Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Tom, Put it underground, most of the noise from a diesel is engine noise, build a little cement bunker it will make it great for winter use (easy starting and less gelling). Luke From: Thomas Kelly [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Date: Wed, 28 Jun 2006 09:38:30 -0400 Mike, I have a concern about noise from a generator. I live in a rural area closest neighbor is about .3 mi away. I live here because I like peace and quiet. I sometimes sit in the garden and listen to the caterpillars eating leaves on my trees. The friend who's offering the VW engine has a 12 or 15KW Changfa ... it's loud!!! My thinking is to build a small generator house into a slope on my property line the inside with foam or something to deaden the sound . muffler on the exhaust. The idea is to keep the heat on and the well pump going when there's an interuption in power. I'd like the energy for processing BD to come from a generator run on BD. I think solar will be part of my energy future (not including the plant middle man I already rely on). With improvements in batteries and inverters, it would seem possible to add PV arrays to supplement the diesel generator, and eventually take over. I know little about generators, PV arrays, batteries or inverters, but at this time last year I hadn't made anything bigger than 1L batches of BD, had never driven a diesel car, and knew nothing about nozzles, electrodes, or even what the little door on my furnace were for. A lot can happen in a year. Tom - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 9:25 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GM alternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easily run a 200 amp, or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect it would handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it is noisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mike ason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* biofuel mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
You can rewind those old GM small frames for more juice - I picked it because I had a friend with and old one and as a one-time mechanic I'm familiar with them. There is a ton of stuff on the web re HO alternators if you are after DC. For AC, I would go with a decent genset - the ones they sell at Northern and Harbour Freight seem to fry after awhile - not sure they are designed for long continuous use. -Mike -Mike Zeke Yewdall wrote: On sound deadening, it is amazing how much sound comes out of the Intake of the VW engines (in addition to the exhaust which is the obvious place that most people take). On my rabbit, I've got a short 3 diameter pipe going into the air cleaner (which is built into the intake manifold), and it's pretty loud. The stock intake is designed to muffle the sound more (and also cuts a bit of power out -- it accelerates noticeably faster with the new short wide intake pipe). The water cooled engine jacket will cut down on some of the sound compared to an air cooled diesel, but still, putting it in a underground shed might be a good idea. This is one reason I am a big fan of PV vs biodiesel generators -- places where I want power, you can't even hear a car within a few miles, so I don't want to be listening to a droning generator.Snow also makes a great sound deadener. Seriously, 100 yards of snow covered conifers can deaden even an air cooled lawnmower engine down to nothing Of course, that time of year is when you don't get any sun for the PV's either On 6/28/06, *Jason Katie* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: the majority of gm parts from the early 50's to the mid 80's were standardized (except buick) so if you are in the boneyard sometime, fancy a look into buying another alternator to experiment with. you can change these mid 80s alternators just about any way you want, i had one with a variable control field, that would output whatever voltage i wanted depending on how i set the field feed. very versatile equipment those alternators. Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, June 28, 2006 9:24 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator It's a rebuilt small frame from an 80's diesel caddy Jason Katie wrote: how old of a gm alternator? you could bypass the diode set and get unregulated AC out of it anyway. Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 8:25 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GM alternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easily run a 200 amp, or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect it would handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it is noisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mike ason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* biofuel mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Take it! Thomas Kelly wrote: Mindy, Waddya mean the Lister is the noisiest generator? I listened to one the other day Chug - Chuga - Chug - Chuga . I thought I was listening to the rhythm section of a band. You think I ought to pass on a Lister? Too noisy? Tom - Original Message - *From:* Thompson, Mark L. (PNB RD) mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Wednesday, June 28, 2006 2:41 PM *Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator In Alaska we had a 2 cylinder 4Kw Lister. The absolute nosiest generator in creation. But it did run for 20 years 12h/day 6m/year without a problem. In our case we took a 55 gallon drum. placed a divider in it, and filled it with gavel, and buried it in the ground. The divider had holes cut into it at the bottom. The exhaust went in one Bung - Down to bottom - back up the other side - and then into the stack. It worked great as a muffler. We built a small building to house it and used 1' layer sod/tundra to insulate the building walls. Mindy *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Kirk McLoren *Sent:* Wednesday, June 28, 2006 11:17 AM *To:* biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Dont forget to mount the motor on vibration damper. Also consider cooling flow and combustion air. Sound studios use labyrinths/baffles on air conditioning Kirk */Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]/* wrote: I have mine in a shed - boat shops have sound-deadening material. Zeke is the guy to ask about plans and how it should fit together... Thomas Kelly wrote: Mike, I have a concern about noise from a generator. I live in a rural area closest neighbor is about .3 mi away. I live here because I like peace and quiet. I sometimes sit in the garden and listen to the caterpillars eating leaves on my trees. The friend who's offering the VW engine has a 12 or 15KW Changfa ... it's loud!!! My thinking is to build a small generator house into a slope on my property line the inside with foam or something to deaden the sound . muffler on the exhaust. The idea is to keep the heat on and the well pump going when there's an interuption in power. I'd like the energy for processing BD to come from a generator run on BD. I think solar will be part of my energy future (not including the plant middle man I already rely on). With improvements in batteries and inverters, it would seem possible to add PV arrays to supplement the diesel generator, and eventually take over. I know little about generators, PV arrays, batteries or inverters, but at this time last year I hadn't made anything bigger than 1L batches of BD, had never driven a diesel car, and knew nothing about nozzles, electrodes, or even what the little door on my furnace were for. A lot can happen in a year. Tom - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver To: Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 9:25 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GM alternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easily run a 200 amp, or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect it would handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it is noisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mike ason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly *To:* biofuel *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Doug, Jason Katie, Mike and Zeke, Thanks for the replies. -The engine can be used to power a generator -Even if I don't use it that way, it has value "... can pretty much bolt into any VW, diesel or gas, made between 1977 and 1996 or thereabouts." How about a Passat or a Beetle? At 6'3" I barely fit into a Rabbit ... Jetta's aren't much better. I wish I had even a thimble full of what you guys know about engines/generators/things mechanical ... don't ever underestimatethe value of such knowledge. Thanks again, Tom - Original Message - From: lres1 To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 11:56 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Very rough, 48Hp close to 30Kw at 4,000 plus. At 1,800 is about 12Kw minus Power factor = about 9Kw useable at low revs on multi pole generator. The engine should not glaze at that and if kept close to a reasonable load at 4 to 5 Kw then you could have a happy genset that should last a very long time. I run Deutz units which are horrible for prices on parts. My very quick and rough and ready calcs. Doug - Original Message - From: Thomas Kelly To: biofuel Sent: Wednesday, June 28, 2006 7:34 AM Subject: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested ingetting adiesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom Information from NOD32 This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System for Linux Mail Servers.- is OKpart000.txt - is OKpart001.htm - is OKpart001.txt - is OKhttp://www.eset.com-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Lao Telecom MailScanner with NOD32, and is believed to be clean. ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ Information from NOD32 This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System for Linux Mail Servers. - is OK part000.txt - is OK part001.htm - is OK part001.txt - is OKhttp://www.eset.com Information from NOD32 This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System for Linux Mail Servers.part000.txt - is OKpart001.htm - is OKhttp://www.eset.com-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Lao Telecom MailScanner with NOD32, and is believed to be clean. ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Mike, I have a concern about noise from a generator. I live in a rural area closest neighbor is about .3 mi away. I live here because I like peace and quiet. I sometimes sit in the garden and listen to the caterpillars eating leaves on my trees. The friend who's offering the VW engine has a 12 or 15KW Changfa ... it's loud!!! My thinking is to build a small generator house into a slope on my property line the inside with foam or something to deaden the sound . muffler on the exhaust. The idea is to keep the heat on and the well pump going when there's an interuption in power. I'd like the energy for processing BD to come from a generator run on BD. I think solar will be part of my energy future (not including the plant middle man I already rely on). With improvements in batteries and inverters, it would seem possible to add PV arrays to supplement the diesel generator, and eventually take over. I know little about generators, PV arrays, batteries or inverters, but at this time last year I hadn't made anything bigger than 1L batches of BD, had never driven a diesel car, and knew nothing about nozzles, electrodes, or even what the little door on my furnace were for. A lot can happen in a year. Tom - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 9:25 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GM alternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easily run a 200 amp, or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect it would handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it is noisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mike ason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* biofuel mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
I have mine in a shed - boat shops have sound-deadening material. Zeke is the guy to ask about plans and how it should fit together... Thomas Kelly wrote: Mike, I have a concern about noise from a generator. I live in a rural area closest neighbor is about .3 mi away. I live here because I like peace and quiet. I sometimes sit in the garden and listen to the caterpillars eating leaves on my trees. The friend who's offering the VW engine has a 12 or 15KW Changfa ... it's loud!!! My thinking is to build a small generator house into a slope on my property line the inside with foam or something to deaden the sound . muffler on the exhaust. The idea is to keep the heat on and the well pump going when there's an interuption in power. I'd like the energy for processing BD to come from a generator run on BD. I think solar will be part of my energy future (not including the plant middle man I already rely on). With improvements in batteries and inverters, it would seem possible to add PV arrays to supplement the diesel generator, and eventually take over. I know little about generators, PV arrays, batteries or inverters, but at this time last year I hadn't made anything bigger than 1L batches of BD, had never driven a diesel car, and knew nothing about nozzles, electrodes, or even what the little door on my furnace were for. A lot can happen in a year. Tom - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 9:25 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GM alternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easily run a 200 amp, or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect it would handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it is noisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mike ason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* biofuel mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
It's a rebuilt small frame from an 80's diesel caddy Jason Katie wrote: how old of a gm alternator? you could bypass the diode set and get unregulated AC out of it anyway. Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 8:25 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GM alternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easily run a 200 amp, or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect it would handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it is noisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mike ason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* biofuel mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Zeke, "You don't want to run it at too low of power though, or it won't run hot enough, and efficiency will go down, stuff will get carbonned up, and such. Sort of like cars that are always used for short run errands." I seem to recall something about "cold stacking"? If the engine doesn't run at 25%+ --- problems. Is this what you're referring to? (I gotta spend some time in the archives) Tom - Original Message - From: Zeke Yewdall To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 9:24 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Yeah, I'd rig up several generators to it. Or better yet, you can buy 10 - 20kW generators from northerntool.com which are meant to be driven off of PTO's from tractors. If you are running the rabbit engine at a nice 1,800 or 2,000 rpm instead of redlined at 4,500 where the 48 hp is measured, it should be alot happier long term, and still provide somewhere around 20 horsepower -- or about 15kW (maybe more like 12kW if you count inefficiency). You don't want to run it at too low of power though, or it won't run hot enough, and efficiency will go down, stuff will get carbonned up, and such. Sort of like cars that are always used for short run errands.Zeke ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Don't bother putting it in a vanagon, tho' Zeke Yewdall wrote: Yeah, Mike's got a point. It'll pretty much bolt into any volkswagen, diesel or gas, made between 1977 and 1996 or thereabouts. If it's a good engine, you might be able to find an old VW jetta with a toasted engine, drop it in, and have a biodiesel car. On 6/27/06, *Mike Weaver* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Take the motor anyway! Is it any good? It'll fit a lot cars. Thomas Kelly wrote: Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Dont forget to mount the motor on vibration damper. Also consider cooling flow and combustion air. Sound studios use labyrinths/baffles on air conditioning KirkMike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have mine in a shed - boat shops have sound-deadening material.Zeke is the guy to ask about plans and how it should fit together...Thomas Kelly wrote:Mike, I have a concern about noise from a generator. I live in a rural area closest neighbor is about .3 mi away. I live here because I like peace and quiet. I sometimes sit in the garden and listen to the caterpillars eating leaves on my trees. The friend who's offering the VW engine has a 12 or 15KW Changfa ... it's loud!!! My thinking is to build a small "generator house" into a slope on my property line the inside with foam or something to deaden the sound . muffler on the exhaust. The idea is to keep the heat on and the well pump going when there's an interuption in power. I'd like the energy for processing BD to come from a generator run on BD. I think solar will be part of my energy future (not including the plant "middle man" I already rely on). With improvements in batteries and inverters, it would seem possible to add PV arrays to supplement the diesel generator, and eventually take over. I know little about generators, PV arrays, batteries or inverters, but at this time last year I hadn't made anything bigger than 1L batches of BD, had never driven a diesel car, and knew nothing about nozzles, electrodes, or even what the "little door" on my furnace were for. A lot can happen in a year. Tom- Original Message - From: "Mike Weaver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: <BIOFUEL@SUSTAINABLELISTS.ORG>Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 9:25 PMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GMalternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easilyrun a 200 amp,or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect itwould handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it isnoisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural.-Mikeason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe?JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>(mostlikely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> *To:* biofuel <mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBi
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
In Alaska we had a 2 cylinder 4Kw Lister. The absolute nosiest generator in creation. But it did run for 20 years 12h/day 6m/year without a problem. In our case we took a 55 gallon drum. placed a divider in it, and filled it with gavel, and buried it in the ground. The divider had holes cut into it at the bottom. The exhaust went in one Bung - Down to bottom - back up the other side - and then into the stack. It worked great as a muffler. We built a small building to house it and used 1' layer sod/tundra to insulate the building walls. Mindy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kirk McLorenSent: Wednesday, June 28, 2006 11:17 AMTo: biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Dont forget to mount the motor on vibration damper. Also consider cooling flow and combustion air. Sound studios use labyrinths/baffles on air conditioning KirkMike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have mine in a shed - boat shops have sound-deadening material.Zeke is the guy to ask about plans and how it should fit together...Thomas Kelly wrote:Mike, I have a concern about noise from a generator. I live in a rural area closest neighbor is about .3 mi away. I live here because I like peace and quiet. I sometimes sit in the garden and listen to the caterpillars eating leaves on my trees. The friend who's offering the VW engine has a 12 or 15KW Changfa ... it's loud!!! My thinking is to build a small "generator house" into a slope on my property line the inside with foam or something to deaden the sound . muffler on the exhaust. The idea is to keep the heat on and the well pump going when there's an interuption in power. I'd like the energy for processing BD to come from a generator run on BD. I think solar will be part of my energy future (not including the plant "middle man" I already rely on). With improvements in batteries and inverters, it would seem possible to add PV arrays to supplement the diesel generator, and eventually take over. I know little about generators, PV arrays, batteries or inverters, but at this time last year I hadn't made anything bigger than 1L batches of BD, had never driven a diesel car, and knew nothing about nozzles, electrodes, or even what the "little door" on my furnace were for. A lot can happen in a year. Tom- Original Message - From: "Mike Weaver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: <BIOFUEL@SUSTAINABLELISTS.ORG>Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 9:25 PMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GMalternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easilyrun a 200 amp,or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect itwould handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it isnoisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural.-Mikeason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe?JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <MAILTO:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>(mostlikely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly <MAILTO:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> *To:* biofuel <MAILTO:BIOFUEL@SUSTAINABLELISTS.ORG> *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journe
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Mindy,
Waddya mean the Lister is the
noisiest generator?
I listened to one the other day Chug -
Chuga - Chug - Chuga . I thought I was listening tothe rhythm
section of a band.
You thinkI ought to
pass on a Lister? Too noisy?
Tom
- Original Message -
From:
Thompson,
Mark L. (PNB RD)
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Wednesday, June 28, 2006 2:41
PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power
a generator
In Alaska we had a 2 cylinder 4Kw Lister. The absolute
nosiest generator in creation.
But it did run for 20 years 12h/day 6m/year without a
problem.
In
our case we took a 55 gallon drum. placed a divider in it, and filled it with
gavel, and buried it in the ground.
The
divider had holes cut into it at the bottom.
The
exhaust went in one Bung - Down to bottom - back up the other side - and then
into the stack.
It
worked great as a muffler.
We
built a small building to house it and used 1' layer sod/tundra to insulate
the building walls.
Mindy
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kirk
McLorenSent: Wednesday, June 28, 2006 11:17 AMTo:
biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSubject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to
power a generator
Dont forget to mount the motor on vibration damper. Also consider cooling
flow and combustion air. Sound studios use labyrinths/baffles on air
conditioning
KirkMike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
I
have mine in a shed - boat shops have sound-deadening material.Zeke
is the guy to ask about plans and how it should fit
together...Thomas Kelly wrote:Mike, I have a
concern about noise from a generator. I live in a rural area
closest neighbor is about .3 mi away. I live here because I like peace
and quiet. I sometimes sit in the garden and listen to the
caterpillars eating leaves on my trees. The friend who's
offering the VW engine has a 12 or 15KW Changfa ... it's
loud!!! My thinking is to build a small "generator house" into a
slope on my property line the inside with foam or something to
deaden the sound . muffler on the exhaust. The idea is to keep
the heat on and the well pump going when there's an interuption in
power. I'd like the energy for processing BD to come from a
generator run on BD. I think solar will be part of my energy future
(not including the plant "middle man" I already rely on). With
improvements in batteries and inverters, it would seem possible to
add PV arrays to supplement the diesel generator, and eventually
take over. I know little about generators, PV arrays, batteries or
inverters, but at this time last year I hadn't made anything bigger
than 1L batches of BD, had never driven a diesel car, and knew
nothing about nozzles, electrodes, or even what the "little door" on
my furnace were for. A lot can happen in a year.
Tom- Original Message - From: "Mike Weaver"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: <BIOFUEL@SUSTAINABLELISTS.ORG>Sent:
Tuesday, June 27, 2006 9:25 PMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to
power a generator I have a 4.7
HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GMalternator
- I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easilyrun a
200 amp,or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC
current. I expect itwould handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't
use much fuel but it isnoisy - needs to be in a shed unless you
are rural.-Mikeason
Katie wrote: maybe rig
up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain
maybe?JasonICQ#:
154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
<MAILTO:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>(mostlikely to get
me) - Original Message
- *From:* Thomas Kelly
<MAILTO:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> *To:* biofuel
<MAILTO:BIOFUEL@SUSTAINABLELISTS.ORG> *Sent:* Tuesday, June
27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a
generator Hello all, I'm
interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has
offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would
be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I
was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would
be appreciated. Tom
___ Biofuel
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Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
(50,000 messages):
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No virus fou
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
the majority of gm parts from the early 50's to the mid 80's were standardized (except buick) so if you are in the boneyard sometime, fancy a look into buying another alternator to experiment with. you can change these mid 80s alternators just about any way you want, i had one with a variable control field, that would output whatever voltage i wanted depending on how i set the field feed. very versatile equipment those alternators. Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Wednesday, June 28, 2006 9:24 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator It's a rebuilt small frame from an 80's diesel caddy Jason Katie wrote: how old of a gm alternator? you could bypass the diode set and get unregulated AC out of it anyway. Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 8:25 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GM alternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easily run a 200 amp, or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect it would handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it is noisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mike ason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* biofuel mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/377 - Release Date: 6/27/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/377 - Release Date: 6/27/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
On sound deadening, it is amazing how much sound comes out of the Intake of the VW engines (in addition to the exhaust which is the obvious place that most people take). On my rabbit, I've got a short 3 diameter pipe going into the air cleaner (which is built into the intake manifold), and it's pretty loud. The stock intake is designed to muffle the sound more (and also cuts a bit of power out -- it accelerates noticeably faster with the new short wide intake pipe). The water cooled engine jacket will cut down on some of the sound compared to an air cooled diesel, but still, putting it in a underground shed might be a good idea. This is one reason I am a big fan of PV vs biodiesel generators -- places where I want power, you can't even hear a car within a few miles, so I don't want to be listening to a droning generator. Snow also makes a great sound deadener. Seriously, 100 yards of snow covered conifers can deaden even an air cooled lawnmower engine down to nothing Of course, that time of year is when you don't get any sun for the PV's either On 6/28/06, Jason Katie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: the majority of gm parts from the early 50's to the mid 80's werestandardized (except buick) so if you are in the boneyard sometime, fancy alook into buying another alternator to experiment with. you can change these mid 80s alternators just about any way you want, i had one with a variablecontrol field, that would output whatever voltage i wanted depending on howi set the field feed. very versatile equipment those alternators. JasonICQ#:154998177MSN:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me)- Original Message -From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Wednesday, June 28, 2006 9:24 AMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator It's a rebuilt small frame from an 80's diesel caddy Jason Katie wrote:how old of a gm alternator? you could bypass the diode set and getunregulated AC out of it anyway. JasonICQ#:154998177MSN:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me)- Original Message -From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]To: biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 8:25 PMSubject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GMalternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it.I think it would easily run a 200 amp,or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current.I expect itwould handle 3000 - 4000 watts.It doesn't use much fuel but it isnoisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mikeason Katie wrote:maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it?use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe?JasonICQ#:154998177MSN:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mostlikely to get me)- Original Message -*From:* Thomas Kelly mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]*To:* biofuel mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org*Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generatorHello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend hasoffered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was lookingat 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated.Tom ___Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date:6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/--No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus
[Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Hello all, I'm interested ingetting adiesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - From: Thomas Kelly To: biofuel Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM Subject: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested ingetting adiesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Yeah, I'd rig up several generators to it. Or better yet, you can buy 10 - 20kW generators from northerntool.com which are meant to be driven off of PTO's from tractors. If you are running the rabbit engine at a nice 1,800 or 2,000 rpm instead of redlined at 4,500 where the 48 hp is measured, it should be alot happier long term, and still provide somewhere around 20 horsepower -- or about 15kW (maybe more like 12kW if you count inefficiency). You don't want to run it at too low of power though, or it won't run hot enough, and efficiency will go down, stuff will get carbonned up, and such. Sort of like cars that are always used for short run errands. ZekeOn 6/27/06, Jason Katie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? JasonICQ#: 154998177MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - From: Thomas Kelly To: biofuel Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM Subject: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested ingetting adiesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006___ Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Take the motor anyway! Is it any good? It'll fit a lot cars. Thomas Kelly wrote: Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Yeah, Mike's got a point. It'll pretty much bolt into any volkswagen, diesel or gas, made between 1977 and 1996 or thereabouts. If it's a good engine, you might be able to find an old VW jetta with a toasted engine, drop it in, and have a biodiesel car. On 6/27/06, Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Take the motor anyway!Is it any good?It'll fit a lot cars.Thomas Kelly wrote: Hello all,I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP.Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GM alternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easily run a 200 amp, or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect it would handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it is noisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mike ason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* biofuel mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
how old of a gm alternator? you could bypass the diode set and get unregulated AC out of it anyway. Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, June 27, 2006 8:25 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator I have a 4.7 HP Changfa I've been happy with - it runs a 100 amp GM alternator - I get about 1200 watts out of it. I think it would easily run a 200 amp, or just buy a genset from Grainger if you want AC current. I expect it would handle 3000 - 4000 watts. It doesn't use much fuel but it is noisy - needs to be in a shed unless you are rural. -Mike ason Katie wrote: maybe rig up 2 or 3 generators to it? use a heavy motorcycle chain maybe? Jason ICQ#: 154998177 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (most likely to get me) - Original Message - *From:* Thomas Kelly mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* biofuel mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Tuesday, June 27, 2006 7:34 PM *Subject:* [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested in getting a diesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.9.5/376 - Release Date: 6/26/2006 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator
Very rough, 48Hp close to 30Kw at 4,000 plus. At 1,800 is about 12Kw minus Power factor = about 9Kw useable at low revs on multi pole generator. The engine should not glaze at that and if kept close to a reasonable load at 4 to 5 Kw then you could have a happy genset that should last a very long time. I run Deutz units which are horrible for prices on parts. My very quick and rough and ready calcs. Doug - Original Message - From: Thomas Kelly To: biofuel Sent: Wednesday, June 28, 2006 7:34 AM Subject: [Biofuel] VW Diesel to power a generator Hello all, I'm interested ingetting adiesel generator. A friend has offered me a VW Rabbit diesel engine (48HP) and says it would be great to power a generator. It seems a bit overkill. I was looking at 4 - 6 HP. Guidance here would be appreciated. Tom Information from NOD32 This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System for Linux Mail Servers.- is OKpart000.txt - is OKpart001.htm - is OKpart001.txt - is OKhttp://www.eset.com-- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Lao Telecom MailScanner with NOD32, and is believed to be clean. ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ Information from NOD32 This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System for Linux Mail Servers. - is OK part000.txt - is OK part001.htm - is OK part001.txt - is OKhttp://www.eset.com Information from NOD32 This message was checked by NOD32 Antivirus System for Linux Mail Servers. part000.txt - is OK part001.htm - is OK http://www.eset.com -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by Lao Telecom MailScanner with NOD32, and is believed to be clean. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hi Joe Ok Keith; Thanks for the welcome. You're welcome. :-) Sorry if I stepped on anyone's toes, Not at all. as it wasn't my intent but around here (Ontario, Canada) it seems just about everybody has the mentality I described. Not only around there, sad to say, it's widespread. But maybe it's less widespread than it was a few years back. Hope springs eternal. They just don't seem to get it that the future is gonna look a little different. Don't seem to and I suppose don't want to either, nothing like a comfortable addiction, and there's plenty of encouragement for it from the mainstream media and all around, the comfortable assumptions go unchallenged, pretty much. Sometimes (often?) they see the facts as an attack and attack you back. Shoot the messenger. BTW I'm glad to be on this list. Making biodiesel is quite new to me and I'm sure I can benefit from all the experience gathered here. I hope so. Best wishes Keith Joe Keith Addison wrote: Hello Joe Greetz to all on the list; I have joined recently but have not posted till now. This thread just touched on a topic which has been on my mind. The question of multifuels and which is the best etc. There seems to be an underlying assumption that I keep coming up against as I interact with local people and tell them about my biodiesel efforts and the whole green oil vs black oil issue. Everyone including some on this list it seems, (don't be offended if you are not one of them)(but if you are one feel free to 1. be offended, 2. go do some soul searching) talks as if they just assume that this is a case of Oh I can put this in my tank instead of that and continue on as ever To me this is an example of our collective infantile world view that we can consume energy like pigs at the trough. I wonder how many people, and not just the ones who are so wired into 'the matrix' that they just don't even see the important issues, but even amongst the so called environmentally conscious types that can be found here and there, how many believe that it is a case of just finding an alternative energy source so we can continue on the way we have been? Does anyone believe that 80 to 100 billion extra barrels of vegetable oil can be produced every day to replace the petroleum industry? Whether future multifuel vehicles will run on vegetable oil or ethanol or liquified genius to me is a moot point. The truth is energy always has a price. I am reminded that the first R of the famous three R's is REDUCE. Using french fry oil again as fuel is only an example of recycling which is the third and least valuable of the three! There is certainly not enough WVO to go around if everyone were to jump on the bandwagon anyways. We are fortunate to be the early ones who are getting a kind of free ride, only because the masses are still passing the oil dumpster by on thier way to the petroleum store to give money to people who are content to poison them for thier support. I think there should be a lot more effort in the PR department challenging people to think differently. To live close to thier work. To walk and ride thier bicycles. This will improve the health and reduce the heathcare burden anyways. Buy stuff that is locally produced and think carefully about what you support and how you vote with your dollars. It is inevitable that we restructure society when the truth about the unsustainability of our lifestyle is in our faces and can no longer be denied in our daily routines. Those who have already begun to restructure thier own lives will be ahead of the game when the time comes but why wait? Start todaypick up the phone and call...a golden future awaits.. Just my two cents. A good two cents' worth. However, you'd probably have been a lot more cheery about had you spent some time in the list archives. That's pretty much the message the list has been pushing for the last five years. It's almost a mantra by now: Merely replacing fossil fuels is not the answer. A rational and sustainable energy future requires great reductions in energy use (currently mostly waste), great improvements in energy use efficiency, and, most important, decentralisation of supply to the small-scale or farm-scale local-economy level, along with the use of all ready-to-use renewable energy technologies in combination as the local circumstances require. More than that, there's a great deal of attention paid to how the feedstock is produced. If you just swap fuels instead of changing the entire disaster you'll end up with wall-to-wall industrialized monocrops of GMO soy and canola. Big Biofuels may not turn out to be much better than Big Oil. Silly thing about it is that industrialized monocropping of biofuels crops would be (is) just as fossil-fuel-dependent as industrialized monocropping of anything else is. What's the use of finding a cure for cancer if it gives you a heart attack? So
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Chris, Many thanks. Bob A. - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 3:28 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel hi, bob. wvo = waste vegetable oil svo = straight vegetable oil biod = biodiesel dino = petroleum-based fuel (or so i infer) e85 = 85% ethanol fuel (the norm in the u.s.a. is 10% max) e100 = 100% ethanol vw diesel simply refers to a vw diesel. i think that about covers it. -chris b. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello Keith. The system that I am referring to is described at: http://www.elsbett.com/engl/index.htm Technology/ 4. The ELSBETT duothermic combustion system. Quoting: Only by combining the above mentioned elements it is possible to achieve the optimum thermal and mechanical conditions required for the combustion of fuels, such as natural vegetable oils, which are slow to vaporise. These guys have a lot of know-how which is highly relevant for the combustion of SVO:s. With best regards Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB [EMAIL PROTECTED] + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 6:36 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel Hello Jan Hello Lyn. Yes, you are missing something. The main problem with SVO as diesel engine fuel is not the high viscosity, but the final boiling point and the low cetane number. Elsbett system have taken action before these disadvantages and have designed a dual air system in the combustion chamber of the piston. This makes it possible to combust SVO completely, since the outer air layer isolates from the inner air layer, where the combustion temperature is high enough. And although the engine is directly injected, it is equipped with pre-chamber injectors, on which coke will form, but works self-cleansing due to the typical design of pre-chamber injectors. Are you talking about the original Elsbett 3-cylinder multifuel diesel engine? Best wishes Keith Best regards Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB jan at carryon.se + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil. I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops. Am I missing something? Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel Don't get some two-tank system that probably has copper parts in it and all it does is pre-heat the oil to lower the viscosity, there's a lot more to it than that, even with a Merc. forgetting to) - switch on and go, stop and switch off, SVO, biodiesel or petro-diesel, in any combination. We've had a two-tank system for a couple of years but we never used it. I just didn't think it addressed the problem fully, and the more I learnt the more I thought so. A few months ago we installed a single-tank Elsbett system in our Toyota TownAce and we're most pleased with it. It does exactly what it claims to do, as we fully expected. http://www.elsbett.com Best wishes Keith On 25 Jun 2005 at 8:46, John Hayes wrote: You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. I went to the TDIclub site as well. I probably only saw a fraction of the posts, and what I saw made me realize that I didn't really do Mike's question justice with my previous answer, so this will be long in an attempt to provide more substantive info. I researched WVO for a while and decided upon the Jetta TDI, which I bought specifically with the intent of doing a WVO conversion. I chose the Jetta even though the golf or beetle would have been more to my personal taste, because the consensus seemed to be that it was desirable to isolate the WVO tank from the passenger area because the tank is heated - a hot metal tank of oil being not the most desirable presence in a passenger compartment There are a variety of systems and kits and ways that people have done these conversions and I have no doubt people have ruined their TDI's with WVO. The TDI has very close tolerances, also why it its such a high performance engine. From what I have gathered, gumming up the injectors with WVO is one of the serious risks. Critical issues in the system then are well filtered WVO and that it be HOT. Just to clarify matters for any readers, a WVO system is a 2 tank system. Do not ever consider just pouring WVO into your regular fuel tank - that will destroy your TDI. The system I have has : a heated WVO tank and fuel lines (the lines are heated by being bundled beside a line filled with engine coolant) , a filter for the WVO (which has already been prefiltered the remove the obvious particulate
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello Jan Hello Keith. The system that I am referring to is described at: http://www.elsbett.com/engl/index.htm Technology/ 4. The ELSBETT duothermic combustion system. Quoting: Only by combining the above mentioned elements it is possible to achieve the optimum thermal and mechanical conditions required for the combustion of fuels, such as natural vegetable oils, which are slow to vaporise. These guys have a lot of know-how which is highly relevant for the combustion of SVO:s. Definitely, I doubt anyone else even comes close. They've been involved in it for so long. However, just to clarify it for others following this thread, obviously the duothermic combustion system is not part of the Elsbett single-tank SVO conversion kit. Main components of the kit are: different injector nozzles (manufactured by Elsbett, with a different spray pattern and angle); different glowplugs; coolant heat exchanger, electric filter heater; extra fuel filter (the two filters operate in parallel); temperature sensor; electronic relays for the filter heater and glow plugs; new fuel lines. And you have to increase the injection pump pressure. A couple of friends helped us install the system in our TownAce. One of them had already installed one in his Golf (the guy I mentioned yesterday with the horrible oil). I'm very reluctant to mess with a car's electrical system (though I've repaired starter motors and alternators and so on when I've had to), but he works for IBM, no mystery to him. But they did some strange things, messy and chaotic. There's not much room inside the engine compartment, much less than a car. I managed to make some brackets so we could squeeze in the extra filter (they wanted to leave it out), though I didn't like it much. They decided to fit the coolant heat exchanger *outside* the car, mounted behind the left front wheel. Hm. I didn't like that at all. The relays were fitted under the cubby-hole in the dashboard, there were pipes and wires going every which way in the engine compartment, it looked like a plate of spaghetti. It worked, but in the end we went over everything again, from end to end, with a mechanic friend we work with (and send work to), a very good guy. There were wrong pipes in the wrong places and so on, just as well we checked. We ended up reinstalling it, putting both filters, plus a particle filter replacing the one inside the tank, the coolant heat exchanger and the relays on a steel frame in the dead space behind the front passenger seat. It looks like a bit of industrial sculpture or something, definitely a talking point for passengers. Much more sensible, plenty of space in the engine compartment now, and we only used about half as much fuel line. I'll post some photographs soon. Best wishes Keith With best regards Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB [EMAIL PROTECTED] + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2005 6:36 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel Hello Jan Hello Lyn. Yes, you are missing something. The main problem with SVO as diesel engine fuel is not the high viscosity, but the final boiling point and the low cetane number. Elsbett system have taken action before these disadvantages and have designed a dual air system in the combustion chamber of the piston. This makes it possible to combust SVO completely, since the outer air layer isolates from the inner air layer, where the combustion temperature is high enough. And although the engine is directly injected, it is equipped with pre-chamber injectors, on which coke will form, but works self-cleansing due to the typical design of pre-chamber injectors. Are you talking about the original Elsbett 3-cylinder multifuel diesel engine? Best wishes Keith Best regards Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB jan at carryon.se + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil. I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops. Am I missing something? Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel Don't get some two-tank system that probably has copper parts in it and all it does is pre-heat the oil to lower the viscosity, there's a lot more to it than
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Lyn Gerry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil.I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops.Am I missing something?Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel snip Lyn, IMO, peoplewill still process biodiesel for pure enjoyment among other reasons. Many times it is not just aboutsaving money, but the personal satisfaction of seeing your own homemade quality fuelput to use. Quality biodiesel can also be used in other applications as well,not just fordiesel cars. People are heating their homes with it too. Thereare many more applications that it can be used for where a system such as the one Elsbett produces wouldnot be applicable. Just my thoughts. ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ Discover Yahoo! Find restaurants, movies, travel & more fun for the weekend. Check it out!___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello Jonathan, Lyn Lyn Gerry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil. I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops. Am I missing something? Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/fuel snip Lyn, IMO, people will still process biodiesel for pure enjoyment among other reasons. Many times it is not just about saving money, but the personal satisfaction of seeing your own homemade quality fuel put to use. Quality biodiesel can also be used in other applications as well, not just for diesel cars. People are heating their homes with it too. There are many more applications that it can be used for where a system such as the one Elsbett produces would not be applicable. Just my thoughts. I agree with you. We tend to think biodiesel is a transitional step between today's fossil-fuel addictions and the true multifuel vehicles of tomorrow, with motors such as the advanced three-cylinder Elsbett direct-injection car diesel engine developed in the early 1980s, updated (though the Elsbett was the forefather of all modern DI car diesels in production today). That's the reason we try to push veg-oil use, with whatever system, or even with no system, including mixes, in order to achieve a critical mass of users that's big enough to put pressure on the manufacturers: ... in establishing what works and what doesn't work, some are likely to be left with the remains of what didn't work. They'll be heroes in the cause of real straight vegetable oil diesel motors, that anyone can use, not just enthusiasts -- manufacturer-made, supplied and warranted diesels that can run on petro-diesel, biodiesel or straight vegetable oil, in any blend, without any fuel-switching or fuss: fill 'er up, switch on and go, stop and switch off, like any other car. http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_TDI.html The TDI-SVO controversy However, tomorrow is likely to be a few years down the road at least. And even after that, there'll still be a very large stock of ordinary diesel motors on the road all over the world, diesels last a long time. Biodiesel will continue to be a good answer for them, especially because of the local-level or independent sort of production Lyn envisages rather than via big, centralised industrial operations. As you say, it's great making your own fuel! Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Greetz to all on the list; I have joined recently but have not posted till now. This thread just touched on a topic which has been on my mind. The question of multifuels and which is the best etc. There seems to be an underlying assumption that I keep coming up against as I interact with local people and tell them about my biodiesel efforts and the whole green oil vs black oil issue. Everyone including some on this list it seems, (don't be offended if you are not one of them)(but if you are one feel free to 1. be offended, 2. go do some soul searching) talks as if they just assume that this is a case of Oh I can put this in my tank instead of that and continue on as ever To me this is an example of our collective infantile world view that we can consume energy like pigs at the trough. I wonder how many people, and not just the ones who are so wired into 'the matrix' that they just don't even see the important issues, but even amongst the so called environmentally conscious types that can be found here and there, how many believe that it is a case of just finding an alternative energy source so we can continue on the way we have been? Does anyone believe that 80 to 100 billion extra barrels of vegetable oil can be produced every day to replace the petroleum industry? Whether future multifuel vehicles will run on vegetable oil or ethanol or liquified genius to me is a moot point. The truth is energy always has a price. I am reminded that the first R of the famous three R's is REDUCE. Using french fry oil again as fuel is only an example of recycling which is the third and least valuable of the three! There is certainly not enough WVO to go around if everyone were to jump on the bandwagon anyways. We are fortunate to be the early ones who are getting a kind of free ride, only because the masses are still passing the oil dumpster by on thier way to the petroleum store to give money to people who are content to poison them for thier support. I think there should be a lot more effort in the PR department challenging people to think differently. To live close to thier work. To walk and ride thier bicycles. This will improve the health and reduce the heathcare burden anyways. Buy stuff that is locally produced and think carefully about what you support and how you vote with your dollars. It is inevitable that we restructure society when the truth about the unsustainability of our lifestyle is in our faces and can no longer be denied in our daily routines. Those who have already begun to restructure thier own lives will be ahead of the game when the time comes but why wait? Start todaypick up the phone and call...a golden future awaits.. Just my two cents. Joe Keith Addison wrote: Hello Jonathan, Lyn Lyn Gerry [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil. I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops. Am I missing something? Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/fuel snip Lyn, IMO, people will still process biodiesel for pure enjoyment among other reasons. Many times it is not just about saving money, but the personal satisfaction of seeing your own homemade quality fuel put to use. Quality biodiesel can also be used in other applications as well, not just for diesel cars. People are heating their homes with it too. There are many more applications that it can be used for where a system such as the one Elsbett produces would not be applicable. Just my thoughts. I agree with you. We tend to think biodiesel is a transitional step between today's fossil-fuel addictions and the true multifuel vehicles of tomorrow, with motors such as the advanced three-cylinder Elsbett direct-injection car diesel engine developed in the early 1980s, updated (though the Elsbett was the forefather of all modern DI car diesels in production today). That's the reason we try to push veg-oil use, with whatever system, or even with no system, including mixes, in order to achieve a critical mass of users that's big enough to put pressure on the manufacturers: ... in establishing what works and what doesn't work, some are likely to be left with the remains of what didn't work. They'll be heroes in the cause of real straight vegetable oil diesel motors, that anyone
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello Joe Greetz to all on the list; I have joined recently but have not posted till now. This thread just touched on a topic which has been on my mind. The question of multifuels and which is the best etc. There seems to be an underlying assumption that I keep coming up against as I interact with local people and tell them about my biodiesel efforts and the whole green oil vs black oil issue. Everyone including some on this list it seems, (don't be offended if you are not one of them)(but if you are one feel free to 1. be offended, 2. go do some soul searching) talks as if they just assume that this is a case of Oh I can put this in my tank instead of that and continue on as ever To me this is an example of our collective infantile world view that we can consume energy like pigs at the trough. I wonder how many people, and not just the ones who are so wired into 'the matrix' that they just don't even see the important issues, but even amongst the so called environmentally conscious types that can be found here and there, how many believe that it is a case of just finding an alternative energy source so we can continue on the way we have been? Does anyone believe that 80 to 100 billion extra barrels of vegetable oil can be produced every day to replace the petroleum industry? Whether future multifuel vehicles will run on vegetable oil or ethanol or liquified genius to me is a moot point. The truth is energy always has a price. I am reminded that the first R of the famous three R's is REDUCE. Using french fry oil again as fuel is only an example of recycling which is the third and least valuable of the three! There is certainly not enough WVO to go around if everyone were to jump on the bandwagon anyways. We are fortunate to be the early ones who are getting a kind of free ride, only because the masses are still passing the oil dumpster by on thier way to the petroleum store to give money to people who are content to poison them for thier support. I think there should be a lot more effort in the PR department challenging people to think differently. To live close to thier work. To walk and ride thier bicycles. This will improve the health and reduce the heathcare burden anyways. Buy stuff that is locally produced and think carefully about what you support and how you vote with your dollars. It is inevitable that we restructure society when the truth about the unsustainability of our lifestyle is in our faces and can no longer be denied in our daily routines. Those who have already begun to restructure thier own lives will be ahead of the game when the time comes but why wait? Start todaypick up the phone and call...a golden future awaits.. Just my two cents. A good two cents' worth. However, you'd probably have been a lot more cheery about had you spent some time in the list archives. That's pretty much the message the list has been pushing for the last five years. It's almost a mantra by now: Merely replacing fossil fuels is not the answer. A rational and sustainable energy future requires great reductions in energy use (currently mostly waste), great improvements in energy use efficiency, and, most important, decentralisation of supply to the small-scale or farm-scale local-economy level, along with the use of all ready-to-use renewable energy technologies in combination as the local circumstances require. More than that, there's a great deal of attention paid to how the feedstock is produced. If you just swap fuels instead of changing the entire disaster you'll end up with wall-to-wall industrialized monocrops of GMO soy and canola. Big Biofuels may not turn out to be much better than Big Oil. Silly thing about it is that industrialized monocropping of biofuels crops would be (is) just as fossil-fuel-dependent as industrialized monocropping of anything else is. What's the use of finding a cure for cancer if it gives you a heart attack? So there's a focus here on sustainable crop production. You might find these previous posts interesting reading: http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg18745.html Re: Biofuels hold key to future of British farming http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg48264.html How much fuel can we grow? I think there should be a lot more effort in the PR department challenging people to think differently. Um, PR is the enemy - there's a great deal about that in the archives too, and how to counter it. But your concerns are well-addressed - indeed, walk, ride your bike, Is your journey really necessary? Catch a train, not a jet. And so on. The list deals with the entire subject of biofuels, not just how to make it, put it in and go without a care in the world thinking How green am I! Maybe you will be, and maybe not. Locally produced? The whole drift of the list is for local production and local economies - the sheer madness of the food miles
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Ok Keith; Thanks for the welcome. Sorry if I stepped on anyone's toes, as it wasn't my intent but around here (Ontario, Canada) it seems just about everybody has the mentality I described. They just don't seem to get it that the future is gonna look a little different. BTW I'm glad to be on this list. Making biodiesel is quite new to me and I'm sure I can benefit from all the experience gathered here. Joe Keith Addison wrote: Hello Joe Greetz to all on the list; I have joined recently but have not posted till now. This thread just touched on a topic which has been on my mind. The question of multifuels and which is the best etc. There seems to be an underlying assumption that I keep coming up against as I interact with local people and tell them about my biodiesel efforts and the whole green oil vs black oil issue. Everyone including some on this list it seems, (don't be offended if you are not one of them)(but if you are one feel free to 1. be offended, 2. go do some soul searching) talks as if they just assume that this is a case of Oh I can put this in my tank instead of that and continue on as ever To me this is an example of our collective infantile world view that we can consume energy like pigs at the trough. I wonder how many people, and not just the ones who are so wired into 'the matrix' that they just don't even see the important issues, but even amongst the so called environmentally conscious types that can be found here and there, how many believe that it is a case of just finding an alternative energy source so we can continue on the way we have been? Does anyone believe that 80 to 100 billion extra barrels of vegetable oil can be produced every day to replace the petroleum industry? Whether future multifuel vehicles will run on vegetable oil or ethanol or liquified genius to me is a moot point. The truth is energy always has a price. I am reminded that the first R of the famous three R's is REDUCE. Using french fry oil again as fuel is only an example of recycling which is the third and least valuable of the three! There is certainly not enough WVO to go around if everyone were to jump on the bandwagon anyways. We are fortunate to be the early ones who are getting a kind of free ride, only because the masses are still passing the oil dumpster by on thier way to the petroleum store to give money to people who are content to poison them for thier support. I think there should be a lot more effort in the PR department challenging people to think differently. To live close to thier work. To walk and ride thier bicycles. This will improve the health and reduce the heathcare burden anyways. Buy stuff that is locally produced and think carefully about what you support and how you vote with your dollars. It is inevitable that we restructure society when the truth about the unsustainability of our lifestyle is in our faces and can no longer be denied in our daily routines. Those who have already begun to restructure thier own lives will be ahead of the game when the time comes but why wait? Start todaypick up the phone and call...a golden future awaits.. Just my two cents. A good two cents' worth. However, you'd probably have been a lot more cheery about had you spent some time in the list archives. That's pretty much the message the list has been pushing for the last five years. It's almost a mantra by now: Merely replacing fossil fuels is not the answer. A rational and sustainable energy future requires great reductions in energy use (currently mostly waste), great improvements in energy use efficiency, and, most important, decentralisation of supply to the small-scale or farm-scale local-economy level, along with the use of all ready-to-use renewable energy technologies in combination as the local circumstances require. More than that, there's a great deal of attention paid to how the feedstock is produced. If you just swap fuels instead of changing the entire disaster you'll end up with wall-to-wall industrialized monocrops of GMO soy and canola. Big Biofuels may not turn out to be much better than Big Oil. Silly thing about it is that industrialized monocropping of biofuels crops would be (is) just as fossil-fuel-dependent as industrialized monocropping of anything else is. What's the use of finding a cure for cancer if it gives you a heart attack? So there's a focus here on sustainable crop production. You might find these previous posts interesting reading: http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg18745.html Re: Biofuels hold key to future of British farming http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg48264.html How much fuel can we grow? I think there should be a lot more effort in the PR department challenging people to think differently. Um, PR is the enemy - there's a great deal about that in the archives too, and how to counter it. But your
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello Biofuel List, If anyone is interested, I have more information on the install of Elsbett single tank systems. (It is large document not suitable for posting) We will be hosting another Elsbett install workshop in North Carolina, U.S. in September. If you are interested in participating let me know. This workshop will be part of larger Sustainability Fair for North Carolina covering sustainable agriculture, transportation, building, and water conservancy. I do agree with Niels and Keith on the success of these conversion kits. Thanks, Rachel Piedmont Biofuels www.biofuels.coop On Jun 25, 2005, at 12:47 PM, Keith Addison wrote: Hello Lyn There's rather more to it than just pre-heating the oil to lower the viscosity. I posted this a few weeks ago: Is there anyone out there who can compare the commercially available kits, their pros and cons? Which is the best system to install for use in Northern California. Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel Don't get some two-tank system that probably has copper parts in it and all it does is pre-heat the oil to lower the viscosity, there's a lot more to it than that, even with a Merc. Our SVO page is currently being revised. It was three years ago that I first uploaded it, and it's been revised and added to regularly since then, but more information has emerged on just what is required to run an engine on SVO successfully. We don't any longer recommend simple two-tank systems that only pre-heat the oil. As Niels Ansø of the Folkecenter in Denmark said recently: The secret is injector and glow plugs, increased injection pressure, + afterglow and good quality rape seed oil. Or at least good quality oil, if not rapeseed. Special injectors, special glow-plugs, adjustments to the injector pump, electronic controls that keep the glow-plugs on and the heaters heating until a certain fuel temperature is reached. The only such system available in the US and internationally is Elsbett, and IMO it's the best system anyway - Elsbett has been deeply involved in this business for a long time, 30 years and more. No switching fuel from one tank to the other once it's finally warmed up enough, no purging before you switch off (or forgetting to) - switch on and go, stop and switch off, SVO, biodiesel or petro-diesel, in any combination. We've had a two-tank system for a couple of years but we never used it. I just didn't think it addressed the problem fully, and the more I learnt the more I thought so. A few months ago we installed a single-tank Elsbett system in our Toyota TownAce and we're most pleased with it. It does exactly what it claims to do, as we fully expected. http://www.elsbett.com Best wishes Keith On 25 Jun 2005 at 8:46, John Hayes wrote: You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. I went to the TDIclub site as well. I probably only saw a fraction of the posts, and what I saw made me realize that I didn't really do Mike's question justice with my previous answer, so this will be long in an attempt to provide more substantive info. I researched WVO for a while and decided upon the Jetta TDI, which I bought specifically with the intent of doing a WVO conversion. I chose the Jetta even though the golf or beetle would have been more to my personal taste, because the consensus seemed to be that it was desirable to isolate the WVO tank from the passenger area because the tank is heated - a hot metal tank of oil being not the most desirable presence in a passenger compartment There are a variety of systems and kits and ways that people have done these conversions and I have no doubt people have ruined their TDI's with WVO. The TDI has very close tolerances, also why it its such a high performance engine. From what I have gathered, gumming up the injectors with WVO is one of the serious risks. Critical issues in the system then are well filtered WVO and that it be HOT. Just to clarify matters for any readers, a WVO system is a 2 tank system. Do not ever consider just pouring WVO into your regular fuel tank - that will destroy your TDI. The system I have has : a heated WVO tank and fuel lines (the lines are heated by being bundled beside a line filled with engine coolant) , a filter for the WVO (which has already been prefiltered the remove the obvious particulate fryer gunk before being put in the tank) This filter should be replaced approximately every 2000 miles, and a PURGE switch. The purge switch is a very important part of the system. It is used when switching *back* to diesel from WVO. It pushes the WVO out of the lines and injectors. If you purge for too long, you begin to suck diesel fuel into your WVO tank, but ithat's not really not a problem. The *problem* in a WVO system *without* a purge
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello Lyn. Yes, you are missing something. The main problem with SVO as diesel engine fuel is not the high viscosity, but the final boiling point and the low cetane number. Elsbett system have taken action before these disadvantages and have designed a dual air system in the combustion chamber of the piston. This makes it possible to combust SVO completely, since the outer air layer isolates from the inner air layer, where the combustion temperature is high enough. And although the engine is directly injected, it is equipped with pre-chamber injectors, on which coke will form, but works self-cleansing due to the typical design of pre-chamber injectors. Best regards Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB [EMAIL PROTECTED] + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - From: Lyn Gerry [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 9:53 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil. I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops. Am I missing something? Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel Don't get some two-tank system that probably has copper parts in it and all it does is pre-heat the oil to lower the viscosity, there's a lot more to it than that, even with a Merc. forgetting to) - switch on and go, stop and switch off, SVO, biodiesel or petro-diesel, in any combination. We've had a two-tank system for a couple of years but we never used it. I just didn't think it addressed the problem fully, and the more I learnt the more I thought so. A few months ago we installed a single-tank Elsbett system in our Toyota TownAce and we're most pleased with it. It does exactly what it claims to do, as we fully expected. http://www.elsbett.com Best wishes Keith On 25 Jun 2005 at 8:46, John Hayes wrote: You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. I went to the TDIclub site as well. I probably only saw a fraction of the posts, and what I saw made me realize that I didn't really do Mike's question justice with my previous answer, so this will be long in an attempt to provide more substantive info. I researched WVO for a while and decided upon the Jetta TDI, which I bought specifically with the intent of doing a WVO conversion. I chose the Jetta even though the golf or beetle would have been more to my personal taste, because the consensus seemed to be that it was desirable to isolate the WVO tank from the passenger area because the tank is heated - a hot metal tank of oil being not the most desirable presence in a passenger compartment There are a variety of systems and kits and ways that people have done these conversions and I have no doubt people have ruined their TDI's with WVO. The TDI has very close tolerances, also why it its such a high performance engine. From what I have gathered, gumming up the injectors with WVO is one of the serious risks. Critical issues in the system then are well filtered WVO and that it be HOT. Just to clarify matters for any readers, a WVO system is a 2 tank system. Do not ever consider just pouring WVO into your regular fuel tank - that will destroy your TDI. The system I have has : a heated WVO tank and fuel lines (the lines are heated by being bundled beside a line filled with engine coolant) , a filter for the WVO (which has already been prefiltered the remove the obvious particulate fryer gunk before being put in the tank) This filter should be replaced approximately every 2000 miles, and a PURGE switch. The purge switch is a very important part of the system. It is used when switching *back* to diesel from WVO. It pushes the WVO out of the lines and injectors. If you purge for too long, you begin to suck diesel fuel into your WVO tank, but ithat's not really not a problem. The *problem* in a WVO system *without* a purge function arises because, if the WVO is not completely cleared from the engine components , you will begin to dump some WVO into the diesel tank when you shut off the car. After a while, your diesel will be contaminated with WVO. The reason why this is a problem is because your diesel tank is not heated and the WVO is too viscous at room
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello Jan Hello Lyn. Yes, you are missing something. The main problem with SVO as diesel engine fuel is not the high viscosity, but the final boiling point and the low cetane number. Elsbett system have taken action before these disadvantages and have designed a dual air system in the combustion chamber of the piston. This makes it possible to combust SVO completely, since the outer air layer isolates from the inner air layer, where the combustion temperature is high enough. And although the engine is directly injected, it is equipped with pre-chamber injectors, on which coke will form, but works self-cleansing due to the typical design of pre-chamber injectors. Are you talking about the original Elsbett 3-cylinder multifuel diesel engine? Best wishes Keith Best regards Jan Warnqvist AGERATEC AB jan at carryon.se + 46 554 201 89 +46 70 499 38 45 - Original Message - I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil. I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops. Am I missing something? Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel Don't get some two-tank system that probably has copper parts in it and all it does is pre-heat the oil to lower the viscosity, there's a lot more to it than that, even with a Merc. forgetting to) - switch on and go, stop and switch off, SVO, biodiesel or petro-diesel, in any combination. We've had a two-tank system for a couple of years but we never used it. I just didn't think it addressed the problem fully, and the more I learnt the more I thought so. A few months ago we installed a single-tank Elsbett system in our Toyota TownAce and we're most pleased with it. It does exactly what it claims to do, as we fully expected. http://www.elsbett.com Best wishes Keith On 25 Jun 2005 at 8:46, John Hayes wrote: You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. I went to the TDIclub site as well. I probably only saw a fraction of the posts, and what I saw made me realize that I didn't really do Mike's question justice with my previous answer, so this will be long in an attempt to provide more substantive info. I researched WVO for a while and decided upon the Jetta TDI, which I bought specifically with the intent of doing a WVO conversion. I chose the Jetta even though the golf or beetle would have been more to my personal taste, because the consensus seemed to be that it was desirable to isolate the WVO tank from the passenger area because the tank is heated - a hot metal tank of oil being not the most desirable presence in a passenger compartment There are a variety of systems and kits and ways that people have done these conversions and I have no doubt people have ruined their TDI's with WVO. The TDI has very close tolerances, also why it its such a high performance engine. From what I have gathered, gumming up the injectors with WVO is one of the serious risks. Critical issues in the system then are well filtered WVO and that it be HOT. Just to clarify matters for any readers, a WVO system is a 2 tank system. Do not ever consider just pouring WVO into your regular fuel tank - that will destroy your TDI. The system I have has : a heated WVO tank and fuel lines (the lines are heated by being bundled beside a line filled with engine coolant) , a filter for the WVO (which has already been prefiltered the remove the obvious particulate fryer gunk before being put in the tank) This filter should be replaced approximately every 2000 miles, and a PURGE switch. The purge switch is a very important part of the system. It is used when switching *back* to diesel from WVO. It pushes the WVO out of the lines and injectors. If you purge for too long, you begin to suck diesel fuel into your WVO tank, but ithat's not really not a problem. The *problem* in a WVO system *without* a purge function arises because, if the WVO is not completely cleared from the engine components , you will begin to dump some WVO into the diesel tank when you shut off the car. After a while, your diesel will be contaminated with WVO. The reason why this is a problem is because your diesel tank is not heated and the WVO is too viscous at room temperature to flow through the injectors properly. The WVO must be at 190
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello Lyn I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil. Swings and roundabouts. See Three choices: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make.html#3choices Elsbett systems are not all the same, they're tailormade for each different car, or engine rather. Prices (that I know of) range from 650-750 Euros (US$780-900), plus freight (70 Euros in our case). For the sake of argument make it US$1,000. Installing the system takes a bit of time and skill, and you might have to pay an injection pump workshop to adjust the pump for you, and perhaps fit the new injectors. Anyway, with biodiesel, at 60c/gal if you make it yourself and use WVO, that $1,000 will get you 1,666 gallons of biodiesel. That would last most people three years or more, and you won't have to spend anything on converting the motor. But meanwhile you've had to go to the trouble of making all that biodiesel. Or, on the other hand, you've had to go to the trouble of heating and filtering all that SVO anyway. It's a matter of choice. I think they're complementary, not either/or, certainly not one vs the other (the silly which is better argument). So now we use SVO, but we still make biodiesel anyway. We have other diesels here that we use it in, tractors, a Yanmar that powers a shredder and so on, and we barter quite a lot, we supply it to the folks who come to our seminars, and we use it for promoting biofuels - we supplied biodiesel for the power supply at the 5-day Sun and Moon Festival held at Kyoto University last week for instance. Regardless of whether we personally prefer SVO and Elsbett (we like it, but we like biodiesel too), a major reason for installing it was to help promote the SVO option in Japan, which very few people here have heard of. Yet. By the way, there are folks in the US selling two-tank kits who say any oil, any motor. Well, maybe, I wouldn't bank on it. Elsbett doesn't say that, their warranty is limited to SVO use, virgin oil not WVO, and they send you the Euro specs for rapeseed oil used as fuel. We think it's fine to use WVO as long as it's GOOD WVO, if you can tell the difference. Someone else here in Japan, who fitted the first Elsbett system here, just before we did, brought me some of the oil he'd been using. He got it from his works canteen, very good oil he said, and they'd told him there was no animal fat in it. I titrated it at 7.5 ml 0.1 NaOH solution. Ouch! He doesn't use that oil anymore. He doesn't eat at the canteen anymore either. The oil we use is usually about 1.2 ml. Some other folks in the US are selling a single-tank Elsbett lookalike, having bought a couple of Elsbett systems first and done a sort of copy. They're not diesel engineers, or any engineers, and they seem to have designed it mainly for marketability - claimed to be easy to install and so on, and it has a fancy filter so you allegedly don't need to pre-filter the oil. With only a two-year history and no user-reports that I've seen, as opposed to Elsbett's illustrious record in diesel engineering, well, caveat emptor. I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Or creating scarcity. I once saw economics defined as the art of articificially created shortages. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops. True. Or by-products of other crops. Am I missing something? I don't think so. You might enjoy these two previous posts: http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg18745.html Re: Biofuels hold key to future of British farming http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/msg48264.html How much fuel can we grow? Best wishes Keith Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel Don't get some two-tank system that probably has copper parts in it and all it does is pre-heat the oil to lower the viscosity, there's a lot more to it than that, even with a Merc. forgetting to) - switch on and go, stop and switch off, SVO, biodiesel or petro-diesel, in any combination. We've had a two-tank system for a couple of years but we never used it. I just didn't think it addressed the problem fully, and the more I learnt the more I thought so. A few months ago we installed a single-tank Elsbett system in our Toyota TownAce and we're most pleased with it. It does exactly what it claims to do, as we fully expected. http://www.elsbett.com Best wishes Keith On
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Anyone: Is there a glossary link for newbies explaining such acronyms as WVO, SVO, Dino, VW Diesel, etc.? Bob A - Original Message - From: Lyn Gerry [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Saturday, June 25, 2005 12:53 PM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil. I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops. Am I missing something? Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel Don't get some two-tank system that probably has copper parts in it and all it does is pre-heat the oil to lower the viscosity, there's a lot more to it than that, even with a Merc. forgetting to) - switch on and go, stop and switch off, SVO, biodiesel or petro-diesel, in any combination. We've had a two-tank system for a couple of years but we never used it. I just didn't think it addressed the problem fully, and the more I learnt the more I thought so. A few months ago we installed a single-tank Elsbett system in our Toyota TownAce and we're most pleased with it. It does exactly what it claims to do, as we fully expected. http://www.elsbett.com Best wishes Keith On 25 Jun 2005 at 8:46, John Hayes wrote: You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. I went to the TDIclub site as well. I probably only saw a fraction of the posts, and what I saw made me realize that I didn't really do Mike's question justice with my previous answer, so this will be long in an attempt to provide more substantive info. I researched WVO for a while and decided upon the Jetta TDI, which I bought specifically with the intent of doing a WVO conversion. I chose the Jetta even though the golf or beetle would have been more to my personal taste, because the consensus seemed to be that it was desirable to isolate the WVO tank from the passenger area because the tank is heated - a hot metal tank of oil being not the most desirable presence in a passenger compartment There are a variety of systems and kits and ways that people have done these conversions and I have no doubt people have ruined their TDI's with WVO. The TDI has very close tolerances, also why it its such a high performance engine. From what I have gathered, gumming up the injectors with WVO is one of the serious risks. Critical issues in the system then are well filtered WVO and that it be HOT. Just to clarify matters for any readers, a WVO system is a 2 tank system. Do not ever consider just pouring WVO into your regular fuel tank - that will destroy your TDI. The system I have has : a heated WVO tank and fuel lines (the lines are heated by being bundled beside a line filled with engine coolant) , a filter for the WVO (which has already been prefiltered the remove the obvious particulate fryer gunk before being put in the tank) This filter should be replaced approximately every 2000 miles, and a PURGE switch. The purge switch is a very important part of the system. It is used when switching *back* to diesel from WVO. It pushes the WVO out of the lines and injectors. If you purge for too long, you begin to suck diesel fuel into your WVO tank, but ithat's not really not a problem. The *problem* in a WVO system *without* a purge function arises because, if the WVO is not completely cleared from the engine components , you will begin to dump some WVO into the diesel tank when you shut off the car. After a while, your diesel will be contaminated with WVO. The reason why this is a problem is because your diesel tank is not heated and the WVO is too viscous at room temperature to flow through the injectors properly. The WVO must be at 190 degrees F to liquify it adequately. I am not a car mechanic, and the above description is what I've gained from online research and conversations, and this was the data I used to decide whether and what conversion I would do. Hope this helps. Lyn And the professional 'we need more scientific data' skeptics. And the 'yes, we need data but your studies are too old' counter-skeptics. Yup. I think that about sums it up. jh Keith Addison wrote: Hello John Just FYI, there is a major debate on SVO use raging at TDIclub.com right now. It's actually spilled over into 3 different threads in the biodiesel section of the forums(sic
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
hi, bob. wvo = waste vegetable oil svo = straight vegetable oil biod = biodiesel dino = petroleum-based fuel (or so i infer) e85 = 85% ethanol fuel (the norm in the u.s.a. is 10% max) e100 = 100% ethanol vw diesel simply refers to a vw diesel. i think that about covers it. -chris b. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello John Just FYI, there is a major debate on SVO use raging at TDIclub.com right now. It's actually spilled over into 3 different threads in the biodiesel section of the forums(sic). Would you perhaps be up to giving us a summary? Best wishes Keith jh Lyn Gerry wrote: Hi Mike and All, I just had my 1999 Jetta TDI converted, and so far, I'm really pleased. I live in central New York State and the conversion was done by Lucas MacDonald at Vegpower http://www.vegpower.com/ They can do the work or you can buy components from them. Lucas is also an experienced VW/volvo mechanic. Lyn On 22 Jun 2005 at 16:26, Mike wrote: Has anyone ever converted a VW diesel to run on leftover oil from restaurants or fast foods like Krispy Kreeme and McDonalds etc... I'm about to do it and want to follow the lead of someone else who's done it. Thanks. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. And the Greasel 'TDIclub member don't have a clue' people. And the professional 'we need more scientific data' skeptics. And the 'yes, we need data but your studies are too old' counter-skeptics. Yup. I think that about sums it up. jh Keith Addison wrote: Hello John Just FYI, there is a major debate on SVO use raging at TDIclub.com right now. It's actually spilled over into 3 different threads in the biodiesel section of the forums(sic). Would you perhaps be up to giving us a summary? Best wishes Keith jh Lyn Gerry wrote: Hi Mike and All, I just had my 1999 Jetta TDI converted, and so far, I'm really pleased. I live in central New York State and the conversion was done by Lucas MacDonald at Vegpower http://www.vegpower.com/ They can do the work or you can buy components from them. Lucas is also an experienced VW/volvo mechanic. Lyn On 22 Jun 2005 at 16:26, Mike wrote: Has anyone ever converted a VW diesel to run on leftover oil from restaurants or fast foods like Krispy Kreeme and McDonalds etc... I'm about to do it and want to follow the lead of someone else who's done it. Thanks. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- John E Hayes, M.S. Instructor, Dietetics Program, DIET 203 / DIET 215 Doctoral Student, Nutritional Sciences University of Connecticut - 326 Koons Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 860.486.0007 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
On 25 Jun 2005 at 8:46, John Hayes wrote: You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. I went to the TDIclub site as well. I probably only saw a fraction of the posts, and what I saw made me realize that I didn't really do Mike's question justice with my previous answer, so this will be long in an attempt to provide more substantive info. I researched WVO for a while and decided upon the Jetta TDI, which I bought specifically with the intent of doing a WVO conversion. I chose the Jetta even though the golf or beetle would have been more to my personal taste, because the consensus seemed to be that it was desirable to isolate the WVO tank from the passenger area because the tank is heated - a hot metal tank of oil being not the most desirable presence in a passenger compartment There are a variety of systems and kits and ways that people have done these conversions and I have no doubt people have ruined their TDI's with WVO. The TDI has very close tolerances, also why it its such a high performance engine. From what I have gathered, gumming up the injectors with WVO is one of the serious risks. Critical issues in the system then are well filtered WVO and that it be HOT. Just to clarify matters for any readers, a WVO system is a 2 tank system. Do not ever consider just pouring WVO into your regular fuel tank - that will destroy your TDI. The system I have has : a heated WVO tank and fuel lines (the lines are heated by being bundled beside a line filled with engine coolant) , a filter for the WVO (which has already been prefiltered the remove the obvious particulate fryer gunk before being put in the tank) This filter should be replaced approximately every 2000 miles, and a PURGE switch. The purge switch is a very important part of the system. It is used when switching *back* to diesel from WVO. It pushes the WVO out of the lines and injectors. If you purge for too long, you begin to suck diesel fuel into your WVO tank, but ithat's not really not a problem. The *problem* in a WVO system *without* a purge function arises because, if the WVO is not completely cleared from the engine components , you will begin to dump some WVO into the diesel tank when you shut off the car. After a while, your diesel will be contaminated with WVO. The reason why this is a problem is because your diesel tank is not heated and the WVO is too viscous at room temperature to flow through the injectors properly. The WVO must be at 190 degrees F to liquify it adequately. I am not a car mechanic, and the above description is what I've gained from online research and conversations, and this was the data I used to decide whether and what conversion I would do. Hope this helps. Lyn And the professional 'we need more scientific data' skeptics. And the 'yes, we need data but your studies are too old' counter-skeptics. Yup. I think that about sums it up. jh Keith Addison wrote: Hello John Just FYI, there is a major debate on SVO use raging at TDIclub.com right now. It's actually spilled over into 3 different threads in the biodiesel section of the forums(sic). Would you perhaps be up to giving us a summary? Best wishes Keith jh Lyn Gerry wrote: Hi Mike and All, I just had my 1999 Jetta TDI converted, and so far, I'm really pleased. I live in central New York State and the conversion was done by Lucas MacDonald at Vegpower http://www.vegpower.com/ They can do the work or you can buy components from them. Lucas is also an experienced VW/volvo mechanic. Lyn On 22 Jun 2005 at 16:26, Mike wrote: Has anyone ever converted a VW diesel to run on leftover oil from restaurants or fast foods like Krispy Kreeme and McDonalds etc... I'm about to do it and want to follow the lead of someone else who's done it. Thanks. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- John E Hayes, M.S. Instructor, Dietetics Program, DIET 203 / DIET 215 Doctoral Student, Nutritional Sciences University of Connecticut - 326 Koons Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 860.486.0007 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hello Lyn There's rather more to it than just pre-heating the oil to lower the viscosity. I posted this a few weeks ago: Is there anyone out there who can compare the commercially available kits, their pros and cons? Which is the best system to install for use in Northern California. Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel Don't get some two-tank system that probably has copper parts in it and all it does is pre-heat the oil to lower the viscosity, there's a lot more to it than that, even with a Merc. Our SVO page is currently being revised. It was three years ago that I first uploaded it, and it's been revised and added to regularly since then, but more information has emerged on just what is required to run an engine on SVO successfully. We don't any longer recommend simple two-tank systems that only pre-heat the oil. As Niels Ansø of the Folkecenter in Denmark said recently: The secret is injector and glow plugs, increased injection pressure, + afterglow and good quality rape seed oil. Or at least good quality oil, if not rapeseed. Special injectors, special glow-plugs, adjustments to the injector pump, electronic controls that keep the glow-plugs on and the heaters heating until a certain fuel temperature is reached. The only such system available in the US and internationally is Elsbett, and IMO it's the best system anyway - Elsbett has been deeply involved in this business for a long time, 30 years and more. No switching fuel from one tank to the other once it's finally warmed up enough, no purging before you switch off (or forgetting to) - switch on and go, stop and switch off, SVO, biodiesel or petro-diesel, in any combination. We've had a two-tank system for a couple of years but we never used it. I just didn't think it addressed the problem fully, and the more I learnt the more I thought so. A few months ago we installed a single-tank Elsbett system in our Toyota TownAce and we're most pleased with it. It does exactly what it claims to do, as we fully expected. http://www.elsbett.com Best wishes Keith On 25 Jun 2005 at 8:46, John Hayes wrote: You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. I went to the TDIclub site as well. I probably only saw a fraction of the posts, and what I saw made me realize that I didn't really do Mike's question justice with my previous answer, so this will be long in an attempt to provide more substantive info. I researched WVO for a while and decided upon the Jetta TDI, which I bought specifically with the intent of doing a WVO conversion. I chose the Jetta even though the golf or beetle would have been more to my personal taste, because the consensus seemed to be that it was desirable to isolate the WVO tank from the passenger area because the tank is heated - a hot metal tank of oil being not the most desirable presence in a passenger compartment There are a variety of systems and kits and ways that people have done these conversions and I have no doubt people have ruined their TDI's with WVO. The TDI has very close tolerances, also why it its such a high performance engine. From what I have gathered, gumming up the injectors with WVO is one of the serious risks. Critical issues in the system then are well filtered WVO and that it be HOT. Just to clarify matters for any readers, a WVO system is a 2 tank system. Do not ever consider just pouring WVO into your regular fuel tank - that will destroy your TDI. The system I have has : a heated WVO tank and fuel lines (the lines are heated by being bundled beside a line filled with engine coolant) , a filter for the WVO (which has already been prefiltered the remove the obvious particulate fryer gunk before being put in the tank) This filter should be replaced approximately every 2000 miles, and a PURGE switch. The purge switch is a very important part of the system. It is used when switching *back* to diesel from WVO. It pushes the WVO out of the lines and injectors. If you purge for too long, you begin to suck diesel fuel into your WVO tank, but ithat's not really not a problem. The *problem* in a WVO system *without* a purge function arises because, if the WVO is not completely cleared from the engine components , you will begin to dump some WVO into the diesel tank when you shut off the car. After a while, your diesel will be contaminated with WVO. The reason why this is a problem is because your diesel tank is not heated and the WVO is too viscous at room temperature to flow through the injectors properly. The WVO must be at 190 degrees F to liquify it adequately. I am not a car mechanic, and the above description is what I've gained from online research and conversations, and this was the data I used to decide whether and what conversion I would do. Hope this helps. Lyn And the professional 'we need more scientific data' skeptics. And the
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. And the Greasel 'TDIclub member don't have a clue' people. And the professional 'we need more scientific data' skeptics. And the 'yes, we need data but your studies are too old' counter-skeptics. Yup. I think that about sums it up. jh Uh-hu, I get the picture. Thanks John. Best Keith Keith Addison wrote: Hello John Just FYI, there is a major debate on SVO use raging at TDIclub.com right now. It's actually spilled over into 3 different threads in the biodiesel section of the forums(sic). Would you perhaps be up to giving us a summary? Best wishes Keith jh Lyn Gerry wrote: Hi Mike and All, I just had my 1999 Jetta TDI converted, and so far, I'm really pleased. I live in central New York State and the conversion was done by Lucas MacDonald at Vegpower http://www.vegpower.com/ They can do the work or you can buy components from them. Lucas is also an experienced VW/volvo mechanic. Lyn On 22 Jun 2005 at 16:26, Mike wrote: Has anyone ever converted a VW diesel to run on leftover oil from restaurants or fast foods like Krispy Kreeme and McDonalds etc... I'm about to do it and want to follow the lead of someone else who's done it. Thanks. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- John E Hayes, M.S. Instructor, Dietetics Program, DIET 203 / DIET 215 Doctoral Student, Nutritional Sciences University of Connecticut - 326 Koons Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 860.486.0007 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
I went to the site that Keith recommended and it looks fantastic. What this maker Elsbett sells is a one tank system you can put anything from WVO to Dino into. If such a system exists, why are people bothing to make biodiesel? It would be easier, more ecological, economical etc to just use vegetable oil. I think about this problem both in the ecolological sense and the Peak oil sense. Particularly with the latter, the fewer things you have to buy, the less exposure you have to being gouged by corporations exploiting scarcity. Anyone with access to a few acres of land and a home made oil press can create fuel out of a variety of easy to grow crops. Am I missing something? Lyn Elsbett. See: http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_svo.html Straight vegetable oil as diesel fuel Don't get some two-tank system that probably has copper parts in it and all it does is pre-heat the oil to lower the viscosity, there's a lot more to it than that, even with a Merc. forgetting to) - switch on and go, stop and switch off, SVO, biodiesel or petro-diesel, in any combination. We've had a two-tank system for a couple of years but we never used it. I just didn't think it addressed the problem fully, and the more I learnt the more I thought so. A few months ago we installed a single-tank Elsbett system in our Toyota TownAce and we're most pleased with it. It does exactly what it claims to do, as we fully expected. http://www.elsbett.com Best wishes Keith On 25 Jun 2005 at 8:46, John Hayes wrote: You have the 'SVO destroyed my TDI' folks. And the 'SVO is just fine' pollyannas. I went to the TDIclub site as well. I probably only saw a fraction of the posts, and what I saw made me realize that I didn't really do Mike's question justice with my previous answer, so this will be long in an attempt to provide more substantive info. I researched WVO for a while and decided upon the Jetta TDI, which I bought specifically with the intent of doing a WVO conversion. I chose the Jetta even though the golf or beetle would have been more to my personal taste, because the consensus seemed to be that it was desirable to isolate the WVO tank from the passenger area because the tank is heated - a hot metal tank of oil being not the most desirable presence in a passenger compartment There are a variety of systems and kits and ways that people have done these conversions and I have no doubt people have ruined their TDI's with WVO. The TDI has very close tolerances, also why it its such a high performance engine. From what I have gathered, gumming up the injectors with WVO is one of the serious risks. Critical issues in the system then are well filtered WVO and that it be HOT. Just to clarify matters for any readers, a WVO system is a 2 tank system. Do not ever consider just pouring WVO into your regular fuel tank - that will destroy your TDI. The system I have has : a heated WVO tank and fuel lines (the lines are heated by being bundled beside a line filled with engine coolant) , a filter for the WVO (which has already been prefiltered the remove the obvious particulate fryer gunk before being put in the tank) This filter should be replaced approximately every 2000 miles, and a PURGE switch. The purge switch is a very important part of the system. It is used when switching *back* to diesel from WVO. It pushes the WVO out of the lines and injectors. If you purge for too long, you begin to suck diesel fuel into your WVO tank, but ithat's not really not a problem. The *problem* in a WVO system *without* a purge function arises because, if the WVO is not completely cleared from the engine components , you will begin to dump some WVO into the diesel tank when you shut off the car. After a while, your diesel will be contaminated with WVO. The reason why this is a problem is because your diesel tank is not heated and the WVO is too viscous at room temperature to flow through the injectors properly. The WVO must be at 190 degrees F to liquify it adequately. I am not a car mechanic, and the above description is what I've gained from online research and conversations, and this was the data I used to decide whether and what conversion I would do. Hope this helps. Lyn And the professional 'we need more scientific data' skeptics. And the 'yes, we need data but your studies are too old' counter-skeptics. Yup. I think that about sums it up. jh Keith Addison wrote: Hello John Just FYI, there is a major debate on SVO use raging at TDIclub.com right now. It's actually spilled over into 3 different threads in the biodiesel section of the forums(sic). Would you perhaps be up to giving us a summary? Best wishes Keith jh Lyn Gerry wrote: Hi Mike and All, I just had my 1999 Jetta TDI converted,
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Hi Mike and All, I just had my 1999 Jetta TDI converted, and so far, I'm really pleased. I live in central New York State and the conversion was done by Lucas MacDonald at Vegpower http://www.vegpower.com/ They can do the work or you can buy components from them. Lucas is also an experienced VW/volvo mechanic. Lyn On 22 Jun 2005 at 16:26, Mike wrote: Has anyone ever converted a VW diesel to run on leftover oil from restaurants or fast foods like Krispy Kreeme and McDonalds etc... I'm about to do it and want to follow the lead of someone else who's done it. Thanks. __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] VW Diesel
Just FYI, there is a major debate on SVO use raging at TDIclub.com right now. It's actually spilled over into 3 different threads in the biodiesel section of the forums(sic). jh Lyn Gerry wrote: Hi Mike and All, I just had my 1999 Jetta TDI converted, and so far, I'm really pleased. I live in central New York State and the conversion was done by Lucas MacDonald at Vegpower http://www.vegpower.com/ They can do the work or you can buy components from them. Lucas is also an experienced VW/volvo mechanic. Lyn On 22 Jun 2005 at 16:26, Mike wrote: Has anyone ever converted a VW diesel to run on leftover oil from restaurants or fast foods like Krispy Kreeme and McDonalds etc... I'm about to do it and want to follow the lead of someone else who's done it. Thanks. __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- John E Hayes, M.S. Instructor, Dietetics Program, DIET 203 / DIET 215 Doctoral Student, Nutritional Sciences University of Connecticut - 326 Koons Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] / 860.486.0007 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] VW Diesel
Has anyone ever converted a VW diesel to run on leftover oil from restaurants or fast foods like Krispy Kreeme and McDonalds etc... I'm about to do it and want to follow the lead of someone else who's done it. Thanks. __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[biofuel] VW diesel into small rear wheel drive pickup conversion
I have heard about kits that allow VW diesels to be installed in Suzuki Samurais. What I am interested in doing is putting this engine in a Nissan or Toyota pickup. Does anyone have any ideas about how I would make the flywheel/clutch part work? Stan Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW diesel into small rear wheel drive pickup conversion
Much easier to just get a diesel from those makers (Toyota/Nissan) Regards, Edward Beggs On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 06:13 PM, Stanley Baer wrote: I have heard about kits that allow VW diesels to be installed in Suzuki Samurais. What I am interested in doing is putting this engine in a Nissan or Toyota pickup. Does anyone have any ideas about how I would make the flywheel/clutch part work? Stan Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM - ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW diesel into small rear wheel drive pickup conversion
I have heard about kits that allow VW diesels to be installed in Suzuki Samurais. What I am interested in doing is putting this engine in a Nissan or Toyota pickup. Does anyone have any ideas about how I would make the flywheel/clutch part work? Stan You can make anything bolt up to anything if you really want to. I've never done such a swap but I own a Toyota 2wd pickup with a 2.4L diesel engine, factory and very economical. Nissan (datsuns) I believe were also available with diesel engines. Might be cheaper to start off with something factory made... J-L Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW diesel into small rear wheel drive pickup conversion
Where I live in Canada, there are very few small pickups with diesel engines. The ones that are available are quite old and have very high mileage. I have a couple of VW diesels in my shed as well as a garge full of machine tools and welders. A mid nineties Mazda would be a good candidate for the swap as I like the way they look. stan Jean-Leon Morin wrote: I have heard about kits that allow VW diesels to be installed in Suzuki Samurais. What I am interested in doing is putting this engine in a Nissan or Toyota pickup. Does anyone have any ideas about how I would make the flywheel/clutch part work? Stan You can make anything bolt up to anything if you really want to. I've never done such a swap but I own a Toyota 2wd pickup with a 2.4L diesel engine, factory and very economical. Nissan (datsuns) I believe were also available with diesel engines. Might be cheaper to start off with something factory made... J-L Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT http://rd.yahoo.com/M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupweb/S=1705083269:HM/A=1481659/R=0/*http://www.gotomypc.com/u/tr/yh/cpm/grp/300_yh1/g22lp?Target=mm/g22lp.tmpl Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW diesel into small rear wheel drive pickup conversion
Stan: http://www.keltec.com/hardware/index.html were making a kit, but quit. They have some stock. Ed B - Original Message - From: Stanley Baer To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, March 18, 2003 8:13 PM Subject: [biofuel] VW diesel into small rear wheel drive pickup conversion I have heard about kits that allow VW diesels to be installed in Suzuki Samurais. What I am interested in doing is putting this engine in a Nissan or Toyota pickup. Does anyone have any ideas about how I would make the flywheel/clutch part work? Stan Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW diesel into small rear wheel drive pickup conversion
Take off the Mazda body and mount on a wrecked Dodge Cummins frame. Now that would be fun, and give you about 35mpg, while pulling Oak stumps. ;-) On Tuesday, March 18, 2003, at 07:59 PM, Stanley Baer wrote: Where I live in Canada, there are very few small pickups with diesel engines. The ones that are available are quite old and have very high mileage. I have a couple of VW diesels in my shed as well as a garge full of machine tools and welders. A mid nineties Mazda would be a good candidate for the swap as I like the way they look. stan Jean-Leon Morin wrote: I have heard about kits that allow VW diesels to be installed in Suzuki Samurais. What I am interested in doing is putting this engine in a Nissan or Toyota pickup. Does anyone have any ideas about how I would make the flywheel/clutch part work? Stan You can make anything bolt up to anything if you really want to. I've never done such a swap but I own a Toyota 2wd pickup with a 2.4L diesel engine, factory and very economical. Nissan (datsuns) I believe were also available with diesel engines. Might be cheaper to start off with something factory made... J-L Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT http://rd.yahoo.com/M=246920.2960106.4328965.2848452/D=egroupweb/ S=1705083269:HM/A=1481659/R=0/*http://www.gotomypc.com/u/tr/yh/cpm/ grp/300_yh1/g22lp?Target=mm/g22lp.tmpl Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM - ~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Make Money Online Auctions! Make $500.00 or We Will Give You Thirty Dollars for Trying! http://us.click.yahoo.com/yMx78A/fNtFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW Diesel Warranty exclusions!!
legally, the warranty can only be voided if the claim was due to a fuel related problem. Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter Discussion Boards. Read about Sustainable Technology: http://www.green-trust.org [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: mkitchin6548 [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, March 07, 2003 6:56 PM Subject: [biofuel] VW Diesel Warranty exclusions!! Hello, Went looking at the Golf TDI today and had TWO dealers tell me that the engine warranty wold be VOIDED if I bought one and ran biodiesel. I'm gonna check further intoi it, but thought I'd pass this on. Bill in Az Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- New Yahoo! Mail Plus. More flexibility. More control. More power. Get POP access, more storage, more filters, and more. http://us.click.yahoo.com/Hcb0iA/P.iFAA/46VHAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW Diesel Warranty exclusions!!
Hello, Went looking at the Golf TDI today and had TWO dealers tell me that the engine warranty wold be VOIDED if I bought one and ran biodiesel. I'm gonna check further intoi it, but thought I'd pass this on. Bill in Az Hi, Bill - If you are interested in owning a TDI, you ought to check out http://www.tdiclub.com/ This is a great resource for TDI owners. It has a number of forums, including one on biodiesel. There are quite a few TDI owners running bio without any problems. Regarding the warranty issue -- that's actually somewhat of a grey and iffy area. I think your two dealerships were giving you misleading information. [NOTE: be aware that most VW salespeople don't really know very much about the TDI, and quite often give out nonsense information rather than admit they don't know the facts. You are going to get much more good info from the TDIclub forums than from VW sales staff, most of whom have barely driven a TDI around the lot, let alone out in the real world.] There was a big discussion about biodiesel and warranty issues on http://www.tdiclub.com/ a while ago, but I don't remember all the details. Bottom line, though, as I recall, is that there is no official VWOA policy -- merely a statement that they do not condone or encourage biodiesel use in the USA -- and none of the people running bio in new TDI's seem to have had any problems with this. But again, you need to check the forum for more accurate info, as I'm only going from memory here. If you post a question about this in the biodiesel forum of http://www.tdiclub.com/, I'm sure you'll get some serious discussion and information. Are you in the Phoenix area? There are quite a few TDI'ers there, and also several sources for good quality commercial biodiesel. Cheers - RJLaue Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] VW Diesel Warranty exclusions!!
Hello, Went looking at the Golf TDI today and had TWO dealers tell me that the engine warranty wold be VOIDED if I bought one and ran biodiesel. I'm gonna check further intoi it, but thought I'd pass this on. Bill in Az Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
RE: [biofuel] VW diesel question
on this page you can find hp and torque of diferent vw engines http://www.volkswagen.org/EngineSwap/Default.htm hope this helps Manolo Rolan Valencia, Spain -Mensaje original- De: dennis [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Enviado el: martes, 14 de mayo de 2002 22:28 Para: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Asunto: Re: [biofuel] VW diesel question i dont know the exact hp or torque, but after looking in my generator book your engine should have more than enough power. one thing you would have to do is put a belt driven governor on the motor to maintain the speed.dennis Tiastobio wrote: VW 1500-1600 HP/Torque vs RPM ? Can anyone provide a horsepower/torque vs RPM graph for the VW 1500 or 1600 non-turbo diesel engine? I would like these figures to see if a small imported generator end could provide 10-15 kilowatts when driven by a small VW diesel. I've seen the site with the belt driven homebuilt unit, but I would like to investigate the possibility of a direct-coupled homebuilt unit. Can any member give me a hand? -tiasto Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ADVERTISEMENT http://rd.yahoo.com/M=226014.2032696.3508022.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705083269:HM/A=1000239/R=0/*http://ads.x10.com/?bHlhaG9vaG0xLmRhd=1021408118%3eM=226014.2032696.3508022.1829184/D=egroupweb/S=1705083269:HM/A=1000239/R=1 http://us.adserver.yahoo.com/l?M=226014.2032696.3508022.1829184/D=egroupmail/S=1705083269:HM/A=1000239/rand=225520788 Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send quot;unsubscribequot; messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Terms of Service. [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Stock for $4 and no minimums. FREE Money 2002. http://us.click.yahoo.com/orkH0C/n97DAA/Ey.GAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send quot;unsubscribequot; messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW diesel question
i dont know the exact hp or torque, but after looking in my generator book your engine should have more than enough power. one thing you would have to do is put a belt driven governor on the motor to maintain the speed.dennis Tiastobio wrote: VW 1500-1600 HP/Torque vs RPM ? Can anyone provide a horsepower/torque vs RPM graph for the VW 1500 or 1600 non-turbo diesel engine? I would like these figures to see if a small imported generator end could provide 10-15 kilowatts when driven by a small VW diesel. I've seen the site with the belt driven homebuilt unit, but I would like to investigate the possibility of a direct-coupled homebuilt unit. Can any member give me a hand? -tiasto Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Stock for $4 and no minimums. FREE Money 2002. http://us.click.yahoo.com/orkH0C/n97DAA/Ey.GAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send quot;unsubscribequot; messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] VW diesel question
VW 1500-1600 HP/Torque vs RPM ? Can anyone provide a horsepower/torque vs RPM graph for the VW 1500 or 1600 non-turbo diesel engine? I would like these figures to see if a small imported generator end could provide 10-15 kilowatts when driven by a small VW diesel. I've seen the site with the belt driven homebuilt unit, but I would like to investigate the possibility of a direct-coupled homebuilt unit. Can any member give me a hand? -tiasto -- Powered by Outblaze Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Stock for $4 and no minimums. FREE Money 2002. http://us.click.yahoo.com/orkH0C/n97DAA/Ey.GAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send quot;unsubscribequot; messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW diesel question
I think you have the wrong motor, too high rpm.you would have to use gear reductiontry these people... http://www.chinadiesel.com/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Kwick Pick opens locked car doors, front doors, drawers, briefcases, padlocks, and more. On sale now! http://us.click.yahoo.com/ehaLqB/Fg5DAA/Ey.GAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send quot;unsubscribequot; messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW diesel question
check out http://www.webconx.dns2go.com/cogen.htm Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter: http://www.webconx.com/subscribe.htm Renewable Energy Pages - http://www.webconx.dns2go.com/ Human powered devices, equipment, and transport - http://www.webconx.dns2go.com/2000/humanpower.htm [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Tiastobio [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Monday, May 13, 2002 6:06 PM Subject: [biofuel] VW diesel question VW 1500-1600 HP/Torque vs RPM ? Can anyone provide a horsepower/torque vs RPM graph for the VW 1500 or 1600 non-turbo diesel engine? I would like these figures to see if a small imported generator end could provide 10-15 kilowatts when driven by a small VW diesel. I've seen the site with the belt driven homebuilt unit, but I would like to investigate the possibility of a direct-coupled homebuilt unit. Can any member give me a hand? -tiasto -- Powered by Outblaze Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send quot;unsubscribequot; messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Stock for $4 and no minimums. FREE Money 2002. http://us.click.yahoo.com/orkH0C/n97DAA/Ey.GAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send quot;unsubscribequot; messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW diesel question
On Mon, May 13, 2002 at 04:46:06PM -0700, Rik wrote: I think you have the wrong motor, too high rpm.you would have to use gear reductiontry these people... http://www.chinadiesel.com/ Don't know why you say the VW diesels are too high rpm. They've got more than enough power at 1800 rpm to give you 10-15kw. Perfect for that, in fact. Or 20kw. I wouldn't buy anything from chinadiesel on a bet, I've seen an awful lot of complaints from people who bought their gensets back during the Y2K thing, and frankly, the vast majority of the tools and other hardware I see imported from the PRC seems pretty crude. No real quality control apparantly. -- Harmon Seaver CyberShamanix http://www.cybershamanix.com Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Buy Stock for $4 and no minimums. FREE Money 2002. http://us.click.yahoo.com/orkH0C/n97DAA/Ey.GAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Biofuels list archives: http://archive.nnytech.net/ Please do NOT send quot;unsubscribequot; messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] VW Diesel 1.6l 0.040 Oversized Pistons...
Hello, Anyone have know where I can get some 0.040 (1mm) oversized pistons for my soon to be oil burning 1.6l VW diesel engine? If anyone has a set I'm interesting... Steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] = Steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Universal Inkjet Refill Kit $29.95 Refill any ink cartridge for less! Includes black and color ink. http://us.click.yahoo.com/r9F0cB/MkNDAA/ySSFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW Diesel Pumps
vw injector pumps are widely available, but a bit expensive ($350) and difficult to install. Steve Spence Subscribe to the Renewable Energy Newsletter: http://www.webconx.com/subscribe.htm Renewable Energy Pages - http://www.webconx.com Mirror Site http://www.webconx.dns2go.com/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] (212) 894-3704 x3154 - voicemail/fax We do not inherit the earth from our ancestors, we borrow it from our children. - Original Message - From: Andrew Layton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 12, 2001 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [biofuel] VW Diesel Pumps Hello all, I have some fairly rare, high tech methods of producing replicas and one-off parts. I run a Prototyping Laboratory at Georgia Institute of Technology and may be able to help reproduce parts (mechanical components) that are no longer available. As long as you have the original part, I can run a 3D laser scan and use the resulting data set to drive CNC equipment, etc. Also, if you want a one-off part and have a model in AutoCAD, Pro/E, or Solidworks (or any software that can save a drawing in a .STL format), I can work with the .STL file. If you have a rough sketch, I can draw it in AutoCAD for you (I will donate drawing time). Let me know if I can be of help, can't do it for free, but can do it at cost. Andrew Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- FREE COLLEGE MONEY CLICK HERE to search 600,000 scholarships! http://us.click.yahoo.com/Pv4pGD/4m7CAA/ySSFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [biofuel] VW Diesel Pumps
Hello all, I have some fairly rare, high tech methods of producing replicas and one-off parts. I run a Prototyping Laboratory at Georgia Institute of Technology and may be able to help reproduce parts (mechanical components) that are no longer available. As long as you have the original part, I can run a 3D laser scan and use the resulting data set to drive CNC equipment, etc. Also, if you want a one-off part and have a model in AutoCAD, Pro/E, or Solidworks (or any software that can save a drawing in a .STL format), I can work with the .STL file. If you have a rough sketch, I can draw it in AutoCAD for you (I will donate drawing time). Let me know if I can be of help, can't do it for free, but can do it at cost. Andrew Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get your FREE credit report with a FREE CreditCheck Monitoring Service trial http://us.click.yahoo.com/Gi0tnD/bQ8CAA/ySSFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
[biofuel] VW Diesel Pumps
Hello, I have two extra VW diesel pumps for the non-turbos of the '80. I think they need rebuilt but I have a local shop that does a bunch of these for one of the larger engine rebuilders around. They use Viton seals and he said that any biodiesel would work fine. Anyone interested? I could supply them either rebuilt or not rebuilt. The rebuild shop charges about $350 to go over the pump and put in new stuff. I hope the commercial nature of this dosen't offend anyone, if so I am sorry. I just thought you guys might have a need for these since they are getting hard to find. Please respond to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] . Thanks, Steve = Steve [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Make a great connection at Yahoo! Personals. http://personals.yahoo.com Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-- Get your FREE credit report with a FREE CreditCheck Monitoring Service trial http://us.click.yahoo.com/Gi0tnD/bQ8CAA/ySSFAA/FGYolB/TM -~- Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Please do NOT send unsubscribe messages to the list address. To unsubscribe, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
