On Thu, Jun 9, 2016 at 1:01 PM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]> wrote:
> > The question is about primary matter, not matter. > That's your question not mine. A s I've said many times, molecules are certainly NOT primary but molecules certainly exist and molecules certainly are necessary for life ; and matter may or may not be primary but either way matter exists , and either way matter is needed for consciousness. > >> >> if what you say is true then ingesting a form of matter that obeys the >> laws >> >> of physics like cyanide, strychnine, or cobra venom will have no effect >> >> on >> >> your consciousness, but I have a hunch it will. So I don't recommend you >> do >> >> it. > > > > You might actually need to read what I say. > I have read what you said and if you're right and calculations can be performed and consciousness produced independently of matter then the injection of a particular form of matter into your bloodstream, such as cyanide, should have no effect on your consciousness. But it does. I can explain why and you can't. I can also explain why mathematicians are made of matter and you can't explain that either. > > You have added an axiom saying that some PRIMARY MATTER > [blah blah] > > As I've said over and over and over, whether matter is "PRIMARY" or not is irrelevant, without matter nobody is going to be calculating a damn thing, not even Mr. Robinson . The only axiom I've added is intelligent behavior produces consciousness because without it I'd have to conclude I'm the only conscious being in the universe and I could not function if I believed that. > > > you just keep asserting that things are made of primary matter, > No I keep asserting things are made of matter. The primacy of matter is an entirely different question, > >> >> Wow, calling a guy known for disliking religion religious, never heard >> that one before, at least I never heard it before I was 12. >> >> > > > Probably because you are not yet aware that your belief in PRIMARY matter > I'm an agnostic on PRIMARY matter , maybe something else is, maybe the vacuum is primary, or maybe the laws of Quantum Mechanics are, or maybe you're right and the Peano postulates are. If one's focus is on consciousness it makes no difference. I am much more interested in how matter (primary or not) can make calculations and produce intelligent behavior and, assuming Darwin was right, consciousness. > > > your belief in physicalism are religious. > Wow, calling a guy known for disliking religion religious, never heard that one before, at least I never heard it before I was 12. > > > You might not be a fundamentalist christian, but you are still its best > ally. > Wow, calling a guy known for disliking religion religious, never heard that one before, at least I never heard it before I was 12. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
