On Feb 12, 9:03 am, Quentin Anciaux <allco...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 2011/2/12 1Z <peterdjo...@yahoo.com>
>

> > > > However, they don't exist, so there is no mystery. You just
> > > > have to pretend they do in order to play certain games.
>
> > > However they do exists...
>
> > Proof?
>
> I can think about them. I exist.
>
> >  >you don't have to pretend to play games... what
> > > does it mean to pretend something exists ?
>
> > And you from the brithplace of Marcel Marceau!
>
> ?

"I'm pretending I'm walking into the wind"..."now I'm pretending I'm
in a glass box"...


> > > All your definitions of existing lies down to interaction with you
> > > (RITSTIAR)... You are so sure by what you mean by real, that it has so
> > much
> > > sense that you could not look beyond...
>
> > I don't need to. Existing abstract objects, ie numbers, explain
> > nothing about our ability to think about  abstract objects ,
> > since they can't interact with our brains. (Benacerraf)
>
> They interact with mine,

Interesting. How do you know? I mean, the idea that abstract
objects don't interact with concrete object is usually regarded
as a logical truth (and one that realists concede as well as anti
realists,
which makes Benacerraf's argument powerful. But, hey, if you know
better....)

> I can think about them, that's an interaction, I
> don't invent them. I do not decide their properties.
>
>
>
> > > I don't agree with your definition
> > > even with RITSTIAR just because I don't know what makes me real and I
> > don't
> > > know in what sense I'm more real than you or not... but I'm sure I'm more
> > > real than you from my own POV.
>
> > I don't think I need to worry about how real I am for my argument to
> > go through
>
> I think it does because you insist about RITSTIAR...

I am in less doubt about my own reality than anything else...It don't
need
to throw insistence at it to *make*it true..

>and I don't know if you
> are Real In the sense that *I* am real

Maybe you don't. But the point is that you don't have to believe
that I am real...from your perspective, the point is you are real. And
that your reality is  not the result of "the usual mathematical sense
of existence"

>... I don't know either in what sense
> I'm real,

It doesn't matter what sense. It is some non-zero sense, so any
argument
about my reality must assume something about reality.

>does it mean something beyond the fact that I can die and no more
> be real if it's what it is ?

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