On 26 Sep 2017, at 22:17, John Clark wrote:
On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 12:19 PM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]>
wrote:
you must not neglect the question asked
What question? I saw words and question marks but I saw no
question.
The question is always the same. Just read the posts and the papers.
It is "what could the helsinki guy expect to live as first person
experience in the WM-duplication?". Is it "I will die plain and
simple", or "I will survive"?
Well, you have already answer that you will survive. So now, the
question is "do you expect to feel, from an 1p perspective, to be in
one city or to be in two city"?. the answer is obvious (assuming of
course computationalism).
> which concerns the first person experience expected.
Which THE the first person experience is the prediction suposed to
be about,
Both, of course. "THE" refers to the only city EACH copies will seen.
John Clark's THE
first person experience in Helsinki John Clark's THE first person
experience in Moscow or
John Clark's THE first person experience in Washington? John Clark
predicts that Bruno's
answer will contain a gaggle of personal pronouns with no referent,
talk about THE 1p as if
there were only one, or do both.
Just keep the 1p and 3p views difference into account, and all
ambiguities on person vanish away. What remains is only that the
copies have to admit that in Helsinki, they could not have written the
city seen now in advance.
> I am asking just the H-man, about what he expects
For all I know the H-man expects Santa Claus's
workshop, but I neither know nor care what the
H-man expects,I only care who will remember tomorrow being the
H-man today, and two men
will not one.
If you don't care, just say nothing. But you do seem care a lot.
Keep in mind that UDA is...
babytalk.
So you lost the argument if this is all what you can say.
> You know you will push on a button,
Yes, I know who "you" refers to up to this point, but after that
the word "you" must be abandoned.
There are no reason. After the experience "you" remains as useful as
ever, but to remain consistent with computationalism, we just need to
take into account the 1p/3p distinction which has been introduced and
explain in the second step of the UD Argument.
open a door and see a city
John Clark opens 2 doors and sees 2 cities.
In the 3p description, but this is just a description of the protocol.
> Don't patronize
No I think I’m going to continue to patronize
"patronizing" is insulting. In all circumstances.
as long as you continue to assume the meaning
of personal pronouns is always obvious even in a world that
contains personal pronoun duplicating
machines as is done in the following:
I don't say it is obvious. Just "simple" once you keep the 1p and 3p
distinction into account, which of course is important when working in
a theory of mind.
"It is the specific city that I will feel be in that I cannot
predict.”
>> No, he should not expect to get tea he should expect the
promise to be broken and it would be
better if he expected to end up in Santa Claus's workshop
instead.Why should he expect that?
Because he will happier if he does,Santa Claus's workshop sound
like more fun than drinking tea
Of course expectations need not turn out to be correct to bring
happiness
> Good joke.
I’m not joking.Santa Claus's workshop is as good a response as any
to a meaningless sequence of
words followed be a question mark.
You make it meaningless by forgetting that the question is on the, or
"a" if you prefer, future first person experience. THE one which both
are living after. The M-man man will say, yes I got a definite result
among {W, M}, and the W-man too, but, as they could have guess in
Helsinki, none of them live the experience of being in the two city at
once, and the split has definitely lead to getting one bit of
information for both of them. Both have to acknowledge the FPI, or be
inconsistent.
Bruno
John K Clark
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