On Mon, Oct 26, 2015 at 10:25 PM, Bruce Kellett <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 27/10/2015 12:27 pm, Jason Resch wrote: > > On Mon, Oct 26, 2015 at 8:15 PM, Bruce Kellett <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> On 27/10/2015 12:05 pm, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> On Mon, Oct 26, 2015 at 7:37 PM, Bruce Kellett < >> <[email protected]>[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> On 27/10/2015 10:52 am, Jason Resch wrote: >>> >>> On Monday, October 26, 2015, Bruce Kellett < <[email protected]> >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> > On 27/10/2015 8:16 am, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: >>> > >>> > On Tuesday, 27 October 2015, John Clark <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>> >>> >>> > >>> >>> so where does semantic content come from? >>> >> >>> >> From examples in the physical world. You can give as many botanical >>> definitions of the word "tree" as you want but it will just be a word >>> defined by other words that are themselves defined by yet more words that >>> are.... If you tried to dig for meaning all you'd find is a endless loop, >>> it would just be a game where words are manipulated according to the rules >>> of botany until somebody forgot about definitions and pointed to the ASCII >>> string "t-r-e-e" and then pointed to a large photosynthesizing organism >>> made largely of cellulose that exists in the physical world. Then even a >>> martian would notice a correspondence between this game of manipulating >>> symbols called "botany" that humans had invented and the way these large >>> photosynthesizing organism made largely of cellulose live. >>> > >>> > What about a virtual world with trees and observers, and no I/O >>> devices connecting it to outside trees? >>> > >>> > I think Brent answered this in his response to Russell. The trees of >>> the ordinary physical world do not connect with anything outside this world >>> either in order to have semantic content. A virtual world would be no >>> different in this respect. The point is that the content comes from >>> something other formal symbol manipulation -- things such as pointing and >>> sensory responses. There has to be something other than the consciousness >>> with which the consciousness can interact. >>> >>> I take it you've never played video games. >>> >>> Not with any regularity. But I take it that when you play such games, >>> you interact with the simulated environment via the provided interface -- >>> the game only interacts with itself in so far as the original programmers >>> designed it to. The semantic content is provided from outside in either >>> case. >>> >> >> So what do you think would happen if an AI, or uploaded mind were >> uploaded into a virtual reality that was fully disconnected from the >> physical world? Would that mind no longer be conscious? >> >> Difficult to tell because, by construction, you can't ask it. But if both >> the AI and the VR are programmed by some external intelligence, semantic >> content might be provided in that way. >> > > So what you're saying is that depending on what is on the mind of the > programmer, the AI within the virtual reality may or may not be conscious? > > > Of course. You wouldn't want to be the result of an incompetent programmer > now, would you? > > My desires are irrelevant in the matter. I think I would be conscious in the same way whether God, or evolution programmed our DNA. > Does what is on the mind of makers of video games make a difference to the > game playing experience (assuming the same code was written either way)? > > > But you are providing the meaning to the game you are playing. > As it would to an AI within such a game of an entirely isolated computer. Jason -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
