On 22 Mar 2015, at 22:45, LizR wrote:
On 23 March 2015 at 07:37, meekerdb <[email protected]> wrote:
I don't think step 3 is at all essential to the argument. It's
nothing but setting up an analogy to Everett's MWI to show how
uncertainty and determinism are compatible - all of which JKC
already accepts.
I have put this point to him, but he says something like "because we
can never see the consequences of the MWI split, but we could see
the result of a teleporter duplication, therefore it's
different" (that seems like the gist of the argument, at least).
Bruno's point of course is just that if we had the teleporter, it
would lead to indeterminacy, just as MWI splits do (indeed, if we
take Everett literally, ISTM the MWI is an instance of Bruno's
teleporter) - whether or not we can talk to our duplicate later is
irrelevant to the point of the argument.
ISTM that the flaws in comp, if they exist, are either (a) at the
start - the premises are flawed (e.g. assumptions about the
ontological status of Peano arithmetic), or (b) at the end - the
MGA / "reversal" stage. The intermediate steps follow fairly
straightforwardly from the premises (if they are assumed correct).
In the theoretical science, it does not make sense to ask if the
premise are correct or not.
We can never answer that question.
But we can, if the theory is precise enough, test it.
Someone might believe that the theory is inconsistent, but it is up to
him to show the contradiction.
The ontological status of PA is not relevant. You need to believe only
in what PA says. Actually, only in what RA says, although the
interview is on the PA machines emulated by RA.
The only strong axioms are Church thesis, and "yes doctor". This is
were we suppose we survive some finite truncation.
The arithmetical realism used is the part on which all mathematicians
agrees, except the ultrafinitists (0,000001 % of mathematcians, at
most).
So we're still at the point where John claims to have spotted a
flaw, but he can't satisfactorily explain it to anyone else. When
asks to do so he resorts to insults, irrelevant comments about the
terminology, and mockery - the equivalent of a child putting its
fingers in its ears, closing its eyes and singing loudly.
I'm afraid so.
Bruno
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