On 6/22/2012 8:04 PM, meekerdb wrote:

On 6/22/2012 4:49 PM, Stephen P. King wrote:Hameroff is a crackpot. If microtubles were the source ofconsciousness my finger would be conscious; microtubles are inalmost all cells.## Advertising

OK, that solves it, just call him a crackpot and sit back andwonder why no progress occurs. I think that the sensitivity might beset too high on your crackpot meter. ;-)Or yours is set too low. What difference would it make if one foundquantum computation in microtubles?

`Not quantum computation per se, phenomena that becomes possible`

`when one has coherent states available. Quantum computation is one use`

`of this feature of coherence of entanglement. It allows one to use the`

`EPR effect to alter the duration of an interaction event such that`

`measurements of its conjugate are possible. The canonical conjugate to`

`transition duration is Energy.`

and for some reason only in the microtubles in brain cells.

`Those particular structures have the necessry topological`

`properties required to implement a topological quantum computer, which`

`is just another way of talking about begin able to select a scale`

`(measure) of the total energy (Hamiltonian) of a system. This is about`

`"time" uncertainty. It is a hair-brained theory of mine that does not`

`even rise to crackpot status how this would work, but I am not here to`

`boost my own theory, I am trying to get a good handle on this COMP stuff.`

Would that show that computation done by classical computerscouldn't be conscious?

`Not unless we can show that a QM system can pass the ultimate`

`Turing test and a classical system cannot. What would make this test`

`ultimate is that it was to be judged by all possible entities that can`

`believe (ala Bruno's definition) that they themselves are conscious. In`

`this way we short-circuit observer bias.`

Would it show that any computation by microtubles was conscious.

`Yes. It would offer justification of the idea of panpsychism (but`

`not proof!).`

Has Hashameroff et al show how microtubles in cells could computesomething?

Yes. Watch the linked talk; it is described.

Do you suppose that high level intelligence can exist withoutconsciouness?

No, not one that can pass my version of a Turing test.

Do you suppose computers (without quantum computation) cannotachieve high level intelligence?

No. -- Onward! Stephen "Nature, to be commanded, must be obeyed." ~ Francis Bacon -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.