Chris de Morsella <cdemorse...@yahoo.com> wrote: > I am just asking you to acknowledge you were incorrect in characterizing > the popular and democratically elected leaders of sovereign states as "two > bit" leaders. >
Would you prefer a "Banana Republic Leaders"? In Iran in 1953 women, half the human race, were not allowed to hold office or even vote, but today the elected officials accurately carry out the wishes of the majority of their superstitious constituents. And that is why Iran is such a hellhole, imprisoning people for naming their Teddy Bear "Mohamed", forcing young girls to undergo genital mutilation, and making woman wear the equivalent of a hazmat suit 24/7. How about this, in the future I promise to give such democratically elected leaders all the respect they deserve. > You have acknowledged that you were in fact incorrect > Where the hell did I do that?? > > I am going to have to disagree with your peonage to the fascist regime > of the Pavlavi family dynasty; don't think it was a good thing to install > that brutal fascist regime and associate our country with all the > repression, torture and killing that the Savak - the Sha's secret police > -- engaged in. > Oh the Shah was a brutal monster no doubt about it, but he didn't murder significantly more of his own people than the typical leader of a Islamic country, and he was a pussycat compared to the leaders of Iraq or Syria or Indonesia. Most important of all from the CIA's point of view he didn't try to push the rest of the world back into the ninth century. > > The 1979 revolution in Iran has roots that can be convincingly traced > back to that earlier CIA backed coup > It was a very bad thing that in 1979 a bunch of loonies took over Iran who were so stupid that they actually took the imbecilic teachings of the Islamic religion seriously, but it would have been even worse if they became boss in 1953; at least from 1953 to 1979 the human misery caused by that mind virus was largely confined to the borders of Iran. But is the world really a better place because of the CIA's action 60 years ago, would the Islamic revolution really have happened in 1953 not 1979 without their intervention? I think it probable that it would have but I could be wrong and reasonable men can disagree about this. But I do not think a reasonable person can say that the world is a better place because of 911, nor that the world is a better place because the Arabs supported Hitler, in fact I think such a person, and anybody who fails to denounce him (and I'm looking at you Chris) has all the morality and intelligence of a baboon in heat. > >>To my mind if something is democratic that does not automatically mean >> it occupies the moral high ground. Hitler gained power legally, and a >> recent opinion poll showed that 64% of the Muslims in Egypt and Pakistan >> think the death penalty should be invoked for anyone who leaves Islam, and >> in Afghanistan 78% think so. And in Iraq and Afghanistan 60% think that >> the killing of female family members by men should be legal if the women >> "sully" the family honor. Would you really be upset if somebody prevented >> these democratic practices from being implemented? I wouldn't be. >> > > > Are you trying to say that it was the correct and moral course of action > to overthrow these two democratically elected leaders and then to support > the fascist regimes that we installed in their place? > I'm saying that being democratic and being moral are not the same thing, I'm saying that replacing a evil democratic regime which exports grief worldwide with a evil fascist regime that just torments its own people is probably a very good idea, or at least a better idea than doing nothing. It worked pretty well in Iran for 26 years, and may have been the best worst decision. John K Clark > * > * > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to email@example.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.