheers,
dalibor topic
My company has invested some resources on this
public-relations too, protecting our current and future position, as
well as our investment on our Java framework
To make the long
On Thu, Aug 10, 2006 at 01:35:34PM +0100, Tim Ellison wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Thu, Aug 10, 2006 at 10:27:42AM +0100, Tim Ellison wrote:
Mikhail Loenko wrote:
The problem is Base64 functionality is unavailable through the
standard API, so people have a choice either use unportable
On Thu, Aug 10, 2006 at 12:01:32PM -0400, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Thu, Aug 10, 2006 at 01:35:34PM +0100, Tim Ellison wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Thu, Aug 10, 2006 at 10:27:42AM +0100, Tim Ellison wrote:
Mikhail Loenko wrote:
The problem is Base64
, but the bug has been fixed
in Eclipse.
cheers,
dalibor topic
Thanks,
xiaofeng
-
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On Thu, May 18, 2006 at 05:05:21PM -0400, Davanum Srinivas wrote:
So where are the gifts? :)
it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing ... :)
congratulations!
cheers,
dalibor topic
-- dims
On 5/18/06, Geir Magnusson Jr [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Today is Harmony's 1st birthday
' License for the upcoming
wonderlicense at JAvaOne 2010. :)
cheers,
dalibor topic
[1]
http://groups.google.de/group/linux.debian.legal/browse_thread/thread/41c95fc0e542c5c5/cfcff8fd3e4b4d63?lnk=stq=jdk+debian-legalrnum=35hl=de#cfcff8fd3e4b4d63
geir
students.
...
Lets agree on projects here first.
Great idea.. certainly one project that seems suitable is completing
the gnuclasspathadapter stuff started by Weldon.
A fun little project could be to turn JCHVM into a jit by using tcc[1]
to create linkable objects.
cheers,
dalibor topic
[1
on this: provide a
useful exception message that helps the user figure out what
the problem is.
cheers,
dalibor topic
[1] http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath/docs/hacking.html
[2] http://forums.oracle.com/forums/thread.jspa?threadID=377599tstart=0
for a classic example
report for it on the ant bugzilla, but it gets boring
to have to patch ant to work around the VM version detection code. It
is simpler to just give it what it wants, a 1.5-ish VM. ;)
In other words, Gump is great for discovering that sort of issues.
cheers,
dalibor topic
One of my former
On Tue, Apr 04, 2006 at 09:05:04AM -0700, Matt Benson wrote:
--- Dalibor Topic [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
We'll have 1.5 support out of the box for the next
Kaffe release.
Guilhem has checked in the code, so I just need to
find some time to
make the build system work with a generified
stand. :)
cheers,
dalibor topic
On Fri, Mar 24, 2006 at 12:05:11PM -0800, Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
Leo Simons wrote:
, that that can
lead to no end of confusion over the actual license of a VM using
modules from Harmony, if the SableVM
! The world is beautiful. :-)
Excellent! Merci beaucoup!
cheers,
dalibor topic
Hmmm... Have I got something wrong?
Cheers,
Etienne
PS: Please be patient. It will probably take a little time to double
check everything before making the official license change in our
repository
suggest reusing words
off the Apache License 2.0 to do so. I can even propose some text, if
you wish me to do so.]
Is the intent that you want to be able to claim copyright on VMs linking
to Harmony's VM modules?
cheers,
dalibor topic
6- Each ICLA and Software Grant has an explicit hand
On Thu, Mar 23, 2006 at 01:12:33PM -0800, Leo Simons wrote:
Dalibor,
On Thu, Mar 23, 2006 at 09:46:16AM -0800, Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Thu, Mar 23, 2006 at 10:32:19AM -0500, Etienne Gagnon wrote:
5- The ASF provides me with an official, legally binding document,
signed by officers
On Tue, Mar 21, 2006 at 04:17:26PM +0100, Chris Gray wrote:
On Tuesday 21 March 2006 15:53, Dalibor Topic wrote:
But alas, Sun currently sees other implementations as a threat to its
business model as a proprietary Java vendor, so one has to deal with
such things until they stop having
On Mon, Mar 13, 2006 at 06:50:44PM -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
On a Harmony-unrelated side note, if you are interested in seeing your
port in the Kaffe.org CVS tree, and your contract allows for it, feel
free to send me the patch. :)
On a harmony-related
all involved parties are handling it, and working openly and honestly on a
resolution. Good work, everyone.
cheers,
dalibor topic
You brought up a claim that was at
first blush legitimate, and it was *our* decision to aggressively lock
down SVN while we sorted things out - you never made
in seeing your
port in the Kaffe.org CVS tree, and your contract allows for it, feel
free to send me the patch. :)
cheers,
dalibor topic
.
Alternatively, we could also keep codebase B locked down until we have
the paperwork for the codebase A submission, which would also be simple,
but not my favourite choice.
Finally, we could do the painful thing, but I am sure nobody needs that.
cheers,
dalibor topic
cheers,
Leo
,
dalibor topic
Runtime.java -- expected wrapper code. e.g., add VMRuntime.exit() to
Runtime.exit()
Method.java, Field.java, Constructor.java -- minor mods
System.java -- added VMSystem.setOut, setErr... etc
ThreadGroup.java -- wrappers
Class.java -- wrappers
Object.java -- wrappers
be converted to unicode using several code points, and
in that case there is nothing Java can do to 'compress' the character
to a single code point, since such a code point does not exist in unicode.
cheers,
dalibor topic
-Original Message-
From: Richard Liang [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent
hand, the specs also give you a lot of leeway
to do the right thing efficiently, without having to explicitely mimic
the RI. :)
cheers,
dalibor topic
Obviously since Japi is Free Software I can't prevent others from making a
version that does this, but I hope I've shown why I think it would
fast.
Also note that Charva is licensed under the LGPL license, which is
currently not allowed by the Apache board to be used by any Harmony
component, so you'd have to write it from scratch, or persuade the board
to change the policy.
cheers,
dalibor topic
--
Thorbj?rn
Geir Magnusson Jr geir at pobox.com writes:
I can say this as I am a victim of the same thing...
My apologies, all the naming mistakes are mine. :(
cheers,
dalibor topic
year.
That's no longer the case, and no code is forcibly bundled any more. The code
that was forcibly bundled was not open source, and therefore unaccaptable for
Harmony anyway. In other words, we'll have to implement everything.
cheers,
dalibor topic
free software, you, personally, can ship a subset of Apache
Harmony code, unless you've got a contract with Sun that prevents you from doing
that. BCL, JRL, SCSL, or whatever else they have to prevent you from shipping
subsets. If in doubt, ask your lawyer.
cheers,
dalibor topic
switching over to the next best proprietary
Java-like platform, once Whidbey is dominant, and leaving Java behind them on
their CVs.
cheers,
dalibor topic
without proof to the contrary.
The 1.6 beta license has a lot of other nice, comical gems, and is a wonderful
piece in the finest tradition of the earlier works from the same software
license publishing house. Use with care, avoid excessive exposure, etc.
cheers,
dalibor topic
model is not designed for that at all, etc. In order to do it somewhat
sensibly, you need isolates, and isolates are having their winter sleep at this
point, judging by the JSR mailing list activity (none in past two months).
Yay JCP! :)
cheers,
dalibor topic
eclipse jars is an issue, we'll just have to write a new Apache
Licensed compiler to go with Harmony, even though we may prefer to use something
else for development.
cheers,
dalibor topic
deployments of the application.
cheers,
dalibor topic
[1] http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/classpath/2005-08/msg00033.html
[2].
cheers,
dalibor topic
[1] And for some odd reason tomcat 4.1.31 binary relase tarball doesn't
seem to mention BCL anywhere, despite having lots of com.sun.* classes
in the various jars, which makes sanitizing it so painful: one needs
to look into every single JAR to figure out
emulating native widgets, or defining one's own widget set. Both are
choices with their own tradeoffs.
cheers,
dalibor topic
out the precise legal status of their
contracts/NDAs/obligations is up to contributors, and whoever they have
contracts with to figure out.
cheers,
dalibor topic
license it, though. But if we are writing compilers
from scratch, then a ML dialect would be a pretty nice implementation
language choice. See
http://www.cs.princeton.edu/~appel/papers/cmljava.html for details.
cheers,
dalibor topic
geir
On Mon, Feb 13, 2006 at 11:44:46AM -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Mon, Feb 13, 2006 at 11:01:57AM -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr wrote:
We need one.
I assume we'd want to do something like the launcher that invokes the VM
and then just executes the eclipse compiler
to determine them. ;)
cheers,
dalibor topic
more free code out there.
cheers,
dalibor topic
, please. It's unlikely that many gcj developers will be
able to help you if you ask your questions about one project in another
one. :)
cheers,
dalibor topic
tia,
.V
(Mostly to see if my app works and how close is javaws (JNLP browser
plugin. Allegedly it's at 98%).
Dalibor Topic
with packaging decisions, than to try
to provide packages for the various platforms on Kaffe.org.
cheers,
dalibor topic
Regards,
Tim
netsql wrote:
Where can I find Kaffe, ClassPath or Harmony download for windoze plz?
tia,
.V
--
Tim Ellison ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
IBM Java
implementation's comments
are two pairs of shoes, and they do not have to be the same thing. In
practice, I assume that they often enough are, as I'd doubt that formal
methods have made huge inroads into J2SE specification development yet,
unfortunately.
cheers,
dalibor topic
APIs integrated with the implementation. But that
could suffer from a long term maintainance problem if it was not part of
a JCP effort. And if it was, it would not be free, so it would not
really be useful. Catch 22. :)
cheers,
dalibor topic
Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
Zsejki Sorin Miklós wrote:
I have absolutely no experience with such things, but I'm wondering how
was this done with Tomcat, for example. They have the servlet API built
from their source code, and the javadoc seems to be word by word
Tim Ellison wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
Agreed -- and if we agree on using OSGi bundles as the technology for
generic class library interop then I think we simply need to agree on
the small number of non-JSE API dependencies between the bundles to
allow for component interop.
+lots:)
I'm
Tim Ellison wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
Just to be clear, the kernel classes are VM-dependent types that are not
typically reusable since the VM typically will 'know' the shape of the
class/instances. I think it is useful to minimize that set.
Yeah, I think we were talking past each
On Mon, Dec 05, 2005 at 05:59:53AM -0800, Leo Simons wrote:
On Sun, Dec 04, 2005 at 06:53:08PM -0800, Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Sun, Dec 04, 2005 at 01:52:32PM -0600, Archie Cobbs wrote:
Conclusion being: if it's the merely legality that concerns ASF,
then they should already be happy
, and
merging things too early would eliminate the advantage of being able to
appeal to initially different audiences.
cheers,
dalibor topic
geir
On Dec 5, 2005, at 8:38 AM, Leo Simons wrote:
On Sun, Dec 04, 2005 at 01:52:32PM -0600, Archie Cobbs wrote:
Conclusion being: if it's the merely
On Mon, Dec 05, 2005 at 08:41:10AM -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On Dec 4, 2005, at 11:59 PM, Dalibor Topic wrote:
[SNIP]
On Sun, Dec 04, 2005 at 02:13:30PM -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On Dec 4, 2005, at 12:38 PM, Anthony Green wrote:
Whether or not you make a distinction
limiting proprietary modifications in Apache projects.
I am looking forward to seeing your contributions in form of patches to
various Apache.org projects. Talk is cheap, right? So do show us the
code, please.
cheers,
dalibor topic
[1] from http://java.sun.com/j2se/1.5.0/jdk-1_5_0-license.txt
3
+linking exception licensed
bits in there, if that would help cut any armchair lawyering short.
cheers,
dalibor topic
to be
consolidated, and we need to start building some test snaps, as Geir
proposed, for gump and people to play with.
cheers,
dalibor topic
- LSD
gcc-compiled
binaries of Harmony. Someone tell the httpd guys to raise it at legal-discuss.
If not, we'll have to create yet another licensing bridge and it will
take some more time, that's all.
+1.
cheers,
dalibor topic
On Sat, Dec 03, 2005 at 02:19:15PM -0500, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On Dec 3, 2005, at 12:01 PM, Dalibor Topic wrote:
I'd like to see the ASF allow use of code under the GPL+linking
exception
as well, as that is necessary for the Apache httpd builds made
using gcc
Anthony Green wrote:
On Thu, 2005-12-01 at 10:47 -0800, Dalibor Topic wrote:
Yup. I think dual licensing with the LGPL should be sufficient for
that to happen,
and get us rolling forward in that aspect as well.
Rather than dual license the code, maybe switching to LGPL+exception
would
;-)
If in doubt, I'd chose spending my time with my girlfriend over license
wrangling, as software licenses are so damn boring, whereas my girlfriend
is just wonderful. One has to have his priorities in life ... :)
cheers,
dalibor topic
, specific solutions, sooner
rather than later.
cheers,
dalibor topic
.V
hope it'll
be under the christmas tree) I hope to push forward om some of that.
Thanks, Leo and Mark!
cheers,
dalibor topic
LSD
Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On Nov 14, 2005, at 3:18 PM, Dalibor Topic wrote:
On Mon, Nov 14, 2005 at 09:57:48AM -0500, Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
Leo Simons wrote:
Rant below. Decided not to tone it down.
Leo++
+1 from me, too. sounds like an excellent way to shoot oneself
happen, as it'd force the ASF to play arbiter in disputes that don't
exist.
cheers,
dalibor topic
--
Stefano.
,
dalibor topic
--
David N. Welton
- http://www.dedasys.com/davidw/
Linux, Open Source Consulting
- http://www.dedasys.com/
more automated ways of
partitioning libraries into separate, coupled artefacts. I've heard on
the classpath list, that such tools exist[1], but it seems that I've my
google skills are not good enough to locate them :)
cheers,
dalibor topic
[1] http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/classpath/2005-10
is incompatible with the
ASL.
Licenses in real, printed books?
I've only got three words: first sale doctrine.
cheers,
dalibor topic
Leo Simons wrote:
Whoohooh! An actual vi-vs-emacs discussion! Now we are *really* getting
started!
ed is the one true editor.
cheers,
dalibor topic,
patiently awaiting the first ruby on rails vs. java discussion on this
list :)
inttypes.h and stdint.h. That's what Kaffe does for jni_md.h, and I
really need to get the patch up into GNU classpath before the next
release. there is a wrapper autoconf macro for older systems on
ac-archive.
cheers,
dalibor topic
Tom
involved (copyright law, scenes-a-faire, copyrightability, is my
code really my own, do we have any clue about the pedigree of the code
at hand) can be pretty harmful to a $BIGCORP's bottom line, see SCO vs.
The World. [1]
cheers,
dalibor topic
[1] http://perens.com/Articles/SCO/SCOSlideShow.html
, and get a signed
agreement.
cheers,
dalibor topic
the group of porters
OK. File a bug in the JIRA, and someone will see to it. :)
There was someone attempting a port at
http://www.cygwin.com/ml/bug-glibc/2001-09/msg00053.html and afaict
there is a sf.net project of the kind.
cheers,
dalibor topic
a long way ahead.
cheers,
dalibor topic
people on more academic platforms to
override them for their specific needs (for example, when they have a
barebone system).
cheers,
dalibor topic
On Wed, Sep 07, 2005 at 10:19:24PM +0200, Mail Delivery Subsystem wrote:
From: Dalibor Topic [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: harmony-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: Classpath .18 release
Mark Wielaard wrote:
OT: Is there any way to run Java apps for Sony PSP? XBOX 360?
There might
.
The numbers look better in HEAD in part since the generics branch and
HEAD are synced up irregularly, and haven't been synced up in a while.
cheers,
dalibor topic
the
reuse of bits and chunks of Harmony in GPLd projects as well.
cheers,
dalibor topic
part is GTK only, so even with using things like
gtk-win32 it adds an extra layer in between.
Yeah. That should be easy enough to replace though, using a different
peer implementation. Someone just needs to write them.
cheers,
dalibor topic
Steve Blackburn wrote:
Dalibor Topic wrote:
Many people don't see the need to look at non-free software in
general, and chances are pretty slim that anyone I know will ever get
that bored and out of reading material to accept the 'Read only'
license, for an example of a very funny non-free
Dalibor Topic wrote:
[hot stuff]
Holy cow, with a bit of hindsight, that was one little emotional
firebrand speech without harmonic undertones. I am afraid I pressed the
send button way too soon, so sorry about that, and I hope to avoid
turning the list into a legal speculative fest. After
class loader.
+1 to that, too.
cheers,
dalibor topic
, as
for these afaik no free software equivalents exist yet.
cheers,
dalibor topic
threats to their status. If that is an itch
you need to scratch, get in touch with *them* and get it fixed, as they
are the only ones who can.
cheers,
dalibor topic
On Sun, Jun 05, 2005 at 06:20:37AM -0300, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On Jun 3, 2005, at 6:39 PM, Dalibor Topic wrote:
That's a rather weird thing to standardise, being the internals of
a binding
between the library and the VM, and necessarily something that is
in flux, as
VMs
On Sun, Jun 05, 2005 at 02:20:53PM -0300, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On Jun 5, 2005, at 1:45 PM, Sven de Marothy wrote:
On Sun, 2005-06-05 at 06:25 -0300, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
On Jun 4, 2005, at 12:59 PM, Sven de Marothy wrote:
AFAIK there are
no other class libraries out there
that an independant effort like this one can help spot and
prevent such mistakes to happen in the future, and that can only be good
for the quality of the platform.
cheers,
dalibor topic
or anything esle.
cheers,
dalibor topic
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