On 25 Oct 2013, at 22:28, meekerdb wrote:

On 10/25/2013 9:08 AM, John Clark wrote:
On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 5:00 PM, Quentin Anciaux <allco...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Be consistent, reject MWI, or ask *the same question* about the probability of *you* (who is you ? pinocchio maybe ?)

In the MWI John Clark doesn't have to worry about who "you" is because however many copies of "you" there may or may not be they will never meet and John Clark will never see more than one copy of Quentin Anciaux. But in Bruno's thought experiment that is no longer true, so to continue to blithely babble on about "you" causes nothing but confusion.

I don't see why that is determinative. Suppose the M-man never meets the W-man and in fact neither of them even knows whether the other one exists?


> measuring spin up while measuring the spin of an electron

And probability implies prediction and prediction has nothing to do with a sense of self, and that is what Bruno's "proof" is all about. If when you pressed the button you were 99% certain, in fact even if you were 100% certain and there was not the tiniest particle of doubt in your mind that you would end up in Washington, and one second later you found yourself in Moscow your sense of self would not be diminished one iota, you'd just figure that you made a bad prediction, and it wouldn't be for the first time.

Sure, and if the experiment were repeated N times then most of the 2^N participants would find, consulting their diaries, that they were right about half the time and wrong the half - and, even after comparing notes with one another, they would decide that Bernoulli trials are a good model of what happens when being teleported via Bruno's duplicator.



> Your agenda is not to try to comprehend something, it is just to bash someone with no reason except misplaced pride.

Ask yourself this question, why aren't Bruno's ideas universally recognized by the scientific community as a work of genius? There are 2 possibilities:

1) Due to the same misplaced pride that I have the entire scientific community is jealous of Bruno and would rather destroy a stunning new advancement in human knowledge than admit they didn't find it first.

2) The entire scientific community has run into the exact same logical stumbling block in Bruno's ideas that I did.

Or they consider this particular idea, uncertainty via duplication, to be a commonplace and uncontroversial. Most people (including me) find the last two steps of Bruno's argument more suspect in which he argues that all possible computation is the fundamental basis of the material world.

Some people, knowing rather well Church thesis and computer science find those part non controversial, and so feels that they have to stop early in the reasoning, like step 3 (John Clark, or even step 0, like Bill Taylor). My "real" opponents does not want to admit that anything could be controversial, as this would already lead to some recognizance, and they want me to be ignored at all price, for reason unrelated to anything on the topics. My "real" opponents tended to consider AI and even QM as crackpot, in fact they even fight against the whole of computer science. Some pure mathematicians are like that. They hate applied mathematics, especially when you suggest that some part of pure mathematics can have applications. But it is worst than that. Some scandal are hidden with the goal of hiding worst scandal. Humans can be very grave sometimes.

Bruno





Brent


  John K Clark







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