On Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:25:51 AM UTC-5, yanniru wrote: > > Craig, > > The monads themselves are sensitive,
How? Why? > being able to map or reflect or > perceive the rest of the universe instantly. That means that this capacity of reflection and perception is more primitive than the monads themselves. > Whether they care or not > is beyond the scope of science. That's a cop out. The truth is the only scope of science. > Not seeing any difference is your > problem. Richard > Ok, but why should I want to fix this problem? Why does it matter which shapes are fundamental? It's like arguing whether percussion, wind, or stringed instruments are responsible for music. Craig > > On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 9:16 AM, Craig Weinberg > <whats...@gmail.com<javascript:>> > wrote: > > I don't really see much of a difference whether we talk about BECs, > strings, > > charged geometries, vacuum flux, aether, numbers, or any other spatially > > structured medium. Who cares? The question is how does that begin to > know > > about something and to care about it? > > > > > > On Wednesday, January 16, 2013 9:08:35 AM UTC-5, rclough wrote: > >> > >> Hi Richard Ruquist > >> > >> OK, I was thinking about appying Leibniz to it. > >> > >> [Roger Clough], [rcl...@verizon.net] > >> 1/16/2013 > >> "Forever is a long time, especially near the end." - Woody Allen > >> ----- Receiving the following content ----- > >> From: Richard Ruquist > >> Receiver: everything-list > >> Time: 2013-01-16, 08:59:49 > >> Subject: Re: Fwd: the curse of materialism > >> > >> > >> Roger, Any kind of particle from photons and light up to molecules can > >> form a BEC. BEC is a mathematical object and not confined to any one > >> substance. Even physical BECs have properties that are effectively > >> outside spacetime. > >> Richard > >> > >> On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 8:48 AM, Roger Clough wrote: > >> > Hi Richard Ruquist > >> > > >> > That sounds fine, except the BEC is not something specific, it is > >> > not a mind or brain, it is matter. I imagine that it condenses in > >> > some container held near 0oC. That condensate could be > >> > considered to be a monad or substance. And it could of course > >> > be conscious in some way, but it has nothing to do with being human. > >> > It is not even a brain in a vat. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > [Roger Clough], [rcl...@verizon.net] > >> > 1/16/2013 > >> > "Forever is a long time, especially near the end." - Woody Allen > >> > ----- Receiving the following content ----- > >> > From: Richard Ruquist > >> > Receiver: everything-list > >> > Time: 2013-01-16, 07:47:52 > >> > Subject: Fwd: the curse of materialism > >> > > >> > > >> > Roger, > >> > I liked your "1p think therefore 1p am" > >> > > >> > But your statement below, although correct , is much too vague. > >> > > >> > Quantum mechanics is not understood because it is not complete. > >> > Feynman came close to completing it but still missed an essential > >> > property. > >> > > >> > That property is that the quantum mind has instant action. > >> > Something you have been preaching for some time. > >> > With instant action, the quantum mind can be understood. > >> > > >> > Instant action derives directly from your claim that > >> > the quantum mind from monads to quantum fields > >> > are out side of spacetime. > >> > > >> > I just add that it is effectively out of spacetime > >> > because the quantum mind is a > >> > Bose-Einstein Condensate BEC. > >> > which allows the monads to be distributed thru-out the universe yet > >> > act as though they were out of spacetime. > >> > Richard > >> > > >> > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > >> > From: Roger Clough > >> > Date: Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 5:01 AM > >> > Subject: the curse of materialism > >> > To: everything-list > >> > > >> > > >> > Hi socr...@bezeqint.net > >> > > >> > You want to know why nobody understands QM ? > >> > Because QM is nonphysical, but is treated as being physical. > >> > This might be called the curse of materialism. > >> > > >> > > >> > [Roger Clough], [rcl...@verizon.net] > >> > 1/16/2013 > >> > "Forever is a long time, especially near the end." - Woody Allen > >> > ----- Receiving the following content ----- > >> > From: socr...@bezeqint.net > >> > Receiver: Everything List > >> > Time: 2013-01-15, 11:20:20 > >> > Subject: Re: Science is a religion by itself. > >> > > >> > > >> > Physics and Metaphysics. > >> > > >> > John Polkinghorne and his book ? Quantum theory?. > >> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Polkinghorne > >> > === . > >> > > >> > John Polkinghorne took epigraph for his book ? Quantum theory? > >> > the Feynman? thought : ? I think I can safely say that > >> > nobody understands quantum mechanics. ? > >> > Why? > >> > Because, he wrote: > >> > ? ,we do not understand the theory as fully as we should. > >> > We shall see in what follows that important interpretative > >> > issues remain unresolved. They will demand for their > >> > eventual settlement not only physical insight but also > >> > metaphysical decision ?. > >> > / preface/ > >> > ? Serious interpretative problems remain unresolved, > >> > and these are the subject of continuing dispute? > >> > / page 40/ > >> > ? If the study of quantum physics teaches one anything, > >> > it is that the world is full of surprises? > >> > / page 87 / > >> > ? Metaphysical criteria that the scientific community take > >> > very seriously in assessing the weight to put on a theory > >> > include: . . . .? > >> > / page 88 / > >> > ?uantum theory is certainly strange and surprising, . . .? > >> > / page92 / > >> > ? Wave / particle duality is a highly surprising and > >> > instructive phenomenon, . .? > >> > / page 92 / > >> > ==. > >> > In my opinion John Polkinghorne was right writing > >> > what to understand and to solve the problems of the Universe: > >> > ? They will demand for their eventual settlement not only > >> > physical insight but also metaphysical decision ?. > >> > / preface / > >> > And, maybe, Aristotle was right separating the world and knowledge > >> > on two parts: Physics and Metaphysics. > >> > === . > >> > Somebody wrote: > >> > The science will purify the religion of the ?ross?. > >> > I agree. > >> > ===========. > >> > Best wishes. > >> > Israel Sadovnik Socratus. > >> > ===. > >> > > >> > -- > >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> > Groups "Everything List" group. > >> > To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. > >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> > everything-li...@googlegroups.com. > >> > For more options, visit this group at > >> > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > >> > > >> > -- > >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> > Groups "Everything List" group. > >> > To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. > >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> > everything-li...@googlegroups.com. > >> > For more options, visit this group at > >> > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > >> > > >> > -- > >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> > Groups "Everything List" group. > >> > To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. > >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> > everything-li...@googlegroups.com. > >> > For more options, visit this group at > >> > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > >> > > >> > -- > >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> > Groups "Everything List" group. > >> > To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. > >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> > everything-li...@googlegroups.com. > >> > For more options, visit this group at > >> > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > >> > > >> > >> -- > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > >> "Everything List" group. > >> To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com. > >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> everything-li...@googlegroups.com. > >> For more options, visit this group at > >> http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > > "Everything List" group. > > To view this discussion on the web visit > > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/everything-list/-/mnLD8PFZdYEJ. > > > > To post to this group, send email to > > everyth...@googlegroups.com<javascript:>. > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > everything-li...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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