On 28 Dec 2013, at 17:43, Stephen Paul King wrote:

## Advertising

Dear Bruno,On Sat, Dec 28, 2013 at 7:30 AM, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>wrote:On 28 Dec 2013, at 05:27, Stephen Paul King wrote:Hi LizR and Jason,Responding to both of you. I don't understand the claim ofdeterminism is "random noise" is necessary for the computations.Turing machines require exact pre-specifiability. Adding noiseoracles is cheating!But it exist in arithmetic. Subtracting it would be cheating. thesilmple counting algorith generates all random finite strings(random in the strong Chaitin sense).Almost all numbers are random, when written in some base. And youcan define the notion of base *in* arithmetic, so they exist in allmodels of arithmetic. We can't subtract them.With respect: No! We cannot wait forever (literally) to obtainconsistency of our data bases in the face of the inability to knowin advance the arrival time of messages in the network.The fact that arithmetic "contains" all finite (even the randomones) strings is an ontological claim. I have no problem with theclaim. My problem is that we cannot reason as if time does not existwhen we are trying to construct real computers.We have to use different ideas, for example: competition forresources! Platonic computers do not compete for resources norchange. They are static and fixed eternally...

`In God's eyes. We already know that from inside, except for the`

`measure problem which remains to be solved, things look very dynamical`

`and changing all the times. Bp & p is already a logic of (subjective)`

`time. Bp & Dt gives a quantum logic, Bp & Dt & p gives a subjective or`

`intuitionist quantum logic full of percepts including a time which can`

`be felt.`

`It is a trivial exercise to show that all diophantine approximation of`

`anything physical is emulated in arithmetic, so Platonia contains all`

`possible competition on all conceivable resources, and actually`

`anything that you can live, or not live, like the collision between`

`the Milky Way and Andromeda is emulated statically in arithmetic, and`

`lived temporally by its emulated persons.`

`Platonia is static from outside, not from inside. Arithmetic becomes a`

`block universe(s), although it is more like a "block-mindscape" or a`

`block multi-dreams".`

Bruno http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.