On Saturday, January 5, 2019 at 4:26:11 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 4 Jan 2019, at 17:25, Philip Thrift <cloud...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > Physicists today (as I've observed) are not (for the most part) real > materialists. > > > > That is true, and physicists have rarely problem with the consequence of > Mechanism. Now, some physicist can be immaterialist, but still physicalist > (like Tegmark was at some moment at least). The physical reality would be a > mathematical reality among others, but with computationalism, the physical > reality comes from a more global mathematical phenomenon based on the > behaviour/semantics of the material mode of self-rereyence (involving > probabilities, i.e., for those who have studied the self-referential modes > available, the p & X modes, with X being either p, or <>t, or p & <>t). > > This makes mechanism testable, and if quantum mechanics did not exist, I > would have thought that Mechanism is already refuted. > > Bruno > >
"Physicalism"/"Physical" are words that needs deprecating, as they can mean (to some philosophers of science) "can be reduced to physics", and physics is what is currently-accepted in the physics scientific community. (When I use "physical", I mean it in the sense of being "explainable" by physics.) It gets worse: "In this entry, I will adopt the policy of using both terms ['materialism' and 'physicalism'] interchangeably, though I will typically refer to the thesis we will discuss as ‘physicalism’." https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/physicalism/ Better to just use "materialism" and reject the use of "physicalism" (unless it refers to a the particular meaning of "can be reduced to physics"), though materialism has a "weak" and "strong" definition. Galen Strawson defines what "hard-nosed materialism" is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvHVo6TslV4 But what exactly would be a "test for Mechanism"? - pt -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to email@example.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.