On 27/10/2015 1:13 pm, Stathis Papaioannou wrote:
On 27 Oct 2015, at 12:15 PM, Bruce Kellett <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
On 27/10/2015 12:05 pm, Jason Resch wrote:
On Mon, Oct 26, 2015 at 7:37 PM, Bruce Kellett
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
On 27/10/2015 10:52 am, Jason Resch wrote:
On Monday, October 26, 2015, Bruce Kellett
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>>
wrote:
> On 27/10/2015 8:16 am, Stathis Papaioannou wrote:
>
> On Tuesday, 27 October 2015, John Clark
<[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>
>>> >
>>> so where does semantic content come from?
>>
>> From examples in the physical world. You can give as many
botanical definitions of the word "tree" as you want but it
will just be a word defined by other words that are themselves
defined by yet more words that are.... If you tried to dig for
meaning all you'd find is a endless loop, it would just be a
game where words are manipulated according to the rules of
botany until somebody forgot about definitions and pointed to
the ASCII string "t-r-e-e" and then pointed to a large
photosynthesizing organism made largely of cellulose that
exists in the physical world. Then even a martian would notice
a correspondence between this game of manipulating symbols
called "botany" that humans had invented and the way these
large photosynthesizing organism made largely of cellulose live.
>
> What about a virtual world with trees and observers, and no
I/O devices connecting it to outside trees?
>
> I think Brent answered this in his response to Russell. The
trees of the ordinary physical world do not connect with
anything outside this world either in order to have semantic
content. A virtual world would be no different in this respect.
The point is that the content comes from something other formal
symbol manipulation -- things such as pointing and sensory
responses. There has to be something other than the
consciousness with which the consciousness can interact.
I take it you've never played video games.
Not with any regularity. But I take it that when you play such
games, you interact with the simulated environment via the
provided interface -- the game only interacts with itself in so
far as the original programmers designed it to. The semantic
content is provided from outside in either case.
So what do you think would happen if an AI, or uploaded mind were
uploaded into a virtual reality that was fully disconnected from the
physical world? Would that mind no longer be conscious?
Difficult to tell because, by construction, you can't ask it. But if
both the AI and the VR are programmed by some external intelligence,
semantic content might be provided in that way.
But once programmed, there may be no further evidence of semantic
content. The computer could be fired into space, and the programmers
and their entire civilisation might die. If aliens find it and somehow
work out the syntax, there is no way for them to work out the meaning
behind it, since there is no intrinsic meaning in circuits turning on
and off. So what is the explanation here: the meaning is still there
because the long-dead programmers had thought about it in a particular
way?
Could be. If the program is no longer running, the meaning might not be
recoverable.
Bruce
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