Re: An 1816 vihuela

2005-03-08 Thread Monica Hall
I couldn't get through to the site - kept getting a message Gateway timeout. I was intrigued to learn recently though that Matanya thingks there never was a vihuela. What does he mean by this - that there weren't any 6-course flat backed figure of 8 shaped instrument in the 16th century?

Re: campanellas

2005-03-12 Thread Monica Hall
The tuning which Sanz (in Instruccion de musica (1674) recommends for playing baroque guitar music featuring campanellas and elaborate ornamentation is the re-entrant tuning. That is there are no low octave strings on the 4th and 5th courses so it is tuned aa d'd' gg bb e'. Anyone who plays

Re: tuning for Foscarini

2005-03-14 Thread Monica Hall
He doesn't specifically recommend any particular method of stringing for his music. However, he does include instructions for tuning the instrument which include a tuning check in octaves. One can assume from this that he expected at least some players to use octave stringing on both the 4th

Re: gee, it's cold in here ...

2005-05-12 Thread Monica Hall
I think everyone must have left the list in a huff. Pity really! Can't we think of some controversial comment to revive it? Monica - Original Message - From: Garry Bryan [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 6:12 PM Subject: RE: gee, it's cold in

Re: Vihuela stringing

2005-05-13 Thread Monica Hall
As I understand it the laud and vihuela de Flandes are different names for the same thing. He is calling the laud a vihuela de Flandes because it was played by Flemish musicians of whom there were many at the Spanish Court. But I may be wrong... Monica - Original Message - From: Lex

Re: Baroque guitar strings advice wanted

2005-05-13 Thread Monica Hall
Mine also has a string length of about 61cms. It is strung with Kurschner gut as follows 1st courseD 2046 2nd course D 2056 3rd courseD 2066 4th courseD 2050 D 2100 (bourdon) 5th courseCurrently Sofracob 0

Fw: S. de Murcia

2005-05-13 Thread Monica Hall
- Original Message - From: Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Eugene C. Braig IV [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 9:54 AM Subject: S. de Murcia At 01:12 PM 5/12/2005, Monica Hall wrote: How about - Santiago de Murcia never went to Mexico (there is actually no evidence

Re: S. de Murcia

2005-05-13 Thread Monica Hall
the sequel yet. Monica - Original Message - From: Lex Eisenhardt [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED]; vihuela vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 10:14 AM Subject: Re: S. de Murcia It may be a good subject for a Milos Forman movie: 'Santiago' So

Re: Antwort: Re: S. de Murcia

2005-05-14 Thread Monica Hall
This seems like the right moment to mention that Eloy has made a brilliant CD of music combining baroque sources with son jarocho. It's called Laberinto en la guitarra : el espiritu barroco del son jarocho. It's on the Urtext label (which I think is Mexican), maker's number is UMA 2018. The

Re: re-entrant tuning, las sirenas, jarana

2005-05-18 Thread Monica Hall
an adequate range of notes for his more complex music. For a more popular repertoire a re-entrant tuning may have been used. Monica - Original Message - From: bill kilpatrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: vihuela vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005

requintas

2005-05-19 Thread Monica Hall
The term requinta must refer to octave stringing on a course and not to the intervals between the courses. I have a photocopy of a Mexican cittern manuscript which also uses the term to refer to the 3rd course of the instrument which is strung in octaves. Possibly the term is derived from

Re: requintas

2005-05-19 Thread Monica Hall
the tuning looks for the note again, or has something missing. Monica - Original Message - From: Mathias Rösel [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: vihuela vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2005 5:37 PM Subject: Re: requintas Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: The term requinta must

Fw: vihuelina

2005-05-21 Thread Monica Hall
Sorry - I forgot to send this message to the list as well as Bill. I'm always doing that. Monica - Original Message - From: Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: bill kilpatrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 6:38 AM Subject: Re: vihuelina This came up some time ago

Re: bordón

2005-05-22 Thread Monica Hall
Not surprising really! In my modern dictionary it is defined as a pilgrim's staff i.e. a long pole like St. Christopher has to help him on his way, not as in office personel. Also as a helping hand. I managed to decipher the rest of what Corvarrubias says. The whole is as follows: BORDON en

Mudarra's bordon

2005-05-24 Thread Monica Hall
On 22nd May Lex wrote the following: That's exactly what a bourdon does. Probably that was what the temple viejo was designed for. When there is an interval of a fifth between the lowest strings of the guitar, the lowest one is used predominantly as an open string. It has always been used like

Re: Mudarra's bordon

2005-05-27 Thread Monica Hall
was suffering from the effects of too much red wine not Mudarra. Un abrazo a todo Monica - Original Message - From: Lex Eisenhardt [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED]; vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu; lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2005 9:59 PM Subject: Re: Mudarra's

Re: 4c. guitar structure

2005-05-31 Thread Monica Hall
- Original Message - From: bill kilpatrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: vihuela list vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Saturday, May 28, 2005 6:36 PM Subject: 4c. guitar structure a friend of mine on the charango site has suggested that structural differences (light bracing, thinner sound

Re: 4c. guitar structure

2005-06-01 Thread Monica Hall
which book are you reading? It's called Thomas More's Magician - a novel account of Utopia in Mexico by Toby Green, published in England by Weidenfeld Nicolson. Unfortunately it doesn't specify which instruments they made, but they were primarily for native musicians to play. ciao Monica

Re: Stefano Pesori

2005-06-17 Thread Monica Hall
Are the illustrations from the copy in the British Library? Not all are included in the facsimile published by S.P.E.S. Great to have them reproduced in this way! The music in the two copies varies too. The pieces are arranged in a different order and the facsimile includes a piece which

Re: Stefano Pesori

2005-06-17 Thread Monica Hall
P.S. The instrument you suggest is a manocordo looks like a 6-course cittern. It is being played by Orpheus. The cittern was held in high esteem in Italy during the Renaissance because of its supposed resemblance to the classical Kithara. Monica - Original Message - From: [EMAIL

Mudarra's bordon

2005-06-27 Thread Monica Hall
I have just been able consulted Emilio Pujol's edition of Mudarra. Appropos the stringing of the 4-course guitar he says: Tengase presente para el efecto auditivo, que las notas contenidas en el intervalo de quinta mas grave en el bajo cuando el temple de la guitarra es a los viejos y en el

Re: Baroque guitar in flat keys

2005-06-29 Thread Monica Hall
There are even pieces in F minor - with 4 flats. There is a whole suite in this key in Murcia's Resumen de acompanar and at least a couple of pieces by Corbetta - the Toccata at the beginning of his 1643 book and an Allemande in a manuscript copied by Jean Baptiste de Castillion. The sequences

Re: Re: Baroque guitar in flat keys

2005-07-01 Thread Monica Hall
but baroque guitarists were way ahead of every one else in their understanding of harmony and tonality. but the guitar has the really interesting harmonies. That's right - especially Corbetta There are many extraordinary harmonies in Baroque guitar music. Sometimes these arise from modifying

Re: Gerard Rebours and split string technique

2005-07-08 Thread Monica Hall
One way or another I listen to a lot of recordings of baroque guitar music and I get the impression that most people leave out one or other string of a course either by accident or design a lot of the time! Indeed some people seem to leave out whole courses when it suites them! Paul O'Dette for

Re: Baroque guitar in flat keys

2005-07-08 Thread Monica Hall
- Original Message - From: Mathias Rösel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: vihuela vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Friday, July 01, 2005 12:53 PM Subject: Re: Baroque guitar in flat keys Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] schrieb: Murcia, Matteis, Sanz and other Baroque guitarists wrote instructions

Re: Otras tres diferencias

2005-07-10 Thread Monica Hall
I think that these are two quite separate pieces. The Spanish translates better as Another three variations on 'Guardame las vacas' made on the other (or another) part - the other part being a different version of the bass line. In his dissertation on the vihuela John Ward says that the bass

Re: Otras tres diferencias

2005-07-10 Thread Monica Hall
associated with the chacona. Cheers Monica -Original Message- From: Monica Hall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 09 July 2005 15:43 To: Rob MacKillop Cc: vihuela Subject: Re: Otras tres diferencias I think that these are two quite separate pieces. The Spanish translates

Re: Rebours and split string technique

2005-07-12 Thread Monica Hall
Not much more one can say really. Looking back I think what Martyn said was the most helpful. You don't need to leave out one of other string of a course because you can play in such a way that one or the other predominates. I certainly do this a bit. And just as Martyn says you get used to

Bartolotti/Doisi de Velasco

2005-07-21 Thread Monica Hall
Sent: Tuesday, July 19, 2005 5:30 PM Subject: *** SPAM *** strumming and basses Monica Hall wrote: The problem here as I see it is that all these people who make recordings seem to think they have a hot line to the composer - they are very confident - to quote one of them - that the composer

[VIHUELA] BArtolotti

2005-07-24 Thread Monica Hall
We should maybe start a Bartolog? Haven't we already? I'm afraid this chicken and egg argument seems totally illogical to me. Given that the 4-3 suspension is stock in trade of all 17th century music I think it unlikely that Bartolotti only included it after he had decided to

[VIHUELA] Re: guitar continuo

2005-08-14 Thread Monica Hall
There are two treatises and lots of other references in guitar books to the use of the guitar as a continuo instrument. But are there any actual references outside of guitar publications to the use of the guitar as a continuo instrument? It depends a bit on what you mean by references. As

[VIHUELA] Re: guitar continuo

2005-08-19 Thread Monica Hall
It is my humble opinion (for what it is worth) that re-entrant stringing was the preferred option for the guitar because it worked best in practice with the kind of strings available until the end of the 17th century. What was the problem? Couldn't they use the same strings as

[VIHUELA] Re: New Sanz disc

2005-08-19 Thread Monica Hall
You've sold me. How does Gordon string for this disc? (I found the octave g' on Hoppy's disc a little off putting.) I'm happy to say he does exactly what Sanz says. No octave strings at all. I haven't heard it yet but I'm sure it will be really good. Monica To get on or off this list

[VIHUELA] Doizi de Velasco

2005-08-19 Thread Monica Hall
Whilst on the subject I would like to mention that Doizi de Velasco does say that when chords are played rasgado, the wrong inversions are acceptable. What he says is And although whichever method of stringing is used, some chords will still have a fourth in the bass, these can be made

[VIHUELA] Re: Doizi de Velasco

2005-08-20 Thread Monica Hall
Oh no. I just gave the example of the D major chord with an x on the 5th course. Can be made good any way you wish. Punteado or rasgado. (You mentioned rasgado, by the way) Why can't they be made good punteado? What are the obvious reasons? What Doizi says is it seems to me better

[VIHUELA] Re: *** SPAM *** Re: Doizi de Velasco

2005-08-22 Thread Monica Hall
I sincerely doubt if it is that.easy. There are situations in Foscarini's music that I find difficult to explain and where there is a choice to be made. He sometimes writes really crude dissonants. For those who have Foscarini at hand: try the first line of the Passacalle passegiate sopra l'E

[VIHUELA] Re: Doizi de Velasco

2005-08-25 Thread Monica Hall
E and I. I can't give you any other reasons as to why I think this should be left out. It just sounds horribly dissonant to me. Monica Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I forgot to send my reply to Martyn's query to the list as well as to Martyn which gives me an opportunity

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta

2005-08-30 Thread Monica Hall
The fifth example on B is actually a 4-3 rather than a 6th chord and in the first two examples and the last two the bass notes are an octave above those written in the bass part - in the tenor register in fact. Tenor, yes. But still the lowest note. That was the point. But that is

[VIHUELA] Re: Re: Foscarini/Corbetta

2005-08-30 Thread Monica Hall
I think we touch at a crucial point here. When we speak of guitar continuo there are very different treatises involved from writers departing from very divergent views. Their publications date from over a century. They also represent practices in different parts of Europe - in particular

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta

2005-08-31 Thread Monica Hall
I get the feeling from reading Monica that the entire corpus of evidence from the 17th and 18th century will (almost, 'in principle'...almost in an 'a priori' sort of way) never and can never settle the issue of tuning/stringing. I can't speak for Lex, but you have summed up my position quite

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta

2005-09-02 Thread Monica Hall
Strizich devoted a larger portion of his article(s) exactly to the question of the bass not being the lowest note. He mentiones the 'incorrect' inversions in the instructions of Fleury and Bartolotti, and he sees an argument in these to suppose a permissive attitude towards the appearance of

[VIHUELA] Re: Granata

2005-09-03 Thread Monica Hall
I borrowed the term chords as harmonic units without a functional bass from Gary Boye who uses it when referring to the continuo exercises of Granata and Valdambrini. This theory certainly applies to Valdambrini. But not to many exercicses of other composers, like Granata, as Robert

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta

2005-09-04 Thread Monica Hall
Have a look on p. 71 of the same book, LGR, last full bar of the second line. Do you suppose the dot above the d cipher on the 4th course means to leave that particular note out while still maintaining a barre? Otherwise you have the resolution note sounding against a dominant chord. It

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-04 Thread Monica Hall
I don't seem to have received Lex's latest message. Perhaps I have been black-balled. Can you send it again? Sanz says that guitarists in Rome use only thin strings. He doesn't comment on what guitarists elsewhere in Italy did - presumably because he didn't know. But Foscarini, Bartolotti

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta

2005-09-04 Thread Monica Hall
I have a much clearer print out of the copy in the British Library and this dot is not visible in it! I'd want to look at the original before commenting! Monica Have a look on p. 71 of the same book, LGR, last full bar of the second line. Do you suppose the dot above the d cipher on

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-04 Thread Monica Hall
Maybe Lex forgot to send it to the list? Thank you for this summary of your views Lex. After reading it I went to Corbetta 1648 and, indeed, the style of writing (especially the use of chords on the three 'lowest' courses) does seem rather different to his post 1671 stuff. I had previously

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-05 Thread Monica Hall
and the style of play it's difficult to be certain but page 72 is 'normal' interval tuning and, as I mentioned earlier, the melody here is on the fourth course. M Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I don't know whether Lex is referring to the scordatura pieces (I can't spot any three

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-06 Thread Monica Hall
I wouldn't know. The pieces by Colista for guitar that I've seen are mediocre. I happen to Like Bartolotti and Corbetta As you haven't seen it, other than in two manuscripts copied in the 18th century you can't evaluate it. All that you can say is that you know nothing about it. So

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-06 Thread Monica Hall
They actually work just as well for the French tuning. The 5th course is tuned in unison at the upper octave. When it is stopped at the 5th fret, the thin string of the 4th course - which is next to it - can be tuned in unison with it. When the 4th course is stopped at the 5th

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-06 Thread Monica Hall
In the third bar it goes onto the 2nd course - But don't forget that from here to the end most of the notes on the 4th course will also sound an octave higher - creating a completely different treble line from what you imagine. it doesn't matter that there's no strict voice leading

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-06 Thread Monica Hall
Then Corbetta is to blame, he does that sort of thing all the time. Not Corbetta - You! Alfabeto chords do not have a functional bass note - or rather they are all in root position. This is simply an F minor chord. Indeed unsatisfactory. But where is the d from the fourth course going? No

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-06 Thread Monica Hall
Within few years someone will prove that they used an octave e'' to the first course. This is complete nonsense, Indeed, that's what it is. Sometimes I'm not sure whether you are serious either! I thought at first you were joking about including all the open courses in Foscarini -

[VIHUELA] Re: proposed name change

2005-09-06 Thread Monica Hall
I vote for Baroque guitar. Early guitar could even be Villa-Lobos on gut strings. Lex I second that - never could abide Giuliani - heresy I know. Monica Hi folks - There is currently a discussion on the lute list concerning Beethoven and Giuliani which really has nothing

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-07 Thread Monica Hall
If you wanted to avoid string break you wouldn't start with the 5th course at all. If you tune the 5th course too high, when you get to the 1st course - ping - off it goes! Still that is what the instructions say: 'tune the fifth course to a convenient pitch' or 'the fifth may be tuned

[VIHUELA] Re: Foscarini/Corbetta - low basses

2005-09-07 Thread Monica Hall
Pesori - he has probably copied Foscarini in Galeria musicale. The tuning check is not the same. The fact that tuning charts are all similar doesn't say they are copied. Still don't clearly mention octave stringing. I took it from 'Recreazioni armoniche' Now I see that it is probably from

[VIHUELA] Re: Luis Milan

2005-09-07 Thread Monica Hall
I believe that Tess Knighton is preparing a translation of this but as far as I am aware it has not yet appeared in print. I am hoping to read it myself when it does. Monica - Original Message - From: Fossum, Arthur [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Vihuela Net vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent:

[VIHUELA] Re: rasgueo

2005-09-13 Thread Monica Hall
Subject: Re: [VIHUELA] Re: rasgueo I think the correct Spanish spelling is rasgueado or rasgado from the verb rasguear - to strum. (At least in the 17th century). rasqueado is the proper (spanish) spelling of the word but the bolivian source spelled it rasgueo. are there

[VIHUELA] Re: ??

2005-10-03 Thread Monica Hall
The second question is about the guitar in a basso continuo environment. I am looking for information, listings of instrumentation, descriptions or otherwise, that could make clear that the guitar was used in Opera, Ballet or instrumental (or instrumental/vocal) ensembles. I've seen Biagio

[VIHUELA] Re: rain ...origins of guitar

2005-10-23 Thread Monica Hall
Laurence Wright argues that the medieval citole developed into the Renaissance cittern and the medieval gittern into the Renaissance guitar. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/s.walsh Gitterns - lute-shaped, round-backed, plectrum-plucked instruments somehow morph into waisted, flat or fluted

[VIHUELA] Re: [VIHUELA] Re: [VIHUELA] Re: [VIHUELA] bord ón - revisited

2005-10-26 Thread Monica Hall
i take da mano to mean handy, i.e. portable, in which case the ronrocco is a handy vihuela. De mano doesn't mean handy! It means that it is played with the fingers of the right hand rather than with a plectrum Monica Nowhere nearly as pretty in look and sound. i'd love to

[VIHUELA] Re: What is the historical vihuela?

2005-10-26 Thread Monica Hall
None of the other images of so-called vihuelas look much like the Milan (El Maestro) version, in fact they don't resemble each other much either. Nor do any of the surviving instruments which we label vihuelas or possible vihuelas. I have pictures of the most 'important' ones on my site:

[VIHUELA] Re: vihuela and viola

2005-11-02 Thread Monica Hall
Professor John Griffiths is widely recognised as one of the top two or three academics specialising in the vihuela. I have just received this from him. Rob ''The Dias copy is an excellent choice. I know it's controversial, but I have found a heap of documentation on vihuelas that has not

[VIHUELA] Re: vihuela and viola

2005-11-03 Thread Monica Hall
Alexander, You say we have absolutely no idea what sort of barring arrangement violas might have had. But surely we - or makers like you - do have some idea. Some violas look very similar to vihuelas, and were made at roughly the same time, and not geographically distant and play the same

[VIHUELA] Re: [LUTE] Re: Re: What is the historical vihuela?

2005-11-03 Thread Monica Hall
According to Bermudez, the string-length is 727 cm., quite large for a solo instrument, but taking into account its late date, and the fact that it probably was the instrument used by Santa Mariana de Jesus to accompany herself singing devout songs, it seems likely that it may have been

[VIHUELA] Re: [LUTE] Re: Re: What is the historical vihuela?

2005-11-03 Thread Monica Hall
I would agree with you regarding the stretches in chords such as N and L, but, while they might have been favourites of Corbetta, they are not necessary for simple chordal accompaniments as one would presume Santa Mariana might have played. I would be tempted to imagine that the Saint

[VIHUELA] Re: What is the hysterical vihuela?

2005-11-03 Thread Monica Hall
Monica Hall wrote: I can't see either why there should be any advantage in having a longer string length when accompanying, unless it is to tune to a lower pitch. This is not necessary if you are a member of the fair sex accompanying yourself either. But an alto singing a song

[VIHUELA] Re: What is the historical vihuela?

2005-11-12 Thread Monica Hall
But we are not talking about the theorbo - which consists mostly of unstopped strings anyway and in the 17th century would more often have been played by professional players who would have been men, rather than by nuns or young ladies in general. Still - Alexander has dispelled most of my

[VIHUELA] Re: Vihuela tutor book

2005-12-14 Thread Monica Hall
I have reviewed it for the Lute Society. Review should be in the next issue of Lute. Will be happy to translate anything if John is too busy. Monica - Original Message - From: Rob MacKillop [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Tuesday, December 13, 2005 10:39 PM

[VIHUELA] Baroque guitar picture

2005-12-28 Thread Monica Hall
Don't know how many of you receive Hispanica Lyra the journal of the Spanish Vihuela Society, but the latest issue has a reproduction of a very nice picture attributed to Francesco Gentileschi of a young man tuning his guitar to a keyboard instrument. He appears to be tuning the 4th course to

[VIHUELA] Re: singing along with fantasias

2006-01-20 Thread Monica Hall
I just wonder if, in addition to any didactic purpose, Daza (and as you say, Pisador) had a particular sonority in mind. I wonder if anyone has tried adding a vocal part as indicated? Not that I know of. I've never heard anyone play much Pisador - not surprisingly as it is not very good.

[VIHUELA] Re: Marizapalos words

2006-01-26 Thread Monica Hall
I think they exist in several different versions. Russell gives as his source for the verses he quotes as Cotarelo y Mori's Coleccion de entremeses from which indeed he seems to have taken most of his information. This is in 2 vols. There is a copy in the British Library. Robert Stevenson also

[VIHUELA] Re: Mean tone temperament

2006-03-24 Thread Monica Hall
I think you should join the main lute list and ask the question there too. There have been many discussions about temperaments and (I think they're called) tastini on lutes and theorbos. Tastini is the word I was trying to think of. I'm reluctant to join the lute list as you get so many

[VIHUELA] Re: Christ's Cross

2006-04-05 Thread Monica Hall
The cross symbol in Brizeno's notation (Castilian cifras in modern day jargon) represents the D major chord. The fingering of this is sort of cross shaped and the chord was known in Spain as cruzado. The term is even in the Diccionaro de autoridades. Other chords have names which in some way

[VIHUELA] Re: Christ's Cross

2006-04-05 Thread Monica Hall
Well - for sure Montesardo never invented alfabeto. I have copies of two manuscript dated 1599 which use it. Monica - Original Message - From: Stewart McCoy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Vihuela List vihuela@cs.dartmouth.edu Sent: Wednesday, April 05, 2006 2:35 PM Subject: [VIHUELA] Christ's

[VIHUELA] Foscarin/Pesori

2006-06-29 Thread Monica Hall
Hi list Last year when we were discussing Foscarini the question of including open courses in strummed chords came up. Recently I came across this passage in Pesori's Galeria musicale (p.3) which seems to cast some light on the matter. My Italian is a bit basic so I wonder whether I have

[VIHUELA] Re: New De Murcia manuscript

2006-09-21 Thread Monica Hall
Great news indeed!!! what it says briefly for those who can't read Spanish is A manuscript of 1722 containing 87 dances has been discovered in Chile by Alejandro Vera. Bound in goat skin it is the oldest volume dedicated entirely to guitar in Latin America and the fourth by Murcia. I wonder

[VIHUELA] Re: [vihue-lista] Santiago de Murcia

2006-09-22 Thread Monica Hall
, Antonio - Original Message From: Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, 21 September, 2006 4:00:52 PM Subject: [vihue-lista] Santiago de Murcia Hola Amigos Parece que un nuevo manuscrito de Murcia ha sido descubierto en Chile. Vea esto http

[VIHUELA] Re: [vihue-lista] Santiago de Murcia

2006-09-23 Thread Monica Hall
M. Ms, but perhaps my searching skills in Spanish are just not up to the task. Regards, Daniel Heiman On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 10:00:14 +0100 Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I had the attached message from Antonio after posting the info on the Spanish vihuela list. It seems

[VIHUELA] Re: Cifras Selectas de Guitarra - Murcia

2006-09-27 Thread Monica Hall
If anyone is interested this is the link to another article about the new Murcia ms. Monica - Original Message - From: Francisco Valdivia To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2006 8:35 PM Subject: *** SPAM *** Cifras Selectas de Guitarra Hola Monica: No se si te

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tuning?

2006-10-14 Thread Monica Hall
- Original Message - From: Monica Hall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Lex Eisenhardt [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2006 8:26 PM Subject: Re: [VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tuning? I am not on the lute list so have missed the beginning of this discussion

[VIHUELA] Why re-entrant tuning?

2006-10-14 Thread Monica Hall
Having now read Gordon's message I think he is making some very valid points. Recently I was able to borrow a cittern for a few months and the advantages of a re-entrant tuning were immediatly obvious as soon as I began to play (rather badly) with a plectrum. If you are strumming chords it

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tuning?

2006-10-15 Thread Monica Hall
really believe that guitarists would have lost any sleep over them. Monica Regards, Michael [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] -Original Message- From: Monica Hall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, October 14, 2006 2:29 PM To: vihuela Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: Why re

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tuning?

2006-10-15 Thread Monica Hall
If you are strumming chords it doesn't matter if the lowest sounding course is in the middle but having treble strings outermost makes the playing of a single melodic line with up and down strokes of the plectum much easier and cleaner. That is an interesting thought. If we compare to the

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tuning?

2006-10-15 Thread Monica Hall
According to Ian Harwood's book on the Rose bandora gut was often used for the highest course on wire strung instruments because suitable wire was not available. Apparently the instrument is strung like that now. Monica Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tuning? Martyn, The stringlength

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tuning?

2006-10-15 Thread Monica Hall
] Re: Why re-entrant tuning? Dear Monica As I understand this CS2 is from the late 17th c. It is hard to tell if -and how- the mutual influence from cittern and guitar has worked out. It certainly could be a subject where we guitarists could learn some. It would be difficult to date. The

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tuning?

2006-10-16 Thread Monica Hall
There is another interesting paper on wire strung guitars in the most recent Galpin Society Journal. Darryl Martin The early wire-strung guitar - G.S.J. no. 59, May 2006, p.123-137. M - Original Message - From: Martyn Hodgson [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Lex Eisenhardt [EMAIL PROTECTED];

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tuning?

2006-10-16 Thread Monica Hall
On the frontpage of Corbetta's book from 1639 there are two guitars depicted. The one at the right is clearly a guitar with the strings fixed at the end of the corpus. The strings go over the bridge. Maybe strings of wire. The only problem here is that it would be possible to set up an

[VIHUELA] Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-17 Thread Monica Hall
Having got as far as the chapter on the theorbo in Linda's dissertation it seems worth quoting some of the things which she says - on p.51-2 - i.e. It is very difficult to string a single peg box lute in gut so that all the strings sound well over its wide range. The larger the lute, the

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-17 Thread Monica Hall
I think especially for open air performance the plain gut basses of the five course guitar are not very useful. The 'musica ruidosa' that Sanz speaks of could refer to another (indoor?) situation. 'el que quiere taner guitarra para hazer musica ruidosa, o accompagnarse el baxo con alguno

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-17 Thread Monica Hall
Players who think that somehow guitar music can and must conform to a very narrow interpretation of the rules of music theory are following the wrong star altogether! As do scholars who think that the rules of music would not apply to the guitar The emphasis is on narrow

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-17 Thread Monica Hall
Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings Apart from this specific case: who is to decide whether arguments are pseudo-academic. To take everything on the paper for granted is not necessarily 'more scientific'. The very unusual (maybe even unique) harmonic language of Corbetta is in

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-18 Thread Monica Hall
Corbetta's harmony is by no means unique. It is a feature of the strummed repertoire. Nearly all of Corbetta's dissonance can be explained in this way. I simply do not agree with your view on Corbetta's style. Your explanations do not make much sense to me. When I say his harmony is

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-18 Thread Monica Hall
I'm sorry to hear that you understand it like this. I was able to convince quite some well-informed colleagues. Well - unless I know who they are I can't of course comment. I have considered all that. In a way all dissonant chords are 'altered alfabeto chords'. (Except indeed L) Standard

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-18 Thread Monica Hall
from which they may have copied. They even could have written from memory, though that would have been difficult) On the contrary - this is thought to be the way in which much baroque guitar music circulated - which is why it varies. In the 17th century people probably had better memories and

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-19 Thread Monica Hall
It has struck me in the past few years that certain leading scholars have changed their minds on the subject of the stringing of the five course guitar in their writings. I just found some of our e-mail exchanges on my harddisk. I would suggest that we both play this fair, Dr. Hall. Unless I

[VIHUELA] Why re-entrant tuning?

2006-10-20 Thread Monica Hall
Lex The last message I sent to your address came back to me undelivered. Monica -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-21 Thread Monica Hall
Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings Dear Lex/List This is really a personal message to Lex which I hope the rest of the list will excuse. Lex - all my messages to you come back Delivery temporarily suspended. You are getting my messages from the list. As I have a similar problem

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings

2006-10-22 Thread Monica Hall
Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings On Oct 22, 2006, at 4:35 AM, Monica Hall wrote: I keyed it into my computer so that I could listen to it because when you are playing there are other things to think about.The underlying harmonic structure is quite simple. So do you

[VIHUELA] Why re-entrant tunings?

2006-10-22 Thread Monica Hall
Monica, This is an off list message. I hope you can fix the Internet problems. It seems I can be reached by others and over the Vihuela net. I have to reply to this on the list but as one person has expressed an interest I hope that is ok and there is nothing in it which is really private.

[VIHUELA] Re: Why re-entrant tunings?

2006-10-23 Thread Monica Hall
Hi Lex I think it is not always easy to decide which open courses should be included in the strum when the tablature doesn't give information (for example when dots are missing, with Corbetta). Let me give just two examples that can cause headaches: p.69 2nd line, bar 2 and, more painful, 5th

  1   2   3   4   5   6   7   8   9   >