On 25 Oct 2013, at 22:28, meekerdb wrote:
On 10/25/2013 9:08 AM, John Clark wrote:
On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 5:00 PM, Quentin Anciaux
<[email protected]> wrote:
> Be consistent, reject MWI, or ask *the same question* about the
probability of *you* (who is you ? pinocchio maybe ?)
In the MWI John Clark doesn't have to worry about who "you" is
because however many copies of "you" there may or may not be they
will never meet and John Clark will never see more than one copy of
Quentin Anciaux. But in Bruno's thought experiment that is no
longer true, so to continue to blithely babble on about "you"
causes nothing but confusion.
I don't see why that is determinative. Suppose the M-man never
meets the W-man and in fact neither of them even knows whether the
other one exists?
> measuring spin up while measuring the spin of an electron
And probability implies prediction and prediction has nothing to do
with a sense of self, and that is what Bruno's "proof" is all
about. If when you pressed the button you were 99% certain, in fact
even if you were 100% certain and there was not the tiniest
particle of doubt in your mind that you would end up in Washington,
and one second later you found yourself in Moscow your sense of
self would not be diminished one iota, you'd just figure that you
made a bad prediction, and it wouldn't be for the first time.
Sure, and if the experiment were repeated N times then most of the
2^N participants would find, consulting their diaries, that they
were right about half the time and wrong the half - and, even after
comparing notes with one another, they would decide that Bernoulli
trials are a good model of what happens when being teleported via
Bruno's duplicator.
> Your agenda is not to try to comprehend something, it is just to
bash someone with no reason except misplaced pride.
Ask yourself this question, why aren't Bruno's ideas universally
recognized by the scientific community as a work of genius? There
are 2 possibilities:
1) Due to the same misplaced pride that I have the entire
scientific community is jealous of Bruno and would rather destroy a
stunning new advancement in human knowledge than admit they didn't
find it first.
2) The entire scientific community has run into the exact same
logical stumbling block in Bruno's ideas that I did.
Or they consider this particular idea, uncertainty via duplication,
to be a commonplace and uncontroversial. Most people (including me)
find the last two steps of Bruno's argument more suspect in which he
argues that all possible computation is the fundamental basis of the
material world.
Some people, knowing rather well Church thesis and computer science
find those part non controversial, and so feels that they have to stop
early in the reasoning, like step 3 (John Clark, or even step 0, like
Bill Taylor).
My "real" opponents does not want to admit that anything could be
controversial, as this would already lead to some recognizance, and
they want me to be ignored at all price, for reason unrelated to
anything on the topics. My "real" opponents tended to consider AI and
even QM as crackpot, in fact they even fight against the whole of
computer science. Some pure mathematicians are like that. They hate
applied mathematics, especially when you suggest that some part of
pure mathematics can have applications. But it is worst than that.
Some scandal are hidden with the goal of hiding worst scandal. Humans
can be very grave sometimes.
Bruno
Brent
John K Clark
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