On 06 Feb 2016, at 03:20, spudboy100 via Everything List wrote:
I have no analogy to think that we might continue to exist as minds
in some sequence of numbers, somehow. This may be a intellectual
flaw as the primate that I am. I know that Stephen Wolfram touched
on this, as well as Clifford Pickover. Its difficult for me to
comprehend the mechanism for our minds to continue to exist in a
sequence of numbers. This may not be what you are saying, Hugo,
Bruno. Not Hugo.
And indeed it is not exactly what I am saying, although it can be sum
up like that in some context.
You cannot associate consciousness or first person notion to anything
third person describable. But metamathematically we can ascribe
consciousness and personhood to the truth (the semantic), and in this
case to the true fact that the sequence of numbers incarnate the doing
and thinking of a universal numbers with respect to (normal set of
computations, that is mainly other universal numbers).
In the contest of the MGA it is important to distinguish a computation
(emulate by a an abstract Fortran Interpreter, or by a physical
universe, or by elementary arithmetic) from a description of that
computation (a sequence of numbers).
but its what I am perhaps, misapprehending on what you mean.
It is because you are not aware that mathematical logician study
athematically some relastionship between syntactical relations and
semantical relations, and so I use their tools to avoid the confusion,
in a filed where the confusion is easy.
Consciousness and mind is an attribute of person, not of bodies,
numebrs, etc. The persons are incarnated (assuming Mechanism) through
number relations interpreted by universal numbers.
I think you need just to study a bit more of computer science and a
bit of mathematical logic.
Its a potentially, pleasent thought, but I can see no reason why all
this may be true?
In science we never know the truth as such. We are modest, and indeed
the fundamental equation of "everything" can be said to be the modesty
formula of Löb: []([]p -> p) -> []p. See my oldest explanation.
Now, the reason why all this may be true is that it is a consequence
of the digital mechanist assumption. If you believe you can survive
with an artificial physical digital brain, in virtue of the
computability (and not due to some gentle god making it possible to
happen, like some non Turing emulable "primary matter") then you can't
avoid the association with the truth rising from the elementary
arithmetical relation.
Ignorance, on my part, may be said to be bliss, but know that I am
not so blissful, right now.
All opinion on this are private matter.
All what I say is that IF consciousness is an invariant for some
transformation, THEN the physical laws are given by modalities arising
from the Löbian universal machine self-reference, making the digital
mechanist thesis testable, and partially tested.
At the least, it provides a consistent model of "everything" where
terms like "God", "matter", "consciousness", "persons" etc. admits
definition in terms of numbers and weak notion of truth (ultimately,
for the ontology, we need no more than the sigma_1 truth, (definable
by the machine itself) that makes already the first person views
unboundable by *any* theory).
A tiny part of arithmetic, "seen from inside" appears bigger than the
whole of Mathematics, Cantor Paradise included and Multiverses included.
Bruno
Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
-----Original Message-----
From: Bruno Marchal <[email protected]>
To: everything-list <[email protected]>
Sent: Fri, Feb 5, 2016 12:37 PM
Subject: Re: Cryonics punched cards and the brain
On 01 Feb 2016, at 20:13, Brent Meeker wrote:
The highest cost physiologically is that it partially works.
I think so. For the better, or the worst. Locally and relatively to
"us". People should not leave their "Gödel number" in the public
domain. Better to encrypt them, I guess.
Immortality is easy. Mortality is harder.
Bruno
Brent
On 1/31/2016 11:11 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List wrote:
I am hoping that restoration is somehow doable. The cost
physiologically ( ha ha!) Is that it don't work.
Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
-----Original Message-----
From: Brent Meeker <[email protected]>
To: everything-list <[email protected]>
Sent: Sun, Jan 31, 2016 11:14 PM
Subject: Re: Cryonics punched cards and the brain
There could also be a physiological cost.
Brent
On 1/31/2016 7:42 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List wrote:
There is a 13 min scifi short on youtube, that shows what happens to
a couple, a century after their demise, after cryonic revival. Call
it the price many would be willing to pay if cryonics really worked.
Also, note that, if one believes in a heaven, and their beliefs are
absolutely correct, the emotional effect is just the same, with
cryonic revival, heaven, or uploading to a virch environment. There
is a kind of psychological cost, but most are good with this, if we
only had a good option.
Sent from AOL Mobile Mail
-----Original Message-----
From: Brent Meeker <[email protected]>
To: everything-list <[email protected]>
Sent: Sun, Jan 31, 2016 10:08 PM
Subject: Re: Cryonics punched cards and the brain
On 1/31/2016 6:46 PM, John Clark wrote:
I wish I could be more confident but that's the
best bet I could find. And as I've said if at does't work at least
it won't make me any deader.
But it could make you worse off.
Brent
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